Easy question on purchase choice?

Hi all - long time lurker, first time poster.

I am hoping the experts here can help me with a decision I am trying to make today. Options are:
- 2014 Prodeco X3 (can pick up a 12AH 2014 for ~ $1650) .. seems to lead in value, specs.
- 2014 Easy Motion Xtrem (can get a 9AH 2014 for ~ $1850) .. known to have better torque and build quality.
- Home build project: Haven't found a DIY package that seems simple enough for a beginner .. would seem to have better value, performance (see concerns below) than turnkey models.

I've done enough reading to understand people's concerns with the Prodeco battery mount, general service. I also understand with the advantages of home builds.

My use case: Primarily urban riding. Some light hills, but not heavy grade. Mild/low offroad trails. 90% of the time will be a 4 mile RT commute. Live in Silicon Valley area (if that helps).

My build experience: None, literally no tools and I haven't worked with batteries or bikes extensively in the past. I am an ENG grad, and I have worked on cars (a little); but, compared to most folks on here, I'm super green. I have limited free time (family + work + school); but, taking two days to do a build is possible.

Other thoughts: Hoping to have some resale value in a year or two in case I want to upgrade or my commute gets longer.

Trying to pull the trigger this weekend as I feel like I've been over analyzing for too long and the deal I've been able to arrange on the premade bikes seems to be pretty good.

Thanks in advance for your advice!

If you are ready to ride now go buy one of the prebuilt bikes.
I have no experience with the models you mention so no help there.
But as soon as you put a few miles on the pre built you will then want to start ordering parts for your homebuilt ebike.
Waiting for shipping and parts to arrive is part of the game we play.

Thanks for the reply. I'm fine waiting on shipping/delivery.. no issue waiting. My only concern with the DIY is finding a setup that is in my price range that won't be beyond my skillset or require purchasing a large number of tools/gear/meters that would ultimately push my budget too high.

A few years ago the E-Bikes that were available were real junk, but no more now there are lots of good choices. My vote between the two you have whittled your choice down to would be the 2014 Easy Motion Xtrem.

If you haven't already viewed these reviews do take a look;

http://electricbikereview.com/prodecotech/phantom-x3/

http://electricbikereview.com/easy-motion/neo-xtrem/

If you really get into E-Biking eventually you may want to build something exactly the way you want it but you never know what that is until you try one out.

-R

Well I`m just trying to get you hooked on electric transport.

As soon as you have taken a few rides, well, you will follow the path many of us have.
Hi my name is ..... and I am an e biker.

Good points Russell, thank you.

I've watched all many of that guy's YouTube videos and read both reviews - great recommendations. He is not necessarily definitive in his recommendations - esp with those two bikes as they are not quite apples to apples. One of the surprising videos was the mountain biking on the Stromer and the Xtrem in Chattanooga, was really surprised with how well the Xtrem held up relative to the far more expensive Stromer.

Seems so unintuitive, but the lower powered and smaller battery on the Xtrem (at a higher cost) doesn't seem to discourage anyone from recommending vs the X3. Thanks for your opinion.. seems aligned to many I've spoken with.

I suppose the third choice does not really exist.. the DIY build is just not the right fit for me (based on skills, budget, tool, time, etc).

Icewrench said:

Well I`m just trying to get you hooked on electric transport.

As soon as you have taken a few rides, well, you will follow the path many of us have.
Hi my name is ..... and I am an e biker.

Click to expand...

Love it - I am already excited to get in, but so new to all of this that with my somewhat limited budget I'm trying to make the right choices upfront

In your case, I'd highly recommend the DIY route, and here's why.

A bicycle is designed for 1 human power. It's components are based on handling 1 human power at speeds a human can obtain. Most bikes are generally overbuilt to the task, and have a long service life accordingly.
However, even the smallest hub motors will than double the total power of the bike. Adding a tiny 250w motor to a bicycle is adding more power potential than turning your bike into a tandem. Suddenly, all the bike's parts are dealing with higher forces and energies, and the service life is shortened.

Parts that would wear out in years now wear out in months. Parts that an average rider might never break suddenly are a problem. Basic maintenance that sadly rarely to never gets done on a normal bike now becomes a critical weekly routine.

Owning an ebike, prebuilt or from a kit demands that you develop the mechanical skills to maintain it.
You will at some point need to know how to do the following:
Check spoke tension
True a wheel
Change a tire
Air up a tire
Remove and install a hub motor
Install a torque arm
Test a battery
splice a wire
Tighten and check tightness of every type of nut, bolt, and screw on the bike.

Those are all things you will have to do at some point when owning an ebike. Shops can only do so much, unless you plan to drop the bike off before every ride to be inspected.

Since you have no tools, and no experience, you won't be able to maintain a prebuilt ebike. you'll quickly find yourself broken down or in the shop for all the little problems that will come up. And no matter who builds the bike, they will come up.

By converting your own bike, you'll get the hands on experience needed to understand and maintain the bike properly. Also, by the time you have the conversion finished, you'll have all the basic tools needed to maintain the bike.

You can eliminate much of the DIY confusion by starting with a single vendor for everything. A good example would be : http://www.em3ev.com/store/ Which is a reputable vendor and a good kit.
Or for even more high end, : www.ebikes.ca/shop/ which doesn't include the battery, but they also sell.

demeyer1 said:

My build experience: None, literally no tools and I haven't worked with batteries or bikes extensively in the past. I am an ENG grad, and I have worked on cars (a little); but, compared to most folks on here, I'm super green. I have limited free time (family + work + school); but, taking two days to do a build is possible.

