Trek Retrofit

General Discussion about electric bicycles.
e-beach
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Trek Retrofit

Post by e-beach » Jan 20, 2018 7:04 pm

So for those who don't know, my frame cracked after more then 11,000 miles use.
1.5 in crack.jpg
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So I got a Trek and decided to retrofit my old motor and battery to the new bike frame since they still have life left in them.
Trek.JPG
Trek.JPG (194.4 KiB) Viewed 716 times
The last time I build a battery box I spent a lot of time working out the most efficient space saving way to mount my cells.
Eff Config.JPG
Eff Config.JPG (133.83 KiB) Viewed 716 times
This time I am just going to build something and if it take two or three modifications, the time commitment will be the same.

This time I decided to build a battery containment box.
Box1.JPG
I already see room for improvement, like making holes to access the battery lugs.
Box2.JPG
However this design will allow me to move the cells around without problem. And, yes I know, Headways were made to lock together. I don't want to have to pull the whole battery apart as it is functioning fine at the moment. And what I am building will be stronger and more secure then the interlocking Headway holders.

More later.
Favorite Quote: "This is L.A., sugar. There is no 'over the top." --- Chris Erskine

Current build: Liahona w/ cheap front suspension and suspension seat post. Yescomusa 36v 800w generic front hub motor. 15ah Headway triangle mounted pack. Tronsung 30 amp,

Previous Build:1992 Trek Antelope 800 - Bone Crusher (no suspension) - Yescomusa 800 watt 36 volt front wheel kit. Don't do it! Get suspension!!!

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Re: Trek Retrofit

Post by Wolfeman » Jan 21, 2018 12:49 pm

11,000 miles? That's awesome. Looking forward to seeing your newer Trek come together.
Trek 4300 w/ H3580 Crystalyte at 2300W
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Re: Trek Retrofit

Post by Philaphlous » Jan 23, 2018 3:38 pm

My current ebike is a trek 80C sport. Can't find any info online about it but it's very similar to the 800. Great bike but man...no suspension is a killer. Wish I had at least a suspension fork and jiggly seat post...ouch... The thing isn't really fun to ride over 30mph due to the bumps. Works best around 20 or so. I've got a 1000w motor on it and I regularly pull around 1400w max with my setup. Battery gets warm and that's basically the limit of the controller and battery.

e-beach
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Re: Trek Retrofit

Post by e-beach » Jan 23, 2018 5:58 pm

My first e-bike was a trek 800 with lead batteries (SLA's)....No suspension...... :shock:
Every pothole felt like a bomb going off under me. :evil:

Some of the big people around here say they prefer no suspension only using their tires for cushioning but I won't ever do that again!

:D
Favorite Quote: "This is L.A., sugar. There is no 'over the top." --- Chris Erskine

Current build: Liahona w/ cheap front suspension and suspension seat post. Yescomusa 36v 800w generic front hub motor. 15ah Headway triangle mounted pack. Tronsung 30 amp,

Previous Build:1992 Trek Antelope 800 - Bone Crusher (no suspension) - Yescomusa 800 watt 36 volt front wheel kit. Don't do it! Get suspension!!!

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Re: Trek Retrofit

Post by e-beach » Jan 23, 2018 6:11 pm

A little woodwork and glue....
Batt Plate.JPG
Batt Plate.JPG (222.73 KiB) Viewed 637 times
Now it begins to look like something.
Batt Box.JPG
I was wondering if this would be a problem. The inefficiency of the new battery configuration leaves me with little room to use wood as the main frame box. I do have some aluminum plates that were going to go for another project, and I have more scrap wood then aluminum, but it looks like I will have to use the aluminum for this frame box.
In Frame 1.JPG
In Frame 1.JPG (207.41 KiB) Viewed 637 times
Life is like that some times.

:D
Favorite Quote: "This is L.A., sugar. There is no 'over the top." --- Chris Erskine

Current build: Liahona w/ cheap front suspension and suspension seat post. Yescomusa 36v 800w generic front hub motor. 15ah Headway triangle mounted pack. Tronsung 30 amp,

Previous Build:1992 Trek Antelope 800 - Bone Crusher (no suspension) - Yescomusa 800 watt 36 volt front wheel kit. Don't do it! Get suspension!!!

