Xtreme-scooters' XB-310Li

[SergeTruth]

I ordered the XB-310Li. Please, write more about how to upgrade it.

Thank you,
Serge

[The Stig]

Hi Serge

I replaced the battery and the controller(and throttle because I wanted a thumb throttle).

The battery is in the same case and has the same mount that bolts to the seat tube. Only its a 36V 10AH Li-NiCoMn. I was told by BMS battery its good for 20A continuous and 35A Burst for 10 Seconds.
Specs:http://www.bmsbattery.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=1_2_26&products_id=17&zenid=0bbd6ffcaa154655454869875bd0b28d
When you click add to cart I think it adds the 10AH version instead of the 5AH. Its $210 without shipping. I ordered through skype though because they're not very reliable and its good to have a contact to hold accountable. http://ecitypower.com/index.php?option=com_contact&view=category&catid=12&Itemid=30 I think Annie Lei has the best english. I ordered through Mandy and she wasn't the best I got my battery about the latest she orginally said it would arrive.

The controller I got from Keywin, master of controllers: ecrazyman@gmail.com
It was the 36V 30A brushless one. I think it was 9 Fet.
For wiring the controller to the motor: "YB GG BY, both phase wires and hall sensor" -Keywin

[The Stig]

The results are great. Top speed is higher now. High enough for a bicycle I think. Acceleration is improved especially at medium speeds. Its now the kind of ebike you don't really have to pedal much, whereas before I always pedaled.
The cons are that the motor that comes with the XB is not the highest quality. It would have more power with a better motor. Because of the low quality don't be running the motor at full throttle at really low RPM for a long time (like dont pull a buddy on a pedal bicycle up a small mountain. I burnt a hall sensor doing that. This was before the modification. Luckily the hall sensor failed close to the top of the mountain!)
Heres a post about the battery: http://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=16824&start=15#p267023. An alternative and probably higher quality supplier for a similar battery would be this vendor who is closer by in europe: http://www.e-bicycles.eu/en/contact.html

[SergeTruth]

Thank you for your report. How about this: replacing the motor with a better 350W one, replacing the battery with 36V LiFePO4, and replacing the controller. The world definitely needs more e-bikes, and that means that more people have to learn about them, since at the moment it's a project type vehicle.

[The Stig]

Yeah replacing the motor would be a good idea, but not crucial. I like the cute128 as a replacement motor although I've never tried one before. Lifepo4 would be much cheaper in the long run. 5 times cheaper.the bmsbaterry is slightly lower power than its LiMn.

[SergeTruth]

LiFePO4 is amazing technology...at least compared to many of the other batteries. It's safe - less likely to spontaneously combust than LiPo, it has a long life, it does not have "memory", it self-discharges slowly, and it is considered non-toxic. LiFePO4 has energy density four times higher than lead acid batteries - the same amount of Volt*Amp*Hours weighs four times less in LiFePO4 than in Lead Acid batteries.

[Evoforce]

I almost bought one! Here is what I did instead. Look at E-Bike Photos and Video topic under "Evoforce bike build 1". Then look up builds 2 and 3. Isn't this fun!

[SergeTruth]

How about 36V battery without upgrading the controller? What are the risks?

I almost bought one! Here is what I did instead. Look at E-Bike Photos and Video topic under "Evoforce bike build 1". Then look up builds 2 and 3. Isn't this fun!

viewtopic.php?f=6&t=20345 - Build 3
Haha, looks extreme:)

That silver and red picture is a nice, clean build.

[SergeTruth]

The bike has arrived. I ordered a 24V LiFePO4 from BMS Battery.

I just tested the bike and it is awesome. It's comparable in speed to regular bikes, which is fine because I like to ride on the side-walk, so it's stealthy this way. Just have to get rid of the e-bike stickers...but people probably don't read them before I zoom by hehe. The quality of the bike is good. One of the reasons for buying it were the disc brakes, and they perform well. This bike is certified win.

More speed might be nice, so a 36V upgrade might be good. Can I run two controllers in parallel, so I can switch between 24V and 36V batteries?

[The Stig]

The bike has arrived. I ordered a 24V LiFePO4 from BMS Battery.

I just tested the bike and it is awesome. It's comparable in speed to regular bikes, which is fine because I like to ride on the side-walk, so it's stealthy this way. Just have to get rid of the e-bike stickers...but people probably don't read them before I zoom by hehe. The quality of the bike is good. One of the reasons for buying it were the disc brakes, and they perform well. This bike is certified win.

