What is the "Light Weight" go to "Hobby" Lithium packs

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Tommy L
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What is the "Light Weight" go to "Hobby" Lithium packs

Post by Tommy L » Sep 21, 2017 11:07 pm

Hello everyone!

I have been super busy the past two years. I moved from Canada to St Augustine Florida.
Started a business, and also play in a touring band. Dang! I'm busy!
Just rode my Ebike for the first time in two years!
I'm still using LiFePO4's.........
I need to be Lighter.

What is the go to these days? I don't have a spot welder, so making the Pan or Sam is not an option, but I could purchase a premade one or
just use the "Hobby King" ones.

I've been BMS free on my LiFePO4's for years...... I usually use 50% of the pack on a max round trip. My current pack is around 530 Watt hours
and weighs in at 9KG or 20lbs. Brutal......as I have no frame space on my bicycle and I have this in a backpack.

I need to run at around 100 volts(my controller is an older GRIN with 100v caps).
30amps is what my CA is set at and it hits 36amp max according to the CA's readout. 3kw is plenty for me!
My wheel is a 9C2810.... hence the High Voltage ;)

A KW/h pack would be great! What are my today options?
Thank you Greatly!

Methods...... If you read this.... I'm still using your 9C 2810 and the Grin Controller 7225 that you beefed to do 50amps. I only run it at 30amps.:)

Tommy L sends.....
http://www.rawvelocity.com

- 4th Hoolagan FS Mtn 9C-2810 with 128v nom 9.2ah A123 40S40P(1.2Kw) - Lyen 18Fet 4115 - 77.8kph :)
https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewto ... =4&t=39480

- 3rd Catrike 700 Bionx PL350 Velo build
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rYdnkaAhVtI

- 2nd 150lbs Pusher Trailer
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q1qTc4sjORY

- 1st Sears NS mtn bike - Rigid 10a drill 800rpm - 2 12v AGM - 1000 watt inverter - 600w dimmer for throttle, wicked torque!

48.2mph/77.8kph Club

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dogman dan
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Re: What is the "Light Weight" go to "Hobby" Lithium packs

Post by dogman dan » Sep 22, 2017 6:10 am

Depends on where to you want to go.

If you want to go to cheap, then typically a 20c rated turnigy pack is a good buy. ( when you run at least 10-20 ah of it) But its a horrible time to buy, right when summer is ending and batteries in stock are limited. I always looked for my new lipo in early spring, just after Chinese new year, like March or April.

If budget allows, then start asking about higher c rate flavors, especially if you want to go really light, and run 5-7 ah.

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Tommy L
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Re: What is the "Light Weight" go to "Hobby" Lithium packs

Post by Tommy L » Sep 23, 2017 9:23 am

dogman dan wrote:Depends on where to you want to go.

If you want to go to cheap, then typically a 20c rated turnigy pack is a good buy. ( when you run at least 10-20 ah of it) But its a horrible time to buy, right when summer is ending and batteries in stock are limited. I always looked for my new lipo in early spring, just after Chinese new year, like March or April.

If budget allows, then start asking about higher c rate flavors, especially if you want to go really light, and run 5-7 ah.
Hi Dogman!

Longtime no chat! and the (OP) says why.....
Very nice to see your reply......

Wow..... Luna Cycle has got some amazing prices. I found them on a search for a BB system for my wife. My wife has had two strokes and is now in heart failure.
All since we moved to Florida. :( But she has a Pacemaker now, which helps a lot! She went for a Bicycle ride the day before yesterday.
I had put a Bionx system a while back on her Catrike and she loved it. But now she has a regular Diamond Back and I can get a BB02 for 750 with a 18650 pack.
I can't believe how much the prices have come down in the past two years!

Anyways...... for me Luna offers an 18650 72v 11.6ah 20s pack:
https://lunacycle.com/72v-panasonic-pf-11-6ah/

I cant believe the size and weight. 13 x 3 x 4 and 12lbs

Mine is: 12 x 12 x 4 and 18lbs and only 6.9ah (24s of LiFePO4 79.2v nominal) around 530wh
or my other pack is: 12 x 12 x 4 and 26lbs and 9.2ah (24s of LifePO4 79.2v nominal) around 700 wh

so half the weight of my bigger pack and way smaller! and more wh to boot. Less nominal voltage though.......

I like to run at close to 80v or above. My A123 18650 cells are rated 3.3v nominal instead of the 3.2v like other LiFePO4's.

