Motorcycle Hub Motor Part 2

[Jay64]

Damnit! I totally forgot you were in NY!!!!!!!! I was just up there racing my Harley-Davidson at New Jersey Motorsports Park. Man, I really wanted to stop by and see you guys whenever I made it to NY, but forgot that you were up there when I actually went. I definately like that double rear with the non spoke rim. I need to get a few of my builds done and sold, then talk to you about some builds with your motors.

[rabar10]

So what's new on the hub motor front? Looks like the modded dual-602 did well on the Catavolt bike.

Are the DU-602 and DU-603 motors "list items" now? I don't see any info on your main site about them, just in forums and your blog thus far...

Ryan

[rabar10]

Saw some pictures on FB (link below) of the dual-motor GPRS bike at yesterday's NYC Pier 54 event for National Plug-In Day 2011- congrats on making it out there and offering rides! Looks like you made at least one good impression

Facebook: National Plug-In Day 2011 - taken by Michael Thwaite

This bike is a blast to ride.

and from a separate forum:

Quick review: Mega fun. It was configured for a steady output, it feels like the weight of a 600, pulled like a steady 600, slight cogging at <5mph but with torque like this you won't be doing that speed for long.

[markcycle]

Saw some pictures on FB (link below) of the dual-motor GPRS bike at yesterday's NYC Pier 54 event for National Plug-In Day 2011- congrats on making it out there and offering rides! Looks like you made at least one good impression

Facebook: National Plug-In Day 2011 - taken by Michael Thwaite

This bike is a blast to ride.

We had a fun day We always offer rides its really why we go EV's are about the experience, if you don't try it then you can't understand, but once you do and I see the EV smile on someones face then I know I'm doing my part at spreading the word.

[patrickza]

How are the DU motors doing Mark. Any more news/stats/videos?

[Doctorbass]

My friend Jean Luc bought from Mark the DU-602

We should get it soon and i'll try making some video of the build we are making (a GSXR1100) with headway cells...

Doc

[liveforphysics]

We had a fun day We always offer rides its really why we go EV's are about the experience, if you don't try it then you can't understand, but once you do and I see the EV smile on someones face then I know I'm doing my part at spreading the word.

Great job Mark! That is the best way to make converts to electric.

[markcycle]

We had a fun day We always offer rides its really why we go EV's are about the experience, if you don't try it then you can't understand, but once you do and I see the EV smile on someones face then I know I'm doing my part at spreading the word.

Great job Mark! That is the best way to make converts to electric.

Thanks Luke

On your trips around the world why not stop through New York and visit us.

[whatever]

I saw the catavolt in action at the huntervalley ev day, its an impressive machine indeed.
I'm just wondering, since it has to be cooled, all that heat generated is obviously energy lost,
is it not possible to wind the motor such that there is no heating generated? I'm guessing the windings are a
trade off in some way for torque/speed/heat generated.
Is it not possible to reduce heat loss by having windings that will handle the current ? ( thinkness/no. turns etc)

[Doctorbass]

Hey guys

My Friend Jean Luc got his motor from Mark today!

And.. installed on his own GSX1100 swing arm

Thanks Mark for the great work!

With 144V Headway and 600 amp controller it should be impressive!
( note that the TS cells are for another project!)


Here is some big hub motor porn!

Doc

[patrickza]

That's a good looking piece of equipment. More details please doc. Size of the pack, expected speeds, range, continuos/max power etc. Can these motors be run in series/parallel for a 604/602 switch?

[steveo]

Hey guys

My Friend Jean Luc got his motor from Mark today!

And.. installed on his own GSX1100 swing arm

Thanks Mark for the great work!

With 144V Headway and 600 amp controller it should be impressive!
( note that the TS cells are for another project!)


Here is some big hub motor porn!

Doc

steveo jaw drops to floor...

how wide is stator ?... any ideas?

how wide magnets?

-steveo

[Doctorbass]

Hey guys

My Friend Jean Luc got his motor from Mark today!

And.. installed on his own GSX1100 swing arm

Thanks Mark for the great work!

With 144V Headway and 600 amp controller it should be impressive!
( note that the TS cells are for another project!)


Here is some big hub motor porn!

Doc

steveo jaw drops to floor...

how wide is stator ?... any ideas?

how wide magnets?

-steveo

These motor are like four X5 motor side to side

The stator is dual 70mm if i remember ( correct me if i'm wrong Mark) so 140mm total stator...

