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Advanced ADAPTTO controllers and compatible products

Posted: Mar 18, 2014 4:27 am
by Adaptto E-Drives Lab
We are proud to offer our MINI-E, MIDI-E and Max-E controllers for sale.



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Controllers' major features:
- Sine wave motor power control & intelligent adapting logics higher efficiency , less heat, silent motor operation, all sorts of protection
- Very compact for the power they are pumping through
- Display to show you everything from ride statistics and “dynamics” to voltage sag on each cell (should you opt for our BMS) and allow PC-free adjustability for you to play with the settings right on spot
- Built-in wattmeter
- Fully adjustable regen, analogue (not pre-set) regen power control given you use our throttle
- Traction control
- Cruise-control
- Possibility to set range - controller will limit the power to the necessary level
- Automatic phase/halls wires combo selection = no pain with finding the right combination just make sure the +&- of the halls are connected right the rest will be done by you but electronically through the menu on the display
- Protection motor/controller overheating – there’s a thermosensor the in controller and a thermosensor port to monitor motor’s temperature and manage the power accordingly (first the display will show you an alarm warning that you are reaching a certain temperature and once it gets to high the power will be automatically limited until the motor/controller cools down)
- Square wave, and sensorless (besides sine wave (vectored) motor control modes (if halls fail -which shouldn’t happen due to overheating protection - the controller will automatically switch to sensorless mode, so you might not even notice the halls are dead until you start on a hill)
- Automatic hibernation of the system in the time you set
- Motor and battery health monitor
- Integration with BMS – you can monitor your battery or each cell, set LVC/HVC to manage your battery’s ‘life expectancy’
- 3 fully adjustable power modes allowing you to switch between them by a push of a button and change your power settings, including regen and speed limits
- Auxiliary devices connection bus to enable BMS or DC-DC converter control through the display
- The throttle control the power, not the speed of the motor(however you can switch it to speed control if you like)

1) We've decreased the prices by more than 10%!

2) For retail orders please contact one of our exclusive distributors: http://adaptto.envolt.se/ and http://vectorebike.com/

3) We accept CC payments!


Here are the specs:
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!!!Please note: the controller cannot be used with Crystalyte Crown motor!!!


Every controller kit contains the controller itself, connectors and display:

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Also you can order BMS board which is compatible with our controllers and is fully adjustable using from the controller display.

You will also get a discount when purchasing complete kit MINI-E+BMS

Here is how the latest bms version looks like (28s)
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you can see 7 aux boards with individual 4s connectors grouped in 4 + 1+ 1+ 1 so minimal configuration is 4 boards up to 16cells and max config is 7 boards, up to 28cells.
Each board can be configured for 2-4 cells.

BRAND NEW WIRING SCHEME IS NOW AVAILABLE!

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You can find large interactive scheme here: http://adaptto.com/Support/

Please do not hesitate to contact us via PM or via email sales@adaptto.ru

Re: The most advanced Adaptto Mini-E Controller + BMS

Posted: Mar 18, 2014 5:01 am
by izeman
damn. i want one :) i was waiting for the bms for over 6mo now, but ordered a regular lyen controller, bestechpower bms and ca-v3 last month. surely cheaper, but your solution is REALLY smart. maybe when some more money is left i will switch :)

Re: The most advanced Adaptto Mini-E Controller + BMS

Posted: Mar 18, 2014 5:22 am
by ambroseliao
izeman wrote:damn. i want one :) i was waiting for the bms for over 6mo now, but ordered a regular lyen controller, bestechpower bms and ca-v3 last month. surely cheaper, but your solution is REALLY smart. maybe when some more money is left i will switch :)
Izeman, how much (may I ask) did you pay for your Lyen, BMS and CA-V3 + shipping to you?

Re: The most advanced Adaptto Mini-E Controller + BMS

Posted: Mar 18, 2014 5:44 am
by izeman
ambroseliao wrote:
izeman wrote:damn. i want one :) i was waiting for the bms for over 6mo now, but ordered a regular lyen controller, bestechpower bms and ca-v3 last month. surely cheaper, but your solution is REALLY smart. maybe when some more money is left i will switch :)
Izeman, how much (may I ask) did you pay for your Lyen, BMS and CA-V3 + shipping to you?
lyen 12fet was $160 shipping included
ca-v3 was $170 shipping included
bms was $70 shipping included

so a subtotal of $400 with customs and taxes included this can, but need not, be €400 (or around $550). sometimes thing slip through customs ;)

compared to mini-e plus 16s bms this would mean: $575 plus shipping could be a bit over $600 to europe (just an estimate). depending on taxes this could be $600 or $750 delivered to my home.