So you can see that I have a Big Old Heavy Pack..... But works great. Looking for Lighter and Smaller solutions on todays market.

Hobby foils or 18650 cell? This time I'll try to use a BMS..... hoping that is better these days too.

Any More Thoughts? Dogman? or others?
Bump Bump! :)
http://www.rawvelocity.com

- 4th Hoolagan FS Mtn 9C-2810 with 128v nom 9.2ah A123 40S40P(1.2Kw) - Lyen 18Fet 4115 - 77.8kph :)
https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewto ... =4&t=39480

- 3rd Catrike 700 Bionx PL350 Velo build
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rYdnkaAhVtI

- 2nd 150lbs Pusher Trailer
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q1qTc4sjORY

- 1st Sears NS mtn bike - Rigid 10a drill 800rpm - 2 12v AGM - 1000 watt inverter - 600w dimmer for throttle, wicked torque!

48.2mph/77.8kph Club

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Re: What is the "Light Weight" go to "Hobby" Lithium packs

Post by wineboyrider » Sep 23, 2017 10:55 am

Tool packs like greenworks,echo or EGO in series or parallel?
ES IS SAVED! THANK YOU JUSTIN.

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Re: What is the "Light Weight" go to "Hobby" Lithium packs

Post by Ykick » Sep 23, 2017 11:14 am

Good to see you Tommy L, ‘wondered what you were up to? Sorry about the missus - I hope your touring gig doesn’t take you too far for too long?

I still use combinations of 20C 5Ah RC Lipo with a cheap/small eBay BMS installed for charging only. While discharging the bike LVC will probably catch anything too serious and even if it does go up in flames at least a bike (like lawn power tool) is used outdoors.

Charging I feel better with a BMS but it doesn’t need to be a large powerful BMS. Something 10-20A is dirt cheap and when wired only for charging (discharge directly from pack leads) seems to be a practical compromise, in my experience. Still keep an eye on 'em and charge in a relatively fire-proof location.

Luna carries a nice small 18650 pack for about $300. Mighty mini, I believe? 650-700Wh Shark/Dolphin packs sell for about $500. Not a bad way to go if you don’t wanna play the RC Lipo odds?

Good luck and rock on bro!
Last edited by Ykick on Sep 24, 2017 11:03 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Tommy L
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Re: What is the "Light Weight" go to "Hobby" Lithium packs

Post by Tommy L » Sep 23, 2017 10:37 pm

Ykick wrote:Good to see you Tommy L, ‘wondered what you were up to? Sorry about the missus - I hope your touring gig doesn’t take you too far for too long?

I still use combinations of 20C 5Ah RC Lipo with a cheap/small eBay BMS installed for charging only. While discharging the bike BMS will probably catch anything too serious and even if it does go up in flames at least a bike (like lawn power tool) is used outdoors.

Charging I feel better with a BMS but it doesn’t need to be a large powerful BMS. Something 10-20A is dirt cheap and when wired only for charging (discharge directly from pack leads) seems to be a practical compromise, in my experience. Still keep an eye on 'em and charge in a relatively fire-proof location.

Luna carries a nice small 18650 pack for about $300. Mighty mini, I believe? 650-700Wh Shark/Dolphin packs sell for about $500. Not a bad way to go if you don’t wanna play the RC Lipo odds?

Good luck and rock on bro!
I sent you a PM. :)
http://www.rawvelocity.com

- 4th Hoolagan FS Mtn 9C-2810 with 128v nom 9.2ah A123 40S40P(1.2Kw) - Lyen 18Fet 4115 - 77.8kph :)
https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewto ... =4&t=39480

- 3rd Catrike 700 Bionx PL350 Velo build
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rYdnkaAhVtI

- 2nd 150lbs Pusher Trailer
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q1qTc4sjORY

- 1st Sears NS mtn bike - Rigid 10a drill 800rpm - 2 12v AGM - 1000 watt inverter - 600w dimmer for throttle, wicked torque!

48.2mph/77.8kph Club

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Re: What is the "Light Weight" go to "Hobby" Lithium packs

Post by neptronix » Sep 24, 2017 12:07 am

Your lifepo4 is gonna be between 80 to 130whrs/kg..

As far as the turnigy line goes..

20C lipo = 150whrs/kg -pretty good leap over your lifepo4, but do you need all that power?
10C multistar lipo = 190whrs/kg - close to Samsung 25R.
2C multistar lipo = 250-260whrs/kg - closest to the highest energy density 18650 cells on the market, such as the Samsung GA.

