Metallover's 9c Blackcomb Build

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Re: Metallover's 9c Blackcomb Build

Postby mwkeefer » Sun Mar 07, 2010 6:49 pm

Metallover,

I don't know what type of power your pulling but I have seen many people do this with a relay and a dpdt switch, there are even some nifty automatic timed circuits out there.

I'm only suggesting this because then the resistor stays mounted, you connect your power plug to the pack with the switch in the pre-charge mode... then when your ready to go, flip the switch and engage the relays (however many you need to isolate VCC at your voltage / current).

Personally I have a small circuit based on a 555 timer IC which handles my pre-charge delay and then engages a pair of automotive SPDT relays (wired in parallel) on VCC... normally closed runs through the precharge resistor (so it's in precharge mode on plug in), flip the power up switch and .... the relays engage the normally open side which then allows the pack VCC to directly pass to the controller.

I've run as much as 62.7v @ 69A through this arrangement with no issues.

Hope it helps!

-Mike
Regards,
Mike

{My Rides]
2010 Dahon Jack - GNG v1 - LYEN 6FET - 20/40A - 18S2P10AH - Nom:66.6v,1332w
2004 Hard Rock Pro Disc - Recumpence ms eDrive v4 - Astro 3220 4T - 12S2P16AH - HV110 - Left Side Drive - Gearing: 38mph
Nominal Peak Power @ 60 seconds: 5328 watts - Maximum Power: 49.8v, 120A, 5872w
2010 Downtube 8FH - Stock GNG v1 Stock Controller - EB809XC - 12-16S
2012 Downtube Nova 7spd - Stock GNG v2 - 12S2P10AH - EB809 - 12S-16S - 20A/30A,Nom VCC: 44.4, 888w
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Re: Metallover's 9c Blackcomb Build

Postby Metallover » Wed Mar 10, 2010 9:10 pm

Thank you for the information on the switch! Lots of those things have ran through my mind, and this summer as I start "parking" the bike more as I use it for real transportation, I'll need refinements like that. A good keyed switch will be needed.

I got tired of the batteries in the back so I moved them up front. Balance is way better now and it'll be good for jumping this summer. :twisted: I need to find a good material to put over the packs (in place of the towl) and I need to finish making a good battery hold-down. The material I put over the batteries would ideally be waterproff, durable, and good looking,, but I'll probably have to comprimise.

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I like the new seat position. I grew up riding bmx bikes so the low seat really fits. The batteries are just narrow enough so it doesn't really interfere with my peadaling. I'll report more on that after I get another ride in.
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Re: Metallover's 9c Blackcomb Build

Postby etard » Thu Mar 11, 2010 10:58 pm

It looks great man, Have you thought about using heat wrap film or spandex stretched over it? Are you gonna make a video racing somebody?
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Re: Metallover's 9c Blackcomb Build

Postby nicobie » Fri Mar 12, 2010 3:08 pm

You might try this stuff. .99/roll and comes in a bunch of colors. Easy to wrap and can be re-used if careful.

I use it all the time. It's great for hiding wires and whatnot.

http://www.jefferspet.com/ssc/product.a ... id=0029430
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Re: Metallover's 9c Blackcomb Build

Postby Metallover » Fri Mar 12, 2010 4:49 pm

Thanks for the replies! All things mentioned looks like good options. Something streachy would definately be good. I think the spandex/bandages would be extra good also, because of the breathability of the material; My batteries may get hot this summer, who knows.

And by racing somone, do you mean a car? That sounds like fun, and I'll look into that. :D
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Re: Metallover's 9c Blackcomb Build

Postby etard » Sat Mar 13, 2010 3:02 am

Well earlier you showed a kid on a scooter that didn't want a piece, find a scooter or a car would be good to compare acceleration.
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Re: Metallover's 9c Blackcomb Build

Postby doc007 » Sat Mar 13, 2010 9:32 pm

Metallover wrote: My batteries may get hot this summer, who knows.


Nice build! :D

Maybe you can rig a box out of those L shaped metal brackets you used. It looks like two might fit well together to form a nice box. This might help protect the expensive batts if you take a fall. Also, the metal may help dissipate any heat build-up during the summer. If heat really becomes an issue you might be able to drill some holes into the metal.

I think it would look pretty cool considering the rest of your bike has that metallic look to it. Also, it will camouflage into the bike to help deter any unwanted attention. That is, of course, if you're going for the stealth look.
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Re: Metallover's 9c Blackcomb Build

Postby Metallover » Sun Mar 14, 2010 9:38 pm

I made a new video, and I tried to make this one more interesting. :wink:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QV7XDgA6B9g
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Re: Metallover's 9c Blackcomb Build

Postby Metallover » Mon Mar 15, 2010 8:43 pm

Two questions today. I switched the brakes around so the rear brakes are on my left and I can do wheelies now! Beofre I go out and break something, does anyone have any tips on how to wheelie on an ebike?

