Mac motor purchase and review uk

bionicdan

1 kW
Joined
Dec 22, 2010
Messages
353
Location
uk
I decided to give the old mac motor a whirl from em3ev and surprisingly didnt find much info on it here through search terms "mac motor". Anyway I thought I would splurge down a few details incase someone finds them helpful to decide what they want from a product and its ease of fitment. I have been contacted by another member from the uk for info on my purchase so guess he couldnt find what he needed either.

Purchase and delivery

Went onto http://em3ev.com/store/index.php?route=common/home picked my 10t 36v motor from the pic'n'mix section. Selected double phase wires (Ie two runs of standard cable not 1 strand at double thickness per phase), two freewheels with 11t smallest procket 9 and 7 speed, freewheel removal tool, usb cable, 40a infineon 3077, torque arm, alex dh rim option, extra throttle for spares, temperature probe and sal 2-4week delivery at £68.

Just shy of 4 weeks later (not bad over xmas and new year :)) It arrived very well packaged with no damage. My conhismotor arrived pretty beat up and scratched. No instructions included but when I got stuck and googled the infineon controller on image search it took me back to em3ev to the controller section where the wires are labelled in a picture.

It was all automated and cost £395 going up to £411 with a paypal charge. I had previously asked 4 questions via the websites enquiry section but got no response (maybe i misstyped my email or something). To this day the order status says pending and the only aknoweldgement I got was that money had been taken by paypal. A dispatch email would be nice for people who dont know where cellman lives and get nervous buying online ha ha.

Installation on dh mountain bike

Pulled off my conhis DD slapped in the new wheel with the 9spd freewheel with the washer that looks to have been included to space the frame just right (it looks like a modded lock washer with the lug shaved off so it fits in the small freewheels slot). Spread my frame by 3mm max with very very minimal force at all.

Wires are shorter than my conhis but easily reach up to my cross bar as its a 14" frame and should handle the amp load better. My conhis wires got hot and melted at the terminals once running 36v into a 24v hub. If you have a 22"frame and want your controller on top of the cross bar it may be a stretch or position rethink needed.

Chopped and changed a few terminals to match my bikes ancillaries and ham fisted my standard 3 pin throttle plug into the infineon's 5 pin block easily for now.
Make sure you select ignition off while connecting the battery or you get an inrush pop. I used a 24v bulb anyway until I knew the correct sequence. Talking of popping I slipped with my voltmeter probe into my headways balancing multi pin slot and blinded myself as it got destroyed. I also turned my fingers a funny colour oops 3am isnt a good time for soldering games.

I had a 205mm disc laying around (Hope do them and 225mm ones), as you do. I think it made fitment easier work than trying to space the standard disc away from the hub to allow for the caliper to fit down the narrow gap and then have to move the caliper outwards somehow also. So I just bolted the disc on spaced my caliper upwards 30mm and bang it fits with at least 1mm clearance from the hub ha ha. I think it has something like 15mm clearance for the caliper between the disc and hub which didnt cut it for my shimano hydraulic unit. Cable activated calipers may have better luck if you need discs like I do. This way it sits proud of the hubs body and needs no spacing on the disc or realignment of the caliper (to the left anyway).

2013-01-15-231_zps098825a5.jpg


Here is the semi finished project. I still have a few things to do like battery protection and reducing the size of that huge bag. Although it is a good place for stuff and my datatool alarm and imobiliser from a smashed up motorbike. It beeps if you even touch it :)
2013-01-15-232_zps2035e6b0.jpg


Short test ride of 3 miles

Its criminal but I only had time for a quick test and now its snowing but will put some miles on it soon. I have no idea what my 40a controller is set to. It has three speeds. At a total guess it felt like 10a on slow 15med and 20ish high (I think I am talking battery amps here not phase amps as I am comparing to the ah draw on my conhis) but I was babying my new batteries. People say you dont need to but as someone who has observed heat and extra sag from the first few heavy uses, I will now take it easy. I have only had packs play up that got hit hard right out the box.

I used 1700mah of my 10.000mah pack over 3 miles and guess at a 20 mile range with some assist. I can update this when the sun comes out.

