Long-term reliability of BBS02vB.

What technical problems should someone expect when buying this product? Are these problems still worth it for commuting?

I want to commute 20km round-trip every weekday to work. I have read people having noise and bearing problems after only a few thousand kilometres. Does the BBS02vB need a lot of maintenance itself?

I feel like I should go with a geared-hub instead; my city, Auckland, is quite hilly. Probably the eZee for its reputation for hill-climbing here in New Zealand. But I still want to get that average speed up as much as possible which a mid-drive could do. But I still want the least maintenance required... hmm.

Thoughts?

BBSHD.

tomjasz said:

BBSHD.

Click to expand...

Why?

A company brings a newer model into production, and typically improve it over the previous one. Any wrinkles or failures associated with the older series are usually dealt with. Bafang went a few steps further by offering an even more powerful motor than previous models.

My BBS2 lasted for a long time before any mechanical failure, although I replaced the controller & regreased the gears. My electric odometer turned over. And I wasn't babying it. I got my money's worth from it and more.

But if you can afford the HD, go for it.

At 30A and 52V nominal (14S Li-Ion) which takes in 1560W.... Since it has more or equal 80% efficiency, this translate to more than 1250W mechanical output power, aka 1.67 Horse Power.
Fresh off the charger at 58.8V, 30A is 1764 W electical input that translates to at least 1411W mechanical output aka 1.89 Horse Power
At the more usual 48V (13S Li-ion), it takes 1440W electrical.... So that's 1150W mechanical output aka 1.54 Horse Power

Many people think the BBSHD can easily take 2500W. Someone's even pushed it to 88V and 50A (quite risky though) with a specialty made controller (pumping 4400Watts in !!)....

The BBSHD is a tank. It is much much more robust than the BBS02, period.
In comparison, the BBSO2 is working much closer to the limits.

BTW BBSHD has 160N.m torque on startup

Matador.

Just as a comparison : for 2 stroke motor scooters, 15 to 17 cc = 1 hp
So a 49 cc scooter would be 3.065 horse power (2240 W mechanical output... or roughfly 2800 W of input if efficiency is still 80%)

So basically, at 48V (and 30A), the BBSHD is a 25cc 2-stroke engine scooter (but lighter!). At 52V, it's a 27 cc. At 58.8V it's a 30 cc 2 stoke engine !

I got a bbs02 for sale if you want. It has a small ticking noise when pedaling but nothing major

Here's the thing about mid drives.

You could theoretically make one that is extremely reliable, but your issue is still going to be shredding various bits and pieces of the bike chain drivetrain over time, unless you've got low power levels, like 250-500w peak.

But each mid drive has it's own reliability issues.. we have yet to see s a flawless performer.. the BBSHD might be the best, but still, some parts seem to not be engineered to handle the power output over time, AFAIK.

The main reason i don't run a mid drive, no matter how well it's designed, is that the bike drivetrain is just not up to the task.. and no company has been smart enough to design the bits and pieces that utilize thicker BMX size chains, sprockets, and derailleurs ( 3 or 4 speed drivetrain ).

If you are thinking of a DD hub or geared hub as being the most reliable, you are barking up the right tree. the eZee/BMC/MAC hubs would have to be the most reliable and well engineered geared hubs ever built, and even the direct drive motors built from the leftovers that are scraped off the factory floor are more reliable than a geared hub, as there are very few parts to break

I'm just in the process of repairing a BBSHD. It was being run at pretty low power using the standard settings when it first became intermittent, then the magic smoke appeared. It needed a new controller and hall sensors. It's only done a few hundred miles.

d8veh said:

I'm just in the process of repairing a BBSHD. It was being run at pretty low power using the standard settings when it first became intermittent, then the magic smoke appeared. It needed a new controller and hall sensors. It's only done a few hundred miles.

Click to expand...

Wow. My bbs02 had controller issues within the first 100 miles.. intermittent operation.. throttle lag.. then i snapped a chain.. and that was the end of my interest in a BBSxx.

But that was a mid 2014 model.. they still don't know how to make a controller?

3000 flawless kilometers on my bbs02. but w/ controller tuned down to 22A and using 40t rear cog, 36t front chainring.

agree w/ neptronix about the weak bicycle drivetrain. just a PITA to maintain. accelerated chain and sprocket wear. frequent cleaning/lubing. etc. the only reason i use mid-drives is because i ride steep trails

I like my BBSHD, if I needed a serious climber MAYBE I'd buy another but if a Mac will do it... I'm transitioning to Mac motors. Enough BBSxx adventures from a company that provides shit support.

Nice..
The truth is that the BBSxx is oversold and overamped by many vendors.
Very smart of you to tune it down. My BBS02 was cranked all the way up to 28A from the vendor, and i was running a stiff 47v lipo pack However, i was able to smell the stator offgassing while climbing a 7% continuous grade at 9mph while pedaling furiously..

I did this stunt after the controller started being unreliable and intermittently failing to respond to the throttle. The controller just got worse after that.

Overall, i found it to be lacking compared to the MAC geared hub motors. Most of my riding is on the flats and i noticed the watt usage to sustain 1000W was pretty high. It's no surprise though.. as a mid drive has so many mechanical points to send power through.

I don't love hubs.. i don't like mid drives.. long term, i've got my eye on single stage rear chain reductions tho.. cuz.. best of both worlds!

Two BBS01's still running, one BBSHD running, two HD's retired and sold, one BBS02 and one clone under the bench. I paid in my time and money. Nuff. Would be more fun if they were not so persnickity. Seems they either run or break. While the Mxus 1000 and Mac just run. My nephew just bought a BBS02 without asking first. Argh. Bums me out that I couldn't level out his likely steep learning curve.

Edit to,add comparison BBSHD to BBS02

tomjasz said:

Two BBS01's still running, one BBSHD running, two HD's retired and sold, one BBS02 and one clone under the bench. I paid in my time and money. Nuff. Would be more fun if they were not so persnickity. Seems they either run or break. While the Mxus 1000 and Mac just run. My nephew just bought a BBS02 without asking first. Argh. Bums me out that I couldn't level out his likely steep learning curve.

Edit to,add comparison BBSHD to BBS02

Click to expand...

Yes, best vid I could find to compare the guts of the BBSHD and BBSO2 :
It is true the BBSHD is way overbuilt for 48V@30A (1440W input)...
I mean, the BBS02 runs 48V @25A.... That's 1200W input.
But when you look at this video, you can see that the BBSHD, in comparison, has a rotor and stator 5/3 the size of that of the BBS02 (5 cm deep instead of 3 cm deep). Check the vid at 28:45, you'll see what I mean.
[youtube]E46OW4ubK84[/youtube]
To me, that means the BBSHD should be handeling 2000W quite easily. At 48V, 2000W is 42 Amps...