Re: avanti D8085 - maybe to be renamed D8-93??

Discussions related to motors other than hub motors.
This includes R/C motors, botttom bracket, roller and geared drives.
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Re: So I want to start an RC... er, 'mid drive' build...

Post by nikos7 » Mon Dec 19, 2011 1:46 am

I would definitely not recommend the Bane Bots planetary. I have broken several sun and planet gears on the P80 9:1, 12:1 and 16:1, even under 60A @48V on an Astro 3220 7t. I called them about it (1 year ago) and they said that their gears were powdered metal from China. Unless they have improved their gears, I would not get them. I prefer heat-treated hobbed and ground gears from steel (1045 or 4140).
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Re: So I want to start an RC... er, 'mid drive' build...

Post by sn0wchyld » Mon Dec 19, 2011 2:42 am

warning - massive f'ing post, sorry....

thepronghorn wrote:I don't think you want a lyen sensorless controller. ...

In addition, you might also want to take a look at the P80 gearboxes made by banebots.....

......

Sorry to Hijack your thread Snowchyld (later post)......


no probs with that mate, so long as it A, resembles the topic B, talks about beer or C talks about attractive women or D all of the above im happy.

the controller I have been talking with lyen about is a non-infinion, and he has a few vids of it pushing the larger 170kv motors in a friction drive up to 60v, so given that it should be ok, though he doesn't know the max switching htz. Worst case scenario it can become a lower powered backup for the HT (though itll be pretty uninspiring at <70V) I could (just) afford a CC, and I'm getting a quote from matt for one, but since i'm starting with a smaller RC motor for ~3kw anyway the 6fet will hopefully work out.

Great find on the cheap boxes, though given others experience I think I'd rather spend the $$ and get something that is rated for atleast the torque ill be running. at ~150 delivered, i could be tempted in the future to try one in a low power chain puller <2kw.

right now im shifting between the GBPH-060x-NP:
Image

and the GBPH-090x-NS:
Image

price is about the same, but the top one has 25% higher imput speed and a smaller profile, at the sacrifice of torque handeling (30% of the second one). I know the larger 80-100's will put out peaks of about 9nm at about 100a, but does anyone know the torque of hte smaller motors like these? if its around 4nm or so then the smaller one should be fine, given its 'peak' torque is about 130nm, and the continual is about 45.
Image
https://www.leaderhobby.com/product.asp?ID=9394001224161&Location=HK

I'd prefer to go with the smaller of the two gearboxes, 120mm is far easyer to fit than 170 (though about 50mm is axle in each case), but it'll limit me to about 3kw im guessing. If I end up using the larger can motors ill be needing to upgrade the gearbox too.









bandaro wrote:looking good dude, to get it built over the holidays will mean you can't make any changes, as shipping in the new parts will take you over time...

Couple of things though, firstly regarding the motor, were you going to go the 6374-170 or the 80100-130? .....
............
I would love to take a squizz at your designs if I could, see how you have done it and if there are any problems I can see. If you want to pm me them/upload them that would be awesome.


So lastly, being both in OZ, if you are getting any parts from a seller that has a 13t sprocket and a 15t freewheeling sprocket in stock............

What degree are you doing at uni?


Yea im guessing that Ill miss the start of uni deadline by a country mile, given that it could take till the end of jan to gather all the parts just to start! but hey, you gotta set some sorta goal, and I got nothin but free time till then :twisted:

Motor wise, im starting with the one linked above, running at 40v and ~60-70a. eventually ill upgrade to a 80100 or the 170kv version of the same motor (is that the 6374?) EDIT i think I just figured what the #'s mean, ie can diameter x can length, in which case the 2nd motor will be the 8091.

