new eZip motor

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DAND214
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Re: new eZip motor

Post by DAND214 » Nov 14, 2017 10:08 am

Looks like you forgot to hook up the chain, again.

The easiest repair would of been the spoke on the Schwinn. Why did you disable it?

Are you sure the Samsung 36v pack is LiFePo4 cells or are they Li-ion?

Dan

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Re: new eZip motor

Post by latecurtis » Nov 14, 2017 1:13 pm

I need a reliable cargo bike which is rear wheel drive because it is winter not summer. The Schwinn is front wheel drive. I have never replaced a spore before either so easy for who ? I am helping Doug move today and am going to my friend Mike who has a gas powered Dodge Ram pick up truck. Kind of hard to move a double wide bed with an e bike. :D

However maybe he can fix the spoke and true the wheel on the Schwinn but not in a big hurry as I have three builds or rebuilds to finish first. The one I started last night, A belt drive and a 40 mph 2,000 watt dual motor race bike.

I know I wont get any help on two of those but don't really need help on those. I could use some help on a belt drive WITH disk brakes and a pedal chain. A safe reliable 25 mph top speed cruiser. Any help would be greatly appreciated. Either the Haro V3. or a 29" Mongoose. I will need a pulley set up for a dual D bore motor shaft and a way to make that part work for a 29" wheel or I can use the Haro V3. but will still need the part for the motor shaft and a belt. Please let me know. I got the rest. Thanks.

LC out.
I build e bikes. There not always pretty or practical but sometimes they work, at least for awhile. Immortality is not a dream but the future of our evolution. We were given the tools to forge our own destiny. We were created in gods image and shall evolve to live forever.

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Re: new eZip motor

Post by latecurtis » Nov 15, 2017 6:40 pm

And yes it is just what I thought. Nobody even has a clue how to put a motor on a 29" Mongoose with disk front and rear which has an excellent pedal drive system with fully working gears. The cheapest hub motor kit I found is made by Leaf and way over $300. Belt drive set ups for 29" wheels do not exist as far as I can tell.

Everybody criticizes me for running faulty brakes or only one brake and no chain or pedal gears however whenever I attempt to convert a perfect running pedal bike to electric and only 25 mph and 36 volts maximum power and speed everyone clams up and wont even post.

However the same people criticize me for building a cargo bike with no pedal and one brake. Maybe I do it because sometimes I need groceries and do not want to haul 60 pounds on my back for a mile with a heart condition.

I really want to put a 500 watt 24 volt motor on a rear rack and run a belt drive system which will work with the disk brakes on the rear opposite of the pedal side and run it at 36 volts maximum. The 2,500 rpm Unite motor turns 3,750 rpm and makes 1 horsepower (750) watts at 36 volts. 25 mph gearing is intended but anything over 20 mph will be acceptable for me. Basically a perfect low budget e bike here with the only parts required is the part which bolts to the spokes, the part which replaces the motor sprocket and the belt. Three parts to order and all you smart people out there do not have a clue with all your fancy builds.

If you wont help me on this perfectly sane build then please stop criticizing me on the unorthodox builds that I do as it is the best I can do without the correct parts that I need for a belt drive. Thanks.

LC out.
I build e bikes. There not always pretty or practical but sometimes they work, at least for awhile. Immortality is not a dream but the future of our evolution. We were given the tools to forge our own destiny. We were created in gods image and shall evolve to live forever.

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Re: new eZip motor

Post by DrkAngel » Nov 15, 2017 11:08 pm

Maybe people are just sick of you finding old obsolete motorized bike methods, friction drive, belt drive, yes, even chain drives, and promoting them as some fantastic innovative miracles of technology.

That is not so bad as your absolute helplessness, demanding that others do all the searching and learning, on how to do anything ... for you.
Then, then, we have to spoon feed, and coddle and cajole you to get you to believe us.

Just not worth the effort and frustration?
A little learning is a dangerous thing;
Drink deep, or taste not the Pierian spring:
There, shallow draughts intoxicate the brain,
And drinking largely, sobers us again.

I enjoy enlightening ... and enlivening the spirit of the innovators.

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Re: new eZip motor

Post by latecurtis » Nov 16, 2017 12:57 am

Maybe people are just sick of you finding old obsolete motorized bike methods, friction drive, belt drive, yes, even chain drives, and promoting them as some fantastic innovative miracles of technology.
That's strange. The last time I checked Liveforphysics death bike was a chain drive and the FX 75-5 motor I got is belt driven. Of the three, friction drive would be the less effective up hills but for all those folk in Florida or any state where it is mostly flat a friction drive DIY build will be cheap and reliable.

