What motor and controller to escape cars danger?

cwah

100 MW
Joined
Jul 24, 2011
Messages
4,256
Location
Between paris and london
Hello,

I'm wondering what would be the best setup to escape cars on starting point on dangerous city?

My current setup is leafmotor 54v (14s) 35A on 20" wheel. Max speed around 33mph.

I think top speed around 40-45mph would be good.

But trust is far from enough. Bus start faster than me!
 
An Electric motorbike seems to be made just for that! [or a modified hybrid MC frame like Raptor/Flux/Vector]

If you want to convert a bicycle to electric, you wont be able to achieve this kind of speed on any hills. The frame just isn't built for that purpose.
 
sonnetg said:
If you want to convert a bicycle to electric, you wont be able to achieve this kind of speed on any hills. The frame just isn't built for that purpose.
Many DH racing frames are riding just as good and stiff as an MX motorcycle frame that is 3 times the weight, and 45 Mph is not fast by today's performance ebike builders.



cwah said:
My current setup is leafmotor 54v (14s) 35A on 20" wheel. Max speed around 33mph.

I think top speed around 40-45mph would be good.

But trust is far from enough. Bus start faster than me!
Build with a bigger motor, on a good old DH racing frame.

Cromotor in a 24'' wheel, 20s RC lipo,18 fet 4110 controller upgraded to 150A... You will be able to accelerate almost any vehicle on a start, with a top speed to keep ahead in city commuting. Build it with high end brakes and 3'' tires, and you will be able to outstop anyone around you on the streets. Up to 24s, and you have a true street racing machine.
 
Just one way.
MXUS 4503 in 24-26" wheel.
http://www.aliexpress.com/store/group/18-mosfet-type/313864_259100320.html
Have LVC set to 82-84V. 60A is plenty. That's 6kw peak at 100V.
24s rc lipo
http://www.ebikes.ca/tools/simulator.html
 
MadRhino said:
Many DH racing frames are riding just as good and stiff as an MX motorcycle frame that is 3 times the weight, and 45 Mph is not fast by today's performance ebike builders.

That's most likely on flats. If you climb a 15-20 degree incline, the speed will probably drop to half of that. I dont think there is any ebike motor out there that can maintain the same speed as it does in flat roads..at least as of now.
 
Sure there are, or very close to it. Slow wind motors reach top speed on less amps. Increasing amps up hills will allow a motor more power to maintain speed.
 
sonnetg said:
MadRhino said:
Many DH racing frames are riding just as good and stiff as an MX motorcycle frame that is 3 times the weight, and 45 Mph is not fast by today's performance ebike builders.

That's most likely on flats. If you climb a 15-20 degree incline, ...
I build for 60+ on the flat, then I can sustain 45 climbing. :wink:
This is off road and I rely on lots of power, on the street one could build with a smaller wheel and have less speed loss up a hill.
 
any way to do it on a cargo bike? i'd like to get something like this:

Juiced-Riders-ODK-V3-Cargo-bike-gray-lavender-2.jpg


then put a qshin 205 motor, 10kw with adaptto and 100v?
 
MadRhino said:
I build for 60+ on the flat, then I can sustain 45 climbing. :wink:
This is off road and I rely on lots of power, on the street one could build with a smaller wheel and have less speed loss up a hill.

What is the range of your ebike? I woun't recommend anyone using RC lipos. Too dangerous and too much hassle. Seems you are using a 20S lipo setup.
 
sonnetg said:
An Electric motorbike seems to be made just for that! [or a modified hybrid MC frame like Raptor/Flux/Vector]

If you want to convert a bicycle to electric, you wont be able to achieve this kind of speed on any hills. The frame just isn't built for that purpose.

My converted Cannondale SuperV will hit 80mph up a 5-7% grade on the highway, and I've hit over 50mph up an extremely curvy solid 20% grade. I carry just over 2kwh of battery and more in a backpack when extra long range is needed, but of course range varies greatly depending how I ride.


Cwah,
I'm sorry to hear about your performance woes, because getting shut down by a bus is just embarrassing. My bike has only been beaten once, and that was a small guy on a Ducati who knew how to ride and was prepared for what he was up against at the red light. On my rear facing cam videos cars and buses are left behind as if they're standing still and that's not even riding hard. I love the safety that space gives me, and it's fun too. PM me when you're ready to stop playing around with the kiddie hubbies, and don't listen to Wesnewell, because no hubbie for the street belongs in a 24-26" wheel if you're after performance. You don't want bicycle tires anyway.
 
Your bike should be quicker than a bus up to 20 mph or so anyway unless you are dragging a lot of weight along, are you sure your battery is not sagging and has enough current capability to fully feed your controller all the amps it will take?
 
John in CR said:
PM me when you're ready to stop playing around with the kiddie hubbies, and don't listen to Wesnewell, because no hubbie for the street belongs in a 24-26" wheel if you're after performance. You don't want bicycle tires anyway.

I was thinking at some stage to update to:
- 80V battery
- qs 205 motor
- sabvoton 80V 150A controller (adaptto are nice but expensive, less reliable and need to have screen)
- 20" bike wheel

But would need to find relevant cargo bike frame such as the one above. Is it not enough? Pm'ed you
 
Jonathan in Hiram said:
Your bike should be quicker than a bus up to 20 mph or so anyway unless you are dragging a lot of weight along, are you sure your battery is not sagging and has enough current capability to fully feed your controller all the amps it will take?