You sure you wanna learn the ins and outs of a RC Lipo pack though? those 18650 packs have came down in price and aren't as 'splodey..
My first major build: 8T MAC motor on a Trek 4500.
The new all-arounder: Leafmotor 1500w on a Turner O2 full suspension.
The wheelie machine: 20" Rear Magic Pie II on a Trek 4300 MTB

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Tommy L
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Re: What is the "Light Weight" go to "Hobby" Lithium packs

Post by Tommy L » Sep 24, 2017 9:55 am

neptronix wrote:You sure you wanna learn the ins and outs of a RC Lipo pack though? those 18650 packs have came down in price and aren't as 'splodey..
And this is why i love this forum!
Im seeing the 18650 priced close to the
Hobby packs. But I no nothing of the
Sam/Pan cells. I take it the Sam/Pan cells
are safer? Are they as safe as LiFePO4's?
http://www.rawvelocity.com

- 4th Hoolagan FS Mtn 9C-2810 with 128v nom 9.2ah A123 40S40P(1.2Kw) - Lyen 18Fet 4115 - 77.8kph :)
https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewto ... =4&t=39480

- 3rd Catrike 700 Bionx PL350 Velo build
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rYdnkaAhVtI

- 2nd 150lbs Pusher Trailer
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q1qTc4sjORY

- 1st Sears NS mtn bike - Rigid 10a drill 800rpm - 2 12v AGM - 1000 watt inverter - 600w dimmer for throttle, wicked torque!

48.2mph/77.8kph Club

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Re: What is the "Light Weight" go to "Hobby" Lithium packs

Post by motomech » Sep 24, 2017 1:50 pm

Tommy L wrote:
neptronix wrote:You sure you wanna learn the ins and outs of a RC Lipo pack though? those 18650 packs have came down in price and aren't as 'splodey..
And this is why i love this forum!
Im seeing the 18650 priced close to the
Hobby packs. But I no nothing of the
Sam/Pan cells. I take it the Sam/Pan cells
are safer? Are they as safe as LiFePO4's?
Im seeing the 18650 priced close to the
Hobby packs.
Over the past couple of years, those of us who follow LiPoly prices have seen the useful sizes(Read;Large)of the Multistar almost always deeply dis-counted. I just priced-out my current main pack of 4) MultiStar 6S/10,000 mAh from the US West warehouse-$270, which includes the shipping. That's 20Ah's of 44V, which on my bike produces a range of 30 to 40 miles! I don't follow the prices of round cells, But I thinking no other chemistry comes close in cost/energy capacity.
Motomech

'03 Rocky Mountain Edge 2WD 260 Q100H frt and Ezee V1 rear 2 Elifebike 20A & 25A 9-FET controllers 12S/20Ah Multistar Lipo rear 5Ah Turnigy frt Luna Cyclops Extra lite Alex 24DM rims, 2.4 Holly Rollers run ghetto tubeless. 25 mph. Mean Well HLG-320H-48A
https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewt ... =3&t=83430
'07 GT Idive 4 4.0, Q100C 201 12S LiPoly elifebike 9-FET 17A controller. 20 MPH.
https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewt ... 8#p1237928

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Re: What is the "Light Weight" go to "Hobby" Lithium packs

Post by Tommy L » Sep 25, 2017 9:13 am

I just weighed my pack... 9KG (20lbs) for 546 w/h :(

A whopping 60.66 w/h per KG
My cylindrical a123 cells are in an ABS enclosure 4P4S config 13.2v nominal 6.9ah. So I'm closer to 80 w/h per KG.

well....... Better than lead and it was very awesome 7 years ago!

I guess I could also pull a trailer with a bunch of LiFePO4's in it. I have lots of them! lol
I think I have around 3kw of LiFePO4. Might as well pull a Gas/Propane or Diesel generator in that trailer then!
Did I say that out loud? lol! JK ;)
http://www.rawvelocity.com

- 4th Hoolagan FS Mtn 9C-2810 with 128v nom 9.2ah A123 40S40P(1.2Kw) - Lyen 18Fet 4115 - 77.8kph :)
https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewto ... =4&t=39480

- 3rd Catrike 700 Bionx PL350 Velo build
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rYdnkaAhVtI

- 2nd 150lbs Pusher Trailer
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q1qTc4sjORY

- 1st Sears NS mtn bike - Rigid 10a drill 800rpm - 2 12v AGM - 1000 watt inverter - 600w dimmer for throttle, wicked torque!