Here is some real PORN image







Doc

[mistercrash]

Holy Tabarnak! Sont malades lé Kabakois sti! Where's the build thread of this beast?

[Doctorbass]

Holy Tabarnak! Sont malades lé Kabakois sti! Where's the build thread of this beast?

Comming soon!

Doc

[slayer]

Can t wait

[patrickza]

With 144V Headway and 600 amp controller it should be impressive!

What controller is he going to be running Doc?

[Doctorbass]

With 144V Headway and 600 amp controller it should be impressive!

What controller is he going to be running Doc?

90% probable that it will be the Kelly 144V 600A... the 800A is way too expensive!! for 200A more..

300A phase current per motor will be perfect!.. since i already drive 300A burst on my X5... and that a single Enertrac is like a dual X5... so that's like 150A phase current per X5..... not bad!

and their winding is like a 5302.. so the resistive loss will be minimal... we hope that the controller should not have a hard time to drive the equivalent of 4 parallel 5302 with the DU602 (our dual enertrack MH602 in the same hub)

Doc

[markcycle]

Jon got a chance to get the Catavolt bike onto a Dyno

Dual 602 motors in a 17 inch wheel
144 volt battery pack

[Doctorbass]

Interesting data!

According to the graph that's 51hp max or it's 38kW output at the wheel.

(usually, low winding like the 02 are more efficient due to less resistive loss) so if the motor is around 85% efficient, that mean the input power is around

45kW. And, at 144V, that's 312 amps ( battery current), meaning aroud 780A phase current... so i guess he is using the Kelly 800A ?

Doc

[Hugues]

Hi Mark, Doc,

I like these numbers !

I'm almost finished with my technical file and i should present it to the local DOT this coming week,
i hope it's gonna be ok.

Mark: i measure the whole thing today as agreed on the phone last this week, I'm gonna send you the data soon.

[markcycle]

More Dyno testing

[SamRam]

I require this hub motor!
Anyone happen to know where to get the dual hub version at?

Thanks

Sam

[Jeremy Harris]

I require this hub motor!
Anyone happen to know where to get the dual hub version at?

Thanks

Sam

You could try contacting Mark at the URL he gave in the post immediately above this: http://www.enertrac.net/ ............

[Doctorbass]

Our great electric motorcycle using enertrac motor is not 99% finished.

We did many tests and it was good esxcept that the stall start power is generating vibration and make the 2000$ Kelly controller to reset and genrate few codes.. We investigate that for 3 weeks and communicated with Fany from kelly and made hours of test and sent pictures and video to her to proove that our connections phase and hal sensor connections was good. we used scopes to see teh waveform, the hall sensor tester, and also tested with another controller ( infineon) to try to proove that the motor is ok. We also examined how the phase of the two stator were aligned and with a Tecktronic scope it just look like perfect alignment.. ( congrat to Mark for that)

Problem is that without load the motor run fine and under load and at high speed it run fine too but at low speed wich require very high phase current, the controller is having hard time we think... not to mention that we also upgraded the firmware for a lastest version but it did not solved the low speed vibration problem.

It is now really difficult to confirm that the kelly KHB serie is compativle with the dual Enertrac since the controller finally blown!

It was hard to get Fany to agree to have our controller returned and to get one under warranty but we finally succeded.

We just hope the new controoller will be ok

i just worrie that the dual 602 might be too difficult to drive at low speed for that 600A controller!

Strange thingt is that during the use of the regen, the motor run very smooth!!! but not on the forward direction...
John that race in the TTXGP is having the EXACT setup as we have ( dual 602, 48s2p A123 pouch, kelly 144V 600A).. but HE IS USING TWO CONTROLLER.. one for each stator of the dual nertrac....,... Yes.. 4000$ of controller!!!

Our project total investment is just at 12 000 $ and we thing we used the top quality and performance components ... i admit that if we would need spending for 2nd controller it would be killing us!!

Let say that a 1500$ DC brushed controller and two agni 95R cost less and give a little more power....

We just hope that this great advanture of using hub motor is not turning into a nightmare... we keep confident that the new controller will solve the problem.

I just remember how a 5302 is a controller killer on our ebikes.. .. we have the equivalent of 2 in parallel Dohhhh!

see our project here: http://www.evalbum.com/3931

Thanks you Mark for the big help to try debuging our controller-hub motor issue. we will wait to receive the new controller and will post updates

Doc