Does anyone know of any simple cad software to quickly drum up some sketches :?: ive used solid works a little, but I lack the skill yet to build anything complex. might have to take a few days to train myself once everything is 'in the air'

free-wheel wise at this stage, im waiting to hear back from matt re buying his slipper clutch + a 1:1.3 pully (or near to) as well. Hopefully he has something like that available. if not ill have to find either a chain freewheel or a belt one. I'd much rather go with belt, but given the low tolerances i may end up using a chain to start with. For the BB ill be using prob. a white industries for one or both the motor and the pedal cranks. Ill let you know, ill be ordering prob. late on tues/wed.

Studying Electrical and sustainable engineering ad Adelaide uni. Just finished my first year. enjoying it so far, apart from the work load (50+hour weeks :cry: )



Once I hear back from matt ill start placing orders. with luck they'll start shipping before crissy. my guess is ill end up being held up waiting for the gearbox, ive sent 'em a email but if I dont hear back soon ill call em, though chances are they're on Christmas break already.



nikos7 wrote:I would definitely not recommend the Bane Bots planetary......


powdered metal eeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeewwwwwwwwwwwwwwwww! hehe. thanks for the tip. I think ill try out the higher rated stuff from AA.

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Re: So I want to start an RC... er, 'mid drive' build...

Post by sn0wchyld » Tue Dec 20, 2011 6:37 am

ok, so time to change this thread from 'I want to...' to 'I am....'



MOTORS
Order placed with leaders hoby for a 6470 170kv, a 8090 170kv and a 80100 130kv. also ordered some 6mm bullets since I had 150g to spare.


DRIVE-TERRAIN
I feel im missing something from my sickbikeparts order though,
1 x Chain Guard for 44 and 48 Tooth Chainring
2 x Chainring - Freewheel - 36 Tooth
1 x Chainring - Freewheel - 44 Tooth
3 x Chainring Hardware
1 x Chainring - Freewheel - 48 Tooth w/chain guard
2 x Front Freewheel - Heavy Duty
2 x Sprocket - 11 Tooth for Shift Kit
1 x Sprocket - 17 Tooth (standard left side) for Shift Kit
1 x Chain Breaker
1 x HD Freewheel Removal Tool for HD freewheel

Im ordering a couple of extra sprokets/chanrings incase I cant get the gearbox in a resonable timframe (still havent heard back from 'em... ) is there a better place to order this kind of stuff from? also, does sick bike parts have good enough chains for this stuff?

Do I need a new wider BB axle? sorry I dont know the propper term for this bit of kit, but if im putting 2 free-wheels on the front BB then wont I need a wider axle?

The HD freewheel is kinda pricy but the reviews on the ceaper one are pretty crap on the whole, so for the sake of $100 i'd rather get the better one...

CONTROLLER
I'm still wating too on a reply from matt (recumpance) on a clutch + possibly a cc160, does anyone know if he's away or something? the message went 'out' of my outbox but I haven't heard back. If I dont hear soon ill just go with the lyen controller (witch i'll probably do to start with anyway).

GEARBOX
still waiting to hear back re this. ill try calling soon...

CA
will place order soon on a RCCA, with the presumption ill be using the CC160 in the long run... if not I dont loose much in the way of features.


Im house sitting for a friend from the 24th-29th so ill teach myself how to use solid works during that time and try and drum up some basic sketches for you guys to peek at.
I think thats it for now...

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Re: So I have started an RC... er, 'mid drive' build...

Post by bandaro » Sat Jan 07, 2012 8:02 pm

So any updates? If you still needed some stuff from superkids I managed to get a reply, they can't ship via usps only ups, so its 80 bucks for one pound apparently. If you get anything from a place selling #25 sprockets I'm still interested.

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Re: So I have started an RC... er, 'mid drive' build...

Post by sn0wchyld » Sun Jan 08, 2012 12:11 am

bandaro wrote:So any updates? If you still needed some stuff from superkids I managed to get a reply, they can't ship via usps only ups, so its 80 bucks for one pound apparently. If you get anything from a place selling #25 sprockets I'm still interested.

yea still collecting parts. Ill be sorting out my order from sikbikeparts in the next day or so, so if you want me to add anything to my order let me know...

ive got a grand total of 5 electric motors now, a second (dead) HT, a 6374, 8085 and a 80100. They (learershobby) must have gotten stock of the 80100's just after I ordered, I thought they'd be out of stock for a while so I ordered the 8085 'in the mean time', but it would have been better to have two 80100's to play with... :twisted: ah well....

