Mac, Triangle A123, Giant Hardtail Commuter - 1st build

[stripedtuna]

Hi everyone,

I have nearly got my first build up and running. Progress has been slow but I am learning heaps and happy with it. The A123 battery and frame bag fit my frame like a glove, the Mac looks awesome, and with all the research ive done on this forum over the last few months, I reckon the end result should be perfect for my needs. Anyway, I took some photos of the progress so far, and am ready to spam this thread with them. Hopefully someone will learn something from it. There is nothing really unique about this build that hasn't been done before, but is hopefully an example of a fairly easy first build.

Cell_man has been awesome too. He has provided any advice that I needed and his kit is pretty much plug and play. I am glad I followed the advice of many others before me, and bought my whole kit from him. Lastly a big thanks to the guys who have given me advice and help thus far from this forum, especially gm6046 and philistine. I wont talk much more, but here are my pics..

Cheers,

Ed.

[stripedtuna]

Some more pics..

[stripedtuna]

and some more pics..

[Philistine]

Looking good Ed, turned out well. Did you make those torque plates up yourself? Nice work.

[stripedtuna]

Thanks mate..

With the torque arms, 'gm6046' helped me out big time.. he made up two square plates 50mm x 50mm and made the shaped axle hole in the middle. All i had to do was slightly file the middle hole for a perfect fit, cut the excess plate edges to fit my frame, and then drill the mounting holes.

One thing that would be awesome, is if all rear motor kits came with a basic torque arm plate base, which had that perfect axle hole made for a perfect fit. (pretty much what Stuart sorted me with.) That way people only need to cut the excess edges off the plate and dril mount holes.. The axle hole would have been the hard part IMHO..

I did however make that rusty bench vice from scratch when i was an apprentice years ago.. lol.

[Joseph C.]

Excellent job. You even have the wire coming from the motor in the right position to minimise water entry.

[gm6046]

G'day Ed,
You have got it coming together really well. I like the padding that you made for the battery pack. I'm looking forward to seeing it up and running!

-Stuart

[kfong]

Nice setup, sounds like you did a lot of reading before building this. Excellent choices for a commuter ebike.

[Spicerack]

Nice one Ed!

[stripedtuna]

Thanks everyone,

I will add some comments to the pics when i get the chance and also write up some lessons learnt throughout the process. Will also write up a complete parts list, in the hope that it might help others on their first build.

Anyway, I am hoping to get a little bit more done each night this week until its finished.

Left over tasks at this stage is:

mounting a Battery isolater switch
running all cables from the handle bars to the back
a bit of wiring (isolater and fuse holder)
plugging the rest of the cables together.
final disk brake adjustment
cycle analyst adjustment
run some sort of thin cable lock through the battery bag and frame so as to need at least a tool to steal the battery
padlock the bag
adjust the rear de railer bump stop
wire a dc - dc step down to power low voltage things like lights and my power switch led.
fit some sort of mudguard under the controller
and then throw the empty pannier bag over the top of the rack.

This has been by far the most interesting / satisfying thing i have built in a while. I used to do trade work years ago, but since working an office job, I dont get to build / fix things enough. Has been a lot of fun and certainly an addictive hobby - and i havent even ridden it yet.. lol..

anyway,

better get to it..

Cheers,

Ed.

[Philistine]

Don't forget when you put it all together, you need to set the Rshunt value of the controller in the CA. Cell man will be able to tell you the shunt resistence for the controller, then you go into advanced settings on the CA and enter it. You may have already done this but it is a common thing for people to miss on the first build.

Just wait until you have your first go on it and get the grin.

Cheers, Phil.

[stripedtuna]

Cheers for that Phil,

Cell_man's controller came with the shunt resistance value written on the case and also on the bubble wrap packaging. I'd better add that to my task list so i don't forget though.

I wired up the isolater and fuse holder tonight. Will try to get a lot more done tomorrow night. Hopefully this rain pisses off for the weekend..

