Buying forest land, implementing solar

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Re: Buying forest land, implementing solar

Post by swbluto » Dec 16, 2017 11:33 am

marty wrote:
Dec 16, 2017 10:24 am
How close are the houses in this neighborhood? Shooting guns in a residential neighborhood is a bad idea.

Doesn't stop them! And they do it right behind my backyard.

Personally, I'd shoot a few blanks to get a hold of the loading/ejection/fires procedures, and then I'd save target practice for the range. I could also construct some clay mounds for a backstop.

All this talk about "It's not a good idea", this is not some safe white suburb! It's filled with illegals out for blood. The shit that happens in Mexico and Brazil, happens here. Probably more so here since the illegals are largely the poorer more violent people of their countries.

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Re: Buying forest land, implementing solar

Post by DAND214 » Dec 16, 2017 2:06 pm

Will you move to a place that has, electric, water and sewer? If so you could stop the trips to the post office and water runs since it will have an address.

\ater for a shower would be nice. Electric would solve the generator concerns. A sewer would be really handy. Those items is a must to build a HOUSE. Without them it's a shack or cabin.

So how would you rent out the old place? Has non of the above and has NO HOUSE to live in.

Dan

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Re: Buying forest land, implementing solar

Post by swbluto » Dec 16, 2017 2:12 pm

DAND214 wrote:
Dec 16, 2017 2:06 pm

So how would you rent out the old place? Has non of the above and has NO HOUSE to live in.

Dan
I thought about that, i'm pretty sure sewer/toilet would be a necessity to rent out, I'm sure it's written in law somewhere. And, I have no idea, lol. So maybe I'd just build out the structure and then "rent out the land" or some such. They can use the house-like structure however they see fit.

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Re: Buying Subdivision Land, implementing generator

Post by Dauntless » Dec 16, 2017 2:20 pm

swbluto wrote:
Dec 16, 2017 7:15 am
Let's see.Another suburbanite who lives in a nice and peaceful white enclave with really no idea what it's like here.
Sounds like you're looking in a mirror. I've been at my Mother's, my sister's, at other relatives when certain REAL countryside confrontations occur. They're not like those cheesy low budget movies you base your life on. The scary thing is you're right there with no idea what its like because you're buried deep in your delusions.

If they were after you, they'd already have got you. And your little dog Toto, too. What's this "Show of Force" nonsense? One guy with a hunting rifle picks you off from a distance. What an unfortunate accident. But more likely they follow you to a gas station, a parking lot. Away from them so they don't seem connected. A mugging gone bad. IF they were after you. As if.

Going to buy a gun because you want to act out on a paranoid delusion. You've got the wrong idea about what's popular in Texas.
DAND214 wrote:
Dec 16, 2017 2:06 pm
So how would you rent out the old place? Has non of the above and has NO HOUSE to live in.

Dan
The people trying to kill him will rent it so they secure the area from intruders. Certainly they have criminal element friends that need a place to go.
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Re: Buying Subdivision Land, implementing generator

Post by swbluto » Dec 16, 2017 2:44 pm

Dauntless wrote:
Dec 16, 2017 2:20 pm
swbluto wrote:
Dec 16, 2017 7:15 am
Let's see.Another suburbanite who lives in a nice and peaceful white enclave with really no idea what it's like here.
Sounds like you're looking in a mirror. I've been at my Mother's, my sister's, at other relatives when certain REAL countryside confrontations occur. They're not like those cheesy low budget movies you base your life on. The scary thing is you're right there with no idea what its like because you're buried deep in your delusions.

If they were after you, they'd already have got you. And your little dog Toto, too. What's this "Show of Force" nonsense? One guy with a hunting rifle picks you off from a distance. What an unfortunate accident. But more likely they follow you to a gas station, a parking lot. Away from them so they don't seem connected. A mugging gone bad. IF they were after you. As if.
You act like this is a smart, well funded group with this being the group's goal. And long range isn't possible here, can't see more than 100 feet in. This particular area where my property front is has exceptionally thick brush, which maybe they don't feel like walking through. The areas they appear to be walking thru behind the back are a bit thinner, easier to walk thru. I get the sense the perpetrator is that methhead I saw walking by the other day, with that "I'm going to kill you" face he was trying miserably to hide. Got a /real bad/ feeling from that guy, had my hand on my knife ready to deploy when he knocked on the RV door. And, no, that's not the usual procedure.