If driver go slow from red light I go slightly faster. But on the bus lane when bus go full acceleration bus goes faster.

Minibus are always faster.

Some lycra start faster too.


Maybe 2kw on leafmotor isn't good enough? It's only 30mm stator width
 
If the goal is to beat a bus, you should be able to do it with controller mod, maybe some wiring and connectors too.

Yet, 'to escape car danger', means to me building serious acceleration and braking performance. That is a whole new rig. There are many ways to do it, but you need to do it good so it is safe to handle it.
 
John in CR said:
sonnetg said:
An Electric motorbike seems to be made just for that! [or a modified hybrid MC frame like Raptor/Flux/Vector]

If you want to convert a bicycle to electric, you wont be able to achieve this kind of speed on any hills. The frame just isn't built for that purpose.

My converted Cannondale SuperV will hit 80mph up a 5-7% grade on the highway, and I've hit over 50mph up an extremely curvy solid 20% grade. I carry just over 2kwh of battery and more in a backpack when extra long range is needed, but of course range varies greatly depending how I ride.

That's good to know, but at the price of a DH frame, i think it would be better to simply invest in an ebike frame specifically built for performance and abuse. These bike frames have enclosed battery compartments and no need to strap batteries or backpacks.

Going fast is one thing, but the faster you go, the shorter range becomes. It's a catch 22. To go 45 mph in all terrains, you will probably have to shoot for 60 mph on flats.
 
Cwah, are you using a 12-fet IRFB4110 infineon? If so, you'd probably be happy with just modding it to 60A. I recently did so running a Crystalyte H3540 on 50v in a 26" wheel and can keep up with all the traffic in town and most definitely outperform busses. To be honest, I'm surprised you can't already with your current setup. How much do you weigh? Also, as stated by others, are you sure your battery is performing as it should?
 
John, I had looked at used Cannondale Super V's but did not find any in my area with disc brakes, or even the tabs on the fork and swingarm for disc brakes.
What Super V / year do you have ?
What rear swing arm on your's ?, they used at least 3 different swing arms on the Super V production line , over the years.

Where did you put so much battery ?

I would love to see pictures, as the Super V frame is one I had considered for a while.



My converted Cannondale SuperV will hit 80mph up a 5-7% grade on the highway, and I've hit over 50mph up an extremely curvy solid 20% grade. I carry just over 2kwh of battery and more in a backpack when extra long range is needed, but of course range varies greatly depending how I ride.


Cwah,
I'm sorry to hear about your performance woes, because getting shut down by a bus is just embarrassing. My bike has only been beaten once, and that was a small guy on a Ducati who knew how to ride and was prepared for what he was up against at the red light. On my rear facing cam videos cars and buses are left behind as if they're standing still and that's not even riding hard. I love the safety that space gives me, and it's fun too. PM me when you're ready to stop playing around with the kiddie hubbies, and don't listen to Wesnewell, because no hubbie for the street belongs in a 24-26" wheel if you're after performance. You don't want bicycle tires anyway.[/quote]
 
sonnetg said:
...but at the price of a DH frame, i think it would be better to simply invest in an ebike frame specifically built for performance and abuse. These bike frames have enclosed battery compartments and no need to strap batteries or backpacks.
No ebike specific frame does ride as stiff and good as DH racing frame, and very few can take as much abuse.
Most of all, they weight significantly more abnd their suspension design is often inefficient.

But yes, it is more expansive and more trouble to build on a DH frame, and you need to dig to find a neat finish after fitting the batteries and other mods. For those who are riding very fast, or very hard, it is well worth it.
 
my bike is barely accelerating stronger than bus which makes escape difficult. escaping black cab or minibus is impossible.

I was considering dh bike, but in this case i'd maybe rather buy an ebike frame.. otherwise a small cargo bike would be my preference.

controller is bmsbattery sine wave one and i don't want something that blow on long slope. battery is perfectly fine
 
You can probably add a 2nd motor on the front to give you the boost (probably a lightweight 6T MAC motor?). If that doesn't work out, you will probably have to plan on building a new bike.

DH frames are nice, but it would be better if the frame space was available for the huge battery.

You cold also look into CrMo Dirt Jump bikes. The frame should be able to take such abuse.

I am on a similar boat as you...but I need torque to get me up hills without slowing me down. I am contemplating on adding a secondary motor, but not sure how feasible that would be. Will have to do some research..
 
sonnetg said:
You can probably add a 2nd motor on the front to give you the boost (probably a lightweight 6T MAC motor?). If that doesn't work out, you will probably have to plan on building a new bike.

DH frames are nice, but it would be better if the frame space was available for the huge battery.

You cold also look into CrMo Dirt Jump bikes. The frame should be able to take such abuse.

I am on a similar boat as you...but I need torque to get me up hills without slowing me down. I am contemplating on adding a secondary motor, but not sure how feasible that would be. Will have to do some research..

Yeah that's also possible to buy jump bike... but in that case wouldn't that be simpler to buy an ebike frame?

I haven't bought ebike frames yet because I'd like to have a bike where I can carry a passenger, that's why I'm looking toward cargo bikes.
 
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