Anyone can buy a hub motor and install it in an hour or two using few tools or skills. DIY builds however take a bit of mechanical skills and imagination. The beginning of this post I was advised to purchase a bolt in replacement also requiring only limited mechanical skills to accomplish. After about three years of building e bikes (not perfect ones) but e bikes that run at least for awhile it is time to advance and come up with a cheap , less expensive and simple but effective drive-train and not only is a belt safer but if an automotive belt will work it can be replaced at any auto parts store. you can't beat that.

Also I have been searching extensively for many hours for the motor pulley and wheel unit. Also many others have built friction and belt drives but have NOT seen a belt system for a larger wheel than 26".

Also I am 5 feet 8 inches but there are a lot of taller people out there who prefer larger bikes than 26". Most hub motors are for 26" mountain bikes. There are a lot of cheap hub motor kits for 26" bikes for approx. $150. However nothing for 700cc or 28 or 29" bikes. The cheapest and only one I found was $345.

Now imagine how many millions of people out there daily commute to work via bicycle and need a reliable ebike to cover the distance and overcome any physical limitations pedaling due to hills , distance and for those who are less than physically fit. For the few who can shell out enough $$$$$ for a brand new factory e bike : good for them. Also for those that can afford a 29" leaf hub motor kit : good for them also but where does that leave the rest. Taxi cabs !!!! 200 to 300 a month in transportation costs or maybe just another unemployment statistic. Get the picture.

Wall - Mart makes many inexpensive 700cc , 28" and 29" bikes with disk brakes which are VERY expensive to convert to electric. What I want to do is a build for ALL to see which is cheap and has decent hill climbing capability and will do at least 20 mph so people can be on time for work and cost around $250 WITH batteries. Here is a price list of parts which is a good educated guess. If you can find a hub motor for the same price or less which can do the job PLEEEEEase post it as I will order it as soon as I get the money. Also chain drives require a high degree of alignment for motor and wheel sprockets. Any belt drive should be a lot more forgiving.

1. 500 watt 24 volt Unite 2,500 rpm motor. - approx $50 - ebay.

2. 800 watt 36 volt Chinese controller - approx. $15 - ebay.

3. rear factory bike rack and hardware - approx $50 - ebay.

4. pulley wheel for dual D motor shaft - approx $15 - ??????

5. belt drive rear wheel kit for 26" wheel - $35 on e bay. However need one for a 700cc , 28" and 29" wheel ???????

6. Belt. any auto parts store for approx $20

Total - $185.

Batteries - e bay 2 - 36 volt Lion packs with BMS. approx - $70

$185 + $70 = $255

Can you guys please reconsider and please help me out. After all it is NOT an outrageous , unsafe , hair-brained 40 or 50 mph build. It is a very safe pedal assist low budget build anyone with limited skills and tools can do. All that is required is a few difficult to find parts I need. I hereby plead my case. Please let me know. Thanks.

LC out.
I build e bikes. There not always pretty or practical but sometimes they work, at least for awhile. Immortality is not a dream but the future of our evolution. We were given the tools to forge our own destiny. We were created in gods image and shall evolve to live forever.

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Re: new eZip motor

Post by DrkAngel » Nov 16, 2017 5:59 am

DrkAngel wrote: That is not so bad as your absolute helplessness, demanding that others do all the searching and learning, on how to do anything ... for you.
Then, then, we have to spoon feed, and coddle and cajole you to get you to believe us.

Just not worth the effort and frustration?
Now there you go again ...
Swapping between 40-50mph dreaming and "reasonable" 20mph requests.
Trying to fool us into thinking you are being sensible!
As soon as we respond you start talking 40-50mph again.

You may seem to be of some entertainment value, laughing at your hapless ineptitude ...
but for those of us who actually try to help, it has become exceedingly fruitless and tiresome.
A little learning is a dangerous thing;
Drink deep, or taste not the Pierian spring:
There, shallow draughts intoxicate the brain,
And drinking largely, sobers us again.

I enjoy enlightening ... and enlivening the spirit of the innovators.

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latecurtis
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Re: new eZip motor

Post by latecurtis » Nov 16, 2017 7:21 am

Now there you go again ...
Swapping between 40-50mph dreaming and "reasonable" 20mph requests.
Trying to fool us into thinking you are being sensible!
As soon as we respond you start talking 40-50mph again.
I already stated earlier I was not comfortable with high speeds on bikes high up. I want to pedal assist with the 29" mongoose.