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Re: Buying forest land, implementing solar

Post by swbluto » Dec 16, 2017 3:44 pm

It's hard to tell if my paranoia has been kicked up for no particularly good reason and the intruder was a figment of my imagination on a windy dark night where the dog was barking into my front yard just about 10 minutes earlier (He was tethered to the front of the RV, so he couldn't get onto the property like in previous days to run them off.), or if there really was an intruder and my paranoia has been appropriately kicked up a notch. Just walking around my fence line and see those opaque thick woods, makes me think he could be hiding there waiting for a good opportunity to shoot and I'm just anticipating getting shot all of a sudden.

The fact the dog was barking into my property at 10 p.m. on the dot the last 3 days, and then suddenly when I fenced off the back, he didn't bark once any time after 9 p.m.... makes me think there was definitely an intruder targeting my generator cutoff times, just like there was definitely one in the front targeting my generator turn on times. And, he definitely rushes me when he thinks I'm going to be out there a while (like fixing my tire), I know because my dog will start sniffing the ground and then running near his position and start barking directly at him. He's done this "sniff" and "Run towards him and bark him off" twice. Once in the front, then he started going thru my backside, then once in the back.

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Re: Buying forest land, implementing solar

Post by swbluto » Dec 16, 2017 4:35 pm

I see, the area where I really wouldn't mind being has land going for $30,000. I guess that's my savings goal.

If I wanted to be in a town with restrictions (City or suburb restrictions), one nice and another kind of poor, the price is $15,000. The restrictions are likely something like 1000-1800sqft. minimum.

I'm inquiring about the restrictions on 2 properties about 9 miles closer to Houston. I see there's HOA fees on one, and one belongs to "an estate" that had hoa fees associated with it in another listing. Hoa makes me think restrictions, but the dwellings I've seen in that area don't seem to be particularly compliant with hypothetical restrictive restrictions. I like the higher price, probably has a better crowd there. I think I'm learning "cheapest price" in a given city area means "The scummiest/violent/dangerous people of the city". I see my neighbor's insistence on keeping neighbors away from him and he's completely fenced with a 10 foot fence... I was naive in thinking that's overkill, but.... I'm now thinking THAT'S ABOUT WHAT IT TAKES HERE! lol. The crackheads/methheads don't leave you alone as much one might want to believe "You leave them alone, they'll leave you alone". Yeah right! Wishful thinking.

These properties used to be $1000 just 4 years ago. So if you had spare change, you could own land here.

I think I might want to keep possession of this property, because my neighbor would be routing in electricity next year. That'll make it more marketable/valuable in addition to the rapid appreciation these properties seem to be having.

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Re: Buying forest land, implementing solar

Post by swbluto » Dec 16, 2017 10:03 pm

This idea of just owning land all over houston is kind of intriguing. It's more the "neighborhood" and "the Access to locations" I find more interesting than "sheer amount of land" I own, so not really a countryside person. However, if I ambitioned to be a dairy farmer or rancher, I might have an interest in much land.

Not that /this/ particular location is particularly interesting compared to other Houston locations, but it's definitely interesting to someone with more meager means looking into moving to Houston.

I think I'll purchase the car first before making the next land purchase.

I wonder if I could create a little mini RV park out of this property?

Seems like it'd be kind of interesting possibility. Maybe 4 lots with something like a pool. For the right price, and the right marketing, I might be able to find tenants. It'd be a relatively low cost experiment. I don't know if I could convince savory tenants to stay there though considering the hood... might have to accept that the tenants likely to be willing to stay there would be the less savory types. And would they bring legal problems with them I'd have to deal with? Hmmm...

And who would supervise it to make sure everything is kosher?

I guess I could also develop a duplex on it.

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Re: Buying forest land, implementing solar

Post by swbluto » Dec 16, 2017 11:25 pm

I just wonder if these land prices will go down duing a recession. Be nice owning a nice location if I just saved my pennies and bought in a recession. It definitely seems land prices here are dictated by "how nice" the nearby areas are, in particular the commercial areas. Location = price.

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Re: Buying Subdivision land, implementing generator

Post by Dauntless » Dec 16, 2017 11:37 pm

Yours is the type of land that becomes unsellable in a recession, as the people who would buy it are the hardest hit. Dang, I could sell my SoCal house and buy a ranch down there. In the last 5-7 years the prices here doubled. They were already ridiculously high. My guess is my capital gains tax would be more than you would have paid for that place.

Having a better idea of where you are than you do, I'll say that even if you had the required 3 acres for an rv park the answer is still no, you can't run one there. Oh and, if you dig a well they'll make you put a meter on it. They'll occasionally log your water use.

I don't remember the final count on your under acreage, but I'm thinking you have 750 sqft. more than I. No, the amount of acreage doesn't make you country folk any more than marrying a cousin does.

