E-BikeKit rewiew, 36 volt front hub

[Russell]

Full wattage is when it's disconnected, connect the jumper for lower wattage.

I found that peak watts is the same with the speed suppressor wires connected as it is normally. When accelerating from a stop a motor will often draw the maximum current the controller will allow and since the suppressor doesn't limit current the power will spike just as high with or without the white wires connected. Of course since the throttle is limited to 60% with the wires connected acceleration quickly slows as speeds increases. But yes overall when I used my 9C at 48V with the white wires connected it performed very much like my 36V 250W Bafang at 36V.

-R

[Drunkskunk]

Nice Review!

I'm currious how you feel this motor compares to your other motors in torque. The numbers and simulaters will say one thing, but by the seat of your pants, does this compare closer to the 530X, or the Aetoma?

[dogman]

Still only on mile 30 riding it, but it seems definitely more torquey than the aotema I have been riding. The difference is not huge, but it's definitely there.
The E-BikeKit motor just seems a bit perkier off the line at stop signs, and definitely I am noticing more wheel spin if I hit trottle on a sandy patch. Since it's a hall sensor type motor, it takes off smoother at first than a sensorless.

What Russel says about wattage spikes makes sense to me, a motor will grab all the power it can, till the controller stops it. That's why a 22 amp controller can spike 30 amps easily on a start. I was only repeating what the owners manual said. "limits motor power to 200 watts when connected."

[Russell]

What Russel says about wattage spikes makes sense to me, a motor will grab all the power it can, till the controller stops it. That's why a 22 amp controller can spike 30 amps easily on a start. I was only repeating what the owners manual said. "limits motor power to 200 watts when connected."

A controller with a 22A limit really does limit current (from the battery) to 22A, at least that's what my WU meter says. The suppressor makes the 9C feel overall like a lower power motor however the WU meter recorded a peak power of 1095W when I had it enabled and used a 48V/10Ah LiFePO4 battery and the 22A E-BikeKit controller.

-R

[dogman]

I thought it was still possible for very brief spikes above the controllers amp limit to ocurr, till the controller goes to work and pulls it back down. Wasn't that what happend to people running x5's on pingbatteries with 45 amp controllers. Brief amp spikes would trip the bms high amp limit and shut down the pack.

You guys will allways be way over my head on this controller stuff, I'm just an ol Agriculture degree guy. If the tractor breaks get a bigger hammer to hit it.

Do continue to jump my butt when I get it all mixed up.

Replying to Ypedal, right now I don't have a handy 48v battery, my nicads are permanent mounted to the dirt bike. But eventually I'll get a battery, or remove the nicads for a 48v test. I'd love a 48v 15 ah ping so I'd have 70 mile range for some cross country trips when also carrying my 36v 20 ah ping.

[Russell]

I thought it was still possible for very brief spikes above the controllers amp limit to ocurr, till the controller goes to work and pulls it back down. Wasn't that what happend to people running x5's on pingbatteries with 45 amp controllers. Brief amp spikes would trip the bms high amp limit and shut down the pack.

You guys will allways be way over my head on this controller stuff, I'm just an ol Agriculture degree guy. If the tractor breaks get a bigger hammer to hit it.

Do continue to jump my butt when I get it all mixed up.

I don't know how fast the WU meter samples but the peak current it displays at the end of a ride is always in a very tight range, for example 21.83A to 22.13A for my E-BikeKit 22A unit. I've noticed that peak amps is not what the controller allows steady state such as when climbing a hill, in that case the current is normally held an amp or two lower than the peak. For my other E-BikeKit controller modified for 15A it will peak at a max of about 15.25A (48V) but will limit current to just under 14A going up a hill. At 36V the same controller allows peaks of right about 16A.

-R

[Drunkskunk]

I thought it was still possible for very brief spikes above the controllers amp limit to ocurr, till the controller goes to work and pulls it back down. Wasn't that what happend to people running x5's on pingbatteries with 45 amp controllers. Brief amp spikes would trip the bms high amp limit and shut down the pack.

I'd have to reread those threads, but I think they were using a CA to limit the current lower than the controller's max. Cycle Analyst have a lag before they react, so you can get a few thousandths to hundredths of a second of an amp spike before the CA clamps it down.

[mwkeefer]

I thought it was still possible for very brief spikes above the controllers amp limit to ocurr, till the controller goes to work and pulls it back down. Wasn't that what happend to people running x5's on pingbatteries with 45 amp controllers. Brief amp spikes would trip the bms high amp limit and shut down the pack.

You guys will allways be way over my head on this controller stuff, I'm just an ol Agriculture degree guy. If the tractor breaks get a bigger hammer to hit it.

Do continue to jump my butt when I get it all mixed up.

