how to program a sevcon gen4

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Doctorbass
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Re: how to program a sevcon gen4

Post by Doctorbass » Jun 15, 2014 4:18 pm

Arlo1 wrote:
Doctorbass wrote:
Arlo1 wrote:I wonder how long it took Ryan to find that out :)

Yeah it was not that long! he replied me about 10 minutes after i emailed him in CC with Luke 8)

My plans now are to get a Size 6 ASAP, and then to install it on the 2012 S, and take the ME0913 and the Size 4 and install them on my 2009 Zero X frame and operate them at 116V for a drag bike :twisted:
Actually I ment the first time he discovered the problem...

As for me I just picked up a 2007 kx250f from a fire I'm going to cut the front off and weld it to a zero frame and make my race bike with 2 size fours.

2 Size 4 !! OMG !! did you know that there is some Size 8 availlable :lol: But i agree that you can put 2 size 4 for alot cheaper and get higher power as well!

Doc
CURRENT PROJECT: 2WD duo MXUS/Max-E ebike 32kW
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Re: how to program a sevcon gen4

Post by tomaj » Jun 15, 2014 4:57 pm

Well I just got Sevcon size 6 (650A) and Motenergy ME1302 motor :lol:

It is going to be a fun motorcycle to ride :mrgreen: 8)

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Re: how to program a sevcon gen4

Post by Doctorbass » Jun 15, 2014 8:30 pm

tomaj wrote:Well I just got Sevcon size 6 (650A) and Motenergy ME1302 motor :lol:

It is going to be a fun motorcycle to ride :mrgreen: 8)

That will be fun as well !! 60kW peak!
CURRENT PROJECT: 2WD duo MXUS/Max-E ebike 32kW
https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewto ... =3&t=65764
-Fastest speed record 117 km/h on flat
-Fastest 1/4 mile@ 114km/h on flat and 16.316 sec
-Succeded to haul a 19200 pounds schoolbus!
113kmh Gianthttp://www.evalbum.com/3406
Mongoosehttp://www.evalbum.com/1947
YOUTUBE---https://m.youtube.com/user/Doctorbasss
http://twitter.com/DocbassMelancon
I speak FRENCH and english

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Re: how to program a sevcon gen4

Post by tomaj » Jun 16, 2014 3:06 pm

I have just hook another Sevcon to DVT software and read those numbers:
product code: 0×0705302d
serial nr.: 1304100187
hardware version: 0×01000003

What was this controller meant for?
Hall, sin/cos encoder?

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Re: how to program a sevcon gen4

Post by Doctorbass » Jun 16, 2014 3:40 pm

Usually the gen4 with SN ending by 201 mean Hall sensor encodre and by 203 mean SIN/COS :wink:

Ending by 187 ?? I don't know.. is it a gen 4?

Doc
CURRENT PROJECT: 2WD duo MXUS/Max-E ebike 32kW
https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewto ... =3&t=65764
-Fastest speed record 117 km/h on flat
-Fastest 1/4 mile@ 114km/h on flat and 16.316 sec
-Succeded to haul a 19200 pounds schoolbus!
113kmh Gianthttp://www.evalbum.com/3406
Mongoosehttp://www.evalbum.com/1947
YOUTUBE---https://m.youtube.com/user/Doctorbasss
http://twitter.com/DocbassMelancon
I speak FRENCH and english

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Re: how to program a sevcon gen4

Post by tomaj » Jun 16, 2014 4:25 pm

Yes, I am familiar with that.

But 187 makes me very confused 8)

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Re: how to program a sevcon gen4

Post by tomaj » Jun 21, 2014 12:04 pm

I have started programming the controller. Everything is wired and I managed to pair controller with PC. I have already uploaded dld and dcf file for my motor.
Now the problem is that it is impossible to change settings in tree menu. It just reports fault like: application error: Error: can not read "xxx":no such variant.
At the bottom of the window I have green indication for comm open and CAN, and red indication (Not monitoring).

Any Idea?

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Re: how to program a sevcon gen4

Post by tomaj » Jun 22, 2014 1:14 pm

Now I tried with Windows 8 and it works :D
I get no fault codes but, motor does not spin. If I flip the reverse switch it struggles to spin and that is all :twisted:

How can I change the rotation direction?