And nothing about a lone gunman taking you out requires funding or organization, which is why its so popular. Its so simple even you could do it. Or people like your neighbors who are at that level. A show of force requires funding, to buy the weapons, to pay the people. It also requires organization, as does putting on any show. You really don't see yourself describing high level operatives, do you. Yet you talk about more involved operations. You gotta talk to that writer of yours doing better research. Quite the time tables they stick to. They sound like the type of terrorists who never miss the new opera seasons' opening night. Well, that would be colorful.

They have import restrictions on women now. There's guys around me who bought theirs years ago and still can't get them into the country. Easier to import an exotic pet. Damn, I sure could go for an eastern European woman, though.
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Re: Buying Subdivision land, implementing generator

Post by swbluto » Dec 17, 2017 12:01 pm

Dauntless wrote:
Dec 16, 2017 11:37 pm
Yours is the type of land that becomes unsellable in a recession, as the people who would buy it are the hardest hit.
That's what Steven was telling me, the people who buy land like this would run out of cash. I guess running out of cash implies lower land prices for those /really trying to sell/ and unsellable for those asking for the prices that were there during the peak (That possibly being right now), so effectively the price would go down.

I guess those people who are hit less hard in the better areas, would still retain value a little bit more since a much greater percentage of people would've kept their jobs and income in those areas, including the people interested in purchasing in those areas?

I didn't really buy for resale value, but as a segue into the Houston area. First stop.

I guess I'll treat all properties I don't intend as finally settling into as investments and do some kind of tenable rent-seeking (Land rent, duplex rent, rv park, etc.).

I think I'll keep off permanent improvements on this property until I designate a final design. Duplex,etc. If I were to put a small abode for the short-term, I'd ensure it could be expanded into a duplex.

I originally intended to build my dream-house here, but having guns shooting behind my property is not exactly a dream! I think I'm learning my dream house needs a NON-nightmare neighborhood, lol.

When I move out of the area, I wonder if I should retaliate against my neighbors? I don't want to, but if I think it might reasonably clean up the neighborhood, it might be good for neighborhood. But would it clean up the neighborhood since it appears to be the entire family? Probably not. So there doesn't really seem to be a practical longterm gain to apprehending the individual criminals that might get caught. So even if I move away, there doesn't seem to be any realistic benefit to retaliation. And really, I don't have the kind of freetime they appear to have. Any freetime I have gets devoted to work and income-seeking, lol. I don't waste too much time on nonproductive things like that.

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Re: Buying forest land, implementing solar

Post by swbluto » Dec 17, 2017 12:45 pm

Boy, seems like I'm confused today. Dementia of some sort? Vascular, azlheimers, lewey bodies, etc?

And, what's a close cousin of dementia? Paranoia.

Oh man, is the paranoia/anxiety causing the dementia, or the dementia causing the paranoia?

I did get a mild memory impairment diagnosis a decade ago. It manifesting 'further' a decade later shouldn't be too surprising, as much as I don't like the idea, lol.

I was already creeped out about these woods the first time I came, my hostile neighbors shooting guns hiding in those same woods in unrelenting intimidation isn't helping matters. And trespassing thru my open back(now sealed off) setting off the dog at 10:00 p.m. who was pointing into my yard when barking for 3 days straight, sure wasn't helping matters. Since it was sealed off, the dog hasn't barked once over the past 2 days past 9 p.m.

I'm cutting off the generators early today and I'm going to reposition them to the entrance tomorrow. Unpredictable cutoff times means they can't target me.

I think I'm learning... you don't want to be bothered... don't exist within walking distance of an illegal stronghold. Now that I'm in the area, the signs of these strongholds is pretty clear. Multiple mobiles on one lot.

I think I'm also learning that HOAs are a great thing for this area (To keep out the illegal strongholds). It's just that... I don't think there's too many I could afford with my current cash holdings and their minimum requirements. And, I get the sense that rules can be invented ad hoc to suit the despotic whims of the committe and often the chairman to any one members detriment. Not a bad thing if its to keep out illegal strongholds, but can be a bad thing if the chairman just doesn't like you because you're an alpha male who has no problems with the ladies. Male resentment in the real world is a very real thing.

And shorting out the generator doesn't work, I tried, it just bogs it down. I was really hoping for a method that didn't require me to be in front of the generator.

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Re: Buying Subdivision land, implementing generator

Post by swbluto » Dec 17, 2017 1:17 pm

Dauntless wrote:
Dec 16, 2017 11:37 pm
Yours is the type of land that becomes unsellable in a recession, as the people who would buy it are the hardest hit. Dang, I could sell my SoCal house and buy a ranch down there.
Oh yes, I believe I've seen 100 acre ranches within 30-40 miles of Houston proper for $200,000-$300,000.

