Best double suspension base for XC in a bafang

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Robleman
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Best double suspension base for XC in a bafang

Post by Robleman » Nov 19, 2017 5:03 pm

Hi,
My 2005 scott genius have give me great moments but its obviusly tired..
I'm planning to transplant my bafang BBSHD to another bike, options vary from complete bikes to bare frames like vector light. In any case I want a bike looking and les than 27kg so raptor, standar vector and that kind of big capacity frames are ouf of range.

The main issue with full bikes is the lack of space inside the frame for the battery (48V 17-21Ah should be enought).

So, the post is asking for help and advice to find a good bike/frame base for the proyect.

Thanks

JDMopar
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Re: Best double suspension base for XC in a bafang

Post by JDMopar » Nov 19, 2017 10:44 pm

Edit: l will leave my original comment below but i guess with the bb90 the anthem is incompatible with a bbshd. Sorry. Edit2: Now I'm confused, it looks like the Anthem 3 is bb90 but the other levels are Shimano press fit, for which there are bbshd adapters available.

I'm guessing your looking for brand new? Your mention of clearance in the main triangle makes it tough, as you say. Damn near all full-suspension bikes now have either a shock placement that's makes even a water bottle a tight squeeze, or a heavy relief in the top tube to maximize standover height, or both. I worked in a shop that used to sell Giant and I remember how open the triangles were on the Trance. Looking at their website, 2013 was the last year of the straight top tube on the Trance. However, the new Anthem has what appears to be only subtle top tube bend and it has a rearward relief in the seattube such that the shock is mounted very far back AND it has a downtube that takes a steep angle from the headtube, and bends abruptly toward the bottom bracket which yields even more space. https://www.giant-bicycles.com/us/anthem-3

Image

The apparent downside to the latter point is that the motor hangs pretty low-as seen in older Trance builds that you can google-as opposed to downtubes that angle straight toward the headtube from the bottom bracket....but I guess compromises must be made. edit: far as weight goes, this review has the 2017 Anthem 2 at 13.5 kg with pedals. https://www.ambmag.com.au/feature/teste ... m-2-451467 Apparently the carbon ones can be sub-10 if you're looking to break open the piggy bank.

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MadRhino
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Re: Best double suspension base for XC in a bafang

Post by MadRhino » Nov 20, 2017 1:49 pm

Why not build another one, like most of us usually do ?

Your ´obviously tired’ Scott Genius has broken frame?
If it is only scuff and scratch, it is easy to restore.
If components are worn out, it is a good reason to upgrade some.

After we ride a bike for a year, we all find many things that we’d like different. Building a new one is letting us improve, and gain experience. For me, it took 8 to achieve a bike that is filling all my requirements. Now I can hadly improve performance and geometry, but I can still work on aesthetic design. I can also work on a completely different bike, for different purpose. The old bikes are usually sold after I quit using them, but I like keeping one as a guest bike.
Make it fool-proof, and I will make a better fool.
Current bikes
Street: https://s20.postimg.org/ewrvugywt/Session_04_2015.jpg
Dirt: https://s20.postimg.org/lbqwr55ml/IMG_0157.jpg

Robleman
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Re: Best double suspension base for XC in a bafang

Post by Robleman » Nov 20, 2017 2:39 pm

JDMopar wrote:
Nov 19, 2017 10:44 pm
Edit: l will leave my original comment below but i guess with the bb90 the anthem is incompatible with a bbshd. Sorry. Edit2: Now I'm confused, it looks like the Anthem 3 is bb90 but the other levels are Shimano press fit, for which there are bbshd adapters available.

I'm guessing your looking for brand new? Your mention of clearance in the main triangle makes it tough, as you say. Damn near all full-suspension bikes now have either a shock placement that's makes even a water bottle a tight squeeze, or a heavy relief in the top tube to maximize standover height, or both. I worked in a shop that used to sell Giant and I remember how open the triangles were on the Trance. Looking at their website, 2013 was the last year of the straight top tube on the Trance. However, the new Anthem has what appears to be only subtle top tube bend and it has a rearward relief in the seattube such that the shock is mounted very far back AND it has a downtube that takes a steep angle from the headtube, and bends abruptly toward the bottom bracket which yields even more space. https://www.giant-bicycles.com/us/anthem-3

