Should I work with what I have or upgrade

[John in CR]

Joey,

If you verify that it's brushless (3 larger wires and a set of 5 small ones for the halls going to the motor), then all you need is higher voltage for more speed unless you're looking for much more powerful acceleration. That means more batteries and a new controller. Yes, if it's brushless the motor will handle 96V without issue. According to the Ebikes.ca simulator the X409 (using a 408 sim and adjusting for the additional turn in the windings), it will get you to a 30mph cruising speed on about 83V from the battery, so you'll need 26-27s of Lifepo4 or 23-24s of Lipo or LiMN. You'll only be running 800W or less so the motor shouldn't be strained at all, though if it's a lot of stop and go, you may want to direct some extra air flow at the motor. Check how warm it getting under your hardest existing operating conditions to give you a baseline, and then also feel it for heat a number of times early on after the change.

If the motor is inside the velo with you, then it's going to be hard to beat the quiet little X409. A lot of the newer motors are noisier, which would be amplified inside a velo. If you wanted more like 40mph or better and far more zippy acceleration, then I'd have a different suggestion for you, but just for that kind of moderate speed, what you have is fine. If you've put a whole lot of miles on it, then I'd say crack it open and change the bearings, and coat the stator with some rust prevention, but there's always a risk of messing something up by opening a motor that is working fine. I'm of the mindset "If it ain't broke, don't fix it".

If you do open it up, put alignment marks on each cover with a corresponding mark on the magnet backing ring. I use a center punch to put 1 dimple on each on one side and 2 on each on the other. That way everything can go back together exactly as before.

John

[dnmun]

when you say 96V do you mean 32S of lifepo4?

you may get 40mph out of the 409 on a 26" at 72V lifepo4.

go look on justin's simulator.

[Farfle]

The 400 series crystalyte BRUSHLESS motors, IMHO are fairly decent motors. They are the quietest motor you are going to find period. Plus, in a smallish wheel you can really put the power to them, my guess is that they can handle similar power to the 9C style motors, as they have a much wider stator, and much more copper, although they are a smaller diameter. (160mm as opposed to 200mm). I would stick with that motor, depending on what FETs / caps are in the controller, running it at a higher voltage/amperage should get you what you want.

[JoeyB]

Just took a minute to unscrew the controller and have a look around it and it seems to have a sticker saying "4820" on the back which I am going to assume means it comes from the Crystalite "Roadrunner" 4820 kit. See image

It appears to have 7 or 8 wires coming out of the back.

[JoeyB]

If you wanted more like 40mph or better and far more zippy acceleration, then I'd have a different suggestion for you,
John

What would be that suggestion?

Is there some place I can get pre made connectors to put batteries in series?

Thanks

[JoeyB]

when you say 96V do you mean 32S of lifepo4?

you may get 40mph out of the 409 on a 26" at 72V lifepo4.

go look on justin's simulator.

Great advice. The siumulator does not seem to have the 409 but the 408 shows 20 mph. In reality I get about 19. It indicates that if I switch to a 404 it takes me to 35mph. If I go to 72 V at stock config I get to about 30 mph

[dogman]

4820. Oh well, 48v 20 amp controller. It was possible you had a 36-72v 20 amp controller but you don't. Looks like a brushless controller to me.

Seems to me, that although that motor is a good motor, that the cheapest easiest upgrade is still to replace the motor with one that is a faster winding.
9continent and 9c clones, muxus, golden, conhis, etc tend to be the least expensive. The advantage will be no need to upgrade the battery or controller.

But no doubt, a 72v 20 amp controller and more battery voltage will pep up that motor.


Anderson powerpoles make good connectors for series or paralell connections since they are all the same. Not polarized into male and female like most connector types.

[docnjoj]

Now it still may be worth opening the controller to see caps and fets. Maybe they are rated high enough so you just have to add batteries in series to get 72 volts?
otherDoc

[JoeyB]

Ebikes.ca just relieved me of a few hundred dollars....Went with the HS3548 and popped for a new controller more for the regen and direct CA hookup. It will also give some room to expand if I ind myself short on range. I went right along and got a new direct connect CA also. So if anyone wants my old stuff I am sure it will be in the for sale forum in a week or so.

[Farfle]

Depending on where your located, I may buy that 409 from you. I have been looking for one for awhile.