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Re: Buying forest land, implementing solar

Post by nicobie » Dec 17, 2017 2:42 pm

If I was one of your imaginary neighbors I wouldn't be targeting you, however your imaginary generator would be full of holes.

Do you have any idea how irritating the noise it makes is?
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Re: Buying forest land, implementing solar

Post by DAND214 » Dec 17, 2017 2:55 pm

I never got a reply on, if you are still parked on the side of road or on the property.

I guess we will never see that mansion we have read so much about. A shame that the neighbors hate you so much. I sure hope I don't have that concern when I move south. But than again, I sure don't plan on parking my moving van in front of my property longer than a day.

Dan

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Re: Buying forest land, implementing solar

Post by swbluto » Dec 17, 2017 4:25 pm

nicobie wrote:
Dec 17, 2017 2:42 pm
If I was one of your imaginary neighbors I wouldn't be targeting you, however your imaginary generator would be full of holes.

Do you have any idea how irritating the noise it makes is?
I figured that might be the issue, but I was at their house and tried hearing it, turned off the motor of the van and listened real carefully(even stuck my head out the window)... and couldn't hear it one iota. Not sure where exactly they might be thinking they require some silence? 200 feet in front of my property where they're making drugs?

btw, I've fully baffled the generators with 3/4" OSB which does make it noticeably quieter at a distance.

The noise abatement step up would be cinder blocks filled with clay surrounding it with some kind of heavy top, then the exhaust would need to be ported into an another place which could also be abated. That requires a solid flat surface. That's going to require time to set that up, something I don't have right now.

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Re: Buying forest land, implementing solar

Post by swbluto » Dec 17, 2017 4:34 pm

DAND214 wrote:
Dec 17, 2017 2:55 pm
I never got a reply on, if you are still parked on the side of road or on the property.
Impossible to turn the RV onto the driveway. Road isn't wide enough to do a backing up turning maneuver.

So I intended to build my house in november, but bamm.... got booked with work until well after christmas, well into the cold and colder season. What luck.

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Re: Buying forest land, implementing solar

Post by swbluto » Dec 17, 2017 5:34 pm

Good places I've found for finding land.

Landwatch.com
Some kind of MLS-search service like 21-st century. There might be better MLS sites.

Other places where I've seen land for sale, but aren't necessarily the best/easiest places to find it.

Facebook markeplace
Craigslist

I'd imagine those "for sell" newspaper ads would have listings? I don't know of which ones here would be good ones, but these would probably have "For sale by owner" listings in them. Landwatch and MLS seem to be all realtor listings. The other place that "For sale by owner" list their property for sale is by putting up a sign on the property; not the most efficient way, but I guess it works - it seems that people often enough drive around looking for said signs.

One thing I wouldn't buy ever again is cheap unrestricted forested properties squirreled far away from the main road. Bunch of crackheads hiding from the law (And, in this particular part of the USA, illegals).

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Re: Buying forest land, implementing solar

Post by swbluto » Dec 17, 2017 7:40 pm

Okay, let's create a giant formula that predicts walling, ceiling and flooring costs.

wall area = 2*L*H+2*W*H
ceiling area = W*H
floor area = W*H

than sample square foot costs...

wall sheathing:

lp smart siding = $26/32 = 81 cents
osb + fiber cement = $1.21

Flooring:

OSB = $16/32 = 50 cents

Ceiling:

osb + shingles = 70 cents.

wall+ceiling+floor cost = 2*(L*H+W*H)*.81+(W*L)*.7+(W*L)*.5

With this formula, I have for a 12x16x10

2*(16*10+12*10)*.81+(12*16)*.7+(12*16)*.5 = 684.

Then add doors, windows and the frame. At this point, I'd estimate $250

$934

So about $1000 for a basic 12x16 structure.

That's about $5/sq. ft.

drywall would add to the ceiling and wall costs (It'd up the sq ft. rate by about 33-40 cents), and flooring and floor padding would up the flooring costs.

Add drywall to the wall, $684 -> $908.

Floor padding = 40 cents, carpet = $1 / sq ft.

Add carpet

$684-> $952

Add drywall and carpet

$684 -> $1171

I think I would go for LP siding on a temp structure or temporary side, because it can be somewhat easily removed for expansion.

drywall + carpet total cost -> $1421

COST PER SQ FT. = $1421 / 192 SQ FT = $7.4/SQ FT.

I don't think I'd go for drywall and carpet on a minimalistic temp structure, but I would try to paint the walls white.