I do NOT need help to do 40 mph. The Haro V3 and a 26" dual suspension Huffy bike with 20" tires are my 40 mph candidates. Not a 29" belt drive ebike.

Also I can get 40 mph with chain drives if I hook up a 1,000 watt unite motor on the FRONT of any bike and one on the back. it would be 2,000 watts. An 1,800 watt belt drive brush-less motor on the back of the Haro V3 would be safer than a dual motor set up as no powerful motor on the front is safe. At least that is what I have been hearing from everyone here.

If 40 or 50 mph was my only goal building e bikes I would have ordered the winch motor someone here on this post told me about. Do you remember who that was ? :lol: " Use your 2,000 watt variable controller to get up to speed then short the something and hold on" It was something like that Also I could have ordered one of those imperial electric 2,700 watt 2100 rpm 36 volt motors for $110 and $25 shipping. I did not.

I even thought about going really cheap for 40 mph and simply order a second 48 volt Chinese controller and swap them for the two 24 volt controllers hooked up to the 20" dual motor cargo bike I already built.

Like I stated in my last post the build will be for everyone. A safe reliable e bike conversion and < $200 alternative to a $350 hub motor. Thanks.

LC out.
I build e bikes. There not always pretty or practical but sometimes they work, at least for awhile. Immortality is not a dream but the future of our evolution. We were given the tools to forge our own destiny. We were created in gods image and shall evolve to live forever.

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Re: new eZip motor

Post by DrkAngel » Nov 16, 2017 10:27 am

If you really want a quality, simple, durable, powerful motor solution see #1 Easy Quick Fix

At time of post was only about $80 (motor and recommended sprocket). ... About $110 now.
A little learning is a dangerous thing;
Drink deep, or taste not the Pierian spring:
There, shallow draughts intoxicate the brain,
And drinking largely, sobers us again.

I enjoy enlightening ... and enlivening the spirit of the innovators.

New & Improved - Acronym Definitions

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Re: new eZip motor

Post by latecurtis » Nov 17, 2017 10:27 pm

29gear.png
I would no doubt consider that route with the 29" Mongoose however it is impossible to do as the Disk brake assembly would be in the way. I would not be able to run disk on that bike and I prefer to run them as the bike came with disk.

A 10 tooth motor and 140 tooth rear wheel sprocket would work if 8 mm chain were used as the 140 tooth sprocket would be large but not too large with teeth for 8 mm chain however nobody makes it and a belt drive would be safer than a chain if it were to break at high speed. Also less likely to pop of if it came out of alignment. That is why after careful study a belt drive would be simple. Also as I stated earlier on I already own a 500 watt 24 volt Unite motor. At 36 volts and 750 watts it will go up hills with 23 mph gearing.

The 24" cargo bike with the 48 volt 1,000 watt Unite motor is going to the scrap metal pile as well as the 20" cargo bike with the 24 volt 500 watt rear motor and the 36 volt 800 watt unite motor. The 48V 1,000 watt motor will be paired up with the 36 volt 800 watt Unite motor for a dual motor bike with 48 volts to each motor for a whopping 2,000 + watts and will go on a heavy duty 26" dual suspension frame with 40 mph gearing.

The 24 volt 500 watt Unite motor will need a new home and none better than on the rear rack I will be installing on the rear of the 29" mongoose.
Either a 140 tooth wheel sprocket which will be 14 to 1 gear reduction for approx. 23 mph or a belt drive system with 14 to 1 gear reduction will work. Like I said I am not asking help for a 40 mph build. I am perfectly capable of accomplishing that myself.

I took the new 24" build out for a spin. The new 24" Mongoose with the 800 watt hub motor on the back. I know it does not have a pedal chain and with a front hub motor on the rear it never will. Also the front brake works but is difficult to apply as it needs a longer brake cable. The seat post collapsed on the way back and ran a bolt thru it and tightened the opposite side of the quick release with vice grips.

Besides those minor issues it is very powerful and smooth and as quiet as a church mouse compared to the chain driven 24" cargo bike. It is the heavy hauler DA stated it could be when I bought it. hills are a breeze and a two mile round trip to Wall-Mart Dan's old packs were VERY stable at 3.99 to 3.97 volts. I have took very good care of those LiPo packs besides not using them much. They are charging back up to 4.2 volts now as I forgot my chain and need to go back as I did not do grocery shopping yet.