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Re: how to program a sevcon gen4

Post by charlesb123 » Jun 22, 2014 2:23 pm

Sounds like you may have the sensor encoder out of sync. easy to reverse the motor, just swap any two motor wires, and the equivalent encoder wires.
The enclosed diagram might help.
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Gen4 to ME0907 - 4-11-12.pdf
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Re: how to program a sevcon gen4

Post by tomaj » Jun 22, 2014 2:55 pm

My motor has sin/cos sensor and I am not really sure which wires to swap :?

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Re: how to program a sevcon gen4

Post by Arlo1 » Jun 26, 2014 10:03 am

Hi guys. I'm having problems getting regen to come on when you Let off the throttle. Ryan has helped me a lot but I have something off. I can use the emergency stop switch to enable "Neutral" braking. But maybe my problem is the stop switch is hooked to pin 18 ans set as forward? So setting pin 9 as forward which is a virtual pin based on analog in 1 (throttle) won't work because I already have pin 18 as forward??
My Leaf motor controller build. viewtopic.php?f=30&t=63982&p=963227#p963227
My YSR build http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BRo8r5g4NBg
RC and most types of Lithium batteries you MUST know your individual cell voltages charging and discharging.
Don't keep them were you cant afford smoke or fire!
Never above 4.2v never below 2.7v EVER!!!
HI power controller design. Game Changer
http://www.undergroundelectrics.ca/

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Re: how to program a sevcon gen4

Post by Doctorbass » Jun 26, 2014 10:51 am

Arlo1 wrote:Hi guys. I'm having problems getting regen to come on when you Let off the throttle. Ryan has helped me a lot but I have something off. I can use the emergency stop switch to enable "Neutral" braking. But maybe my problem is the stop switch is hooked to pin 18 ans set as forward? So setting pin 9 as forward which is a virtual pin based on analog in 1 (throttle) won't work because I already have pin 18 as forward??

Maybe contact BSDThw from the electricmotorcycleforum, he helped me a lot with the Sevcon!

I also have the indication for variable regen that I got from sevcon :wink: but I have not installed that yet...

Right now I have problem with that field weakening feature... it seem that the motor loose sync at high speed when the field weakening begin... it suddenly drop speed... and enter into a kind of speed limitation and oscillate until stabilized.... I can hear the motor reaching 6000rpm briefly but it fall to about 3000 or 4000rpm itself and sustain that speed...

Here is what it does: ( this is a video I sent to Biff)

and here is the log data where you can see the motor current and the rpm:
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doc-field-weakening.JPG
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CURRENT PROJECT: 2WD duo MXUS/Max-E ebike 32kW
https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewto ... =3&t=65764
-Fastest speed record 117 km/h on flat
-Fastest 1/4 mile@ 114km/h on flat and 16.316 sec
-Succeded to haul a 19200 pounds schoolbus!
113kmh Gianthttp://www.evalbum.com/3406
Mongoosehttp://www.evalbum.com/1947
YOUTUBE---https://m.youtube.com/user/Doctorbasss
http://twitter.com/DocbassMelancon
I speak FRENCH and english

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Re: how to program a sevcon gen4

Post by Doctorbass » Jun 26, 2014 10:53 am

tomaj wrote:My motor has sin/cos sensor and I am not really sure which wires to swap :?

if you want to change the rotation direction just swap the SIN and COS wires and also swap the M2 and M3 phase lead :wink:

the sin/cos encoder have 4 wires. two for the power and to for the signal.. just find the ground and also wich have 5 or 10V or 12V...

Doc
CURRENT PROJECT: 2WD duo MXUS/Max-E ebike 32kW
https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewto ... =3&t=65764
-Fastest speed record 117 km/h on flat
-Fastest 1/4 mile@ 114km/h on flat and 16.316 sec
-Succeded to haul a 19200 pounds schoolbus!
113kmh Gianthttp://www.evalbum.com/3406
Mongoosehttp://www.evalbum.com/1947
YOUTUBE---https://m.youtube.com/user/Doctorbasss
http://twitter.com/DocbassMelancon
I speak FRENCH and english

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Re: how to program a sevcon gen4

Post by Doctorbass » Jun 26, 2014 11:11 am

I have found a really interesting thread about that great feature the sevcon controller does have:

the FIELD WEAKENING

on the diyelectricar forum:

http://www.diyelectriccar.com/forums/sh ... 93277.html

some highlight:

Image


From: gunnarhs on diyelectriccar forum

Hi, as stated from members before , the dyno tests starts at 70V /4000 RPM with very low load. At this point efficiency is very low (30-40%)
When more load is applied (holding voltage, and rpm "constant" ) amperage, torque and efficiency increases, efficiency up to 80%.
The highest efficiency should be near base-speed of motor (which is??) and under full load. For a PM-AC this should normally be about 90%.
So I assume that either
1) The motor is not fully loaded
2) The base speed is not 4000 RPM

And now to the FOC - algorithm which holds the voltage/rpm "constant" under different load. Assuming magnets are in the rotor you apply three AC phases to the stator which are typically 120 degree shifted.
When adding the three components (either in rotor or stator frame) you get 2 currents Id and Iq (and two corresponding magnetic fields induced by this currents) which are 90 degree shifted.
One magnetic component is parallel to the magnetic rotor field (induced by Id), the other to the stator coil field (induced by Iq). Together they produce the torque required for the rotation of the load in addition to the magnetic field of the PM present:

T = k1*Iq X (k2*Id + Bpm),

k1 and k2 are constants based on stator inductance,Bpm is the PM-field
For PM-machine the present PM-field in the rotor is usually strong so you try to keep the current Id as little as possible to simplify control.
That leaves Iq as the torque determining component (Id -> 0):

T = k1*Iq X Bpm, with Bpm the constant field from the PM.

As load increases, Iq is increased, this works up to base speed.
Over base-speed Id must be set negative to produce a field opposing Bpm.



From Riwe on diyelectriccar forum


During testing we took some logs as well. Both Iq and Id was monitored and we saw that the highest motor rpm without applied Id is approx. 1650 rpm. This is using a 48V controller.

The picture on the bottom shows the motor running at approx. 2400rpm. Id applied is at the moment -138 A. We can also see that Id is not present until approx. 1650rpm.

As I was told the base speed is dependent on the voltage of the controller. If I would use a 72 Volt controller the base speed would be higher because the controller can handle a higher voltage from the motor before applying Id.
Id in motenergy motors are “normally” (I’ve seen this value in 3 different configurations from Sevcon) set to -200A and we hit that value during our tests. If we increased the Id we got a higher RPM.

I would think that even if I dont run the motor at 72volt the efficiency would be higher and as Major said motenergy claim up to 92% between 24-72V.

I guess there is something wrong with either my config or the way we measure.

To be continued...

Thank you all!

Rikard







Attachments
field weakening log.png
field weakening log.png (87.02 KiB) Viewed 2155 times
CURRENT PROJECT: 2WD duo MXUS/Max-E ebike 32kW
https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewto ... =3&t=65764
-Fastest speed record 117 km/h on flat
-Fastest 1/4 mile@ 114km/h on flat and 16.316 sec
-Succeded to haul a 19200 pounds schoolbus!
113kmh Gianthttp://www.evalbum.com/3406
Mongoosehttp://www.evalbum.com/1947
YOUTUBE---https://m.youtube.com/user/Doctorbasss
http://twitter.com/DocbassMelancon
I speak FRENCH and english

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Re: how to program a sevcon gen4

Post by Arlo1 » Jun 26, 2014 1:20 pm

Doc you need to keep the sine/cosine wires away from all other wires especially the phase and battery wires. Also should be twisted. Maybe your problem is noise? I twisted the signal for my dyno sensor and it cleared the noise right up!
My Leaf motor controller build. viewtopic.php?f=30&t=63982&p=963227#p963227
My YSR build http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BRo8r5g4NBg
RC and most types of Lithium batteries you MUST know your individual cell voltages charging and discharging.
Don't keep them were you cant afford smoke or fire!
Never above 4.2v never below 2.7v EVER!!!
HI power controller design. Game Changer
http://www.undergroundelectrics.ca/

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Re: how to program a sevcon gen4

Post by Arlo1 » Jun 27, 2014 12:49 am

Got my regen working the number or pins had to be set correctly.
My Leaf motor controller build. viewtopic.php?f=30&t=63982&p=963227#p963227
My YSR build http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BRo8r5g4NBg
RC and most types of Lithium batteries you MUST know your individual cell voltages charging and discharging.
Don't keep them were you cant afford smoke or fire!
Never above 4.2v never below 2.7v EVER!!!
HI power controller design. Game Changer
http://www.undergroundelectrics.ca/

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Re: how to program a sevcon gen4

Post by Arlo1 » Jun 30, 2014 10:57 pm

Got another sevcon running... :) Although I did not do all the work. I had to mess with some of it. It was preprogrammed.
My Leaf motor controller build. viewtopic.php?f=30&t=63982&p=963227#p963227
My YSR build http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BRo8r5g4NBg
RC and most types of Lithium batteries you MUST know your individual cell voltages charging and discharging.
Don't keep them were you cant afford smoke or fire!
Never above 4.2v never below 2.7v EVER!!!
HI power controller design. Game Changer
http://www.undergroundelectrics.ca/

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Re: how to program a sevcon gen4

Post by pm_dawn » Jul 05, 2014 4:40 pm

@Arlo1:

Hi !
Nice spin !