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Re: Trek Retrofit

Post by e-beach » Jan 26, 2018 7:34 pm

So the triangle frame is ruffed in. Unfortunately I haven't done any welding for over 40 years when I worked at my grandfathers iron works shop before he died, so this one will be a screw and glue job.
FrameRufedIn.JPG
FrameRufedIn.JPG (203.25 KiB) Viewed 591 times
A first look at what I have done. It is begging to look like an e-bike.
1st look.JPG
1st look.JPG (160.98 KiB) Viewed 591 times
Favorite Quote: "This is L.A., sugar. There is no 'over the top." --- Chris Erskine

Current build: Liahona w/ cheap front suspension and suspension seat post. Yescomusa 36v 800w generic front hub motor. 15ah Headway triangle mounted pack. Tronsung 30 amp,

Previous Build:1992 Trek Antelope 800 - Bone Crusher (no suspension) - Yescomusa 800 watt 36 volt front wheel kit. Don't do it! Get suspension!!!

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Re: Trek Retrofit

Post by e-beach » Jan 28, 2018 9:15 pm

So I strapped the battery into the frame for a test drive. The steering is a bit stiff, so I will loosening that up a bit. And, the rear tire felt a bit loose because I still have a knobby wheel on the back rim. I will change that tomorrow. For the most part things are looking good.

So how to proceed with the aluminum frame. Well, curiosity got me and I went to the "Great Google in the Sky" and it showed me videos of how easy it was to braze aluminum. 8)

I went to the hardware store and $5.50 later I had my three skinny aluminum rods that melt at 700 degrees Fahrenheit.
I wire wheeled the plates clean where I was going to braze them, I grabbed the old Map gas gun and did some testing.....
AL1.JPG
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AL2.JPG
AL2.JPG (246.97 KiB) Viewed 541 times
I would call that failure..... :oops: I am not going to risk my whole frame on this stuff.

So "what kind of aluminum am I using?" you might ask. Well obviously the kind that wilts before the skinny aluminum rods melt. :roll: OK, the truth be told, I got these aluminum plates a long time ago and don't really remember what they were.

What I do know is that I should have used that money to buy a six-pack of beer. :evil:

Ok, plan B. I am good with wood anyway so why not dig into the ole wood pile and make something useful from some old 3/4 x 3.25 inch oak flooring. Milling some sort of useful shape will do.
OakMilled.JPG
OakMilled.JPG (147.49 KiB) Viewed 541 times
Something like this.
Rail1.JPG
I am beginning to see a woodie in my future..... 8)
Favorite Quote: "This is L.A., sugar. There is no 'over the top." --- Chris Erskine

Current build: Liahona w/ cheap front suspension and suspension seat post. Yescomusa 36v 800w generic front hub motor. 15ah Headway triangle mounted pack. Tronsung 30 amp,

Previous Build:1992 Trek Antelope 800 - Bone Crusher (no suspension) - Yescomusa 800 watt 36 volt front wheel kit. Don't do it! Get suspension!!!

e-beach
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Re: Trek Retrofit

Post by e-beach » Jan 30, 2018 11:21 pm

So after 4 hours of milling more then enough oak rails and 4 more hours of discerning angles, cutting and gluing I have gotten this far..... :oops:
Frameg1.JPG
Frameg1.JPG (215.8 KiB) Viewed 496 times
It doesn't look like much yet, but the aluminum frame and wooden milled parts are beginning to come together.
Frameg2.JPG
Frameg2.JPG (196.99 KiB) Viewed 496 times
I am using a polyurethane construction adhesive to glue it all together and I am always amazed just how the darn stuff migrates! No matter how clean I try to be be clean, the stuff always seems to get on my fingers and into everything else... :?
But once it drys it is really strong.

As slippery as the wet glue are my plans. It looks like I will need to have one side with the wood frame permanently glued to the aluminum panels. And the other side (wood frame and wood panel) will need to be removable. This so I can get my big Headway battery pack into the frame while also allowing me to remmove the whole triangle frame if required.

I have yet to make the wood panels, but they are coming tomorrow or the next day.

Onward!
.
Favorite Quote: "This is L.A., sugar. There is no 'over the top." --- Chris Erskine

Current build: Liahona w/ cheap front suspension and suspension seat post. Yescomusa 36v 800w generic front hub motor. 15ah Headway triangle mounted pack. Tronsung 30 amp,

Previous Build:1992 Trek Antelope 800 - Bone Crusher (no suspension) - Yescomusa 800 watt 36 volt front wheel kit. Don't do it! Get suspension!!!