Bought one of the wee little 6fets 3170's from lyen, its only going to drive the 6374 while I sort out the rest of the bike, before I get a CC for the 80100.

The original gearbox I was planning on getting has just gone out of stock, and none are available for the next 4-6 weeks!! so much for getting it running by march! as such the larger gearboxes I linked to earlier might be back on the table, with a small stage of reduction before it to bring imput rpm's below the 4000 max. 170mm long is going to be a chalenge to fit though...

other than that, bugger all movement on this one. once I know what gearbox ill be using ill start putting the mounts together, but there's not much point till I know if the 'box is going to be 130mm or 170mm. Makes me think that using a 2 or 3 stage reduction could be more viable in the short term...

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Re: So I have started an RC... er, 'mid drive' build...

Post by sn0wchyld » Wed Jan 11, 2012 11:10 pm

a change of plans, i think...

since the gearbox I wanted is out of stock, and the ones that are in stock are both a bit big and expensive, im now considering a switch to a 2 stage belt reduction... witch brings up a few questions...

is 9mm belt width enough? or should I go with 15mm :?:

How difficult is it to maintain alignment + tension :?: can it be done with a tention roller like a chain :?:

Whats a good belt 'pitch' to use :?: im guessing 5mm is better than 3mm :?:



so asuming ive got the numbers right, im now thinking of 2 each of these...
http://www.smallparts.com.au/store/item ... mpitchhtd/
http://www.smallparts.com.au/store/item ... mpitchhtd/
for the 2 stages, a total of 20:1.

heres the 1st draft on mounting it... ill be doing frame mods later down the track once I've had a go at getting the driveline right...
Image

Anyone got any better ideas or adivce on how I can do this?

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Re: So I have started an RC... er, 'mid drive' build...

Post by RWP » Thu Jan 12, 2012 12:58 am

sn0wchyld wrote:is 9mm belt width enough? or should I go with 15mm...
so asuming ive got the numbers right, im now thinking of 2 each of these...
http://www.smallparts.com.au/store/item ... mpitchhtd/
http://www.smallparts.com.au/store/item ... mpitchhtd/
You definitely need to go to 5mm pitch and 15mm wide for the first stage. 9mm wide will fail for sure. For the second stage my experience tells me that a 15mm belt will fail...sorry. But maybe if you use a relatively large diameter tensioner to get more pulley wrap you will get a way with 5mm pitch and 15 wide belts if you use a low power motor (my guess is less than 1.5K watts).

Alignment is not problem as the drive pulley has two flanges that keep the belt in line.

If you look at the power handling charts for these pulley systems you will discover that at low speeds and very high power levels (at the extreme ends of the charts) you will find that the belts fail. You need to get rotating a bit to get into a range that will be OK at the low end, and too much power will destroy the belt at the high end.

https://sdp-si.com/eStore/ has the above for $34 and $11...
Matt (recompense) has 5mm pitch - 25mm wide pulleys and belts.

Two stage reductions are a pita. Matt has some wide 5mm pulleys and fairly large tooth count pulleys along with a torque limiter and a tensioner (only to get more belt wrap around the smaller pulley) that may get your system to work in one stage. Can you go to a 13t freewheel (ACS Crossfire) (Matt has an adapter that will do this) and 48t chainring (SickBikeParts)? This system may work as a single stage.

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Re: So I have started an RC... er, 'mid drive' build...

Post by bandaro » Thu Jan 12, 2012 4:49 am

OK, before making the box, I would recommend reading the htd bible, basically outlines the rough design requirements and how strong each belt is, what you need, etc.

The 5mm pitch, 15mm wide htd would be the way to go, possibly even wider. You could also look into pies, a company down in victoria I think, they have some similar stuff to small parts.
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Re: So I have started an RC... er, 'mid drive' build...

