Kingsmotorbikes hub motor kit

Mathurin

100 kW
Joined
May 24, 2006
Messages
1,166
Location
Quebec
...
 
I've been searching around for any remaining BL36 motors that WE sells around on the Internet and haven't much luck finding them. Mainly because I've had very good luck with them and they are a good mix of low cost, good reliability in my experience with them. I did find one company that still sells just the motor at http://store.bicycletaxiservice.com/index.html but they really specialize in the custom Pedicab's more than anything it appears. I did get word of some new brushless motor called the "Brushless HBS-36" which is the same brushless motor technology but a slimmer case so it fits in the more narrow fork sizes. If anyone has any experience with this new "Brushless HBS-36" I would love to hear it :D
 
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M, I presume you fired rock salt at the guy?
I thought you'd gotten your credit card company to reverse the charges for failure to deliver.

Glad the motor's really coming! It seems quite certain now that it's coming--why would he lie now? He'll lose your funds AND his rep
(such as it is) if he abrogates again.

The motor you're getting looks to be a good one.
Slim and nicely styled.

Let us know when it comes!

Glad for you,

Reid
 
...
 
Yeah, I thought from the start that the motor was the only value in the kit--it is THE value.

You'll probably want to go through the motor to be sure it's "right" inside--no loose bearing races--or rubbing windings---little things like that.

Post a pic asap. Hope you have it in hand by now.

Cheers,

Reid
 
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60 pounds? Oh no what did he send you? Maybe four motors?
Or one motor and some bricks? Probably a typo of 16 pounds I guess.

The scene where your motor went en voyage.


Father Guido Sarducci's Pack 'n Drop Shop:

"How mucha dissa ting gonna way?"
"Thinka sheza waiting sisteen. Feelzabout that.
"Zatta averdupois or zatta immetric"
"Right you are botha ways: sheza goin' to Ca nookie da."
"Hokay, marker paid post sisty pouns and marker "vera fragile"
and trower down da chute to the firsta floor."

slide, WHAM, BAM.

"Itsa done"

"Whatsa done? Your sister?
man, I hear sheza gettin' done, an a lot."
 
Heh, so I fetched it around 18h,

Box:
IMG_5122.jpg


Inside the box:
IMG_5123.jpg


Stuff taken out from inside the box:
IMG_5124.jpg


Stuff taken apart more or les cleanly:
IMG_5125.jpg


Rack looks badass steel:
IMG_5126.jpg



slapped it together really crudely and went for a quick test-spin untill the batteries were flat. Messed around a lot with the order of the coil wires, I think I'll have to flip the wheel around to get the best out of it (or at least, quiet operation...). As is I find I can get it to run well at low speeds, or at high speeds. Low speed rides around without pedalling just fine, though it'll choke on hills. High speed is really gutless and rude going slow, but it keeps giving a boost as I go faster. Maybe a coil-switching relay would be a good idea. BTW, Everything except numbers and one flanc of the tire is written in chineese... Oh and it turns out King didn't send extra parts afterall. And as you may have expected, the box smelt like cheap chineese plastic. You know the kind... And it felt less heavy then a sack of feed, so it was probably less then 60lbs.

Both my wheels beeing out of true, it was an interesting experience to ride this thing. Alone it goes slower then the speed I normally ride at, but obviously I can add my power on top of that.

The depleted battery pack is now on the charger, everything is written in chineese and it has two red leds that are lit, meaning that electricity is getting to them somehow... I think it's working OK. It gives out 42v.

Warning label behind the charger:
IMG_5129.jpg


Mystery led's:
IMG_5130.jpg


Some other tag that says how awsome this charger is:
IMG_5131.jpg
 
Wow, it looks good! I like that -real steel rack-
Makes the bike topheavy though, to have to have three bricks up there.
At least they fit. A rachet action cargo strap may be wanted
to really clamp the brick bag to the bike (am presuming it's only velcro'd?)


Wonder what the Kanji says? Is humor OK? Let me "translate"?



! Instruction all to be obeyed

-Read all instructions and obey
-Operate according to all instructions
-Instructions must be followed
-Elder persons must not operate
-Childer persons must not operate
-Unruled persons must not operate
-Operate best by following these instructions

-Current volts 220 to reach full charge
-Do not operate batteries without first charge fully
-Red light mean charge ready
-Green light mean charge bad

-Avoid sparkles. Plug to battery then to central power
-Avoid sparkles. Unplug to battery then from central power.

-Charge battery to instructions.
-China made product for USA and Canada
owned by people of China Republic


have fun! your dream-addiction has begun.

The report is excellent and greatly enjoyed here.
I wish everyone could/would provide that much detail as you have done.

More pictures always welcome.