Replying to Ypedal, right now I don't have a handy 48v battery, my nicads are permanent mounted to the dirt bike. But eventually I'll get a battery, or remove the nicads for a 48v test. I'd love a 48v 15 ah ping so I'd have 70 mile range for some cross country trips when also carrying my 36v 20 ah ping.

I believe this is what Block time parameter is for... there has been some talk that this parameter will change how fast the controller reacts to limit the current... testing seems to indicate this is correct, as I give higher and higher block time value the amount of current over rated which is allowed to spike increases.

A setting of 1 gives the experience Russell conveys above - oh Rus: 48v * 22A = 1056watts so your measurement is correct. I believe the manual to be mistaken here, however since the purpose of the jumper is to comply with EU and Asia laws for eBikes (200w nominal?) the stated value makes sense.

-Mike

[dogman]

Just some bla bla to keep the review on top.

I still really do like this kit, but do kinda miss 25 mph. 20 mph is perfect in town on the bike path or the neighborhood street where the kid chases a ball into your path. But on the last leg home on the frontage road all by myself, 20 mph seems a bit slow now. I find that after a bit of riding, I get used to any speed. When I hypermile cross country, I ride 12 mph to double my range. It's an attitude thing. Commuting, I just want to get home at the end of the day. Food is waiting for me there. On the ride to work, I'm like, "aw shucks, the rides over allready?"

[MattDog]

Welcome to the 9th continent! It is indeed a torquey little beast even at 22A. The 48v Ping with routinely spin the front tire a bit under full throttle when pulling away from a stop...FUN!

That torque arm is better than some I've seen.... The box & packing seem to be the de facto standard for all vendors shipping that particular kit.

Even the axle bearings are sealed against water intrusion...so the thing should be okay to run in the wet ALL the time...I've run in the rain countless times...you WILL have fun on this rig...

Great review!

[JinbaIttai]

. . . I've noticed that peak amps is not what the controller allows steady state such as when climbing a hill, in that case the current is normally held an amp or two lower than the peak. . .

Just out of curiosity, what kind of amp readings do you see at full throttle on level ground, no pedaling?

[Russell]

. . . I've noticed that peak amps is not what the controller allows steady state such as when climbing a hill, in that case the current is normally held an amp or two lower than the peak. . .

Just out of curiosity, what kind of amp readings do you see at full throttle on level ground, no pedaling?

One time as an experiment to see how much power the motor used I ran my (9x7) 9C at full throttle over exactly one mile of fairly flat road and it stayed between 15 and 20A the entire time, this was at 48V with the stock 22A controller. The motor consumed 0.7Ah for that one mile while maintaining mid 20's (700Cx35). I don't presently have the 9C installed on a bike however I'm looking to build up another ebike using this motor again.

-R

[mwkeefer]

Just out of curiosity, what kind of amp readings do you see at full throttle on level ground, no pedaling?

I will sort through my eagletree data later and seperate some flat 1mi WOT accelleration and sustain runs for your viewing pleasure. There is a variance between controllers of as much as 1.5A maximum (stock) due to shunt variances... nothing to worry about. Some get 22.5, some 24, some 21A

-Mike

[ambroseliao]

Hey Dogman,

I have this kit and run it on a combination of 6P Bosch Fat Packs and 1S 18AH 12V SLA for a total of 48V. My TF S-750 runs fast enough that I have hard time keeping up with it and have to stop pedaling after a short while. The speed varies between 27 and 29 mph when fresh off the chargers. I need to put a larger crank on the front so I can reduce my cadence when I'm going on a flat or downhill road. I have to say that the difference between 36V and 48V is dramatic. The 48V setup makes keeping up with traffic much easier and passing is also much easier. I highly recommend running the E-BikeKit front wheel 9C motor at 48V.

Ambrose

[dogman]

Yeah, just trying to wear out my 36v pingbattery though. Only 10,000 miles to go! I'll be testing the motor on 48v nicads eventually, but they aren't big enough to get me back up the hill from work 15 miles to home. Right now the nicads are bolted to another bike. I am finding I have to be carefull not to spin the wheel at 36v, so I can imagine 48 would get to spinning the tire quite a bit.



It's nice though, to be legal at 36v on this kit. The aotema I've been used to goes 24 mph while this one goes 21. It's not that much slower, It's just that I get hungry on the way home. Just slowing down 3mph is getting better range. Amazing how much farther 21 mph goes compared to 24. I should be albe to go further than 25 miles on my 36v 20 ah pingbattery at full throtte, including some hills. Bear in mind also, my bike couldn't be less aerodynamic.

At some point, I'll do a hypermile test too, my personal best so far is 39 miles on the pingbattery. I bet with the larger diameter motor, the E-BikeKit will go farther.