E-S Stealth Electric Bike Owners

[Kepler]

Took the new Fighter over to Stealth today to show John and Al. Managed to get a bit of footage of the bike in action with Al riding it and doing what does best. As you can see, the little BPM has plenty of torque and has no problems popping the bike onto its back wheel and holding it.

[Cowardlyduck]

Took the new Fighter over to Stealth today to show John and Al. Managed to get a bit of footage of the bike in action with Al riding it and doing what does best. As you can see, the little BPM has plenty of torque and has no problems popping the bike onto its back wheel and holding it.

Looks nice.
How does it go off road and up long steep hills?

Cheers

[Justtoby]

Thanks for the vid, it looks great.

Did you put helium in the front tyre?......Al makes me mad as I really want to learn to wheelie like that.

[Lenk42602]

Working on the custom controller for the Fighter at the moment. The controller has been up speced with 4110 Fets and 100V components. All HV wiring has been done in 12gauge silicon cable which should be plenty for the power output. High current solder traces are all beefed up with solid copper bar too. As you can see, the controller is tiny and a piece of cake to install internally. With the bike frame being used as the FET heatsink, hopefully heat will be kept under control. Should have all the mods completed tonight ready for installation tomorrow.

Kepler,

Would you mind providing any additional detail about the controller you put together for the BPM? What did you start with? Other than the fets, larger cap, bigger wires, what else did you do to handle the increase in voltage?

Thanks,

len

[ManxE]

Well done Kepler - it looks really agile. Like a Velociraptor compared to the Bomber's T-Rex!
Can Al also do stoppies on it now that the back wheel has less weight?
I guess John & Co were suitably impressed!

[Kepler]

Took the new Fighter over to Stealth today to show John and Al. Managed to get a bit of footage of the bike in action with Al riding it and doing what does best. As you can see, the little BPM has plenty of torque and has no problems popping the bike onto its back wheel and holding it.

Looks nice.
How does it go off road and up long steep hills?

Cheers

I have only done a bit of off road work with it but has no trouble climbing anything I throw at it so far. Plenty of short steep stuff but no long steep hills tested yet.

[Kepler]

Thanks for the vid, it looks great.

Did you put helium in the front tyre?......Al makes me mad as I really want to learn to wheelie like that.

lol, makes me sick too. No fear and great skills. He has plenty of other party tricks in his book too (ex trials rider)

[Kepler]

Working on the custom controller for the Fighter at the moment. The controller has been up speced with 4110 Fets and 100V components. All HV wiring has been done in 12gauge silicon cable which should be plenty for the power output. High current solder traces are all beefed up with solid copper bar too. As you can see, the controller is tiny and a piece of cake to install internally. With the bike frame being used as the FET heatsink, hopefully heat will be kept under control. Should have all the mods completed tonight ready for installation tomorrow.

Kepler,

Would you mind providing any additional detail about the controller you put together for the BPM? What did you start with? Other than the fets, larger cap, bigger wires, what else did you do to handle the increase in voltage?

Thanks,

len

Everything you ever wanted to know about the controller is right here http://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=12616&hilit=6fet Once you read this you will understand why I was confident to go down this path. I think I am running things well within the controller's capabilities.

[Kepler]

Well done Kepler - it looks really agile. Like a Velociraptor compared to the Bomber's T-Rex!
Can Al also do stoppies on it now that the back wheel has less weight?
I guess John & Co were suitably impressed!

Does stoppies super easy. I will get Al to do some next time I am over at the factory. With the forward battery position, weight distribution is close to 50/50. I will also get Al to show us a few of his other tricks. One I like is when he rides up to a wall with the front wheel up in the air, parks and balances for a second at a 45 degree angle, then flips around and rides off.

Both John and Al I think were a little surprised just how much torque this setup had. I am sure it has him thinking. Essentially I am unofficially beta testing some new setup's for him which at the end of the day is good for everyone.

[Kurt]

Looks great,

Nice little zit.. zit... zit sound from the motor but nothing aggravating or over powering. In regard to controllers I am using a stock 45a 12 fet 9c controller I purchased of john a while back and have had no issues with 2800w peeks. i don't see you having any issues with a modified controller with 4110's .These motors aren't hard on controllers.