Re: The most advanced Adaptto Mini-E Controller + BMS

Posted: Mar 18, 2014 6:00 am
by Rodney64
I have just purchased a 18 fet for my cromotor. I'm keen to go on the waiting list for a e-max by the time they're available should have the money.

Do you configure the controller for plug and play for various motors.



Another question are they waterproof as it will be mounted on the outside of my Phasor?
My other option is to mount it inside the frame. Previously I've had overheating issues and blown controllers but with your protection this should be prevented. Where do you recommend

Re: The most advanced Adaptto Mini-E Controller + BMS

Posted: Mar 18, 2014 6:25 am
by madin88
@ Adaptto

how is the progress on firmware with soft cut off feature?
that instant jerky "on off on off" is really frightening if battery sags to LVC under high load.
..aside from this the controller units are outstanding. for me it was a worthwhile investment, and i did not had to pay customs :D

here a useful pic taken from russia forum how BMS has to be wired up:

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as far as i can see, single packs of 4s would be optimal because they can be directly connected to the boards without the need to solder some adapters.

Re: The most advanced Adaptto Mini-E Controller + BMS

Posted: Mar 18, 2014 11:24 am
by mvly
Just looked at the IRFB4468 data sheet and it's specced for 100V. I guess I am out of the equation. I don't want to regen at full battery on my 24s Li-mn and go over 100V and pop the FETs. But looks like a great product for someone who wants all in one compatible solution.

Re: The most advanced Adaptto Mini-E Controller + BMS

Posted: Mar 18, 2014 11:29 am
by Rollodo
I asked a fellow ES member a question (italicized), got an answer (bolded), and figured I'd also post this here:

I'm personally not that big on controllers / need to know more. Are all of the above connectors necessary for the operation? It looks like the necessities are:

1) the battery (the big thick black one);
2) the motor (another thick one);
3) e-brakes (if any);
4) throttle;
5) ignition;
6) the 'CA'?

But there are 10 connectors?

mini-e.jpg
mini-e.jpg (58.74 KiB) Viewed 27870 times
the blue ones are phase wires to motor.
the red/black are battery
then you have on round one for display
one round one for optional bms
one for throttle
and one for brake

at the display there is a usb charging port

Re: The most advanced Adaptto Mini-E Controller + BMS

Posted: Mar 18, 2014 12:14 pm
by izeman
i'd really like to know more about the bms option. how can it be configured? how does it work?
if i understand correctly the battery can be charged through the adaptto with a regular power supply (no charger!) and the controller takes care of the charging and log/shows usefull information.
please give us some more info :)

Re: The most advanced Adaptto Mini-E Controller + BMS

Posted: Mar 18, 2014 12:39 pm
by cal3thousand
izeman wrote:i'd really like to know more about the bms option. how can it be configured? how does it work?
if i understand correctly the battery can be charged through the adaptto with a regular power supply (no charger!) and the controller takes care of the charging and log/shows usefull information.
please give us some more info :)

If that's the case and it replaces a charger, those price comparison shopping should include that in the price. I like to have a charger at home and one at work, so that would replace 2 chargers if this were true, making it much easier to convert

Re: The most advanced Adaptto Mini-E Controller + BMS

Posted: Mar 18, 2014 1:11 pm
by izeman
cal3thousand wrote:
izeman wrote:i'd really like to know more about the bms option. how can it be configured? how does it work?
if i understand correctly the battery can be charged through the adaptto with a regular power supply (no charger!) and the controller takes care of the charging and log/shows usefull information.
please give us some more info :)
If that's the case and it replaces a charger, those price comparison shopping should include that in the price. I like to have a charger at home and one at work, so that would replace 2 chargers if this were true, making it much easier to convert
not quite correct for all cases. a power supply is not necessarily cheaper then a charger. for sure, if 48v is enough for you there are super cheap 2nd hand server ps you can buy. putting two of them in series is doable but you may need some electronics knowledge for that and the resulting solution is not as compact and simple as a single ps.

Re: The most advanced Adaptto Mini-E Controller + BMS

Posted: Mar 19, 2014 1:05 pm
by madin88
some infos regarding charging with controller i read out of the russia board:
- you have to buy a coil + cap (also available from adaptto) to have this feature. the biggest coil will work up to 3kW.
- the motor also has to be connected
- the higher the voltage of the power supply, the more efficient i will be (for example 48V 20A supply is better than 24V 40A). this means the controller will stay cooler.
- you can set all parameters in the controller charging menu (battery amps, amps consumption from power supply)
- the adaptto controller does not calculate SOC like the CA depending on idle battery voltage. you have to set watt hours.