It felt grunty as a lowish rpm motor should and noise was only audable at lower speeds.

My battery consists of 12x10ah lifepo4 headway cells strung together with 12mm threaded grub screws carefully installed to avoid uneveness and cell damage. They have 5mm glazing foam underneath, wipping twine to support end cells with no metal plate and finally strung onto the frame and gorilla glued to prevent any chance of twisting round. I will probably cover them up at some point but I like the naked look for now lol.

Oh yeah the spokes are painted black and look nice and weather proof. They are spoked on the inner side of the left and outer side of the right flange. They are nice and tought. I build my own front wheel 14 years ago and is as perfectly straight as the day I made it. This wheel was very very close to my own standards of building regarding tension and trueness. I really thought I was going to be let down on this aspect and was pleasantly surprised I didnt have to tweak it.

I have high standards and I am a mechanical perfectionist. So to say I was 90 percent pleased with the transaction and quality of parts supplied is a big thing from me. I am only left wanting to know where I can get the controller software and will hopefully get a reply from cellman soon (only emailed a few hours ago). Any questions let me know and il see if I can help. I cant wait to rip up my 18% gradient hills soon!
Thanks Dan
 
Paul can deliver much quicker if you want to pay for quicker, think we got one for a mate, just before Christmas, in less than 7 days.

One thing you do need to do is turn the axle around, so the wire exits underneath, with a drip loop so water does not flow into the motor

Are you just running at 36 volts? My mate is running at 50 now and is going up to 14 s Lipo so 58 volts in the nxt day or so, as soon as we build up his battery pack, siz 7s packs made as a 14s3p pack, each pack 5.8 AH so a 17 Ah pack
 
Sorry if this is a bit off topic, but, who the hell sells a 223mm disc for bicycle use? i'd love to get my hands on one of those !!
 
NeilP said:
Are you just running at 36 volts? My mate is running at 50 now and is going up to 14 s Lipo so 58 volts...
+1
Not recommended to go over 60v (unless you run a CA V3 with throttle ramping) to keep the clutch from seizing, but at 36v you MAC is not even pulling 500W. I'd recommend as a minimum putting another stick of 3 cells to get to 15s and 48v. Here's a quick run on Justin's simulatorto compare 36 and 48v batteries.

36-48mac_iv.jpg
 
Yeah I wasnt moaning but you start getting twitchy when there has been no coms telling you its on the way ha ha.

I am a fair weather rider hence no mud gaurds and check satellite reports before embarking on my journey to decide if its car walking or bike so no wet stuff for me. If your wondering, I only have a huge soft heavy bike for stability and comfort. I had bad brain damage in an accident and balance better on a bigger bike and its easier on my back/pelvis/coxis after I broke them.

My wire exits out of the side of the axle so whichever way you put it it seems to either point forwards or back not up and down. Plus my phase wires only just reach where I need them too and couldnt afford to lose any length.

I stuck with 12s 37v nom 10ah headways for ease of fitment, relative lightness compared to my old 20ah and low rpm grunt for climbing. Lipos constant degredation reminds me of lead acid as the capacity reduces but they are super light and compact. I also cant risk fire hazards now I am so forgetful and leave chargers on for days by mistake. I just wanted to flatten the hills out mostly as I live right on top of a huge one. I am not interested in going further than 15 miles or doing 30mph and losing my car licence (I have bad luck if someone is going to be a test case it will be me).


Nothing is off topic on ES ha ha. Just a quick ebay search came up with it. Of course one slight machine error on the flat hub surface and your looking at brakes that rub a little. Plus any heat warp will be accentuated with such a big disc.

OOh I totally lied its 205mm sorry but here are links to ones in the uk at 225 (they all seem to be hope products). If the uk has them the states should lol the uk sucks mostly for goodies.

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Hope-Ti-225mm-Floating-Rotor-Disc-M4-Mono-X2-V2-Sram-Avid-Juicy-Elixir-7-/170974748054?pt=UK_sportsleisure_cycling_bikeparts_SR&hash=item27cee39d96

http://www.ukbikestore.co.uk/product/69/hope_saw_disc/hope-mono-minim4-saw-disc.html

Cheers for the youtube vids neptronix, it helped me decide to give the mac motor a go. Although I feel so unfit going from a 27mph dd hub to a 36v 10t low rpm 22mph hub that needs you to pedal ha ha. Its what I wanted though a comprimise bewteen hill assist and feeling like a normal bike. really its what I wanted :?