I also took the kids to the Canberra show last weekend, and there was a display for a local e-bike business in Canberra. I took a closer look and noticed that evey bike was 200w but they looked neat with dedicated ebike frames. I think they ran a home based shop at O'Connor. Anyway, I asked the lady if they were on the Sphere, and she had never heard of this forum. She then told me that they had an extra powerful version for themselves with a 350W motor. Oh mann, that was humourous. Her opinion was that any more power would just break spokes and was unnecessary. Each to their own i suppose.

Anyway, will update again tomorrow..

Cheers.

[stripedtuna]

Got my first E-Grin today. Maiden run on my first build.

Very happy.. I was so keen to have a go, that i didnt setup and video camera.. will have to try that out this week sometime.. So anyway, I got the bike finshed (well near enough) during all this rain lately, and the sun came out this afternoon just in time for my first test run.

I still have to adjust the brake caliper position a little on the front, and still need to adjust the stop for the rear derailer..Also wouldnt mind making a black hard plastic cover (just for looks) over the top and sides of the rear rack / controller. I also want to take the lower side parts off the rear rack, now that i am not going to use the pannier bags.

I got so carried away when taping up all the excess cable and connections that I forgot to leave the controller programming plug exposed. So it is buried under all my tape with the rest of the cables. That said, I was very happy with the default programming from Cell_man, and wouldnt have changed a thing at this stage. I did set the current limit of 30A on the Cycle analyst though just for safety sakes in my inexperienced state.

Absolutely stoked about how nicely the triangle battery and frame bag fit my frame. WIth layer of padding that i added, it fits like a glove. No movement at all, and is fairly narrow too.

I will add comments to all the photos when i get a chance, but here are the pics of where i am at so far.

Cheers, Ed.

[Microbatman]

Nice find on that Hope rotor spacer. I may need one on next build and am glad you found this.
Thanks.

[Racer_X]

Nice build, Those Mac's are really nice and not too big to draw attention.
Have you tested yet how fast you can go?
I also have another question. What is the two buttons by the throttle?
Red button: 3 speed?
Green button: Horn?

[stripedtuna]

Nice find on that Hope rotor spacer. I may need one on next build and am glad you found this.
Thanks.

I found the 1mm and 2 mm rotor spacers at chain reaction cycles in the UK.. Certainly made my life easier to get the brakes working again. The only other spacer i needed was on the axle so that the rotor didnt rub against my frame. I got that spacer from ebikes.ca.

cheers,

Ed.

[stripedtuna]

Nice build, Those Mac's are really nice and not too big to draw attention.
Have you tested yet how fast you can go?
I also have another question. What is the two buttons by the throttle?
Red button: 3 speed?
Green button: Horn?

Thanks Racer_X,

The Mac was awesome. Even better than i thought it would be, in that it wasnt loud at all. Freewheeled perfectly too.

I hadnt set the correct wheel diameter in the cycle analyst at the time of testing so my speed readings would have been out. I also had the current limited to 30A. That said, the bike pulled, and pulled. On the flat, within seconds the wind in my face told me that i was going way faster than i have ever pedalled and i backed off in fear (due to not wearing a full faced helmet and because i also wanted to tweak the brake caliper adjustments too). It went up a short hill without any pedalling without a problem, but on a slight downhill, i chose to back off. It accelerates really quick IMHO. Very happy. I will try to get a video on my first commute to work within a week or so. That will tell us what kind of performance it gives.

Red switch is a 3 speed switch, and the green button was cruise control. The cruise function works really nicely, and i was glad i put the effort into fitting the two cutout brake levers. No horn.

I ordered a piece of black perspex last night, to make a cover to hide the controller and taped up wiring. It will also replace the rear mudguard, and side sections of the rear rack.

The precharge circuit on the A123 battery also was a nice touch. I am not sure what the LVC is set to on the battery management system yet, but will find out.

cheers,

Ed..

[veloman]

What turn is the Mac? 6, 8, 10?
What battery voltage?

Nice build

[stripedtuna]

Thanks Veloman,

Its an 8T motor with the upgraded phase wires (two wires per phase). 12 Fet controller, and cell_man's 52V triangle battery.