More speed might be nice, so a 36V upgrade might be good. Can I run two controllers in parallel, so I can switch between 24V and 36V batteries?

Its a good ebike. I don't think there would be any point in keeping the 24V battery and controller on their if you have a 36V system.
If you do get a 36V battery you also have to get a 36V controller. The 24V controller will not work at 36V.
I like the looks of the ampedbikes.com tube battery. I have a feeling it would go nicely on the frame, just in front and above the pedal crank.

[SergeTruth]

The bmsbattery 24V LiFePO4 doesn't work - probably too little current (Amps). I've had this problem with LiFePO4 before - I've built LiFePO4 packs before, but they had very little Coloumbs, so they were pretty much useless. I have a lot of LiFePO4 cells laying around. Maybe I'll make a backup power supply for computers out of them.

I ordered the bmsbattery 36V 10AH Li-Po battery, like you, Stig. It works fine with the 24V controller, except the controller gets warm. I think it is possible to burn it out with heavy usage, so I might want to look into getting another controller.

The speed with 36V is nice, I estimate around 20mph - there is no real need to pedal anymore, except to get some load off the motor when going uphill.

The speed with 24V got clocked at 14mph by one of those school-zone speed radars. There is a frequent need to pedal.

24V is plenty when off-roading and fine for riding on side-walks. 36V is fine and 36V*10AH = 360WH, so more range overall, but 36V might be a little too fast to be safe on side-walks. Overvolting might kill the controller sooner also. As it is now, it is good to have both options. The batteries are light, so I can ride with both available.

[The Stig]

Thats great you can just unlock and take off the old 24V battery and switch it with the 36V battery! That would make this ebike worth a lot more. It probably still has the old current limit though, 14A. You could try shunt modding the controller but it would be advisable to improve the cooling somehow, better heatsinking of the fets or something. It is a 6Fet controller if I remember correctly.

I would discourage riding on the sidewalks and if you do its good to go nice and slow with less throttle.

[Bigmunch]

Hi,
Thanks for the great info, I just ordered one of the x-treme XB-300li's ( the non-folding model ) and I want to make sure that this is the correct battery that you purchased, as your original link does not go to that item. I am not sure if the 300li uses the same battery setup as the 310li.
Anyways, is this the battery you guys were talking about
?


http://www.bmsbattery.com/packs/162-36v-10ah-lithium-ion-alloy-shell-ebike-battery-pack.html
,
thanks,

Bigmunch

[The Stig]

It looks like they have different battery setups! post a picture of the 300Li so we can see compare!

That link is not the battery for the 310Li and I don't think its the one on 300Li.

[Bigmunch]

Here is a pic of the bike, I would think that there are many bikes using this same setup, but I have searched the internet for a battery upgrade and so far have come up empty.
The descriptions of the ebike say it uses a 24 volt 8ah battery which has 7 cells

http://urbanscooters.com/fhimage/indexshow.php?phto=XB-300Li


Hopefully you experts can guide me in the right direction.

PS, I just found this info on their online user manual, looks like it won't be that difficult:
"What’s Inside Your XB-300Li Battery
The Battery is composed seven-cell, 8 Amp-hour capacity
batteries in series, for a total capacity of 24 V, 8 Ah.
The component batteries are a standard, commercially
available size. Keep this in mind, however, should you
choose to service your battery.
1) The batteries are soldered into place. Replacing
batteries will require soldering equipment and
skills.
2) Batteries can be extremely dangerous. If allowed
to short-circuit, they can cause burns, create
blinding arcs, or explode, causing serious injury. If
you accept this risk, work slowly, and exercise
utmost care! Work with only one wire at one time."

[Bigmunch]

Searching around online I found this website , do you think I could adapt this setup to work ?

http://www.batteryspace.com/Customized-Polymer-Li-ion-Battery-29.6V-1050mAh-31-Wh-10A-rate.aspx

Let me know what you think,
Thanks in Advance ,
Todd in Florida, USA

[The Stig]

Searching around online I found this website , do you think I could adapt this setup to work ?

http://www.batteryspace.com/Customized-Polymer-Li-ion-Battery-29.6V-1050mAh-31-Wh-10A-rate.aspx

Let me know what you think,
Thanks in Advance ,
Todd in Florida, USA

Thats a tiny battery. If your bike has a similar controller to the one mine came in, this battery would not meet the power requirements. My controller had a 14A limit.
I would recommend you get some detailed pictures of the battery your bike comes with. Have a ruler with a scale in the pics. Then find a better battery that you can just swap. You might also need to swap the controller.