Click to expand...

demeyer1 said:

My only concern with the DIY is finding a setup that is in my price range that won't be beyond my skillset or require purchasing a large number of tools/gear/meters that would ultimately push my budget too high.

Click to expand...

You only really need an adjustable wrench and a couple of hex keys to install a motor kit as shown in this 13-minute video:

Hyena Electric Bikes kit installation tutorial
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WwIp3GC5F_c

Installing the motor takes about as much effort as fixing a flat tire. Checking eBay it looks like a 48V 1000W motor kit can be bought for $265 right now (vs the Prodeco and Easy Motion which appear to be 36V 500W and 350W motors). Leaving more you can spend on a good battery which is more important.

If I can install a kit it must be pretty easy, unless the instructions are in Chinese. :lol: I've commuted by bike for dozens of years and still rely on the local bike shop from time to time. I'm not a mechanic, but with minimal basic tools and a few wiring supplies the standard kit installation was pretty easy. You'll be changing flats, adjusting and replacing brake pads, adding a mirror; regular routine bicycle stuff mostly anyway. :wink:
Match a kit to a suitable/serviceable new or used donor bike and get zippin'!

You know your own skill level. I often tell people the kit is "easy as changing a tire" to install. In fact, often the hardest part is removing the old handlebar grip.

But some cannot handle that.... Some return the kit because they can't handle tighten a bolt with an allen wrench. If this is the case, then you better buy a bike from a local shop who will fix it. If the nearest repairs are not in your city, you will find the simplest problem requiring to learn all the same steps as installing a kit. You'll have a flat, then your LBS may wreck the motor just changing a tube.

We need more local bike shops with ebike experience.

Learning the skills is worth it though. The best thing is choosing a bike that fits you, your body size first, and your riding needs second. Then putting a motor on it. Now you have a bike that is a joy to ride, not one that makes your hands or ass numb in 6 miles.

If the "ENG" is for english, then I can see going the prebuilt route, but if you've got an engineering degree and a limited budget then building your own will net you more ebike for the money. There's tremendous satisfaction in building your own vehicle that serves as your primary transportation, and with such a short commute solutions are simple and cheap.

Welcome to ES****Do this before your first post or now (it's retroactive)*****
Please go to the User Control Panel, select Profile, and then enter your city, state/province, and country into the Location field (country minimum) and save it. Once done, your location will appear in every post so you won't have people asking where you are ever again. This will help people help you. Example: Wylie, TX, USA. or just USA, but country as a minimum, and country is the most important. There are many cities with the same name all over the world. Without knowing what country you are in it's hard to make any recommendations. Thank you.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/48V1000W-Electric-Bicycle-LCD-Display-26-Front-Rear-Wheel-Motor-Kit-E-Bike-Hub-/291107275178
Then all you need is a battery. For under 10 mile commute, all you need is 5ah. So $100 worth of 12s rc lipo will do the trick easy.
Three of these would be the cheapest route.
http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/store/__18631__Turnigy_5000mAh_4S1P_14_8v_20C_hardcase_pack_USA_Warehouse_.html
Two of these would make things a little easier.
http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/store/uh_viewItem.asp?idProduct=16207
Bike should have steel dropouts. that's MY only requirement.
Then you need a way to charge them. Many options there from $30 up depending on what you want.

Wow - thank you everyone. I'm now going to spend the afternoon following the links and researching, and thanks for the pointer to update my profile.. taken care of as of now.

Re the question on what ENG stands for, it's Engineering.. sorry for the confusion on that front.

I'm doing the homework on going DIY this afternoon

If you have a bike that's in good shape yes you can buy a kit for as low as $250, a couple of 6S 8Ah LiPo batteries plus a charger/balancer maybe another $250 plus say $50 for a torque arm, tie-wraps, and a few connectors. Add $50-$100 for a rear rack and bag if you don't have them and for $550-$650 you have yourself an E-Bike. More expensive kits from say E-Bikekit will run about $700+battery. And of course you can pay much more.

If you want to build something comparable to the Emotion in integration and want a shiny new bike too here's what I might suggest;

Bike: Motobecane 550HT: $400
http://www.bikesdirect.com/products/motobecane/550ht.htm

36V/14.5Ah downtube battery w/integrated 20A controller and a display, brake levers, throttle and PAS: $379 + shipping (est.$121)
http://www.bmsbattery.com/36v/678-bottle-ebike-battery.html

Bafang CST motor/wheel (260RPM): $265 + shipping (est $125)
http://www.bmsbattery.com/ebike-kits/589-q11-48v1kw-front-driving-hub-motor-e-bike-conversion-kit.html

Torque arms, cassette tool, spoke wrench $20

So for around $1300 you would have a pretty nice E-Bike.

For more power go with the 48V/11.6Ah battery:
http://www.bmsbattery.com/battery-pack/684-bottle-ebike-battery.html

and a separate controller kit:
22A sensorless: http://www.bmsbattery.com/controller/648-s06-250w-imitation-torque-square-wave-controller.html
25A sensored: http://www.bmsbattery.com/controller/649-s06-250w-imitation-torque-square-wave-controller.html

To save a few bucks on the motor get the BPM II that uses a freewheel.

Other places to shop:
http://www.greenbikekit.com/
http://www.elifebike.com/peng/pic.asp
http://www.ebikes.ca/
http://em3ev.com/store/
http://www.ebikekit.com/

-R

Super helpful - thank you Russell.

Before seeing this, I went ahead and purchased a premade bike; but, that is looking like it won't be working out:
http://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=63669

I'll be doing some more homework over the next couple weeks and will update everyone on the thread.