Image

The apparent downside to the latter point is that the motor hangs pretty low-as seen in older Trance builds that you can google-as opposed to downtubes that angle straight toward the headtube from the bottom bracket....but I guess compromises must be made. edit: far as weight goes, this review has the 2017 Anthem 2 at 13.5 kg with pedals. https://www.ambmag.com.au/feature/teste ... m-2-451467 Apparently the carbon ones can be sub-10 if you're looking to break open the piggy bank.
Thats a good option, thanks! I,ve chequed Luna site and found this ebike based on Anthem 3 & BBSHD just the way you proposed.
https://lunacycle.com/luna-crusher-2-eb ... 8-version/
I think this solves the BB compatibility question.
The Luna proyect has enought battery but It needs to be customized to bike frame space. Looking at other Luna bikes with standar battery shapes they only hold 13,5Ah. Have to contact skilled battery makers.
The motor as you predicted is a bit to low, but i agree you can not have everything!
This is at least one good option 👍

Robleman
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Re: Best double suspension base for XC in a bafang

Post by Robleman » Nov 20, 2017 2:55 pm

MadRhino wrote:
Nov 20, 2017 1:49 pm
Why not build another one, like most of us usually do ?

Your ´obviously tired’ Scott Genius has broken frame?
If it is only scuff and scratch, it is easy to restore.
If components are worn out, it is a good reason to upgrade some.

After we ride a bike for a year, we all find many things that we’d like different. Building a new one is letting us improve, and gain experience. For me, it took 8 to achieve a bike that is filling all my requirements. Now I can hadly improve performance and geometry, but I can still work on aesthetic design. I can also work on a completely different bike, for different purpose. The old bikes are usually sold after I quit using them, but I like keeping one as a guest bike.
Thanks for you message
I'm afraid I didn't explain me very well since my english is basic
My plan is to make me an ebike taking apart the electric components of my scott and mounting them on the new bike.
But your suggestion about 'guest bike' is good because i do have an spare hub 9C that I like less than the bafang and can be refitted in the scott and used occasionally.
Reason I look for a new bike is the scott has front and back suspensions with some issues and in particular the rear shock is very rare because it works in extension insted of compresion as most shocks do. Also if you search for scott genius tc shock rebuild in youtube you get mad when you see its complexity.... So I wonder if its worthit to spend so much in a 12 year bike... but you're making me consider it again eventhough if I find a solution for the rear.

marvak
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Re: Best double suspension base for XC in a bafang

Post by marvak » Nov 20, 2017 3:12 pm

Hi, looking for the same thing. This is not full suspension, but maybe you will be able to enjoy the design
https://www.klever-mobility.com/klever-e-bikes/

Robleman
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Re: Best double suspension base for XC in a bafang

Post by Robleman » Nov 21, 2017 2:34 pm

marvak wrote:
Nov 20, 2017 3:12 pm
Hi, looking for the same thing. This is not full suspension, but maybe you will be able to enjoy the design
https://www.klever-mobility.com/klever-e-bikes/
Thánks for your help but full suspension is a must for
regards

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Re: Best double suspension base for XC in a bafang

Post by marvak » Nov 21, 2017 3:57 pm

Maybe something like this, Bultaco bike
bultaco-brino-s-1.jpg
bultaco-brino-s-1.jpg (51.37 KiB) Viewed 405 times

Robleman
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Re: Best double suspension base for XC in a bafang

Post by Robleman » Nov 23, 2017 2:31 pm

marvak wrote:
Nov 21, 2017 3:57 pm
Maybe something like this, Bultaco bike
bultaco-brino-s-1.jpg
Thanks for the proposal marvac, a spanish ebike from my country!
I know it quiet well and I'm sorry to say its 40kg and has bad reliability reputation. Plenty of problems in the rear wheel aligment.
Its a pity since design is nice and old bultaco bikes where among the best dirt bikes in the world back in the 70's

Image

Equals
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Re: Best double suspension base for XC in a bafang

Post by Equals » Dec 02, 2017 5:11 am

The Anthem runs a bb90 Pressfit which will work with the bbshd with an adapter sleeve, luna sells one.

I would take a look at the Giant Stance 2 its about $700 less than the Anthem and unless your getting into aggressive trail riding you likely won't see a difference in the ride.
https://www.giant-bicycles.com/us/stance-2

Robleman
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Re: Best double suspension base for XC in a bafang

Post by Robleman » Dec 03, 2017 5:32 am

Equals wrote:
Dec 02, 2017 5:11 am
The Anthem runs a bb90 Pressfit which will work with the bbshd with an adapter sleeve, luna sells one.

I would take a look at the Giant Stance 2 its about $700 less than the Anthem and unless your getting into aggressive trail riding you likely won't see a difference in the ride.
https://www.giant-bicycles.com/us/stance-2
Thanks Equals, Stance can be a good option since i'm not aggressive!