Thank you,

Reid
 
Great pictures, did this kit come with a headlight? It looks like one in the pictures. Makes me want to wire mine into my batteries just to avoid changing out AAA batteries every month :mrgreen:
 
What wattage is it again? 250W 500W. :shock:

Be sure look on the motor for the serial number and email the manufacturer saying you need a new controller and need details on the motor to get the proper controller. :lol: My 500W e-ride (greenwit) XPE turned out to be a 350W. :x

500W should propel you about as fast as you peddle. 250W is likely slower than what you can peddle. :wink:
 
Well the wattage is sposta be 350 for the motor, controller says 500w on it.

And yes, I too love the actual thick, heavy, steel rack. I was able to bend the legs inwards to fit my bike properly, try that with aluminimum? Also it fits onto the axle, not on the small rack screw things. Unfortunately I have a quick release thing that's too small for it, so the fit isn't tight. Maybe I can fit a solid axle in it's stead...


For now the bike is a Mickey mouse tie-wrap festival, and I'm pretty shure I put the wheel in the wrong way around, since the phase combinations that are silent have the wheel turning the wrong way. But I've not tried them all? Still, I went to and came from work on it today, and was not all damp of sweat.


And yeah the light is big and it sends light all over the place, including straight back into the operator's eyes. It works great for beeing seen though.


Anyways I played around with Sabrewalt's graph of phase wire wireing and effects, and found that my motor is different... I'll have to try it for myself and write down the results, this also means I'll have to install the DB...

Maybe over the weekend I can clean up this setup, right now it kinda looks like an old horse that had it's belly opened with guts hanging out, held together with tie wraps.

Also I have a set of Freddy Fender hardcore coming in from BC for this bike, they're not here yet. When they get here I plan to re-arrange the controller and stuff so it's cleaner and under the rack.

BTW, the bike it's installed on is a genuine clunker, weighing in at 36lbs. And yes about the top heavyness. definitely makes the thing less nimble.
Gonna go mess around with it now, and maybe take you guys some pics.
 
Yeah, we demand pictures, many.
Show the clunker; looks don't matter.
A 36lb bike is a steel bike and steel is good.
(grin: salt say: yum, steel goood)

Show all the parts? How do you like the full length twist throttle?
I have a 1/3 length (OEM currie) twister.

Is there a battery eatermeter?

damn me. I'm a clown tonight. But serious in my interest.

r.
 
Oh, yeah.

This bike is gonne be pretty much ruined from salt and grime by the end of winter. Next summer I'll pick up another 25$ clunker MTB at a garage sale or something, and do it again. Hopefully I'll be able to reuse the hubmotor things, though. The fenders should be allright, what with stainless mounting hardware and all.


The full lenght throttle makes it a little tricky to hold onto the handlebar well. Something like a grip-shift style would be prefferable imo.


BTW, in viewing the following pictures, you hereby agree not to mind the mess and stuff.




Anyways here's teh back of the bike. The battery is held on with a bungee cord wrapped around it. Works fine I guess, keeps turning though. In this picture the charger isn't in the battery bag, normally there's a lump on top.
IMG_5132.jpg



And here's the front:
IMG_5133.jpg



But that was before I'd installed the DB and done some ajustments.
Notably I've flipped the wheel around and after playing with the phase wires, got waaay more torque then the other way around. Also I've found that some similar freewheel speed settings give more or less torque.
Max power consumption is somewhere around 20A


The bike was kinda like this before, note canti brakes. But I've got a set of V's lying around that I may install eventually. Need new pads though...
IMG_5109.jpg



And the dash was simple in the first iteration, the light thing has a 4 led battery meter but it's pretty useless. What I mean is that I can get all the way to work using 5 miles worth of battery, obviously a good part of it's range but the 4 leds are still on. And when they start to drop, they drop fast. The right bottom most led turns on when the battery is near the cutoff level:
IMG_5134.jpg



I'll have to swap the light and DB cause it's in the way to turn the key this way. Using the throttle as a switch in our never really flat and sometimes hilly region, and pedals mostly as footrests, it gives me around 15wh/km. But that's a one shot figure, dunno how much it'll give on average. Here you see the present dash with the no longer backlit DB:
IMG_5135.jpg
 
Great pictures. Hope it runs as good for you as it looks.

A suggestion - "The battery is held on with a bungee cord wrapped around it. Works fine I guess, keeps turning though." the bungee cord looks like its wrapped round and round the battery pack in one direction, try starting in the middle of the bungee and crisscross it around the pack joining the hooks together at the end then the pull will be in both directions instead of all going in one.

Hope that makes sense and that I understood what you were saying about that.
 
Yeah I guess you could say it runs about as good as it looks.

And, well it holds on well enoufgh for me I guess. Kinda got the twist after a few tries.
I go real easy over bumps and stuff cause I'm scared to break the quick release skewer.

It's slow, so I'm always helping it out a lot. It gives me < 10 wh/km...
IMG_5143.jpg


Amps are definitely < 20-ish, but torque is ample by me. Speed is the issue.
IMG_5142.jpg



Figured out the charger's LED's, too. One of 'em eventually turns green.
IMG_5137-1.jpg



Anyways, today I went to get a 200K pot to reproduce grandmaster Fechter's throttle sensibility hack.