Post by sn0wchyld » Thu Jan 12, 2012 8:00 am

RWP wrote: You definitely need to go to 5mm pitch and 15mm wide for the first stage. 9mm wide will fail for sure. For the second stage my experience tells me that a 15mm belt will fail...sorry. But maybe if you use a relatively large diameter tensioner to get more pulley wrap you will get a way with 5mm pitch and 15 wide belts if you use a low power motor (my guess is less than 1.5K watts).

Alignment is not problem as the drive pulley has two flanges that keep the belt in line.

If you look at the power handling charts for these pulley systems you will discover that at low speeds and very high power levels (at the extreme ends of the charts) you will find that the belts fail. You need to get rotating a bit to get into a range that will be OK at the low end, and too much power will destroy the belt at the high end.

https://sdp-si.com/eStore/ has the above for $34 and $11...
Matt (recompense) has 5mm pitch - 25mm wide pulleys and belts.

Two stage reductions are a pita. Matt has some wide 5mm pulleys and fairly large tooth count pulleys along with a torque limiter and a tensioner (only to get more belt wrap around the smaller pulley) that may get your system to work in one stage. Can you go to a 13t freewheel (ACS Crossfire) (Matt has an adapter that will do this) and 48t chainring (SickBikeParts)? This system may work as a single stage.
ok so looks like ill have to up the belt width then... main reason for the 2 stage is that i'd like to keep it fairly low profile, as I plan on eventually putting the whole thing inside the frame (custom bottom 'beam') allong with the batteries. also getting a 30odd:1 in 2 stages is a bit harder. (170kv motor @ 10s ~40V lipo, to a desired 25km/h top speed with a ~32tooth 1st gear)...

looking at the specs sheet quickly from sdp-si seems to show that the 'working tension' of a 25mm belt is only 125N!! wouldnt a 80100 putting out about 9nm peak onto a, lets say, 100mm dia pulley mean about 180N of tension?! (9Nm/.05m(radius))? witch will be even more once I re-terminate it in wye... (9nm*sqrt3 if I remember right...)
Am I looking at this right, that I'll need belts about 60mm wide to handle the tension after the delta-wye mod? (180*sqrt3 = ~300N force, devided by the rated working tension of 5mm per N)? seems way too high... I hope... maybe ill justgo with chains... :cry: or just run less amps... :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry:
bandaro wrote:OK, before making the box, I would recommend reading the htd bible, basically outlines the rough design requirements and how strong each belt is, what you need, etc.

The 5mm pitch, 15mm wide htd would be the way to go, possibly even wider. You could also look into pies, a company down in victoria I think, they have some similar stuff to small parts.
only had a quick look before going to bed just now, but looks like a great book... cheers! so you think 15mm will handle an 80100 on full song? or just a 6374 (what im starting with)? I'll go wider if I can find any...


ps
where on earth do you get 25mm wide belts/pulleys? I cant find any! :shock:

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Re: So I have started an RC... er, 'mid drive' build...

Post by recumpence » Thu Jan 12, 2012 8:52 am

I wish I was close enough to talk on the phone. I can save you a lot of grief trying to figure this whole thing out. Belts and their applications can be very frustrating to say the least........

Matt
1% of the world's population can think "Outside the box". The rest are firmly stuck within the box. Where are you?

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Re: So I have started an RC... er, 'mid drive' build...

Post by sn0wchyld » Thu Jan 12, 2012 10:29 am

recumpence wrote:I wish I was close enough to talk on the phone. I can save you a lot of grief trying to figure this whole thing out. Belts and their applications can be very frustrating to say the least........

Matt

mate if your willing to give up some time to help me out im more than happy enough to find the time (of night) to give you a call... I can just use Skype or even a phonecard... uni holidays are in full swing so time is my friend at the mo...

is there anything blaringly obvious im getting wrong here or am I just miles off in allot of areas getting a belt drive to work? I mean, I could always start with a chain reduction, but I know the noise will mean I either go to a gearbox, or belt in the near future... so seems a little inefficient... I already have a ebike running so I don't need it running immediately... though what I want is a different story :P

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Re: So I have started an RC... er, 'mid drive' build...