48.2mph/77.8kph Club

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Re: What is the "Light Weight" go to "Hobby" Lithium packs

Post by ScooterMan101 » Sep 25, 2017 6:22 pm

If you do go with Hobby Lipo's , get two chargers, at least 7 amp each,
and
A Good Power Supply, 20 amps or more . Many here that use lipo's use the Meanwell Power supply's.

If you want high draw from the pack, and you do want to get the 18650's then get many in Parallel.
I will not do the math right now, but you would want at least a 5 p pack or more like 6 p ( How many Cells in Parallel )
These will be the higher priced and weight packs. do you have room in the frame for them ?

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Tommy L
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Re: What is the "Light Weight" go to "Hobby" Lithium packs

Post by Tommy L » Sep 25, 2017 7:07 pm

ScooterMan101 wrote:If you do go with Hobby Lipo's , get two chargers, at least 7 amp each,
and
A Good Power Supply, 20 amps or more . Many here that use lipo's use the Meanwell Power supply's.

If you want high draw from the pack, and you do want to get the 18650's then get many in Parallel.
I will not do the math right now, but you would want at least a 5 p pack or more like 6 p ( How many Cells in Parallel )
These will be the higher priced and weight packs. do you have room in the frame for them ?

I have no Frame Room! :(
I'm using a BC168 charger (charges through Balance wires..... yes.... charges) I also use a 36v LiFePO4 charger (I split my pack in 1/2 and bulk charge)
I'm using a Server Pwr Sup to power my BC168 charger.

Luna Cycle has this:
https://lunacycle.com/72v-panasonic-pf-11-6ah/

a few hundred more than the multistars, but does have a BMS and Higher current ability.

Just more curious if people prefer to spend a bit more on the 18650's now.
and..... I need to be lighter!

828 w/h and only 12 LBS hmmmmm
http://www.rawvelocity.com

- 4th Hoolagan FS Mtn 9C-2810 with 128v nom 9.2ah A123 40S40P(1.2Kw) - Lyen 18Fet 4115 - 77.8kph :)
https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewto ... =4&t=39480

- 3rd Catrike 700 Bionx PL350 Velo build
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rYdnkaAhVtI

- 2nd 150lbs Pusher Trailer
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q1qTc4sjORY

- 1st Sears NS mtn bike - Rigid 10a drill 800rpm - 2 12v AGM - 1000 watt inverter - 600w dimmer for throttle, wicked torque!

48.2mph/77.8kph Club

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Re: What is the "Light Weight" go to "Hobby" Lithium packs

Post by motomech » Sep 26, 2017 12:21 am

a few hundred more than the multistars, but does have a BMS and Higher current ability.
72v Panasonic PF 11.6ah:

Price-$550
weight-12 lb.s
continuous discharge-50 Amps

3) MultiStar 6S/12,000 mAh-67 Volts:

price-$330(regular price, often on sale)
weight-9 lb.s
continuous disharge-40 Amp
Motomech

'03 Rocky Mountain Edge 2WD 260 Q100H frt and Ezee V1 rear 2 Elifebike 20A & 25A 9-FET controllers 12S/20Ah Multistar Lipo rear 5Ah Turnigy frt Luna Cyclops Extra lite Alex 24DM rims, 2.4 Holly Rollers run ghetto tubeless. 25 mph. Mean Well HLG-320H-48A
https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewt ... =3&t=83430
'07 GT Idive 4 4.0, Q100C 201 12S LiPoly elifebike 9-FET 17A controller. 20 MPH.
https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewt ... 8#p1237928

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Tommy L
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Re: What is the "Light Weight" go to "Hobby" Lithium packs

Post by Tommy L » Sep 26, 2017 8:59 am

motomech wrote:
a few hundred more than the multistars, but does have a BMS and Higher current ability.
72v Panasonic PF 11.6ah:

Price-$550
weight-12 lb.s
continuous discharge-50 Amps

3) MultiStar 6S/12,000 mAh-67 Volts:

price-$330(regular price, often on sale)
weight-9 lb.s
continuous disharge-40 Amp
Thank you for that! I'd probably throw in another 4S / 12,000 mAh for 22S :)
My controller can handle 100V but only 88V on the regen.....