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Re: Trek Retrofit

Post by e-beach » Feb 04, 2018 10:55 pm

Beginning to become something.....but I think a stouter and more stylistic configuration is in order.
panal1.JPG
panal1.JPG (201.51 KiB) Viewed 417 times
Looks like a slow but deliberate few days of glue-ups are in order. Going for style and strength and low weight.
1stglueup.JPG
1stglueup.JPG (190.18 KiB) Viewed 417 times
I am beginning to think a blue woody is emerging, like a 1950's car?

:D
Favorite Quote: "This is L.A., sugar. There is no 'over the top." --- Chris Erskine

Current build: Liahona w/ cheap front suspension and suspension seat post. Yescomusa 36v 800w generic front hub motor. 15ah Headway triangle mounted pack. Tronsung 30 amp,

Previous Build:1992 Trek Antelope 800 - Bone Crusher (no suspension) - Yescomusa 800 watt 36 volt front wheel kit. Don't do it! Get suspension!!!

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Re: Trek Retrofit

Post by amberwolf » Feb 06, 2018 5:38 pm

e-beach wrote:
Feb 04, 2018 10:55 pm

Looks like a slow but deliberate few days of glue-ups are in order. Going for style and strength and low weight.

I am beginning to think a blue woody is emerging, like a 1950's car?
That's kinda how my SB Cruiser ended up (though an earlier era, maybe 1920's?) when I redid the deck and made the seatbox with metal frame and wood panels, a year ago. :) Just red, instead of blue.

I probably should've gone slower when I built mine, but didnt' have the time (needed to use it sooner rather than later)--it'd be nicer and stronger; as it is, a year later I've still not gone back and finished it up, though I might get the chance to do some of that this week.

Hopefully yours turns out better than mine. :)


I use those black thick rubber gloves when working with paints and glues and greases and stuff, and I *still* end up with it all over my hands, sometimes because the gloves rip and I don't notice, but sometimes I can't figure out how it got in there. :(

e-beach
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Re: Trek Retrofit

Post by e-beach » Feb 07, 2018 8:11 pm

amberwolf wrote:
Feb 06, 2018 5:38 pm
........ but sometimes I can't figure out how it got in there. :(
:lol: That's my story as well....How did it get there????

:D
Favorite Quote: "This is L.A., sugar. There is no 'over the top." --- Chris Erskine

Current build: Liahona w/ cheap front suspension and suspension seat post. Yescomusa 36v 800w generic front hub motor. 15ah Headway triangle mounted pack. Tronsung 30 amp,

Previous Build:1992 Trek Antelope 800 - Bone Crusher (no suspension) - Yescomusa 800 watt 36 volt front wheel kit. Don't do it! Get suspension!!!

e-beach
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Re: Trek Retrofit

Post by e-beach » Feb 13, 2018 10:09 pm

Ok, I got sidetracked. My bike is up and running so I took a break and started working on the classical guitar that has been sitting in my closet for 10 years. It didn't have any frets or nut or bridge, but it still had the fret material that I bought for it 10 years ago. I will have to get a nut and bridge bone from somewhere. It will be interesting to hear how it plays.
OrionBuild.JPG
OrionBuild.JPG (183.38 KiB) Viewed 256 times
On the other hand, with the guitar underway, I turned my attention back to my bike. Tomorrow or the next day I will finalize the look of the panels to give it a "Woody" look.
PanelClamps.JPG
PanelClamps.JPG (224.86 KiB) Viewed 256 times
:D
Favorite Quote: "This is L.A., sugar. There is no 'over the top." --- Chris Erskine

Current build: Liahona w/ cheap front suspension and suspension seat post. Yescomusa 36v 800w generic front hub motor. 15ah Headway triangle mounted pack. Tronsung 30 amp,

Previous Build:1992 Trek Antelope 800 - Bone Crusher (no suspension) - Yescomusa 800 watt 36 volt front wheel kit. Don't do it! Get suspension!!!

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Re: Trek Retrofit

Post by Philaphlous » Feb 13, 2018 10:58 pm

Trek looks good! I personally would never use wood on my bike but that's personal preference.

Nice to see a suspension fork on it too! I've got a hard front and tail trek 800 sport from 2002 I believe... I just got a suspension seatpost and I'm planning on a suspension fork despite all I can read on people saying a suspension fork on a non-suspension fork bike is a bad idea...

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Re: Trek Retrofit

Post by e-beach » Feb 13, 2018 11:18 pm

I think, if you can find a good suspension fork for your trek 800 you should go for it. I found the stock fork on my my old Trek 800 had a rake that made the bike unstable. It went straight well, but didn't corner well. I wiped out on it multiple times before I went to my Liahona. That included a fractured rib. Anything to make that frame better I say!