I like the cost per sq. ft. metric, because it lets me quickly evaluate the minimum cost to develop on a particular property.

1000 sq ft -> Around $7000. (A typical "light restriction" around Houston.)

1800 sq ft -> Around $13000. (A typical lake property minimum)

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Re: Buying forest land, implementing solar

Post by swbluto » Dec 17, 2017 8:39 pm

Well, I'm keeping investment minimalistic and I guess I plan on doubling down on this property at the moment. Pseudo-job-loss at the moment, so yep, shit-hits-the-fan property this property is going to be used as for now. Cash is just there to make sure I can fund the basic needs, no new large purchases beyond the immediate necessities (Second car, minimalistic house, security). I think I'm going to insist on a 12x16, 200 sq ft. seems about right and corresponds to the lower bound on a studio apartment. It corresponds to the size of a typical hotel room.

I figured 5 people easily fit into a 1500 sq ft. house, so 1 person should easily make use of 300 sq. ft. I'm already making pretty good use of 100 sq. ft., just the the lack of walking room with the bed right in the middle kind of sucks, but whatever.

And, it looks like that family of 5 with the smoking hot babe was making pretty good use of a 400 sq.ft. shack?

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Re: Buying forest land, implementing solar

Post by swbluto » Dec 17, 2017 10:49 pm

Cinder block wall...

I'm counting 48 blocks for 8 feet.

48*1.3 = $65/8 feet.

a 500 feet wall * ($65/8feet) = $4062.

Well, that doesn't seem too bad, considering a 500 feet welded wire fence is around $1000.

Let's see, my first half, cindered.

70*4 = 280 feet.

280*(65/8) = $2275.

With the concrete base, I'm guessing it'd be around $2500 to implement.

Well, that's not an unreasonable security option if I were paranoid of gunfire. I'd much rather, however, move to a property that didn't require such security measures, lol.

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Re: Buying forest land, implementing solar

Post by nutnspecial » Dec 17, 2017 11:53 pm

I don't usually do formulas for building costs cuz material is cheap (and it's better to figure how you want to run sheathing and drywall first then price by size vs footage for accuracy if you're figuring tight). But anymore I just make sure I have enough money, so I guess the calculation is kinda subliminal/underlying? It'd be cool to be able to write it but it feels too complex (like 'intuition') to do that.

But anyway, dam swbluto I'd give you a run for your money if I had time for a thread, for all the crap I've been getting into lol. Best to you though, and esp for sharing!!
One tip (if you're still into cocoa/cacao) is I found bittersweet nightshade (commonly thought of as 'poison' lol (I made a thread on it)) is interestingly similar to that plant family in it's effects, at least for me. More strong tho probably, which is neither good or bad, but it grows in our regions which is def good.

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Re: Buying Subdivision land, implementing generator

Post by Dauntless » Dec 18, 2017 12:56 am

nutnspecial wrote:
Dec 17, 2017 11:53 pm
But anyway, dam swbluto I'd give you a run for your money if I had time for a thread, for all the crap I've been getting into lol.
Get on down there and build his house for him. Sounds like it should only take you a few days.

Sure wish I could want to go through 10 times of what I'm going through. If I could believe that if there was only 75% of me that a quarter of the bad things would go away, I'm sure I could lose weight quickly.

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Re: Buying forest land, implementing solar

Post by swbluto » Dec 18, 2017 7:11 pm

Okay, think I'm going to tour the area where I'm interested, map the power lines and look for "for sale" signs, and then I'll start sending letters to interesting properties. Based on how well that approach has worked for this mexican broker in this neighborhood, I think there might be a good chance I'll find a good opportunity.

In the mean time, think I'll construct an 8x16 on this property. Make this my "base of operations" when between buying and selling property as I'm moving on up. It's nice to sell before buying so you have the cash available for buying, but doing so often means you need to find some place to live in the gap time and I don't have the luxury of staying with family! lol

I would do an 8x12, but I want it to be more readily expandable into a duplex should I exercise that option in the future, and I think 16 feet wide is better for a duplex. 16x30 = 450 sq. feet.; 20x30 = 600 sq. ft.; maybe I should go with 20 feet? Or.... you know... a large studio kind of duplex... that seems fitting for the area... so 16 feet wide should work.

This neighborhood restricts mobiles but doesn't appear to have a minimum sq. footage? Lots of smallish dwellings in the area.

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Re: Buying forest land, implementing solar

Post by marty » Dec 18, 2017 7:32 pm

swbluto wrote:
Dec 18, 2017 7:11 pm
8x16, 8x12, 16x30
Rectangle? Why not build a round house? Or a Geodesic dome?
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