The controller is now waterproof. I wish I could say the same for the batteries. The next battery upgrade will be waterproof like the controller and with a waterproof thumb throttle it should be 100% waterproof as the hub motor has no holes like the unite motors.

I do not believe there is an easy fix to convert the 29" bike though. No cheap hub motor and the 450 watt kits won't fit with the disk brakes. The only thing I see which will work is a rear rack for the motor and a chain or belt system with 14 to 1 gear reduction. It would need to be opposite the pedal side and clear the disk brake assembly.

3D printers are only cheap for plastic parts. I am not using questionable plastic parts. The only solution is for a pulley wheel for a belt which will fit on a dual D bore motor shaft and a rear wheel assembly for a belt drive which together give a 14 to 1 gear reduction.

https://www.ebay.com/i/322800319943?chn=ps&dispctrl=1

for 26" wheel.


Thanks and please let me know about the 29" 23 mph belt drive Mongoose project.

LC out.
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I build e bikes. There not always pretty or practical but sometimes they work, at least for awhile. Immortality is not a dream but the future of our evolution. We were given the tools to forge our own destiny. We were created in gods image and shall evolve to live forever.

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Re: new eZip motor

Post by Sunder » Nov 21, 2017 6:06 pm

latecurtis wrote:
Nov 15, 2017 6:40 pm
And yes it is just what I thought. Nobody even has a clue how to put a motor on a 29" Mongoose with disk front and rear which has an excellent pedal drive system with fully working gears. The cheapest hub motor kit I found is made by Leaf and way over $300. Belt drive set ups for 29" wheels do not exist as far as I can tell.
Maybe I've missed too many posts now, but huge numbers of people here have motorised 29ers with disc brakes. There's nothing complex or different about it. Any hub motor that has a disc brake mount, can be laced into any size wheel greater than the diameter of the motor. The Q100H and Q100C are both great example for moderate power set ups. Just get a lower speed wind to compensate for the larger wheel size.

$79 - a long way from your "way over $300":

http://www.greenbikekit.com/gbk-100r-36 ... otors.html
4. Suitable wheel size: 16", 20", 22", 24", 26", 28"
v-brake and disc brake are the same drop-out
BTW, before you object that 29" isn't there, A 29er is a marketing term. Few actual wheels without going really fat tyres will hit 29" and it is more accurately called a 28".
29ers or two-niners are mountain bikes and hybrid bikes that are built to use 700c or 622 mm ISO (inside rim diameter) wheels, commonly called 29" wheels.[1] Most mountain bikes use ISO 559 mm wheels, commonly called 26" wheels. The ISO 622 mm wheel is typically also used for road-racing, trekking, cyclo-cross, touring and hybrid bicycles. In some countries, mainly in Continental Europe, ISO 622 mm wheels are commonly called 28" wheels or "28 Incher".[2]
DrkAngel wrote:
Nov 15, 2017 11:08 pm
Maybe people are just sick of you finding old obsolete motorized bike methods, friction drive, belt drive, yes, even chain drives, and promoting them as some fantastic innovative miracles of technology.
Lost me on this one. Why do you think belt drives are obsolete? When I move to London (less than a year now!), I was planning on building a custom BBS02 based bike. Replace cheap square wave controller with Phase Runner, replace chainring with a 3D printed gates drive, use a good quality internally geared hub, possibly continuously geared.

My aim is a very refined, ultra low maintenance bike. I want to use it as a reliable car replacement.
eBike: Q100H on 16S with Phaserunner FOC Controller
eMotorscooter: Vectrix VX-1 on 36S
eCar: Mitsubishi Outlander PHEV... Waiting for warranty to expire
eHouse: Still on grid, but with LTO batteries and 3kw LF inverter...

After 5 builds, the best advice I can give, is start with high quality products. I prefer http://www.ebikes.ca

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Re: new eZip motor

Post by latecurtis » Nov 22, 2017 10:44 pm

I will not be giving up on a belt drive. I got an e mail from the manufacturer who makes sheaves for belt drives.

http://prntscr.com/he24k8

I am not sure if he has the correct size or can make a custom Sheave but I will find out and am not about to give up on it yet.
I will also need the roller part for the motor sprocket. I may have to find a steel roller and drill holes thru it and bolt it to an 11 tooth #415 motor sprocket.