:D
Favorite Quote: "This is L.A., sugar. There is no 'over the top." --- Chris Erskine

Current build: Liahona w/ cheap front suspension and suspension seat post. Yescomusa 36v 800w generic front hub motor. 15ah Headway triangle mounted pack. Tronsung 30 amp,

Previous Build:1992 Trek Antelope 800 - Bone Crusher (no suspension) - Yescomusa 800 watt 36 volt front wheel kit. Don't do it! Get suspension!!!

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Re: Trek Retrofit

Post by ApacheXMD » Feb 14, 2018 2:27 am

Very familiar looking bike you got there. This is mine with a rear Yescom kit and a EM3EV triangle bag that houses (2) 6S 16AH lipos and the controller. It's been solid so far with just over 100 miles on it.
trek4500_ebike.jpg
trek4500_ebike.jpg (192.76 KiB) Viewed 231 times

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Re: Trek Retrofit

Post by dogman dan » Feb 14, 2018 7:49 am

Nice work.

I find the easiest way to make battery boxes is a combination of wood and aluminum panel. I was making external boxes though, so for me it was a simple wood box, made from a strong poplar wood half inch thick. then the aluminum plate sides just screw on. other materials work for sides too, like coroplast, high quality lexan, or just Masonite.

That method suits my carpentry back ground, put it together with wood screws.

One thing I see in that picture though, an alloy fork with no torque arms.. That will last about half a mile.

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Re: Trek Retrofit

Post by e-beach » Feb 14, 2018 11:21 am

@ Dogman, Thanks! ....Ummm, which picture?

:D
Last edited by e-beach on Feb 14, 2018 11:34 am, edited 1 time in total.
Favorite Quote: "This is L.A., sugar. There is no 'over the top." --- Chris Erskine

Current build: Liahona w/ cheap front suspension and suspension seat post. Yescomusa 36v 800w generic front hub motor. 15ah Headway triangle mounted pack. Tronsung 30 amp,

Previous Build:1992 Trek Antelope 800 - Bone Crusher (no suspension) - Yescomusa 800 watt 36 volt front wheel kit. Don't do it! Get suspension!!!

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Re: Trek Retrofit

Post by e-beach » Feb 14, 2018 11:34 am

ApacheXMD wrote:
Feb 14, 2018 2:27 am
Very familiar looking bike you got there. This is mine with a rear Yescom kit and a EM3EV triangle bag that houses (2) 6S 16AH lipos and the controller. It's been solid so far with just over 100 miles on it.trek4500_ebike.jpg
These frames definitely have a lot of triangle space for batteries etc, and, they have a nice flat area in the rear for most any kind of torque arm.
Tqarmarea.JPG
Tqarmarea.JPG (119.28 KiB) Viewed 198 times
The downside is that they come with cheap front forks.

I do, running a front hub motor, appreciate the extra welded plate on the downtube.
Favorite Quote: "This is L.A., sugar. There is no 'over the top." --- Chris Erskine

Current build: Liahona w/ cheap front suspension and suspension seat post. Yescomusa 36v 800w generic front hub motor. 15ah Headway triangle mounted pack. Tronsung 30 amp,

Previous Build:1992 Trek Antelope 800 - Bone Crusher (no suspension) - Yescomusa 800 watt 36 volt front wheel kit. Don't do it! Get suspension!!!

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Re: Trek Retrofit

Post by Philaphlous » Feb 14, 2018 1:12 pm

My big concern right now is I haven't taken my bike to work yet and I'm wondering about security.... I'd have to most likely lock it up on the dc metro bike lock and that's not the safest. I've got a coil lock and boron carbide key lock but I'm not sure...I might try to ride it inside then down the elevator to the buildings parking lot since theres a lot of places behind cars that I can chain the bike up to but not sure if they will not like that since it's paid parking...I have yet to see an ebike locked up so I'd imagine u might lose it or have stuff taken from it during the day....Hopefully not tho. I would bring the battery into work with me since it's removable...