Post by sn0wchyld » Wed Jan 18, 2012 1:58 am

ok, so after going round in circles for what seems like forever, im still no closer to a final desision.

Ive got a few basic questions that I should have asked earlier...
what are the things called that allow you to fit a 10mm axle to a 5/8th" 10t cog? are they simple to make yourself/readily available?
Mounting things like the barings from Sickbikeparts to a plate of alloy or similar, what works best for this? (hey, i did say basic qs!) :oops:


After much deliberation I think I might apply KISS for the first build, and atleast get something running before trying stuff like belts/gearboxes, since its both expensive and my mechanical knowledge sucks a bit at the moment.
something like this would be a good place to start?
https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewto ... 15#p436828

Problem is when I look to get the necessary parts from Sickbikes it totals near $400... is this normal? I keep thinking that im buying too much...

6x Jackshaft Bearing 5/8" ID x 1 3/8" OD
$14.94
2x Keys 3/16 x 3/16 x 3/4 inch
$11.80
1x Shaft - 5/8" Keyed shaft
$11.90

1x Sprocket - 10 Tooth (standard) for Shift Kit
$16.99
1x Chainring - Freewheel - 24 Tooth
$5.95
1x Chainring - Freewheel - 36 Tooth
$7.95
1x Chainring - Freewheel - 44 Tooth
$9.95
1x Chainring - Freewheel - 48 Tooth w/chain guard
$15.95
1x Sprocket - 9 Tooth for Shift Kit
$15.99
1x Sprocket - 11 Tooth for Shift Kit
$17.99

3x Chainring mounting Hardware
$8.98

2x Front Freewheel - Heavy Duty
$139.90
1x Freewheel Adapter
$15.95
1x Set Screws 1/4-20 x 1/2
$1.95
1x HD Freewheel Removal Tool for HD freewheel
$10.95

1x CHAIN - BIKE SPEED- KMC 8X-CHAIN
$17.99
1x Chain Breaker
$9.95

1x Cranks - Freewheel Crank Set
$24.95
1x Bottom Bracket Cartridge 153 mm
$17.95

1x Lock collar 5/8"
$2.49

Arranged like this...
Image
Sorry if the image is a bit confusing, im trying to show all the sprockets on the front of the image, as opposed to 'hidden' behind the 44t chaining.
motor nestles in between the pedals (its only a 6374 or an 8080 so should fit easy)
Total reduction 19.4:1

Someone please tell me I'm on the right track here/that this should work well to start with (ignoring noise)... I think I've over thought this rather than just buying some stuff, throwing it together, and worrying about missing parts etc later.

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Re: So I have started an RC build - some simple reduction q'

Post by bandaro » Wed Jan 18, 2012 3:17 am

Ok I am not really familiar with what design you are going with exactly, so I'll keep to universal stuff.

Why do you need two front drive freewheels? Also you want to order more sprockets than the pic has, I take it that is for gearing options? Also, I assume you want to fit the regular 3 sprockets on the cranks hence you are getting them, plus an extra for the motor drive. 3 sprockets is great, but make sure they will align well enough with the rear cassette, so you can actually use all 3. You could probably get the sprockets off an old bike, they are large so do not wear too fast, then if you cut some holes in the White Industries (un-toothed) freewheel they will bolt onto it, but you need longer bolts, so you may be better off getting them from a hardware store rather than online, to make sure they are long enough.

Check what speeds you will be geared for, because your reduction sounds very low if using a regular size front sprocket, even at 24 volts it will be too fast to peddle with, and there is no point gearing it for speeds you will never and could never reach. 24 volts will give the cranks over 200 rpm, now imagine the bike speed if you pedalled that fast, sprints top at around 120rpm, onroad commuting at 80 ish.