Re: The most advanced Adaptto Mini-E Controller + BMS

Posted: Mar 19, 2014 5:08 pm
by cal3thousand
madin88 wrote:some infos regarding charging with controller i read out of the russia board:
- you have to buy a coil + cap (also available from adaptto) to have this feature. the biggest coil will work up to 3kW.
- the motor also has to be connected
- the higher the voltage of the power supply, the more efficient i will be (for example 48V 20A supply is better than 24V 40A). this means the controller will stay cooler.
- you can set all parameters in the controller charging menu (battery amps, amps consumption from power supply)
- the adaptto controller does not calculate SOC like the CA depending on idle battery voltage. you have to set watt hours.
Is it basically like a forced regen charge from the plug?

Re: The most advanced Adaptto Mini-E Controller + BMS

Posted: Mar 19, 2014 5:22 pm
by zener
cal3thousand wrote:
madin88 wrote:some infos regarding charging with controller i read out of the russia board:
- you have to buy a coil + cap (also available from adaptto) to have this feature. the biggest coil will work up to 3kW.
- the motor also has to be connected
- the higher the voltage of the power supply, the more efficient i will be (for example 48V 20A supply is better than 24V 40A). this means the controller will stay cooler.
- you can set all parameters in the controller charging menu (battery amps, amps consumption from power supply)
- the adaptto controller does not calculate SOC like the CA depending on idle battery voltage. you have to set watt hours.
Is it basically like a forced regen charge from the plug?
Can any controller with regen be used with this coil+cap to be a bulk charger?

Re: The most advanced Adaptto Mini-E Controller + BMS

Posted: Mar 19, 2014 5:29 pm
by cal3thousand
zener wrote:
cal3thousand wrote:
madin88 wrote:some infos regarding charging with controller i read out of the russia board:
- you have to buy a coil + cap (also available from adaptto) to have this feature. the biggest coil will work up to 3kW.
- the motor also has to be connected
- the higher the voltage of the power supply, the more efficient i will be (for example 48V 20A supply is better than 24V 40A). this means the controller will stay cooler.
- you can set all parameters in the controller charging menu (battery amps, amps consumption from power supply)
- the adaptto controller does not calculate SOC like the CA depending on idle battery voltage. you have to set watt hours.
Is it basically like a forced regen charge from the plug?
Can any controller with regen be used with this coil+cap to be a bulk charger?
I doubt it.... They must have some special circuitry to handle that. But I'm not privy to any real information, just my awesome ability to speculate :D

Re: The most advanced Adaptto Mini-E Controller + BMS

Posted: Mar 19, 2014 8:37 pm
by zombiess
Can you switch over to 150v rated components? Running at max spec is unacceptable. Are you planning to build a version capable of running 24s LiPo?

Re: The most advanced Adaptto Mini-E Controller + BMS

Posted: Mar 19, 2014 9:38 pm
by dnmun
i have charged a 24S lipo to 101V on the D131 BMS which uses the irfb4115.

Re: The most advanced Adaptto Mini-E Controller + BMS

Posted: Mar 20, 2014 1:50 am
by Falco
zombiess wrote:Can you switch over to 150v rated components? Running at max spec is unacceptable. Are you planning to build a version capable of running 24s LiPo?
There was alot of discussion about doing this on the russian forum and they said if there was demand for it they would do it but it came back to whats the point? This controller uses flux weakening which can net you 30% more motor speed. running one of these on 18s gives you the same top speeds as running on 24s lipo on a controller that doesnt have this feature. There is also current limiting software on this controller. At 92 volts the limiting starts and cuts all power to the motor above 98v. These controllers are sold with a warrenty. If you want to push them to the edge of what they can do then you just load the unlocked firmware and take matters into your own hands.

Re: The most advanced Adaptto Mini-E Controller + BMS

Posted: Mar 20, 2014 2:03 am
by Lebowski
field weakening kills your efficiency...

Re: The most advanced Adaptto Mini-E Controller + BMS

Posted: Mar 20, 2014 2:51 am
by Falco
Lebowski wrote:field weakening kills your efficiency...
This is true but it only starts after you have reached the maximun motor speed you can achieve with battery voltage alone. Its just there for when you want to do a high speed run. Im doubtful anyone here spends more then 3-5% of their ebike ride time above what 18s Lipo speeds will give them.

