Rear Q128H planetary gears?

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Ykick
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Rear Q128H planetary gears?

Post by Ykick » Dec 17, 2015 8:42 am

Hey folks, one of my Q128H 48V rear motors finally stripped the white plastic planetary gears.

I’ve emailed BMS Battery asking to buy replacements but of course no word yet.

I figured it might be worth asking about alternative sources, if any, for internal parts?
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Re: Rear Q128H planetary gears?

Post by 1boris » Dec 18, 2015 11:40 am


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Re: Rear Q128H planetary gears?

Post by Ykick » Dec 18, 2015 12:19 pm

Thanks for those links. How the hell did you find them? LOL…

Unfortunately, the gear photo in the M128F listing does not appear to have same teeth count as the gears from my Q128H -
image1-1.JPG
image1-1.JPG (90.99 KiB) Viewed 2258 times
My gear count small = 21T, large = 43T

ELB pic - small = 23T, large = 36T

Perhaps an email with my picture could get a clarification if they do carry gears for my Q128H?

Thanks again!
Talent must not be wasted.... Those who have talent must hug it, embrace it, nurture it and share it lest it be taken away from you as fast as it was loaned to you.

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Re: Rear Q128H planetary gears?

Post by spinningmagnets » Dec 18, 2015 12:28 pm

You sound very happy with the performance (in other posts), would you please take lots of pics of the parts and the motor. Some of the guts with the motor apart, and some with it on the bike (to allow everyone to get a feel for how stealthy it is due to small size)?

Its sounds much more powerful than the Q100H, but only a tiny bit larger...

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Re: Rear Q128H planetary gears?

Post by Ykick » Dec 18, 2015 12:40 pm

Yeah, need a day but happy to grab more pics since it’s apart.

I really like the motor pushing an honest 800-900W battery current and this failure had more to do with a chunk of clutch spring which found it’s way into the planetary’s than any riding stress.

Sure ‘hope I can find some gears or will probably buy a Bafang SWX02 to replace.





SWX02
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Re: Rear Q128H planetary gears?

Post by Ykick » Dec 19, 2015 8:43 am

Some promising news - Aikema factory rep responded to an email inquiry and asked for further description of what I’ve got and will need for repair.

I replied using the pictures I posted here and gear tooth counts.

If they’re able to get me/us replacement gears be assured I’m gonna buy a few sets and will continue to love these motors for a long long time…

As promised here’s a few pictures of the internals. Gotta admit it’s one of the easiest geared hub motors to crack open I’ve reworked. 6 screws and you’re in.
image3.JPG
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image2-1.JPG
image2-1.JPG (167.35 KiB) Viewed 2227 times
image1-2.JPG
image1-2.JPG (167.45 KiB) Viewed 2227 times
Talent must not be wasted.... Those who have talent must hug it, embrace it, nurture it and share it lest it be taken away from you as fast as it was loaned to you.

- Frank Sinatra

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Re: Rear Q128H planetary gears?

Post by Ykick » Dec 19, 2015 8:45 am

And a couple more:
image1-3.JPG
image1-3.JPG (126.03 KiB) Viewed 2227 times
image2-2.JPG
image2-2.JPG (103.55 KiB) Viewed 2227 times
Talent must not be wasted.... Those who have talent must hug it, embrace it, nurture it and share it lest it be taken away from you as fast as it was loaned to you.

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Re: Rear Q128H planetary gears?

Post by tomjasz » Dec 19, 2015 9:36 am

Thanks for being so consistently in favor of these little guys or I would have missed them. For all the wrong reasons. Boat of yuz dun goud!
Thanks Justin_le we're here thanks to you. All the best to the mods for their tireless work keeping it on an even keel.

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Re: Rear Q128H planetary gears?

Post by spinningmagnets » Dec 19, 2015 1:02 pm

Thank you very much! There are other small geared motors that are getting lots of love, and a couple of them have the sideplate made so that you have to unscrew the entire plate, necessitating buying or building a special tool.

The first motor I dis-assembled was a BPM, very easy, a few screws and the plate pops off easily for replacing gears, upgrading wires, etc...

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Re: Rear Q128H planetary gears?

Post by tomjasz » Dec 19, 2015 6:05 pm

The Mxus is also easy to open, just as the Q128 is described. More and more I'm head tripping about a 2wd with these little guys.

What are you two using for controllers with them? CA3 capable?

Thanks!
Thanks Justin_le we're here thanks to you. All the best to the mods for their tireless work keeping it on an even keel.

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Re: Rear Q128H planetary gears?

Post by motomech » Dec 19, 2015 8:30 pm

spinningmagnets wrote:Thank you very much! There are other small geared motors that are getting lots of love, and a couple of them have the sideplate made so that you have to unscrew the entire plate, necessitating buying or building a special tool.