But still no BMS...... I do have that BC168 charger for balancing and I could purchase some MEAN WELLs for bulk charging.

And if I get a DUD pack...... does Hobby send out another? If not, then the price starts to creep up too.
But this is the name of the game..... lol
http://www.rawvelocity.com

- 4th Hoolagan FS Mtn 9C-2810 with 128v nom 9.2ah A123 40S40P(1.2Kw) - Lyen 18Fet 4115 - 77.8kph :)
https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewto ... =4&t=39480

- 3rd Catrike 700 Bionx PL350 Velo build
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rYdnkaAhVtI

- 2nd 150lbs Pusher Trailer
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q1qTc4sjORY

- 1st Sears NS mtn bike - Rigid 10a drill 800rpm - 2 12v AGM - 1000 watt inverter - 600w dimmer for throttle, wicked torque!

48.2mph/77.8kph Club

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Re: What is the "Light Weight" go to "Hobby" Lithium packs

Post by 999zip999 » Sep 26, 2017 1:09 pm

I would go with the luna pack. Plug and play. Bms so if you loan your bike or ? It has hvc lvc and current limit. Plus you don't need a barbecue or safe place to charge and store.

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Re: What is the "Light Weight" go to "Hobby" Lithium packs

Post by Tommy L » Sep 26, 2017 6:16 pm

999zip999 wrote:I would go with the luna pack. Plug and play. Bms so if you loan your bike or ? It has hvc lvc and current limit. Plus you don't need a barbecue or safe place to charge and store.
All Good Points!

I found some 2000 Mah LG's for a good price.... not 3000 mah but the 2,000's

10s2P LG 18650 4.4ah 36v with bms for $35

10C continuous cells with 20C peak. A couple of these in Parallel then a couple in series ..... got to try it for $140 for 8.8ah 72v

hmmmmmm
Gets amazing reviews....
http://www.rawvelocity.com

- 4th Hoolagan FS Mtn 9C-2810 with 128v nom 9.2ah A123 40S40P(1.2Kw) - Lyen 18Fet 4115 - 77.8kph :)
https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewto ... =4&t=39480

- 3rd Catrike 700 Bionx PL350 Velo build
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rYdnkaAhVtI

- 2nd 150lbs Pusher Trailer
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q1qTc4sjORY

- 1st Sears NS mtn bike - Rigid 10a drill 800rpm - 2 12v AGM - 1000 watt inverter - 600w dimmer for throttle, wicked torque!

48.2mph/77.8kph Club

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Tommy L
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Re: What is the "Light Weight" go to "Hobby" Lithium packs

Post by Tommy L » Oct 09, 2017 10:26 am

..... The Cells are in!
Just waiting on a charger......

Any Recommendations?
http://www.rawvelocity.com

- 4th Hoolagan FS Mtn 9C-2810 with 128v nom 9.2ah A123 40S40P(1.2Kw) - Lyen 18Fet 4115 - 77.8kph :)
https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewto ... =4&t=39480

- 3rd Catrike 700 Bionx PL350 Velo build
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rYdnkaAhVtI

- 2nd 150lbs Pusher Trailer
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q1qTc4sjORY

- 1st Sears NS mtn bike - Rigid 10a drill 800rpm - 2 12v AGM - 1000 watt inverter - 600w dimmer for throttle, wicked torque!

48.2mph/77.8kph Club

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Tommy L
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Re: What is the "Light Weight" go to "Hobby" Lithium packs

Post by Tommy L » Oct 09, 2017 11:56 am

HLG-240H-42A

I ordered this Mean-Well

My 5 packs (36v nominal 4.4a/h each) Of LG cells.

This should do it from What i understand :)
http://www.rawvelocity.com

- 4th Hoolagan FS Mtn 9C-2810 with 128v nom 9.2ah A123 40S40P(1.2Kw) - Lyen 18Fet 4115 - 77.8kph :)
https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewto ... =4&t=39480

- 3rd Catrike 700 Bionx PL350 Velo build
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rYdnkaAhVtI

- 2nd 150lbs Pusher Trailer
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q1qTc4sjORY

- 1st Sears NS mtn bike - Rigid 10a drill 800rpm - 2 12v AGM - 1000 watt inverter - 600w dimmer for throttle, wicked torque!