[Bigmunch]

Thanks, as soon as my 300li arrives I will post up some pics of the battery with some measurements.

[SergeTruth]

I've been using the 36V battery a lot lately and it works great. In densely populated areas, pedaling makes it go too fast, so it's mostly riding on battery. The battery that comes with the bike (24V 10Ah) is too weak, but it's ok as a backup. The 36V battery is a must-have upgrade for this bike. The power indicators doesn't work properly (it's always on full), but the battery works great.

BMSBattery has changed their web site. Here is the battery I have:
http://www.bmsbattery.com/packs/17-36v- ... -pack.html

This one should also work:
http://www.bmsbattery.com/packs/168-36v ... -pack.html

BEWARE: I have purchased their 24V LiFePO4 little frog battery and it DOES NOT WORK.
BEWARE http://www.bmsbattery.com/packs/16-24v- ... -pack.html BEWARE

The little frog batteries mount onto the bike without any modifications.

[Bigmunch]

I am going to have to search around for a solution, since the 300Li's battery is in a rectangular/Tube enclosure on the seatpost/frame. I sent this query to the x-treme tech via email:


I have an xb-300li on the way to me. My cousin offered me his xb-310 battery. I want to know if his xb-310 battery can work with my xb-300.
What would I need for it to be a back up for me? Do I need to purchase the dock parts? Will the controller on mine work with his battery? Please let me know. Thank you!

-

The tech's answer was short and sweet":
Subject: XB300Li

Posted by Gary (Staff)

Hello,

The batteries are not interchangeable between those 2 models.

Sorry,

Gary

[Bigmunch]

Well,
Had to refuse the first bike today when UPS showed up with a battered box with multiple holes in it, tools from the tool kit were strewn around the UPS freight truck and the front wheel was visible, a few spokes showed damage so I refused the shipment. My other bike arrives tomorrow, hopefully that one will be in one piece.

[The Stig]

Ouch thats unlucky. Sure you don't wanna take this chance to exchange it for the 310Li
My UPS guy was really good and encouraged me to open the box because it had a hole, and check everything in the middle of the street outside my former college

[The Stig]

XB-310Li owners and possibly other commuter ebikers, Check this out:


48V5Ah Li-Ion "Little Frog" EBike Battery Pack
http://bmsbattery.com/48v/324-36v-lithium-ion-little-frog-abs-shell-ebike-battery-pack.html

Packing list:
1. 1Pcs 48V5Ah Li-Ion NiCoMn Little Frog ABS shell ebike battery pack. Included 13s 6665143 cells, 1pcs 10A continuous discharge current smart BMS.
2. 1pcs Lithium Ion battery EMC-120 48V2A aluminium alloy shell charger.

Li-Ion NiCoMn Little Frog ABS Shell EBike Battery Pack Specification:
1. Normal Voltage:48Volts.
2. Dimension: 80mm X 150mm X 250mm.
3. Capacity: 5Ah.
4. Charge Current: 2Amps.
5. Maximal Continuous Discharge C-Rate: 10Amps(24V).
6. Maximal Discharge Current: 20Amps.
7. Overvoltage Protection: 85.6Volts.
8. Undervoltage Protection: 35.75Volts.
9. Lifecycle: 800Cycles.
10. Weight: 3.5Kg.
11. Chemical: Li-Ion NiCoMn.

EMC-120 Lithium Ion Alloy Shell Charger Specification:
1. AC Input Voltage: 90V~132V or 200V~264V.
2. Charge Voltage: 54.6Volts.
3. Charge Current: 2Amps.
4. AC Plug: Europen Standard or American Standard.
5. Power: 120Watts.




The pictures are very loosly tied to reality. The charger in the picture says 43.8V so its probably for the 36V version...? Charge voltage stated for this 48V version is 54.6V.
I wonder if we could find anyone whos bought one of these. I own the 36v10Ah version. I might tell a friend to by this one to power a cute 108.

[Racer_X]

Will 48v frog battery work with the stock XB-310Li controller?

[The Stig]

Will 48v frog battery work with the stock XB-310Li controller?

Doubt it. Although the 36V battery works with it. What are the caps rated at...