Re: The most advanced Adaptto Mini-E Controller + BMS

Posted: Mar 20, 2014 5:10 am
by ridethelightning
izeman wrote:more. Are all of the above connectors necessary for the operation? It looks like the necessities are:

1) the battery (the big thick black one);
2) the motor (another thick one);
3) e-brakes (if any);
4) throttle;
5) ignition;
6) the 'CA'?

But there are 10 connectors?
all connectors are included in the package.

small silver capped connector is both throttle and ebrake. it comes from the display.


there is a good pin out/plugs diagram in the adaptto online user manual, also a lot of other questions could be answered there, for charge setup atc.:wink:
Rodney64 wrote:Another question are they waterproof as it will be mounted on the outside of my Phasor?
yes its waterproof but not to submersion i think.
ambroseliao wrote: so a subtotal of $400 with customs and taxes included this can, but need not, be €400 (or around $550). sometimes thing slip through customs

compared to mini-e plus 16s bms this would mean: $575 plus shipping could be a bit over $600 to europe (just an estimate). depending on taxes this could be $600 or $750 delivered to my home.
Andreym sweetly put a "special" value declaration on my package :P
izeman wrote:
Another question are they waterproof as it will be mounted on the outside of my Phasor?
My other option is to mount it inside the frame. Previously I've had overheating issues and blown controllers but with your protection this should be prevented. Where do you recommend
because of the sinewave function the controller rarely gets warm, even at high power levels.

another thing, the regen can be configured (current and max voltage) so it will just not work over the set voltage, atleast thats what my experience has been.

this is an awesome piece of gear. i just love the silent smootheness of it and ease of setup/configuration via display.
i would never buy any other type of controller again if i had the choice.

Re: The most advanced Adaptto Mini-E Controller + BMS

Posted: Mar 20, 2014 10:18 am
by cal3thousand
No good for 24S LiPo HOC at 100V huh? ... so 22S would be recommended top voltage?

Re: The most advanced Adaptto Mini-E Controller + BMS

Posted: Mar 20, 2014 10:38 am
by mvly
Just my opinion, I think they should use IRFP4568 FETs. They have low RDS and can go up to 150V. I understand they can hack the firmware to make the motor spin faster, but I think because there were no good sine wave controller before with such features, many of us have gone the High Voltage route to get the speed we want at low current. Because of this, I hope they offer a 150V version. I am at 24s Li-mn myself and would like to get the 12KW controller version to see if it's any better than the Kelly Controller I am currently using. I mean the Kelly Controller + CAV3 alone cost around $700. Not counting the wiring and other misc stuff. If the 12KW version can come close in price with the ability to do 150V, I am definitely interested.

Re: The most advanced Adaptto Mini-E Controller + BMS

Posted: Mar 20, 2014 5:38 pm
by ridethelightning
if they see they have the demand for a 150v version, i reckon they might just make a few..it cant be too hard to do , compared to all the work thev done already.

just a point. the adaptto bms is for up to 28s. :?:

Re: The most advanced Adaptto Mini-E Controller + BMS

Posted: Mar 20, 2014 7:18 pm
by andreym
zombiess wrote:Can you switch over to 150v rated components? Running at max spec is unacceptable. Are you planning to build a version capable of running 24s LiPo?
Running at 100v is absolutely not recommended and the power will be limited if the voltage go higher than 92v on stock firmware.
mvly wrote:Just my opinion, I think they should use IRFP4568 FETs. They have low RDS and can go up to 150V.
If the 12KW version can come close in price with the ability to do 150V, I am definitely interested.
There is no way you can get more power using 150v FETs at the moment than 100v ones.
Simply calculate maximum current and power dissipation at the same current for IRFP4468 and IRFP4568
you will be surprised. because 150v ones have twice RDSon compared to 100v ones. This means in the same conditions you can only use half the current.
But wait a minute, you have only 1.5x the voltage, not 2x !!!

In total the most effective way to get maximum power is to go 100v FETs.
So to reach the required speed the only thing you need is correct KV of the motor.
12kw is not a big deal for MAX-E, use 22s lipo, set the current to max and you get it! Still having warranty!!

Want to go crazy?? no problem, Go 28S LiFePo4, charge them to 3.4v per cell (BMS allows to charge to any voltage you like) get 98% capacity and a sweet ~92v average voltage of the pack. Flash unlocked firmware and set battery current to 200amps - no problem, however you will loose the warranty this case, but have you thought about the warranty when pushing infineon controllers with 4110fets to 100.8v? of adding solder to shunt and program them for max currents? I do not think so....
Extreme overclocking usually does not mean you want to use it for years in all conditions but to get the maximum from existing hardware, no matter what happens tomorrow...