The first motor I dis-assembled was a BPM, very easy, a few screws and the plate pops off easily for replacing gears, upgrading wires, etc...
No, no special tools needed for the Cutes(Q100).
After the three dished-head machine screws are removed, one slightly longer 6 m/m hexhead with flat washer is snugged back into one of the locating bosses. A large flat screwdriver and hammer can be used to loosen the cover and get it turning off.
I have done it many times and sometimes a rear motor can be a little reluctent, as the cassette/free wheel forces tighten the cover.
In every other way, the Q128 looks to be constructed exactly like the Q100.
Motomech

'03 Rocky Mountain Edge 2WD 260 Q100H frt and Ezee V1 rear 2 Elifebike 20A & 25A 9-FET controllers 12S/20Ah Multistar Lipo rear 5Ah Turnigy frt Luna Cyclops Extra lite Alex 24DM rims, Crazy Bobs run ghetto tubeless. 25 mph. Mean Well HLG-320H-54A
https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewt ... =3&t=83430
'07 GT Idive 4 4.0, Q100C 201 14S LiPoly elifebike 9-FET 20A controller. 23 MPH.
https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewt ... 8#p1237928

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Re: Rear Q128H planetary gears?

Post by Ykick » Dec 20, 2015 8:24 am

Once you have a suitable bolt and lever arm drilled/configured to open those hubs with the threaded flange using the clutch bolt holes they’re usually not too difficult either. Ease of opening isn’t really that important of criteria for motor choice. It just always amazes me how easy the Q128 housing is to crack open compared to the others.

FYI - I’ve got some Q100C motors running 328RPM in 20” wheels and that’s been a good motor too. I don’t push ‘em more than 600W peak though.

Tomjasz - as far as controllers are concerned I use Lyen 6FET sensored with programming capabilities. Non-sensored seems to have trouble @ high battery voltages with these H series mini-motors.

You can find 3-4x cheaper controller of course but I run high voltages (57-67V, 16S) and Edward’s always been tops with any questions and/or servicing on a few rare occasions I’ve done something which needed repairs. CAV3 connection is easy along with any number of connection/setup parameters. Talk it over when ordering controller.

The ability to tweak programming (or use CA) is important in order to avoid excessive power. 10-15A is about all I’m comfortable pushing into these mini motors.

Gears and clutch seem to handle short bursts of higher power but look at the pictures above - there’s really no decent way to conduct heat away from the motor spinning inside the flange housing? Very easy to cook-off hall sensors after long runs.

Thus a lot of folks try sensorless controllers but run into the timing issues on the H motors running higher voltages. Ugh...

Fingers crossed AKM comes through with Q128H gear sets? If they do, I’ll order a few extra sets.
Last edited by Ykick on Dec 21, 2015 7:55 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Rear Q128H planetary gears?

Post by tomjasz » Dec 20, 2015 12:55 pm

Ykick wrote:Tomjasz - as far as controllers are concerned I use Lyen 6FET sensored with programming capabilities. Non-sensored seems to have trouble @ high battery voltages with these H series mini-motors. .
Thanks, I have a Lyen 6 programable on my front DD. I'll have to try it on my new little Mxus. Although it may be a 200W. I can't seem to match up the numbers on the motor to be certain.

What would you think a 200W might be able to take?

I sure do wish more programs were Mac capable... I may have to find an old won doze notebook afterall. Grrrrr.


Ride safe,

Tom
Thanks Justin_le we're here thanks to you. All the best to the mods for their tireless work keeping it on an even keel.

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Re: Rear Q128H planetary gears?

Post by Ykick » Dec 21, 2015 7:51 am

tomjasz wrote:Thanks, I have a Lyen 6 programable on my front DD. I'll have to try it on my new little Mxus. Although it may be a 200W. I can't seem to match up the numbers on the motor to be certain.

What would you think a 200W might be able to take?

I sure do wish more programs were Mac capable... I may have to find an old won doze notebook afterall. Grrrrr.


Ride safe,

Tom
200W rated motors? I’ve got no idea how much it can actually take? I'd suggest start around 400-500W and give it some good testing and cooking off with IR temp gun.

I push those 36V/350W rated Q100C’s to around 600W running 80% controller speed on 60-67V. But I try to remember they’re designed as 350W motors.

Q128H is rated 48V/800W. We run 800-900W on 100% speed from 60-67V which seems to be avoiding thermal problems. Main thing with these mini motors seems to be avoiding too fast RPM for your wheel size. 48V 201 RPM works nicely in 700c/27" wheels on 60-67V. Tops out about 20-25MPH with plenty hill climbing torque.

328 RPM is almost too fast for 20" wheels IMO. I'd prefer the 260 RPM but the whole thing gets really screwy since vendors often don't understand motor specs they publish. Is the RPM rating based on 36V or 48V? Hard to tell most of the time.

Yeah, I know guys have used boot camp or parallels on Mac but obviously as a crApple user I’m not that savvy. As you mentioned, 'just keep an old WinXP laptop available for this kinda stuff. Comes in handy for CellLog, iCharger programs too.

I’m happy to report AKM has replied they can sell me Q128H gear sets. Gonna buy 3, maybe 4 sets while I only need 1 at the moment.

I’ll report back with cost/time details once everything’s completed with the transaction.
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Re: Rear Q128H planetary gears?