It just felt like a motorbike with dd and never felt like I was doing anything as my speed was locked in by the heavy motor.

13 miles on my conhis motor shows 12ah replaced into the battery on my hilly route at around 25mph. The mac motor seems to have used around 8ah at around 23mph/and some sweat, on a smaller capacity pack of cells that are new but probably not totally primed yet. I dont have a cycle analist but have a cellpro powerlab charger to tell me what was put back into the pack. I guess that wouldnt consider how much was wasted as heat while at high amp draw.
 
teklektik said:
NeilP said:
Are you just running at 36 volts? My mate is running at 50 now and is going up to 14 s Lipo so 58 volts...
+1
Not recommended to go over 60v (unless you run a CA V3 with throttle ramping) to keep the clutch from seizing, but at 36v you MAC is not even pulling 500W. I'd recommend as a minimum putting another stick of 3 cells to get to 15s and 48v. Here's a quick run on Justin's simulatorto compare 36 and 48v batteries.


The laws are very out of date here or just plain rubbish so I wanted to keep under the radar a little. I accidentally did a wheelie today while the pack was showing under 3v a cell. Thats what I want, a load of grunt then a nice bike to poodle about in and take in the scenery. At 27mph on my old set up my ears hurt my eyes dry out a little and it doesnt feel pleasant to me. If I want a drag bike one day I will remove my rear shock and put a 110cc eq rotomax 9kw motor in there ha ha

Oh yes I have the 12fet 40 controller 3077 but no idea what it is set at untill I get windows 7 to register the sofware ocx thingies for programming the infineon :( Just says error this error that etc

Just so you feel my pain anything over this is classed as a motor vehichle that needs licence helmet, mot, insurance etc
Over 40kg weight
over 200w (250w for a tandem I think)
over 15mph, the motor must cut out at 15.5mph max
I think it must only engage when you pedal but not too sure about this. I think if its uk made it has to but if it eu made abroad you can have throttles only.


To be prosecuted it must be proved the system was powering you and active. As I can pedal (for 30 seconds lol) at around 20 mph with the battery removed any video evidence is useless as I always pedal. One copper previously hung his whole body out of his landrover to check my bike but never came back round or stopped.

If I am seen doing 30mph its game set and match and you loose your car licence. I know its worst case scenario but I have had far worse things happen in my life and am all out of 9 lives lol. The hills I mainly need help on are huge 18% gradient and classed as off road :)
 
The mac motor can do much higher speeds and move you along at the speeds of a 9C DD. I ran mine at 35-39mph on the flats for a while. It can do 30mph no problem for long periods of time. It won't leave you wanting compared to the DD, you just have to run the appropriate voltage/amperage.
 
neptronix said:
The mac motor can do much higher speeds and move you along at the speeds of a 9C DD. I ran mine at 35-39mph on the flats for a while. It can do 30mph no problem for long periods of time. It won't leave you wanting compared to the DD, you just have to run the appropriate voltage/amperage.

I dont want speed. I want a bike that feels the same up a hill as it does on the flat. Nothing more lol. I want some fitness back too.

I am not of the tim allen "more power" persuasion

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=eZ9Xk0Lln5Y

I have already died in a horrific road accident due to someone else and need to take it slow now. No more accidents for me. At 20mph I often get overtaken and carved up by people turning immediately left who misjudged my speed. Wheres the bubble wrap
 
go to your use control panel and add your location..see other peoples name on RHS of their post? look down and you can see the location
 
bionicdan said:
I have already died in a horrific road accident due to someone else

NeilP said:
go to your use control panel and add your location

Well, that'd be heaven I'm guessing :lol:
 
Hyena said:
bionicdan said:
I have already died in a horrific road accident due to someone else

NeilP said:
go to your use control panel and add your location

Well, that'd be heaven I'm guessing :lol:


Ha ha luckily I came back after having 6 pints of blood pumped into me once they recovered my body from up in a tree. Crazy times.

