Supplimentary batteries for a ZEV scooter

General Discussion about large electric scooters and motorcycles and other things with no pedals.
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Typopanther
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Supplimentary batteries for a ZEV scooter

Post by Typopanther » Dec 23, 2017 6:17 pm

Greetings everyone,

I have a 2011 ZEV 6100 (http://zelectricvehicle.com/17.html)

Right now it has 24 40AH LIFePO4 cells with a 100A draw, which gives me a max charge of around 87.6V. That gives me around 27-28Ah which translates to about 25-30 miles at around 35-40 mph. My job is moving to a new location so my 10.5 mile commute is turning into 23, and I'm not sure if I'll be able to make it all the way with my current capacity.

So, a friend recommended I come here to get some options for some kind of additional battery pack to give me a little bit more range.

My charging system is made up of two Mean Well HRP-600-48's (https://www.arrow.com/en/products/hrp-6 ... nterprises), and I would want to be able to use that for whatever I add on.

I imagine I could switch to 60AH cells but that would require a new BMS and probably a much bigger project than I want to take on at the moment.

Thanks for any help that can be offered. I'll do my best to answer any questions but my knowledge of electronics is still pretty limited.

- Daniel

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x.l.r.8
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Re: Supplimentary batteries for a ZEV scooter

Post by x.l.r.8 » Dec 23, 2017 8:51 pm

why not buy a second charger and charge at work if able. 2nd choice and probably the easiest get a second pack the same as the 1st in capacity and either fix it somewhere and swap plugs over for the way home. that way you have a second pack and if one goes you still have your scooter. Yes you have to charge packs separately but a second charger once again solves that problem. Also you can leave a pack/ and weight at home if your doing local trips.
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amberwolf
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Re: Supplimentary batteries for a ZEV scooter

Post by amberwolf » Dec 25, 2017 2:22 am

Typopanther wrote:
Dec 23, 2017 6:17 pm
I imagine I could switch to 60AH cells but that would require a new BMS
It shouldn't require a new BMS. If they are the same kind of cells, and the same number in series, and the output current is the same (just greater capacity total), the same BMS can manage the larger cells. It might take longer to balance them if they aren't good cells and don't stay in balance, but that's the only thing I can think of that would be any different.

If you have the room (probably not) you could even wire the 60Ah in parallel with the 40Ah at cell-level, and use the same BMS for both.


You could also try out some aerodynamics improvements, and see how much that reduces your power usage. Tailsock, taller/wider windshield, etc.

Additionally, at those speeds, if it's possible to go just 5MPH slower, you will also extend your range by reducing power usage. Probably not practical for a commute, though.

IBScootn
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Re: Supplimentary batteries for a ZEV scooter

Post by IBScootn » Dec 26, 2017 8:08 am

I used to own this bike. These are GBS 40AH cells so the existing BMS will still work with 60AH cells. The problem is 60AH cells won’t fit in the battery box area. A second 40AH set of GBS cells won’t fit on the bike. If you deeply discharge the pack, the pack tends to become unbalanced as the BMS only provides 100mA -200mA of balancing current. So the OP is trying to add capacity to make it to his work without draining the existing pack especially on very cold Colorado winter days.

Some possibilities:
1. Tow a trailer with a second battery pack.
2. A second battery pack of 15-20AH LiFe cells might fit on the back of the bike.
3. Use a second pack with a different battery chemistry that can safely supply the required 100A, at least 15AH capacity, and in a smaller footprint than LiFe cells.
4. Replace existing pack with Leaf battery modules (unsure if they fit).

An extra 15AH, should allow him to commute to the new workplace at a reasonable commuting speed.

Does anyone know a reliable source for a high power density pack with a footprint that at least 1/3 the size of the GBS Life cells?
Motorcycles:
ZEV T7100, 84V, 60AH, 65+mph; Mods: TNC throttle, windshield, Cycle Analyst , Cell Log , and custom charger
Kymco GT300i - for long rides through the Rocky Mountains
Big EV Grin. :)

IBScootn
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Re: Supplimentary batteries for a ZEV scooter

Post by IBScootn » Dec 26, 2017 8:28 am

His current battery pack consists of six of these 4-cell modules:
40AH, 126 x 198 x 189mm, 6.60kg
So a 39.6kg pack.
Motorcycles:
ZEV T7100, 84V, 60AH, 65+mph; Mods: TNC throttle, windshield, Cycle Analyst , Cell Log , and custom charger
Kymco GT300i - for long rides through the Rocky Mountains
Big EV Grin. :)

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Re: Supplimentary batteries for a ZEV scooter

Post by Scottydog » Dec 26, 2017 10:08 am

Looks like mission impossible as it kinda looks like even with the 60Ah cells you would be pressed? I was using 20 x 60Ah GBS cells on my bike. I am sure there is a way to make the 24 x 60Ah fit your bike, might have to lose the helmet storage if there is any. I like the charge at work idea, though if you get there and an hour in you had to return home could be tricky getting home.

One thing I have learned on my GBS cells is don't get anywhere near the max limit of the cells as they suffer and will begin to fail. So just be sure whatever you do you have plenty in reserve.

The trailer option with 11 x Nissan leaf cans from the older style might work? I think your charger would be under that packs max limit so could getaway without a bms and you would have huge capacity!

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