I noticed that there seems to be a limit on my ecrazyman controller. It seems like it's limited to either 1500w or 20a. Is there a factory power limit? If so, how do I remove it? :twisted:
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Re: Metallover's 9c Blackcomb Build

Postby johnrobholmes » Mon Mar 15, 2010 9:39 pm

Some people like to wheelie standing, some like to sit down. Try both and see what works best for you. Don't go overboard on it and smoke your motor or ESC though :lol: Lots of starting and stopping puts the hurt on stuff.
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Re: Metallover's 9c Blackcomb Build

Postby Hyena » Mon Mar 15, 2010 10:08 pm

Metallover wrote:I switched the brakes around so the rear brakes are on my left and I can do wheelies now!

You were trying to do wheelies previously with the brakes on ??
I just yank a handful of throttle then feather it to try and keep the bike where you want it. It does take alot of practise - you'll either go off the back or the front wheel will come back down. My favorite rolling wheelie/jump is to launch over speed bumps or drops in the foot path or what ever and keep the throttle up so you keep the front wheel in the air a little once you land.
Best to practise on grass so you don't axe yourself and the bike too much when you don't get it right!

It seems like it's limited to either 1500w or 20a. Is there a factory power limit? If so, how do I remove it? :twisted:

Solder up the shunt and you'll see a big improvement in your wheelies and acceleration but as the John said you'll quickly cook your motor especially with the higher current if you're doing wheelies the whole time.
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Re: Metallover's 9c Blackcomb Build

Postby mwkeefer » Mon Mar 15, 2010 10:11 pm

Metallover wrote:Thank you for the information on the switch! Lots of those things have ran through my mind, and this summer as I start "parking" the bike more as I use it for real transportation, I'll need refinements like that. A good keyed switch will be needed.

I got tired of the batteries in the back so I moved them up front. Balance is way better now and it'll be good for jumping this summer. :twisted: I need to find a good material to put over the packs (in place of the towl) and I need to finish making a good battery hold-down. The material I put over the batteries would ideally be waterproff, durable, and good looking,, but I'll probably have to comprimise.

I like the new seat position. I grew up riding bmx bikes so the low seat really fits. The batteries are just narrow enough so it doesn't really interfere with my peadaling. I'll report more on that after I get another ride in.


So these are basically just trays?

Ever consider using ABS downtube to form 3/4 C style covers to go over them - would be more protective and clean looking - or maybe more L channel aluminum with some spotted bolt pilots to seal the box (with weatherstripping for protection from elements...

Looking good!

-Mike
Regards,
Mike

{My Rides]
2010 Dahon Jack - GNG v1 - LYEN 6FET - 20/40A - 18S2P10AH - Nom:66.6v,1332w
2004 Hard Rock Pro Disc - Recumpence ms eDrive v4 - Astro 3220 4T - 12S2P16AH - HV110 - Left Side Drive - Gearing: 38mph
Nominal Peak Power @ 60 seconds: 5328 watts - Maximum Power: 49.8v, 120A, 5872w
2010 Downtube 8FH - Stock GNG v1 Stock Controller - EB809XC - 12-16S
2012 Downtube Nova 7spd - Stock GNG v2 - 12S2P10AH - EB809 - 12S-16S - 20A/30A,Nom VCC: 44.4, 888w
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Re: Metallover's 9c Blackcomb Build

Postby Metallover » Sat Mar 27, 2010 12:30 pm

Thanks Mike! All of your suggestions sound good! I will be working and refining for a long time, and this summer when I get a job hopefully everything can be called completed!

In other news I am about done with my Bullet Plugs. The last short I had to open up one of my zippies and re-solder one of the tabs. It was blown apart. This new short today is the one that sent me over the edge.

Image

I would make a sweet Tattoo, wouldn't it?? :lol: The stuff really doesn't want to come off, so it'll be on there for awhile before I decide to get it permanent. :D

Where is the best place to get 45a andersons? Or will I be able to get away with 30a? I am only pulling 20a atm, but I may in the future go for delta/wye and/or shunt soldering so you never know... :)
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Re: Metallover's 9c Blackcomb Build

Postby mwkeefer » Sat Mar 27, 2010 1:02 pm

Dishsoap / Detergent, ie: liquid Joy - comes right off!

Welcome to the Major KFF club!