If I have missed anything let me know, hate to have overlooked something basic and give bad advice.

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Re: So I have started an RC build - some simple reduction q'

Post by sn0wchyld » Wed Jan 18, 2012 6:34 am

bandaro wrote:Ok I am not really familiar with what design you are going with exactly, so I'll keep to universal stuff.

Why do you need two front drive freewheels? Also you want to order more sprockets than the pic has, I take it that is for gearing options? Also, I assume you want to fit the regular 3 sprockets on the cranks hence you are getting them, plus an extra for the motor drive. 3 sprockets is great, but make sure they will align well enough with the rear cassette, so you can actually use all 3. You could probably get the sprockets off an old bike, they are large so do not wear too fast, then if you cut some holes in the White Industries (un-toothed) freewheel they will bolt onto it, but you need longer bolts, so you may be better off getting them from a hardware store rather than online, to make sure they are long enough.

Check what speeds you will be geared for, because your reduction sounds very low if using a regular size front sprocket, even at 24 volts it will be too fast to peddle with, and there is no point gearing it for speeds you will never and could never reach. 24 volts will give the cranks over 200 rpm, now imagine the bike speed if you pedalled that fast, sprints top at around 120rpm, onroad commuting at 80 ish.

If I have missed anything let me know, hate to have overlooked something basic and give bad advice.
yea ive ordered a couple extra for the reason you said... also to allow myself to do a 3 stage reduction if necessary. ill be using a re-terminated 170kv motor to start with (100kv), at 10s lipo, so about 3200 loaded speed, 160rpm at the crank (a little high, hence the option of using a 3rd reduction). I'll be replacing it with a rewound 80100 (55kv) as funds allow (either getting thud to do it or rewinding it myself), in the mean time I'd like to get something going, even if it doesn't work perfectly I'll be able to learn allot... hopefully!

reason (I thought) for the 2 front drive free wheels is so when you pedal you dont turn the motor as well... you need 1 free wheel for your pedals, and 1 for the motor right?

just 1 speed crank, Im not that interested in pedalling with the motor at this stage, more of a 'get me home' feature if anything breaks..

Cheers for the help guys, this threads getting too long with nothing concrete to show for it yet, im thinking I might just order the parts and if it doesn't work out/I needed less or more parts I'll just chalk it up as research losses. Just trying to minimise those since im living off student funds atm.

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Re: So I have started an RC build - some simple reduction q'

Post by sn0wchyld » Wed Feb 15, 2012 6:52 am

ok so its been a while since I've updated this one... needless to say I was getting frustrated with myself with the indecision and lack of progress... so shortly after my last post i said 'fuckit' and went out and ordered some stuff. the list from sickbikes was pretty much as above, minus some stuff that i figure'd I could do without due to the purchase of one of these...
$(KGrHqQOKjQE5,71U1U+BOlNn45L(Q~~_3.JPG
$(KGrHqQOKjQE5,71U1U+BOlNn45L(Q~~_3.JPG (30 KiB) Viewed 9321 times
except the ple80 version... couldn't find a pic of the '80.
stoked... many thanks to timma for putting me on to the seller and a killer deal. makes the reduction side of things a bit easier.

also bought a couple of SS190-200 controllers from HK, after reading bzhwindtalker's success with this...
https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewto ... 28&t=30490 hopefully I can gain some extra low-end torque with the use of a 36-11 tooth rear freewheel.

Ive got basically everything I need in my hands already, and more than enough to start. just wating on a RC CA to control the ss190-200 RC controllers I've bought (a few as backups/to be used for future electric mountain board) and a few minor bits from HK.

Im heading into the uni workshop tomorow to start laying stuff out!
in the mean time ive been working on my first build... mx rim, thicker spokes, drilled side covers on the HT + forced air, temp alarms etc etc. working great now, aside from the bearings have just bitten the dust :evil:

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Re: So I have started an RC build - some simple reduction q'

Post by Timma2500 » Wed Feb 15, 2012 7:32 am

Good decision getting the PLE80 dude! What ratio and input/output shaft sizes did you end up getting?