If I cannot find a sheave for a 29" wheel I may simply build the 26" Haro with a belt drive. I may also look around for a hub motor but don't know how to lace the spokes. I never did it.

I do realize how well hub motors work ; especially a rear hub motor. I took the new 24" build downtown last night for some beer drinking at my friends house. I remember about a year to 18 months ago when I was at the old apartment and recall the old packs of Dan's slowing down just a little on the way home. They were around 3.7 volts when I got home but it was a downtown trip.

Since those old packs are all I have for LiPo except for a single 8.0 - 6S pack I charged the last three SLAs I had. I threw out all the others I had. The old LiPo packs were FULLY charged and balanced but did not plug them in until I arrived downtown to my destination. The SLAs were still good enough to make it down there. I do not think they had much left though and was a lot of down hill or slight decline.

Running the old LiPos back they never slowed down once on the small hills and made it back with no problem. I never used full throttle and averaged about 10 to 12 mph to try and get thru the winter with them. Thanks.

LC out.
I build e bikes. There not always pretty or practical but sometimes they work, at least for awhile. Immortality is not a dream but the future of our evolution. We were given the tools to forge our own destiny. We were created in gods image and shall evolve to live forever.

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Re: new eZip motor

Post by DrkAngel » Nov 22, 2017 11:22 pm

With a little logic, or basic common sense or even simple observational skills ... you should know that a spoke mount belt "sheave" for a 26" 36h will fit identically on a on a 29" 36h, spokes are identically positioned at connection points, just longer, which has no effect.

Youtube has many tutorials on lacing spokes!

What happened to your 2nd 10Ah LiPo?
Last edited by DrkAngel on Dec 04, 2017 5:49 pm, edited 1 time in total.
A little learning is a dangerous thing;
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And drinking largely, sobers us again.

I enjoy enlightening ... and enlivening the spirit of the innovators.

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Re: new eZip motor

Post by latecurtis » Nov 23, 2017 4:01 am

With a little logic, or basic common seance or even simple observational skills ... you should know that a spoke mount belt "sheave" for a 26" 36h will fit identically on a on a 29" 36h, spokes are identically positioned at connection points, just longer, which has no effect.

Youtube has many tutorials on lacing spokes!

What happened to your 2nd 10Ah LiPo?
Thank you very much DA. At the present time I do not have the money for the sheave however next month is almost here so i will order it then.

I look forward to watching the videos and lacing spokes. I will check them out.

the pair of 10.0 - 6S LiPo packs were fully balance charged and ran in series for 44 volts with the 24" cargo bike (the first one with the 48 volt unite motor not the new one) This took place soon after I bought them. i only used full throttle for about a minute or less and drove it normal and less than five miles and got a puffed up pack for my trouble.

That was the first pack. The second one is the one I destroyed when I was drunk and forgot to charge it and the chain was too tight on the 24" cargo bike. It is why I am not running that bike any more and put the 800 watt hub motor on the back of a 24" Mongoose which is my new 24" cargo bike.


Thanks for posting.

LC out
I build e bikes. There not always pretty or practical but sometimes they work, at least for awhile. Immortality is not a dream but the future of our evolution. We were given the tools to forge our own destiny. We were created in gods image and shall evolve to live forever.

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Re: new eZip motor

Post by latecurtis » Nov 23, 2017 4:01 am

With a little logic, or basic common seance or even simple observational skills ... you should know that a spoke mount belt "sheave" for a 26" 36h will fit identically on a on a 29" 36h, spokes are identically positioned at connection points, just longer, which has no effect.

Youtube has many tutorials on lacing spokes!

What happened to your 2nd 10Ah LiPo?
Thank you very much DA. At the present time I do not have the money for the sheave however next month is almost here so I will order it then.

I look forward to watching the videos and lacing spokes. I will check them out.

the pair of 10.0 - 6S LiPo packs were fully balance charged and ran in series for 44 volts with the 24" cargo bike (the first one with the 48 volt unite motor not the new one) This took place soon after I bought them. I only used full throttle for about a minute or less and drove it normal and less than five miles and got a puffed up pack for my trouble.

That was the first 10.0 - 6S pack. The second one is the one I destroyed when I was drunk and forgot to charge it and the chain was too tight on the 24" cargo bike. That happened in the last week of October about three weeks ago I think. It is why I am not running that bike any more and put the 800 watt hub motor on the back of a 24" Mongoose which is my new 24" cargo bike.