I'm pulling my hair on a Gen4 size4 /me0913 combo.
is that a me0913 on that video ?

Do you care to share your DCF with me ?
I have a couple of files but none of them gets me to that state where the motor is spinning like that.

Regards
/Per Eklund

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Re: how to program a sevcon gen4

Post by Doctorbass » Jul 07, 2014 12:08 pm

Is the v1.5 IXXAT compatible with the Sevcon Gen4 controller?

I know that the one Zero use is the v1.6 , I wonder if it would be compatible and what is the difference between v1.5 and v1.6 ?

Does anyone use the v1.5 with success for the Sevcon?

Doc
CURRENT PROJECT: 2WD duo MXUS/Max-E ebike 32kW
https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewto ... =3&t=65764
-Fastest speed record 117 km/h on flat
-Fastest 1/4 mile@ 114km/h on flat and 16.316 sec
-Succeded to haul a 19200 pounds schoolbus!
113kmh Gianthttp://www.evalbum.com/3406
Mongoosehttp://www.evalbum.com/1947
YOUTUBE---https://m.youtube.com/user/Doctorbasss
http://twitter.com/DocbassMelancon
I speak FRENCH and english

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Re: how to program a sevcon gen4

Post by tomaj » Jul 07, 2014 1:27 pm

Yes, I use IXXAT compact V1.5 and it works.

Only I am not compatible with Sevcon :D It drives me crazy :mrgreen:

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Re: how to program a sevcon gen4

Post by Doctorbass » Jul 07, 2014 2:19 pm

tomaj wrote:Yes, I use IXXAT compact V1.5 and it works.

Only I am not compatible with Sevcon :D It drives me crazy :mrgreen:
So you say YES the Sevcon work with the IXXAT v1.5 right?

Doc
CURRENT PROJECT: 2WD duo MXUS/Max-E ebike 32kW
https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewto ... =3&t=65764
-Fastest speed record 117 km/h on flat
-Fastest 1/4 mile@ 114km/h on flat and 16.316 sec
-Succeded to haul a 19200 pounds schoolbus!
113kmh Gianthttp://www.evalbum.com/3406
Mongoosehttp://www.evalbum.com/1947
YOUTUBE---https://m.youtube.com/user/Doctorbasss
http://twitter.com/DocbassMelancon
I speak FRENCH and english

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Re: how to program a sevcon gen4

Post by tomaj » Jul 07, 2014 2:32 pm

YES it works with IXXAT compact V1.5.

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Re: how to program a sevcon gen4

Post by Doctorbass » Jul 07, 2014 3:47 pm

tomaj wrote:YES it works with IXXAT compact V1.5.

Excellent!!

Doc
CURRENT PROJECT: 2WD duo MXUS/Max-E ebike 32kW
https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewto ... =3&t=65764
-Fastest speed record 117 km/h on flat
-Fastest 1/4 mile@ 114km/h on flat and 16.316 sec
-Succeded to haul a 19200 pounds schoolbus!
113kmh Gianthttp://www.evalbum.com/3406
Mongoosehttp://www.evalbum.com/1947
YOUTUBE---https://m.youtube.com/user/Doctorbasss
http://twitter.com/DocbassMelancon
I speak FRENCH and english

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Re: how to program a sevcon gen4

Post by ceibnu » Jul 10, 2014 3:59 pm

Does somebody know how to get de default dcf file for a gen4 size 6 (Model G4845)?

By the way, has somebody set up this controller to the motor PMS120 (Heinzmann)?

I got this project that was started by other person, but as far as I know it has never worked.

I would appresiate any help (manuals, turorials, the dcf file, etc)

Thanks in advanced

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Re: how to program a sevcon gen4

Post by querlenker » Jul 10, 2014 4:11 pm

There are different models of the PMS 120, I could share the manufactory standard values of a 72/80v 10,5kw water cooled version.

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