I think its good to share buying experiences and levels of support (or lack of sometimes) so people newer to the game can decide which way to go.
 
Update on my motor. It seems I may never have had a fully functioning motor(or I didnt for long). I always had some very minor sync issues and higher than expected amp draw until last night it went dead. All it would do is judder even if the halls got unplugged it acted the same.

After testing voltage on the hall wires I got 4.8v but none of them switched off. On Looking inside I find great looking cogs/teeth and a freeish clutch. I then wiggled the wires half way up and found the dead spot. Of all the wires it had to be the black hall feed. I stripped it back to find they had all been kinked somehow before it got wrapped. So this tight kink caused a semi contact that somehow reduced the halls effectiveness but wasnt bad enough to be obvious. When I tugged it lightly the snail shape kink just snapped.

So now I have 20 percent more power, smoothness, less noise and I dont have to release the throttle after slowing down up a hill to resync the controller. Half way up a hill the motor would become slightly more noisy but a quick off/on flick of the wrist seemed to fix it.

I thought I was just getting used to the power like a new car and always wanting more so got bigger batteries and higher voltage at allot of expense. Wish I hadnt bothered now and stuck with my 36v system, if only I had known lol. The kink may have been caused by the suspension link operating but the hall wires looked to have somehow been awkwardly looped around one phase wire changing direction. I cant see how that could have happened after assembly.

I get 4.93v on two hall wires and 4.78v on a third. Hopefully thats ok.



Ps, the new a123 amp20 50v pack is amazing btw
 
Hi bionicdan,any updates on the motor ?Keep looking at these motors for single tracking ,flat land round here 30mph is good just want to get there quickly
 
Hey there, yes its still going but im babying it a bit (as much as you can with a 40a controller).

I love flying down some woodland tracks (pedal power only) sometimes but have never used it to power back up them for fear of stripping gears. I would prefer a direct drive motor for rough stuff for peace of mind. I even let off the throttle when I see a pothole just incase. My gears look immaculate after maybe 2500-3500 miles so maybe I have over worried.

Now I have full power I have deformed the woodruff key slightly and am due to replace it.

My 10t did around 28mph but only got 30miles out of a 20ah 50v battery at that speed. Some kids saw me in burger king and said wow its that fast bike that makes the funny noise lol. I now run 45v 20ah multistar lipos and it sounds half as screamy.

Me and the mrs did 65miles (15mphish) from hawkinge to rye the other day. She ran out 2 miles from home and demanded I boosted her pack with a hobby charger from my battery. So bear in mind speeds gonna eat your pack. Oh yeah after I got the motor working better the cellman supplied battery terminals that came with my 50v 20ah pack melted inside causing a poor contact hence me dabbling with lipos. My bike feels like a bike again :)
 
I just ordered a replacement clutch and gear and controller. The gears are bright blue? Isnt that old tech? The controller looks used too so just wondered if anyone knows if the blue is new lol?
 
ok cheers I also got the old style clutch. I was just checking he wasnt unloading old stock on me as no one asked which clutch I had. My motor was on the point of changes so I got the new stator but the old style clutch. Its all gone back together ok anyway. Now to see how long it lasts my brother and his untrained wrist muscles lol
ezeegear.jpg
 
I could be wrong but I thought you could use a new type clutch in any year mac motor but you must also use the new gears with it. Who knows. Il have to give my brother a lesson on not yanking the throttle or it will deform the keyway and jam the clutch again. Maybe il disable boost mode 3 or get a smaller controller :)
 
I guess I should specify next time. The watt mater said 47 amps from the battery at 14 cell multi star lipo voltage so possibly over 1kw ha ha. It lasted me 2yrs and my brother 2 mins. All good fun
 
izeman said:
you CAN mix the old/new freewheel and gears. but not all are a perfect match. the old freewheel is known to be weaker. this is no issue if you're within legal limts, but problems may start at 1kW+.

Paul/em3ev just told me the new cutch has problems so they are sticking with the old one which never ceased to be supplied by macmotors? I always heard the new one was stronger but I guess he should know.
 
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