Can't wait to see how the controllers work out, i suspect using them with a mid-drive should give them a reasonably easy run compared to a single speed setup :)
Hopefully you won't need the spare :wink:

Re the RC CA, how do you get ahold of these, just email Justin? How much are they Sn0wy? I'd like to get one for my 80-100 / HV140 build.

Can't wait to see this come together :mrgreen:


Paul :D
Norco Aline / carbon fibre frame mod / 12t Mac / 12fet / 23kg

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Re: So I have started an RC build - some simple reduction q'

Post by sn0wchyld » Wed Feb 15, 2012 8:14 am

Timma2500 wrote:Good decision getting the PLE80 dude! What ratio and input/output shaft sizes did you end up getting?

Can't wait to see how the controllers work out, i suspect using them with a mid-drive should give them a reasonably easy run compared to a single speed setup :)
Hopefully you won't need the spare :wink:

Re the RC CA, how do you get ahold of these, just email Justin? How much are they Sn0wy? I'd like to get one for my 80-100 / HV140 build.

Can't wait to see this come together :mrgreen:


Paul :D
yea just mail justin, he'll send you a 'secret link' :wink: there roughly the same as a normal ca, and the shunts are exactly the same, about $18.

Cant remember the input shaft, I need to fab one as it came without. shoulnt be too hard... i hope. output looks like a 20mm keyed. its a 5:1, so the strongest of the single stages!

RE the controllers, yea I'm fairly confident given the success the aforementioned guy had with em on a single speed.

And yea, I cant wait either. be great to have 2 bikes running, both for backup and for fun!

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Re: So I have started an RC build - some simple reduction q'

Post by bandaro » Thu Feb 16, 2012 3:41 am

Sounding like it's all coming together now! I've been in the good old uni workshop this week as well making a freewheel adapter prototype, but I should be running by weekend. I have a pondering though, I have avoided using a ple or spur gears for their weight, so I have had trouble trying to get a small reduction as a result, so I would be interested to hear what your take on the weight issue is, and if my thinking has been rational and justified or not... those ple 80's are very nice...

But anyway, best of luck chucking it all together, can't wait to hear the results of the bike, and that motor alteration.

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Re: So I have started an RC build - some simple reduction q'

Post by sn0wchyld » Sat May 12, 2012 9:48 am

this is a slow build, but its getting there, slowly but surely. heres the latest array of picas. sorry for the distortion, it was taken with the gopro.
GOPR0100 (Small).JPG
GOPR0100 (Small).JPG (84.16 KiB) Viewed 8941 times
one side of the mounting plate, with the PLE and 8085 attached. Fortunatly the PLE came with a mounting plate, about 40mm deep, otherwise It'd be shorter than the 8085 and require a spacer to get its 'output shaft' beyond the outside of the 8085.
GOPR0103 (Small).JPG
GOPR0103 (Small).JPG (69.41 KiB) Viewed 8941 times
PLE input on the left, 8085 axle on the right. Just a couple of spare screws to mount them for now. Ill probably manage chain tension with a roller, rather than cutting slots for the motor. Chain tension from the 'box to the BB will be managed by moving the entire unit up or down the frame.
GOPR0105 (Small).JPG
GOPR0105 (Small).JPG (69.55 KiB) Viewed 8941 times
GOPR0104 (Small).JPG
GOPR0104 (Small).JPG (82.63 KiB) Viewed 8941 times
As you can see, I can afford to shave some more material off the PLE's base plate, which I probably will to get the whole package to be more 'slim' and ensure it fits between the pedals. Also need to cut down the 8085 axle and then I can add in the brackets to attach it to the bike frame. The plan at this stage is to have one in between the motor/gearbox and one infront of the 'box, with a thinner base plate to protect them both from the elements and any potential knocks from rough terrain. I'm hoping to fit it all between the pedals, with the motor pretty much directly below the BB, and the PLE mounted just far enough forward to be able to drive the cranks.