-Mike
Regards,
Mike

{My Rides]
2010 Dahon Jack - GNG v1 - LYEN 6FET - 20/40A - 18S2P10AH - Nom:66.6v,1332w
2004 Hard Rock Pro Disc - Recumpence ms eDrive v4 - Astro 3220 4T - 12S2P16AH - HV110 - Left Side Drive - Gearing: 38mph
Nominal Peak Power @ 60 seconds: 5328 watts - Maximum Power: 49.8v, 120A, 5872w
2010 Downtube 8FH - Stock GNG v1 Stock Controller - EB809XC - 12-16S
2012 Downtube Nova 7spd - Stock GNG v2 - 12S2P10AH - EB809 - 12S-16S - 20A/30A,Nom VCC: 44.4, 888w
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Re: Metallover's 9c Blackcomb Build

Postby Hyena » Sun Mar 28, 2010 6:31 pm

Ouuuuch, nice KFH man! I'm trying to reconstruct the shape of the burn in my head to picture how that happened. Did you have your hand around the top of the top of the pack, sort of holding it by the wires ?

Metallover wrote:Where is the best place to get 45a andersons? Or will I be able to get away with 30a? I am only pulling 20a atm, but I may in the future go for delta/wye and/or shunt soldering so you never know... :)

The contacts are actually the same so if you can fit your wire in the 30a connectors (12ga or slightly trimmed 10ga) you'll save a few bucks. I don't know why the 45a contacts are so much more expensive... (atleast locally anyway)

As for the source powerwerx.com seems to be a popular choice.
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Re: Metallover's 9c Blackcomb Build

Postby dnmun » Sun Mar 28, 2010 6:47 pm

was there space enuff lengthwise to fit the packs laying on their side across the top and bottom of the main tube there? and clear the front wheel and not get right into your crotch either on top?
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Re: Metallover's 9c Blackcomb Build

Postby Metallover » Sun Mar 28, 2010 7:01 pm

Ha! KFx seems like a popular term.. and I don't know what it means! Please tell me. 8) [thankfully] The black came off the same evening after washing my hands normally 5-6 times. I was plugging something in to my controller and it shorted on my no-spark circut. When I closed my hand the black would go back and I could see how I was holding it... Make a fist with your thumb on the side of your index finger and imagine there's a bullet connecter between your thumb and index finger..

You made a good point saying the contact area is the same on both, so I'll get some 30a connectors and the $15 ratcheting crimper from harbor freight. Don't know when I'll order it; object now if you don't like my crimper.

There might be room to fit the packs. Possibly 2 on the top, probably 2 directly underneath the tube, and I could squeeze the last two below them all next to the shock. The problem with that is complexity of mounting the packs. I like how I have them now because they are easy to get on and off the bike and it wasn't too much work making a mount for them.
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Re: Metallover's 9c Blackcomb Build

Postby dnmun » Sun Mar 28, 2010 9:46 pm

they looked like they would only be about 30 mm wider that way, than the width of the bar.

if you read dogman's stuff, he has his ping laying on it's side and gets lotta cycles with them, i wonder if flat or vertical makes a difference, when vibrating, he squeezed it with his cookie sheet too. but yours is lipo too.

nice bike. way cool.
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Re: Metallover's 9c Blackcomb Build

Postby hydro-one » Sun Apr 04, 2010 10:19 am

lol nice tatoo.....KFF, kentuky fried finger, havent had it yet but i got as much lipo as you now so im crossing my unburnt fingers that it wont happen.....but that looks bad!! one guy fried his whole handskin off ! theres a pic around here somewhere,.,....they call that KFH fried hand...

i see your running big meats on yer bike. once winter dries up switch to some street tires and you will love the extra speed and lack of sound, i just switched , and what a nice change!!! so quiet. those knobbies sure sing on pavement. plus they suck alot of power. im finding.

Hope things are working for ya!!

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Re: Metallover's 9c Blackcomb Build

Postby Metallover » Sun Apr 04, 2010 11:38 am

Thanks for the comments!

My wish list includes biger tires. I want some really wide ones that are good for onroad and offroad (if possible). I took my bike out to a friends today and yesterday and jumped it on his ATV playground. It was a blast. The bike did really well, but wider tires would help immensly.

For the first time the motor got hot. Ambient temp was about 60-65 with a breeze. After 20-30mins hard riding/jumping offroad the motor was too hot to hold my hand on it. The controller was warm. It took around 20 minutes for it to cool down to "warm". Now I really want my temp sensor in my motor.

On the list
-Power supply
-Andersons for easier charging/easier 66v/22v switching/less KFF
-Larger tires
-more work securing the batteries
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Re: Metallover's 9c Blackcomb Build

Postby Metallover » Sat Apr 24, 2010 5:59 pm

Update

I got the temperature sensor of my VT monitor installed inside the motor. I wrote a review here.

I really like my VT monitor and I highly recommend it. It costs $8.50 on hobbycity.

Today my motor got to 72*c (163f) after jettin around in town.

Here are some pics of the VT monitor

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Image

Image

Image

My Crimper and connectors came and I got them installed. I am very happy about these too. Charging is MUCH easier now.