But in the meantime, I've found a LBS with a very skilled guy that have rebuild my genius shocks and gave her a brand new life :D

So, by now, i'll keep going with the genius.

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Re: Best double suspension base for XC in a bafang

Post by Robocog » Dec 03, 2017 11:00 am

HEre is what I came up with. 43 lbs with 14.5ah batt. I has PLUSH suspension. Cushy by MTB standards. 29ers. Fully offroadable. But, built for commute. I ALWAYS pedal, so, TINY PEDALS, and a seat that has ONE perfect spot, as I NEVER get up in the saddle. And, one perfect height, so no dropper. Aluminum is ALWAYS better, for EBIKE. AND, an aluminum bike allows you to mod the crap, RELATIVELY SPEAKING, out of the frame and such, to make the install sano. LEss gears is moar. MY frame is SPECIAL, and had a lot of room to fashion batt case. And, the rear is plush, which AMERICANS hated, so the company went out of business, I bought the last frame in the world. Like it anyway.

So, I used an INCH too long shock, of a downhill LIVELY type. Then, I removed a LOT of air, and backed adjusted the canister, to be quite progressive. So, bottom resist, yet PLUSH. Then, the 36 fox has high and low compression adjust. So, back way off the high speed comp. Lower the air significantly, so it squats commensurate with the rear. Turn up rebound. It rides like a caddy, and yet is light, and rigid. NO cable slap. The 36 easily handles braking forces. All my components are stout and oversized. And yet, 43 lbs is as light as Ive ever heard, for a FULL suspension, high cap batt 1200watt mid DIY. OR pro build. Don't get upgraditis. You have the bones.

P9190074.JPG
Oh, I also have another 7.25 ah that I will strap onto the seatpost, AUX style, for long trips.
Last edited by Robocog on Dec 03, 2017 11:10 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Best double suspension base for XC in a bafang

Post by Robocog » Dec 03, 2017 11:08 am

Robleman wrote:
Nov 20, 2017 2:55 pm
MadRhino wrote:
Nov 20, 2017 1:49 pm
Why not build another one, like most of us usually do ?

Your ´obviously tired’ Scott Genius has broken frame?
If it is only scuff and scratch, it is easy to restore.
If components are worn out, it is a good reason to upgrade some.

After we ride a bike for a year, we all find many things that we’d like different. Building a new one is letting us improve, and gain experience. For me, it took 8 to achieve a bike that is filling all my requirements. Now I can hadly improve performance and geometry, but I can still work on aesthetic design. I can also work on a completely different bike, for different purpose. The old bikes are usually sold after I quit using them, but I like keeping one as a guest bike.
Thanks for you message
I'm afraid I didn't explain me very well since my english is basic
My plan is to make me an ebike taking apart the electric components of my scott and mounting them on the new bike.
But your suggestion about 'guest bike' is good because i do have an spare hub 9C that I like less than the bafang and can be refitted in the scott and used occasionally.
Reason I look for a new bike is the scott has front and back suspensions with some issues and in particular the rear shock is very rare because it works in extension insted of compresion as most shocks do. Also if you search for scott genius tc shock rebuild in youtube you get mad when you see its complexity.... So I wonder if its worthit to spend so much in a 12 year bike... but you're making me consider it again eventhough if I find a solution for the rear.
Them is bragging rights. Same as lefty. It is the FOOSE touches you puff with pride over.

Robleman
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Re: Best double suspension base for XC in a bafang

Post by Robleman » Dec 03, 2017 2:41 pm

Pretty good proyect Robocog 👍
Haven't seen any of this kind for 43 lb!
Have seen some bikes with the downside tube cutted and welded a battery box instead, but welding aluminium is out of reach for me!

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Re: Best double suspension base for XC in a bafang

Post by Robocog » Dec 03, 2017 10:03 pm

And, I have onboard lights and the lock fits the batt extension. It only weighs one lb. I hardly ever charge it. I can go well over 100 miles with aux batt on seatpost. It is ALMOST silent. 25 is my top cadence cruise mph. Which, with medium peddling, sips juice.

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Re: Best double suspension base for XC in a bafang

Post by ginekolog » Dec 04, 2017 12:44 pm

I use 2009 Giant Trance X3 (see signature). Great bike, after I upgraded brakes with Shimano Zee. I ride in Alps allmost every day :mrgreen:

Robleman
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Re: Best double suspension base for XC in a bafang

Post by Robleman » Dec 10, 2017 3:36 am

Very nice bike ginekolog👍
Sorry for controler burnout!

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