I have ran LiPo low two different times. The first time was one of the 8.0 packs and it was when I first got them. However I ran them in parallel for a 16.0 - 6S pack for about a year or more before finding a very unstable cell impossible to balance properly.

The puffed up pack when I first ran the pair of 10.0 packs was not my fault and were 3.74 volts on the pack which was not puffed up and no reading on the puffed up pack. That was a defective cell and the fault of the manufacturer. I should have contacted the vender and demanded my $$$ back for that.


Thanks for posting.

LC out
I build e bikes. There not always pretty or practical but sometimes they work, at least for awhile. Immortality is not a dream but the future of our evolution. We were given the tools to forge our own destiny. We were created in gods image and shall evolve to live forever.

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Lithium Carnage ...

Post by DrkAngel » Nov 23, 2017 11:01 am

Maybe it's just me, but I don't think so, I build Lithium battery packs and run them for years and thousands of miles without those types of failures!
My most recent recycled old used LiPo battery build has run for 4 years and 7000++ miles and still maintains equal charged and discharged voltages.

Preliminary testing, sorting and confirmation allows years of carefree use with no need for any balancing.
(I do a confirmation-balance charge every hundred cycles or so.)

Latest builds take advantage of bargain price on genuine high output Samsung cells (link to bargain posted previously)

25.9V 26.4Ah for $105 in cells, tested and resorted into eZip RMB battery case. Expect many years of excellent performance!
=683.76Wh 350w for 20mph* / 80% efficiency = 437.5wh per 20 miles (31.25 miles @ 20mph) and 150w to spare @ 20mph for hills.

37V 13.2Ah by paralleling 3 x $25 BMS protected packs into an eZip RMB battery case ($75 total). Carefree! great cells with high\low protection and auto-balancing!
=488.4Wh 350w for 20mph* / 80% efficiency = 437.5wh per 20 miles (22.3 miles @ 20mph) But designed for slogging through slush and snow (Snow Beast w/studded tires) ... or cruising @ 27mph (PA Cruiser) (30mph w/assist)
Could go 37V 17.6Ah in same eZip battery case by disassembling 4 packs but Winter and high speed runs will be of short range-limited duration anyhow.

Image

* note - I gear my eBikes for optimal @ 20mph
A little learning is a dangerous thing;
Drink deep, or taste not the Pierian spring:
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I enjoy enlightening ... and enlivening the spirit of the innovators.

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Re: new eZip motor

Post by latecurtis » Nov 23, 2017 4:24 pm

https://evmc2.wordpress.com/2014/09/06/ ... f-rc-lipo/

Very interesting article. I only read one paragraph but when I saw 700 amps with 10 in parallel it got my attention. :lol:

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Sunlite-Gold-T ... SwsYpaBMEH

This also got my attention. The cheapest I saw last night was over $50. This is a deal. The thing I really appreciate when looking at a new build is simplicity. The less moving parts the better. Hub motors are indeed the most simple however I have two hub motors and never built a belt drive.

Besides the rear rack which a lot of non e bikes have all I am looking at is the Unite 500 watt motor, the rear wheel sheave and the belt. The controller and battery pack can go in a front battery bag similar to the one which came with the 800 watt hub motor kit. I will most likely use that one for the controller and perhaps two of those $34 Samsung Lion packs with the BMS if they will fit. If not I will need to order a larger one.


Since the rear wheel sheave will be only one size fits all my 14 to 1 gear reduction will need to come from the motor pulley attachment. I may have to drill holes and bolt something to the 11 tooth #415 motor sprocket like the 80 tooth #25 wheel sprocket is bolted to a 16 tooth freewheel. (The original 48V Currie upgrade). I will need a list for steel wheel pulleys that can be drilled and size will be important for calculating gear reduction. I will require a different calculator for that.

I would also like to be able to use an automotive type belt instead of having to order an expensive one online. I think they are called serpentine belt. That way if one needs replacement I can pick it up at any auto parts store. :D Thanks.

LC out.
I build e bikes. There not always pretty or practical but sometimes they work, at least for awhile. Immortality is not a dream but the future of our evolution. We were given the tools to forge our own destiny. We were created in gods image and shall evolve to live forever.

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Re: new eZip motor

Post by DAND214 » Nov 24, 2017 12:19 am

latecuttis wrote:
Very interesting article. I only read one paragraph but when I saw 700 amps with 10 in parallel it got my attention. :lol:
Yes those are great cells. They are expensive and hard to find. One of the very few LiFePo4 cells that are worth playing with.