48.2mph/77.8kph Club

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Tommy L
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Re: What is the "Light Weight" go to "Hobby" Lithium packs

Post by Tommy L » Oct 20, 2017 12:11 pm

Those EBAY LG Cells fade quick after the first Amp Hour from the pack.
Maybe good if you are a 15mph person. Bring lots.

So I bit the bullet and went for some Hobby King Multi Star 10AH 4S pack. Bought 6 packs for running 20 or 24S.

I love my LiFePO4's. They have been solid. Just too big and heavy.

So..... now onto the C4 plastic explosive packs! lol here we go!

I've been reading as a member here for 5 or 7 years now.

4.1v max charge and 3.6 max discharge voltage and the packs should be happy.

I purchased the Lipo alarms to monitor a cell that may have less capacity.
I will Capacity test before using it in a series pack. ;)

and monitor the heck out of them.


Any other thoughts?

Tommy L sends......
http://www.rawvelocity.com

- 4th Hoolagan FS Mtn 9C-2810 with 128v nom 9.2ah A123 40S40P(1.2Kw) - Lyen 18Fet 4115 - 77.8kph :)
https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewto ... =4&t=39480

- 3rd Catrike 700 Bionx PL350 Velo build
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rYdnkaAhVtI

- 2nd 150lbs Pusher Trailer
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q1qTc4sjORY

- 1st Sears NS mtn bike - Rigid 10a drill 800rpm - 2 12v AGM - 1000 watt inverter - 600w dimmer for throttle, wicked torque!

48.2mph/77.8kph Club

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Re: What is the "Light Weight" go to "Hobby" Lithium packs

Post by Jon NCal » Oct 20, 2017 5:45 pm

The cheap lipo alarms I had were so inaccurate at reading the individual cell voltages, 4-5 millivolts off on some if I remember correctly, that I got rid of them.

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Re: What is the "Light Weight" go to "Hobby" Lithium packs

Post by flat tire » Oct 20, 2017 8:40 pm

cheap lipo alarms suck a dick as mentioned above. I've had then by off by nearly 1/10 volt. The multistars are good but not that great; even older cells like the Samsung 25R and 30Q are much better in terms of $/Wh and Wh/Kg. I do like RC lipo but only high discharge, otherwise they've really fallen behind 18650 cans to an alarming extent. Also you can get a Aulakiria spot welder for $80 and this thing is top quality, even can do copper.
Orange DH w/ Cyclone mid on 6kw
Gary Fisher w/ Leaf hub on 6kw
RC Lipo and domino throttles only!

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motomech
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Re: What is the "Light Weight" go to "Hobby" Lithium packs

Post by motomech » Oct 21, 2017 12:34 am

Flat tire is not only vulgar, but misinformed.
The new MultiStar trades high discharge rates(and high volatility) for low cost, lite weight and sm. form factor
Today I received 4) MultiStar 6S/5200 mAh bricks for $200 US, which included shipping. They all arrived at 3.75-3.76 V/cell and tested fine. I have bought over 40 Ah's of MultiStar and have not had a dud cell yet.
I quickly made a 12S (44V nom.)/ 10,4000 pack that fits in the tiny over-the-frame saddle bag;
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When a 7 pound,10,400 mAh pack can be bought for $200, any talk of how round cells are superior in terms of $/Wh and Wh/Kg. doesn't add up.
Motomech

'03 Rocky Mountain Edge 2WD 260 Q100H frt and Ezee V1 rear 2 Elifebike 20A & 25A 9-FET controllers 12S/20Ah Multistar Lipo rear 5Ah Turnigy frt Luna Cyclops Extra lite Alex 24DM rims, 2.4 Holly Rollers run ghetto tubeless. 25 mph. Mean Well HLG-320H-48A
https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewt ... =3&t=83430
'07 GT Idive 4 4.0, Q100C 201 12S LiPoly elifebike 9-FET 17A controller. 20 MPH.
https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewt ... 8#p1237928

flat tire
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Re: What is the "Light Weight" go to "Hobby" Lithium packs

Post by flat tire » Oct 21, 2017 2:13 pm

No you really haven't thought this out. First you didn't pay $200 for those batteries you had to pay airmail from hong kong which as we know is more than the price of an additional pack. Even if you paid $200 the 18650 still wins out. Oh and yes, those lipo alarms truly eat ass.