Kurt

[full-throttle]

Thanks for the video. Your bike is what I'd be having

I've seen Al doing wheelies on a car once

Nah, but here's a true story: someone just bought a Bomber, brings it back the next day to check if there's something wrong with it. Apparently it 'doesn't do wheelies'. So John calls "Hey Al, could you come over here for a moment and make sure this bike is alright"

Needless to say what happened next - Al pulls a massive wheelie, hands back the bike "Yeah, it's alright"

Essentially I am unofficially beta testing some new setup's for him which at the end of the day is good for everyone.

Does that make me the alpha tester??

[Hyena]

Nice work Kepler.
So when is the drag race between yours and a stock fighter ??

here's a true story: someone just bought a Bomber, brings it back the next day to check if there's something wrong with it. Apparently it 'doesn't do wheelies'. So John calls "Hey Al, could you come over here for a moment and make sure this bike is alright"

Needless to say what happened next - Al pulls a massive wheelie, hands back the bike "Yeah, it's alright"

Al should just buy a unicycle and be done with

Some people seem to think you need big power to do a wheelie but it's all about balance once the front wheel is up (either under power or by yanking it). Not to detract from Keplers bike or anyone elses but I'm sure Al could hold a wheelie with only a 200w bafang

[Kepler]

Some people seem to think you need big power to do a wheelie but it's all about balance once the front wheel is up (either under power or by yanking it). Not to detract from Keplers bike or anyone elses but I'm sure Al could hold a wheelie with only a 200w bafang

That's true, its all about balance but sometimes you need power to maintain the wheelie. The wheelie at 1.15 couldn't be done on 200W thats for sure.

[Rix]

Beutiful Fighter Kepler,

Don't know if its just the the video, but other geared hub motors Ive seen sound noisier than that. Is your BPM any noisier than a gearless hub motor? It sure doesn't sound like it is. Once again, super nice build. Spoke with Darrin last night, he says my bomber may be here next week. Can't wait!! Been a long 6 weeks. I thought for sure that I would get bumped back a little when Darrin and John suggested I switch my order to the bomber. Apparently not. Great Guys and a great company. So.... When you gonna do a comparo between your fighter and a stock fighter. I am curiouse if there will be any accelleration differences. Your fighter at 2KW and a stock fighter at 3KW would suggest that the stock fighter would be faster. However, factor in your fighter's much lighter rolling weight and the geared hub, I wouldn't be suprised if it could beat stock fighter. Thanks for showing your build details and posting the video. Rubberside down, or, at least one wheel. Rix

[Justtoby]

Rix, get some pics up as soon as it arrives. They are easy to put together so you will be buzzing around in no time....just take itmeasynon the first couple of rides to allow the battery to settle in.

[Rix]

Justtoby,
Will do on the pics and I will definately take it easy on the battery break in. I got to see about getting a go pro and learning how to edit videos. There is some pretty bike trails around lake tahoe I would like to post and share with everyone on this this forum. Its neat to see different vidoes from riders around the world. Anyway I will post some pics within the next couple of weeks.

Rix

[Kepler]

Beutiful Fighter Kepler,

Don't know if its just the the video, but other geared hub motors Ive seen sound noisier than that. Is your BPM any noisier than a gearless hub motor? It sure doesn't sound like it is. Once again, super nice build. Spoke with Darrin last night, he says my bomber may be here next week. Can't wait!! Been a long 6 weeks. I thought for sure that I would get bumped back a little when Darrin and John suggested I switch my order to the bomber. Apparently not. Great Guys and a great company. So.... When you gonna do a comparo between your fighter and a stock fighter. I am curiouse if there will be any accelleration differences. Your fighter at 2KW and a stock fighter at 3KW would suggest that the stock fighter would be faster. However, factor in your fighter's much lighter rolling weight and the geared hub, I wouldn't be suprised if it could beat stock fighter. Thanks for showing your build details and posting the video. Rubberside down, or, at least one wheel. Rix

Thanks Rix,

Noise wise the BPM is certainly no louder then a HS35 as used in a stock Fighter. The 54XX motors in the Bomber are definitely quieter though. In fact the 54XX motors are the quietest and smoothest hub motors I have come across so far.

[Kepler]

Had a very interesting commuter type ride with my friend on his Fighter and me on my Fighter this morning.Total distance was just over 12km. As a re-cap, his Fighter has the stock HS35 motor but is running 18S 75V LiPo. We have the current limit set on his bike to 55A so it has over 4000W available. Mine is set to 30A. He weighs about 80kg and is a bit lighter then me.