Dan

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Re: new eZip motor

Post by latecurtis » Nov 24, 2017 4:29 am

https://www.ebay.com/itm/50PCS-Recharge ... fa04c57ae0

OK.

Why and HOW do fake Ah get away with that.

Even if they were 2Ah each five rows of ten could work great for a number of my e bikes. Thanks.

LC out.
I build e bikes. There not always pretty or practical but sometimes they work, at least for awhile. Immortality is not a dream but the future of our evolution. We were given the tools to forge our own destiny. We were created in gods image and shall evolve to live forever.

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Re: new eZip motor

Post by DAND214 » Nov 24, 2017 10:24 am

latecurtis wrote:
Nov 24, 2017 4:29 am
https://www.ebay.com/itm/50PCS-Recharge ... fa04c57ae0

OK.

Why and HOW do fake Ah get away with that.

Even if they were 2Ah each five rows of ten could work great for a number of my e bikes. Thanks.

LC out.
Now you are making sense. Yes they are not what they say they are. Even a 2AH, they are not what you want. Seem cheap for a battery build but they are not!

Hope everyone had a great Thanksgiving!

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Re: new eZip motor

Post by latecurtis » Nov 24, 2017 6:23 pm

sbb.png
Yes. They may not be worth doing. However I am willing to give it a shot. I am just not willing to shell out over $100 for the Full River batteries just yet.

I am wondering if I can build two or three cylinder shaped packs which could fit inside a three liter soda bottle or two of them cut to fit together and run the power wires down out of where the cap goes for 100% waterproof packs ? I have already used this method with the two 24 volt controllers for the 20" cargo bike. Thanks.

LC out.
I build e bikes. There not always pretty or practical but sometimes they work, at least for awhile. Immortality is not a dream but the future of our evolution. We were given the tools to forge our own destiny. We were created in gods image and shall evolve to live forever.

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Re: new eZip motor

Post by latecurtis » Dec 04, 2017 3:26 am

As the Hub Motor Turns and the LiPo Fire burns.

I have not posted lately as I am currently not building anything but I have been running the old packs in the cash box exclusively about two to three times a week now to do grocery shopping ect.

I have been running the 20" hub motor on the rear of the 24" bike. However I will need new batteries soon if I want to go further that 2 miles round trip to the grocery store or the Laundromat.

I really do not see how these sellers of cheap LIFEPO4 cells can get away with the false advertising they do. There should be some standards and considered a scam if greater than 30% of the REAL capacity.

That said I have two simple questions.

1. Is it safe to say the batteries are at least 1/3 what they are rated for. 6,000 mAh - 6 Ah / 3 = 2 Ah * 10 = 20 Ah
3 - 22 Ah SLAs are $132 with shipping and 100 of those cells are $70 with free shipping.

2. I know a BMS is recommended but I do not want one and furthermore running these cells in series the pack is only as good as the weakest cell without a BMS. So I was thinking earlier why not run them in parallel each row instead of series then hook 10 rows in series therefore one or two cells in one of the rows is slightly lower it should not matter as much.

Not only that but easy test for each row. new they should be close in voltage but if a row is significant lower with multi meter then testing cells in the row will work and another $34 could replace the less than perfect cells and still be cheaper than SLA and cheaper and safer than LiPo

Please check my diagram below and let me know. Also what charger would work for charging 100 cells at once ? Thanks.

LC out.
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Re: new eZip motor

Post by DrkAngel » Dec 04, 2017 8:33 am

1. Already answered-explained that.
2. Do search for false over-rated cells ... better check cell testing methodology under Homemade Battery Packs thread.

Should have invested in the Samsung 37V 4.4Ah packs!
I got a total of 29 (580cells), as low as $1.25 per cell, (10 pack purchase).
Built 2x 25.9V 26.4Ah packs for my eZips,
Several cordless power tool upgrades,
Nice pile of cells for many small projects,
and kept a dozen of the packs with the best BMS's

Just resurrected a 2006? era Wilderness Energy 36V 600W front hub brush motor.
Turns out, needed a new controller, but only had a 25A to replace the oem 35A.
OK for testing though ...
Plugged in one of the 36V 4.4Ah Samsung packs, through a V-A-W-Ah meter and took for a test drive.
Pack is rated at 20A continuous 40A surge, but BMS @ 30A continuous and controller at 25A, so I throttled below 20A with a few 25A surges.
Motor @ 36V 35A is rated at 600w 26mph.
25A controller is a severe restriction limiting speed and acceleration, so am shopping for 36V 35A controller.
As is, would be optimal as pedal assist, geared (wound) too high for efficient motor only use.
Many have pumped this motor to 48V ... increases torque and speed but very inefficiently.
I,, am shopping for 36V controller with true ≥35A output.