Ill be using the same HK 200A SS controller as bzhwindtalker used in his 20inch build here https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewto ... 28&t=30490 with good succes, and with the extra gears it should manage even better! Best part is that even if it blows, at just over $30 each delivered, i'm not too fussed! If I do end up killing more than 1, I might try converting this to a single or a twin 6374 drive to make life easyer on the controller/s.

Fortunatly 90% of the battery wireing's already done, as a legacy from the 20s pack I had on the norko (before switching to 24s). So once this part's done its just a matter of rigging up a case for 'em, adding in some basic mounts for the controller and other assorted parts, and we're in business! Uni exams are comming up in just over a month, so I suspect I'll be done sometime soon after that.
Attachments
GOPR0099 (Small).JPG
GOPR0099 (Small).JPG (81.49 KiB) Viewed 8941 times

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Re: So I have started an RC build its starting to come toget

Post by neptronix » Tue Jun 05, 2012 11:27 pm

Cool! I like it!
My first major build: 8T MAC motor on a Trek 4500.
The new all-arounder: Leafmotor 1500w on a Turner O2 full suspension.
The wheelie machine: 20" Rear Magic Pie II on a Trek 4300 MTB

"The best time to plant a tree was 20 years ago. The second best time is now."- Chinese Proverb

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Re: So I have started an RC build its starting to come toget

Post by sn0wchyld » Wed Jun 06, 2012 8:50 am

Progress is slow at the moment... exams are coming up so they get more attention for now!

I did want to ask though, what would people reccomend for chains? would 219# chain handle an 80100 or 8085 on full song? (~50v/~100-150A)? or should I go with #35? I'll be using bike chain to start with but I doubt it'll last long, so the next project is going to be a left side drive with a dog box or a twin motor setup for the norko... I want to start making plans now though. cheers all.

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Re: So I have started an RC build its starting to come toget

Post by Thud » Wed Jun 06, 2012 8:59 am

Both will barley notice an 80-100

219 chain is typicly a better grade than #35 (but you can get HQ #35)..finding 219 drive sprockets is the trick. (be ready to do some fabbing)

I lean toward #35 for low cost accross the board...& sprocket availability. but it's horses for courses.
get some......

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Re: So I have started an RC build its starting to come toget

Post by sn0wchyld » Wed Jun 06, 2012 10:02 am

Thud wrote:Both will barley notice an 80-100

219 chain is typicly a better grade than #35 (but you can get HQ #35)..finding 219 drive sprockets is the trick. (be ready to do some fabbing)

I lean toward #35 for low cost accross the board...& sprocket availability. but it's horses for courses.


cheers for the advice mate.

just for future thought... would 219 handle a twin 8085 setup, say, about 8kw peak?

I did notice that larger sprockets of 219 are common as mud on the bay, and looks like you can get some pretty massive tooth numbers in a small size too, but drive sprokets are almost nowhere to be found! is it hard to make drive sprockets? any advice on the smallest drive sprocket you'd go for?

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Re: So I have started an RC build its starting to come toget

Post by Thud » Wed Jun 06, 2012 10:29 am

219 is the perfered Kart racing chain & would be fine for almost any build with rc motors (or multiple motors)
you can get a 12t drive sprocket with a flange for mounting to a kart clutch that is the easyest to adapt to.

somthing like this:
amsprocket-outer.jpg
amsprocket-outer.jpg (54.42 KiB) Viewed 8376 times
get some......

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Re: So I have started an RC build its starting to come toget

Post by gwhy! » Wed Jun 06, 2012 11:15 am

When the company 'oset' new 20" trials bike goes on sell 'next month ' there will be spares available and I know they will be using a 10t and 11t 219 front sprockets and I think these will be 12mm id with either a grub of they may be D, I will try and find out exactly what fitting it will be I think they are getting them made specially so I have no idea what the price will be.

Edit just thought I would mention also that a 10 and 11t #35 sprockets work ok with 219 chain but nothing bigger

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