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before extension
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_____

Image

Good thing I took my motor off and did this because my hose clamp on my torque arm wasn't doing too hot. I replaced it, and I'll make sure to keep an eye on it. This one lasted 156 miles. I am glad I put two torque arms on. :shock:

Still on my list is a power supply, maxxis hookworm tires, the battery enclosure, and possibly delta/wye and a CA would be nice...
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Re: Metallover's 9c Blackcomb Build

Postby steveo » Thu Apr 29, 2010 1:38 pm

Metallover wrote:Thanks Mike! All of your suggestions sound good! I will be working and refining for a long time, and this summer when I get a job hopefully everything can be called completed!

In other news I am about done with my Bullet Plugs. The last short I had to open up one of my zippies and re-solder one of the tabs. It was blown apart. This new short today is the one that sent me over the edge.

Image

I would make a sweet Tattoo, wouldn't it?? :lol: The stuff really doesn't want to come off, so it'll be on there for awhile before I decide to get it permanent. :D

Where is the best place to get 45a andersons? Or will I be able to get away with 30a? I am only pulling 20a atm, but I may in the future go for delta/wye and/or shunt soldering so you never know... :)


i love these crispy hand shots lol... i think methods had the same thing happen a while back ...

lol..

i've been lucky... i've had a plasma fuse!!!... but no hand burning action for me!

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Re: Metallover's 9c Blackcomb Build

Postby Knuckles » Thu Apr 29, 2010 10:09 pm

Image
Image
Now this is not the end.
It is not even the beginning of the end.
But it is, perhaps, the end of the beginning.
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Re: Metallover's 9c Blackcomb Build

Postby Metallover » Fri Jun 04, 2010 11:15 pm

^^this is awesome :D

Major update on the bike today! I have figured out the controller programming via a usb-ttl adapter, I have added regenerative braking, I have added a 3-speed switch, I have drilled cooling holes in the motor, and I put on some 26x2.4 CST Cyclops tires. :D I also received a new power supply which allows me to charge at 10a instead of the previous 5a.

before
Image

after
Image

Brakes
I have doubled up the brake rotors on the front. I had to dremel one of the pads for awhile to get the extra clearence. The rotors now barely fit inside the caliper; stopping power is superb and the rotor doesn't squeak as much or get as hot. Notice how one rotor is thinner then the other one. :?:

Image

Power Supply
My power supply is a 30a 12v 350w power supply from an ebay member called modders.cn. It works very well.

Image

controller mods
Image

New Tires
Image

Image

Image

Cooling Holes
I used a 1 1/8" Bi-metal hole saw. I made a template out of a baseball card to mark the holes. I took the covers completely off of the motor to drill the holes.

Image

Image

3-speed switch
This is a 6-position rotary switch I got at radioshack. I have 4 options. Three positions are 100%, and the others are less. I can program them with the computer. I will use them for all-out mode and economy modes.

Image

Regen switch
Regen is activated by pushing down the un-used thumb shifter. This works very well. I used a momentry push-button switch.

Image

________________________


I rode about 20 miles today. The new tires are awesome! They are very smooth! It is like going from a non-suspension bike with wagon wheels to a 250cc dirtbike! I really love these tires and I hope they last thousands of miles. :D

The motor had a lot more trouble getting hot. I was still able to peak 97C, but I had to really try. I am and will experiment with fans for cooling. Right now I have a couple powerade caps acting as fins,,, It's not working too wel.. :P

The one thing that puzzled me after today is my max power output. When I changed the amp limit from 20a to 30a, to 40a, to 50a,, I barely felt a difference. When I hooked up the watt meter I found that I only pulled 27a and 1728w. I had 15+ miles on the charge, but I still expected much more power. I was hoping for 2500w+! 8)

Is there a setting that I am overlooking on the parameter designer?
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Re: Metallover's 9c Blackcomb Build

Postby mwkeefer » Sat Jun 05, 2010 2:09 am

Knuckles wrote:Image


Ride the Lightning or Fade to Black?

-Mike
Regards,
Mike

{My Rides]
2010 Dahon Jack - GNG v1 - LYEN 6FET - 20/40A - 18S2P10AH - Nom:66.6v,1332w
2004 Hard Rock Pro Disc - Recumpence ms eDrive v4 - Astro 3220 4T - 12S2P16AH - HV110 - Left Side Drive - Gearing: 38mph
Nominal Peak Power @ 60 seconds: 5328 watts - Maximum Power: 49.8v, 120A, 5872w
2010 Downtube 8FH - Stock GNG v1 Stock Controller - EB809XC - 12-16S
2012 Downtube Nova 7spd - Stock GNG v2 - 12S2P10AH - EB809 - 12S-16S - 20A/30A,Nom VCC: 44.4, 888w
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