We road wheel to wheel or side by side for the full ride and both just peddled lightly. I nearly fell off my bike when I saw the difference in economy.

By the figures below, my bike managed a whopping 40% better efficiency. This was at a moderate average speed of 33kph

Sock HS35 DD Hubmotor on 18S 75V

IMG_1214.JPG (213.99 KiB) Viewed 372 times

BPM Code 10 geared Hubmotor on 18S 75V

IMG_1217.JPG (225.29 KiB) Viewed 372 times

We also had a bit of drag race from about 30kph until I ran out of legs. He was slightly quicker then me but not by much. I only lost one bike length to him over the distance. You can see from the numbers below, both bikes peaked a little higher then the set amp limit but this isn't unusual to see.

Current limit set to 55A. Peak Watts during comparison was 4200W

IMG_1215.JPG (233.61 KiB) Viewed 372 times

Current limit set to 30A. Peak Watts during comparison was 2450W

IMG_1218.JPG (231.01 KiB) Viewed 372 times

I could see one of the big advantages I had was that my bike seemed to glide for much longer when not under power. Although when coasting down a hill, both bikes seem to maintain the same speed. This surprised me as I thought my ability to fully free wheel would have seen me pull away under coast. However, this wasn't the case.

Finally, noise wise, although they had a different sound, the actual noise level between the two bikes were very similar.

[sn0wchyld]

Had a very interesting commuter type ride with my friend on his Fighter and me on my Fighter this morning.Total distance was just over 12km. As a re-cap, his Fighter has the stock HS35 motor but is running 18S 75V LiPo. We have the current limit set on his bike to 55A so it has over 4000W available. Mine is set to 30A. He weighs about 80kg and is a bit lighter then me.

We road wheel to wheel or side by side for the full ride and both just peddled lightly. I nearly fell off my bike when I saw the difference in economy.

By the figures below, my bike managed a whopping 40% better efficiency. This was at a moderate average speed of 33kph

IMG_1214.JPG

IMG_1217.JPG

We also had a bit of drag race from about 30kph until I ran out of legs. He was slightly quicker then me but not by much. I only lost one bike length to him over the distance. You can see from the numbers below, both bikes peaked a little higher the set amp limit but this not unusual to see.

IMG_1215.JPG

IMG_1218.JPG

I could see one of the big advantages I had was that my bike seemed to glide for much longer when not under power. Although when coasting down a hill, both bikes seem to maintain the same speed. This surprised me as I thought my ability to fully free wheel would have seen me pull away under coast. However, this wasn't the case.

Finally, noise wise, although they had a different sound, the actual noise level between the two bikes were very similar.

impressive, for sure.

I'd love to see a drag race from a standing start... and at what speed did the Hx fighter start pulling away?

[voicecoils]

Interesting comparison. With some of the high power & speed setups out there, I'd be interested to see someone with a set daily ride gradually limit current with the CA and see at what point their overall ride time changed significantly. I suspect many people could run at lower current limits than they might have thought. Of course a max current 'turbo' button is nice to have if you need it

Peak current available can make a big difference to efficiency unless you're real gentle rolling on the throttle.

Also at 33 kph, riding wheel to wheel, whoever's at the back will need vastly less power to maintain the speed of the lead rider.

Having a motor that can freewheel is especially nice if you run out of power But as long as power is available, only a few watts are needed to overcome direct drive hubmotor cogging.

Overall, I'd guess the difference in motor weight would have the smallest contribution to any efficiency differences as a few kg difference between 100+kg bike&rider combo isn't much.

[Kepler]

Some good points there voicecoils. I think perhaps a fairer comparison in relation to economy would be to set the HS equipped Fighter for the same current limit as my Fighter. In relation to drafting, its worth noting that what I meant by "wheel to wheel", was that we rode close to each other but there was certainly no drafting.

[Kepler]

I'd love to see a drag race from a standing start... and at what speed did the Hx fighter start pulling away?

The pull away was fairly linear from the time we nailed it to about 60kph where my Fighter ran out of legs. The Hx Fighter had another 10kph in it.

More comparison data to come.

[full-throttle]

in soviet russia a drag race is done with a rope

[Kepler]

The bike with the Cromotor looks like it has a front hub too

[shorza]

Not to mention the Hookworms and being a heavier bike.