Post by cwah » Dec 27, 2015 5:11 am

what controller r u using?
Help me find my stolen electric brompton: http://bit.ly/1a0vbBC and Bosch Sinus B3 http://bit.ly/1eV0WQz

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Re: Rear Q128H planetary gears?

Post by Ykick » Dec 27, 2015 8:32 am

cwah wrote:what controller r u using?
2 posts up...
Tomjasz - as far as controllers are concerned I use Lyen 6FET sensored with programming capabilities. Non-sensored seems to have trouble @ high battery voltages with these H series mini-motors.

You can find 3-4x cheaper controller of course but I run high voltages (57-67V, 16S) and Edward’s always been tops with any questions and/or servicing on a few rare occasions I’ve done something which needed repairs. CAV3 connection is easy along with any number of connection/setup parameters. Talk it over when ordering controller.
btw, anybody following this drama - Aikema factory offered to sell me replacement gear sets. Not exactly cheap shipping and I’ll need to figure out a bank wire transfer for payment but it’s better than junking the motor I suppose?
Talent must not be wasted.... Those who have talent must hug it, embrace it, nurture it and share it lest it be taken away from you as fast as it was loaned to you.

- Frank Sinatra

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Re: Rear Q128H planetary gears?

Post by cwah » Dec 27, 2015 9:22 am

I'm looking for good sine wave controller for these motor. No more square wave
Help me find my stolen electric brompton: http://bit.ly/1a0vbBC and Bosch Sinus B3 http://bit.ly/1eV0WQz

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Re: Rear Q128H planetary gears?

Post by 1boris » Dec 27, 2015 1:21 pm

cwah wrote:I'm looking for good sine wave controller for these motor. No more square wave

https://bmsbattery.com/ebike-kit/552-s1 ... results=13

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Re: Rear Q128H planetary gears?

Post by cwah » Dec 27, 2015 2:12 pm

1boris wrote:
cwah wrote:I'm looking for good sine wave controller for these motor. No more square wave

https://bmsbattery.com/ebike-kit/552-s1 ... results=13

But this one has a massive enclosure for the controller. If you open it, you'll see that half the controller box is empty. I'm looking more for a controller this size:
https://bmsbattery.com/controller/698-s ... oller.html

But without the battery kit
Help me find my stolen electric brompton: http://bit.ly/1a0vbBC and Bosch Sinus B3 http://bit.ly/1eV0WQz

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Re: Rear Q128H planetary gears?

Post by tomjasz » Dec 27, 2015 4:53 pm

Ykick wrote: btw, anybody following this drama - Aikema factory offered to sell me replacement gear sets. Not exactly cheap shipping and I’ll need to figure out a bank wire transfer for payment but it’s better than junking the motor I suppose?
I was about to pull the pin on a pair of these motors for a friends project and build. BUT not being able to access gears? WTF?
Over priced shipping and bank transfer fees kinda kill the fun!
Thanks Justin_le we're here thanks to you. All the best to the mods for their tireless work keeping it on an even keel.

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Re: Rear Q128H planetary gears?

Post by cwah » Dec 27, 2015 5:00 pm

Ykick wrote: btw, anybody following this drama - Aikema factory offered to sell me replacement gear sets. Not exactly cheap shipping and I’ll need to figure out a bank wire transfer for payment but it’s better than junking the motor I suppose?
Can you buy directly from the factory? If so, what's the link?
Help me find my stolen electric brompton: http://bit.ly/1a0vbBC and Bosch Sinus B3 http://bit.ly/1eV0WQz

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Re: Rear Q128H planetary gears?

Post by tomjasz » Dec 27, 2015 5:04 pm

cwah wrote:
Ykick wrote: btw, anybody following this drama - Aikema factory offered to sell me replacement gear sets. Not exactly cheap shipping and I’ll need to figure out a bank wire transfer for payment but it’s better than junking the motor I suppose?
Can you buy directly from the factory? If so, what's the link?
Google is your friend. http://www.aikema.com.cn
Thanks Justin_le we're here thanks to you. All the best to the mods for their tireless work keeping it on an even keel.

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Re: Rear Q128H planetary gears?

Post by cwah » Dec 27, 2015 5:17 pm

thanks very useful!

Look at what I've found:
Image

They have new motor with wiring on the side, so changing wire won't be such a pain anymore!
Help me find my stolen electric brompton: http://bit.ly/1a0vbBC and Bosch Sinus B3 http://bit.ly/1eV0WQz

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Re: Rear Q128H planetary gears?

Post by Ykick » Dec 28, 2015 7:08 am

I fail to see why anyone would bother to change (upgrade) phase wires?

At least on sensored mini-motors since overpowering brings very real risk of damaging Hall sensors when heat cooks-off following long hard runs.
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Re: Rear Q128H planetary gears?

Post by tomjasz » Dec 28, 2015 10:32 am

Ykick wrote:I fail to see why anyone would bother to change (upgrade) phase wires?

.
Good point.
Thanks Justin_le we're here thanks to you. All the best to the mods for their tireless work keeping it on an even keel.

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