Here are the numbers:

Turnigy 6s 5200:
https://hobbyking.com/en_us/multistar-h ... -pack.html
Formula is 1000 / battery capacity in Wh (nominal voltage of 3.7*cell series count*Ah) * $ / pack
$ / kWh is $431.91
Wh / Kg is 179.53

Compare to Samsung 25r and 30Q (in parenthesis), 400 cell purchase prices (100 are not that much higher) from IMRbatteries.com.

$ / kWh $324.32 ($360.36)
Wh / Kg 211.62 (240.78)

Now, this is for the cells without interconnects and protection, but interconnects are lightweight and your lipo still needs a connecting harness too. And the lipo batteries will need protection about equivalent to the weight of a case for 18650s, unless you want damage and fire.

Oh one more thing I forgot to mention. The multistars CAN be pretty cost effective but you need to buy them in the 16ah or 20ah versions.
Orange DH w/ Cyclone mid on 6kw
Gary Fisher w/ Leaf hub on 6kw
RC Lipo and domino throttles only!

Mugenski
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Re: What is the "Light Weight" go to "Hobby" Lithium packs

Post by Mugenski » Oct 21, 2017 3:25 pm

I got 12 of these https://www.genstattu.com/tattu-22-2v-5 ... -plug.html tattu packs shipped for 390USD. This was with free shipping and 15% off. Pleased with them for the price. Little saggy at higher amps but for the price I can't complain. I'm a little more ginger on the last 1/3rd the pack.
Giant Glory Tangent 6kw @ 44v

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motomech
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Re: What is the "Light Weight" go to "Hobby" Lithium packs

Post by motomech » Oct 21, 2017 7:57 pm

First you didn't pay $200 for those batteries you had to pay airmail from hong kong which as we know is more than the price of an additional pack
You are right, I didn't pay $200 for them, it was $177.90. Here is the pay Pal invoice for 2 of them;

Paid with
AMEX x-xxxx
You'll see "PAYPAL *HOBBYKING" on your card statement.
Ship to
gary truex
Tucson, AZ 85712
United States
Category
Return shipping refunds
Enroll free and request a refund
For more info See Terms
Seller info
hexTronik Limited
support@unitedhobbies.com
Entertainment
Transaction ID
0A175303D4650120B
Invoice ID
100844503
Purchase details
Multistar High Capacity 5200mAh 6S 10C Multi-Rotor Lipo Pack (Qty 2)$79.98
Item #912700003-0
Shipping$8.97
Total$88.95
Now, this is for the cells without interconnects and protection, but interconnects are lightweight and your lipo still needs a connecting harness too. And the lipo batteries will need protection about equivalent to the weight of a case for 18650s, unless you want damage and fire.
You just have to yell "fire" in a crowded house. I am so sick of you guys using scare tactics to try and justify the expense and complication of building a round cell battery pack.
And I don't know what you think is needed to configure four LiPoly bricks into a 2S/2P pack, but my "interconnects" consist of 4) Turnigy 4 m/m bullet connectors, about $4. That's it, nothing else. The LVC is in the controller.

Now you might have mentioned the expense and time needed to charge LiPoly and almost have had a sound argument, but not quite. Yeah, I wasted a whole bunch of money on RC "toy" chargers until I figured out my charging system several years ago.
It consists of the indestructable Mean Well potted HLG power supply w/ CC/CV and 4) Battery Medics, about $200 shipped.
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As far as charging procedure, yes, it's two stage process. I charge to a storage cell Voltage of 3.90V and right before I go out, top charge to 4.10 V. Takes 10 to 15 minutes. NBD
The multistars CAN be pretty cost effective but you need to buy them in the 16ah or 20ah versions.
Well, funny you should mention this. My main pack on my 2WD consists of 4) 6S/10000 mAh bricks configured 2S/2P for a 12S pack of 20000 mAh capacity and that cost me $270 shipped(want to see that invoice too?).
You are right, as one goes up in size, the MultiStars absolutely destroy your weight/energy/cost comparisions.
Motomech

'03 Rocky Mountain Edge 2WD 260 Q100H frt and Ezee V1 rear 2 Elifebike 20A & 25A 9-FET controllers 12S/20Ah Multistar Lipo rear 5Ah Turnigy frt Luna Cyclops Extra lite Alex 24DM rims, 2.4 Holly Rollers run ghetto tubeless. 25 mph. Mean Well HLG-320H-48A
https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewt ... =3&t=83430
'07 GT Idive 4 4.0, Q100C 201 12S LiPoly elifebike 9-FET 17A controller. 20 MPH.
https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewt ... 8#p1237928

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