First try I soldered the thing in the middle wire cause I think I remembered that was where the GM had put it. Shoulda checked though cause augmenting resistance made it go slower! Yeah, that was teh signal wire, dumbass! Well, the second try was good. However, I'm at the end of the 200ohm range and that's just about right for this kit, had I known I woulda gotten an 100 ohm resistor too, so I'd have had more play with the pot's range. Or maybe a bigger pot.

Well whatever, here you see the work in progress on the second attempt.
IMG_5145.jpg



And for your pleasure, here's another porn shot of the buisness end:
IMG_5146.jpg




Edit:
Yesterday the 26th of november, I went for a ride and the front wheel slipped out going down the second part of the first curve on cote de la fabrique, going around 50km/h or so. I'm pissed because the crash wore a hole through my combat parka near the shoulder and two tourists saw me take the dive. I blame this mostly on the cheap chineese rubber material the tire is made out of, since I'm confident this would have been prevented by using an actual tire like on the back wheel that has a wonderfull Schwalbe Big Apple.



EditII:
Souped up the controller and now this thing rawckz.
See: http://tinyurl.com/ygqyvt

Also I broke the throttle and want a better rim laced on,
the one that came with this kit is rubbish.



EditIII:
First "real" icebikeing with this thing, put a studded tire on the front, couldn't be arsed to install the back tire. but the brakes really are hopelessly inadequate for this 42kg POS, especially with the steel rim in front. Have to install V brakes w/salmon pads ASAP.



Edit IV:
Installed Freddy Fenders & studded tires on both wheels.
Did quick work of ripping off the back fender with speed + jolts.
The metal holder things get caught in the knobs.
The front one bent over on it's self and, amazingly, didn't break.
IMG_5202.jpg


With snow and winter tires, it'l get about 30wh/km and an average ride speed of 25 kph. So the batteries should be just right to get me to work. When the roads are scraped it'll get about <20wh/km. Keep in mind this is with good pedalling most of the way, with my clothes it's too cold for a person to do to a non-pedalling run for any lenght of time.

Front wheel spends a lot of time skidding, a throttle would be nice.
Also the speedo is is mounted on the rear wheel for accuracy.



Edit V:
Inside the headlamp

Switch seems to directly take the power...
A big ass relay would be prefferable.
IMG_5180.jpg


PCB
IMG_5192.jpg


Bulb, 40v 5w
IMG_5194.jpg




Edit VI:
Inside the charger

A diode and a cap are absent, yet printed on the silkscreen
IMG_5198.jpg


Flipside:
IMG_5200.jpg




Edit VII:
The batteries are now at 15 cycles and get charged on the bike in the unheated shed, temperature is around freezing. Just for fun I took the bike path home today, so the trip took me twice longer then usual and I spent a good amount of time bogging the motor in thick snow, the last km home saw me sucking the batteries 'till cutoff a couple of time. They gave me just over 11Ah, although of course the last 1/3 - 1/4 or so of capacity yeilded anemic performance.

With the controller mod + studded tires + snow, it gives me around 30wh/km of assistance. Average speed around 25km/h per the DB.
 
Which side of the bike do the hubwires come out in this itteration...

Also Have you tried 48 Volts.. I noticed that my controller has 36-48V printed in english on it.
 
Hi Sabrewalt!

Well the wires now come out the right side, and no I've not tried 48v.
With the mods, 36 is ample to get me to 20mph, and I can pedal up to 25.
In day to day usage, I don't want to go faster.

BTW, I've seen your cable wireing chart but it didn't correspond to the way my motor reacted to them, so I had to go over it myself.


Anyways, recent pics.

Much cleaner cableing.
Note the switch accelerator and 5K pot.
IMG_5214.jpg


More clean-ish cabling, note V-brakes.
Cantis were dangerously inadequate for the 40kg bike.
IMG_5216.jpg


IMG_5215.jpg


IMG_5206.jpg


IMG_5213.jpg


IMG_5208.jpg
 
Now that looked like fun, :twisted: :twisted:

Now all you need is a rear hub motor and you'll have a 2 wheel drive bike, ready to take you through any terrain, LOL.
 
Where did you hide the controller in the cleaned up version. Can't see it in the pictures.

I gotta get me one of those wattmeters.
 
Heh, it allready is 2WD.


Controller's not water tight so it's in a plastic bag with nearly all the connectors, tie-wrapped under the rack.

It's getting colder out so it's ok for now, otherwise it would be too hot.
 
What wiring scheme did you end up using between the controller and the hub motor??

BTW, I was not the person who published the wiring matrix. That was ouch and his little boy did that experimentation. I just plugged mine in and started riding it.

My wiring follows the matrix upper left hand corner wiring as follows.

Hall Effect

Motor Controller
Green Blue
Yellow Green
Blue Yellow

The coil wires are matched.
 
You're right, it was ouchthathurtagain who made the chart!

Here it is, mine runs optimally with all the colors matched to each other 8)
wires.jpg



BTW Reid, do you have one of theese?
 
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