Oh, Samsung 4.4Ah pack performed excellently!
~50% discharge left battery at <100 ºF and all banks within .01V.

Minimum of 4 packs in parallel recommended for normal use ... 36V 17.6Ah - cost me $99.60
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Re: new eZip motor

Post by latecurtis » Dec 04, 2017 8:14 pm

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JUeXJe71TCs

Did you watch this guys videos ?

Or did you run your own tests. He speaks highly of the Samsung 36 volt packs.
Minimum of 4 packs in parallel recommended for normal use ... 36V 17.6Ah - cost me $99.60
They are about $34 each on e bay. Where did you get 4 for $99.60.

Christmas is on the way. I do not have $$$ for four packs. Also he recommended a $35 solar charger in the video. He said something about a cheaper one but constant voltage and current is required or the battery will be destroyed.

Perhaps A link should be posted in your battery section to this guys videos. This guy, like you DA. really knows what he is doing and I like that he takes the time to test cells and packs and posts the results.

I will be ordering two of those 36 volt packs to run in parallel. there is no way I can afford four at $34 each and I will need a link for a constant voltage and current charger for the lowest price possible.

I did not watch all his videos but saw the one on the cheap 9800 mAh Chinese rip off cells and it makes me want to find the manufacturer or whoever printed 9800 on the cells and shove a few of them up you know where. :twisted:

I really hate scam artists and for e bay or any vendor to be allowed to sell a big pack of lies is truly outrageous and they should be held accountable in a court of law. It is the same thing as robbing someone and people should put a stop to it.

Thank god for people like you DA. and the guy posting that video as I for one do not have money to be wasting on a pack of garbage.
I will be ordering those two for now but will be doing further research on those FULL RIVER cells as they are larger and I think were made in the USA. I would like test results on those for future reference as I would like to make a large pack capable of at least 50 miles at 20 mph for summer.

Two of the Samsung packs will do fine for up to 5 mile round trips in the city under 15 mph right ? Please let me know. Thanks.

LC out.
I build e bikes. There not always pretty or practical but sometimes they work, at least for awhile. Immortality is not a dream but the future of our evolution. We were given the tools to forge our own destiny. We were created in gods image and shall evolve to live forever.

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Re: new eZip motor

Post by DrkAngel » Dec 04, 2017 9:01 pm

Samsungs were
1 @ $35 each
5 @ $30 each
10 @ $25 each
50 @ $20 each
A little learning is a dangerous thing;
Drink deep, or taste not the Pierian spring:
There, shallow draughts intoxicate the brain,
And drinking largely, sobers us again.

I enjoy enlightening ... and enlivening the spirit of the innovators.

New & Improved - Acronym Definitions

Index - Homemade Battery Packs - Updated - November 2015

EBike Toolbox - Bargains! $

Endless Sphere Wiki

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Re: new eZip motor

Post by latecurtis » Dec 04, 2017 9:15 pm

OK. That explains that. You either bought 10 or 50.

I wish I had the $$$ to buy 50 or even 10 but I do not have that much. I did when I got my disability settlement over two years ago but do not now.

When this website was down for upgrades and repair I started posting on another e bike website and got a couple of reply's.
Another interesting e bike and battery builder. It seems he has advanced knowledge similar to you Dan and Sunder.

I see now that I am not is the same advanced stage as you guys are but see now that you guys have been right all along as everything I am watching in videos and the stuff I read from other sources all confirm what you are all telling me here on endless sphere.

What I found interesting was this guy putting the battery pack up in a front basket exactly like I do with the cash box , chain and padlock in my 24" cargo bike. If you read it he even weighed the front and back wheels on scales for even weight distribution. That was my idea and he came to the same conclusion. Interesting.

You may have to use printscreen or a screenshot and paste it into paint or a program where it can be enlarged as 512 kb is still the limit I believe so I had to scale it down to 458 kb and is a little hard to read but is worth reading. Thanks and I will be ordering the Samsung packs. Any link for a low cost charger which is constant voltage and current will be appreciated. I am looking also and not being lazy. Thanks for posting.

LC out.
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