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Re: Trek Retrofit

Post by wturber » Feb 14, 2018 2:07 pm

Philaphlous wrote:
Feb 14, 2018 1:12 pm
My big concern right now is I haven't taken my bike to work yet and I'm wondering about security.... I'd have to most likely lock it up on the dc metro bike lock and that's not the safest. I've got a coil lock and boron carbide key lock but I'm not sure...I might try to ride it inside then down the elevator to the buildings parking lot since theres a lot of places behind cars that I can chain the bike up to but not sure if they will not like that since it's paid parking...I have yet to see an ebike locked up so I'd imagine u might lose it or have stuff taken from it during the day....Hopefully not tho. I would bring the battery into work with me since it's removable...
Some parking garages have bike racks. The one I used to use had the racks right by the guard/pay shack, which was nice.
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Re: Trek Retrofit

Post by Philaphlous » Feb 14, 2018 4:04 pm

Yea this one is underground in a building so probably not. They do have these handrails welded into the concrete about 6 ft behind parked cars with an overhang that is only about 5ft high so no cars can park that far back...thats my idea to lock it up there...

I also just realized I never ever use the left handlebar twist gear mechanism...or the front derailleur....so I'm gonna take that off when I get a chance. Lol

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Re: Trek Retrofit

Post by wturber » Feb 14, 2018 4:19 pm

Philaphlous wrote:
Feb 14, 2018 4:04 pm
Yea this one is underground in a building so probably not. They do have these handrails welded into the concrete about 6 ft behind parked cars with an overhang that is only about 5ft high so no cars can park that far back...thats my idea to lock it up there...

I also just realized I never ever use the left handlebar twist gear mechanism...or the front derailleur....so I'm gonna take that off when I get a chance. Lol
The rails sound good. Especially if you can lock near a surveillance camera or guard shack. BTW, why don't you just ride into the garage via the car ramp rather than using the elevator etc.?
"Commuter - DC Booster"
Iron Horse 3.0 hardtail - 48V / 1000W / 470rpm generic Chinese DD Hub motor (ebay)
7 x 36v 4.3ah 10s 2P battery packs - Wangdd22 1500W 30A DC Boost Converter delivers 54v and about 1175 watts peak
53T/42T Sakae Road cranks - 30mph+ on flats
https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewt ... =2&t=90369

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Re: Trek Retrofit

Post by Philaphlous » Feb 14, 2018 4:53 pm

wturber wrote:
Feb 14, 2018 4:19 pm
Philaphlous wrote:
Feb 14, 2018 4:04 pm
Yea this one is underground in a building so probably not. They do have these handrails welded into the concrete about 6 ft behind parked cars with an overhang that is only about 5ft high so no cars can park that far back...thats my idea to lock it up there...

I also just realized I never ever use the left handlebar twist gear mechanism...or the front derailleur....so I'm gonna take that off when I get a chance. Lol
The rails sound good. Especially if you can lock near a surveillance camera or guard shack. BTW, why don't you just ride into the garage via the car ramp rather than using the elevator etc.?
Ha. Maybe I'll have to ask the guards if it's OK...

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Re: Trek Retrofit

Post by wturber » Feb 14, 2018 5:14 pm

Philaphlous wrote:
Feb 14, 2018 4:53 pm

Ha. Maybe I'll have to ask the guards if it's OK...
Or just act, "as if" and see if anybody chooses to stop you. :^)

If it is your company's garage, I think it is more likely they won't have a problem with a bike.
"Commuter - DC Booster"
Iron Horse 3.0 hardtail - 48V / 1000W / 470rpm generic Chinese DD Hub motor (ebay)
7 x 36v 4.3ah 10s 2P battery packs - Wangdd22 1500W 30A DC Boost Converter delivers 54v and about 1175 watts peak
53T/42T Sakae Road cranks - 30mph+ on flats
https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewt ... =2&t=90369

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Re: Trek Retrofit

Post by e-beach » Feb 18, 2018 11:45 am

Meanwhile back at the ranch.... :lol:

The glue-ups have been coming along albeit slowly.
Gluup.JPG
Gluup.JPG (167.87 KiB) Viewed 63 times
Although it has afforded me the time to finish the frets, nut and bridge on the guitar and though it has it's flaws, it sounds good for a Korean made Yamaha clone. Probably it is old enough that they still used good wood when it was made.
GuiBi.JPG
Do you think anybody will get the reference?
CovGui.JPG
CovGui.JPG (210.98 KiB) Viewed 63 times
Once I get the dark and natural staining and finishing on the box it will at least be easier to see.

:D
Favorite Quote: "This is L.A., sugar. There is no 'over the top." --- Chris Erskine

Current build: Liahona w/ cheap front suspension and suspension seat post. Yescomusa 36v 800w generic front hub motor. 15ah Headway triangle mounted pack. Tronsung 30 amp,

Previous Build:1992 Trek Antelope 800 - Bone Crusher (no suspension) - Yescomusa 800 watt 36 volt front wheel kit. Don't do it! Get suspension!!!

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