I got heaps of details still to fill in on this build thread, lots of lessons learnt, and also want to post a full parts list of the things I needed. I just quickly posted the pics first as i was so keen just to get the thread started. Will fill in the gaps throughout the week.

I have never bent perspex sheet before but am guessing the heat gun will soften it up.

Tonight I am hoping to do the final adjustment of the derailers and also the brake callipers. Even though I didn't disturb the front wheel / rotor, it now makes a ticking noise each revolution when i apply the brakes. I am guessing it is due to the extra weight. Hopefully its just aligning the calliper with the rotor better.

cheers,

Ed.

[rods77]

Hi Ed.

What size is it Giant frame?
I'm projecting something like you did, so I need to know the size frame and the size of battery bag.
I live in Brasil and we don´t have many options here. The most kit's that I found here it's chinese and the prices it's not so friendly.
Thank you and good luck.

Best regards.
Rod

[stripedtuna]

Hi Rod,

the bike / frame is a 19" Giant Rincon bought new in Oct 2006. So I guess it is a 2006 model. With the padding that i added to the battery bag, it is a snug squeeze into the frame triangle. There is no slack / wobble and i was pure luck it turned out that way..

I took the bike for my first commute yesterday. Kept the 30A limit setting (so i use maximum around 1500W) in the CA and i was really happy with the ride. I also accurately measured the wheel diameter and set that in the CA too. I still hadn't setup a video camera yet. Will try that this week.

Using the 3 speed switch on flat ground (might have had a very slight downward slope now that i think of it. ), i hit 30km/h in 1st speed, 40 in second and 53.7km/h in 3rd speed setting. I think I would feel more comfortable having better tyres and a full face helmet to travel at top speed to be honest. My comfortable speed is between 30 and 40. I only weigh just over 75kg, and the bike accelerates really well. I pedal on take off, before using the motor, and tend to like the feeling of some resistance on the pedals while cruising. That is, i set the throttle and gears to a speed where my bike gears can still add to it with pedalling. That way i am not just spinning the freewheel all the time. I am also not used to being on a bike without pedalling yet. Yet... lol..

I tested the cruise control and it also works well. I think with the half twist throttle though, i will probably hardly use cruise. All in all though, i have realised that all these years, I have been asking Santa for the wrong presents.. I wish i had an ebike years ago.. This is one of the best toys ive had by a long shot.

Anyway, I got some decal stickers coming soon for my perspex controller cover, and also some lights, a wide angle lense, and a mirrylcle mirror on its way.

I also just realised that the third cable coming out of my CA is a battery voltage power lead for powering accessories etc... Perfect.. I would recommend the CA to anyone wanting to build an ebike. It is an awesome unit. I just need to buy a plug to fit the CA power out, and then wire it to my step down transformer. Will take pics. ANyway, might take a look at trying to mount a camera on my helmet to show how it runs and the speedo figures..

Cheers,

Ed.

[veloman]

You upgraded the phase wires - two wires per phase - can you explain that? Where did you learn to do that upgrade?

I'm curious, Cellman suggested I upgrade my phase wires for better efficiency under heavy load. They do get warm when I'm not riding easy, on 1000w max.

The 8 turn on 1500watts must be nice. You say you still had more speed above 55kph? I thought an 8 turn on 52v would top out at about 52kph on 100% setting.

[stripedtuna]

Hi Veloman,

I just took it for another spin and rechecked that top speed, it was actually 53.7km/h. (the 55 i stated earlier was what i thought it got to yesterday, but the cycle analyst showed my max speed was 53.7.. oops. I love fishing, and still tend to exagerate the size of my catch i think) .. Just read my earlier post, and fixed it.. I backed off after maxing the speed out to nearly 55 (well 53.7). I didnt have enough road left to see if it winded out anymore, but after today's ride, i give it another go on a straight stretch and that was what my top speed was around.. So it wouldnt have got any higher i suppose unless i was pedalling and going down hill i reckon.. Will have to give it another go after a fresh charge. Also, an accurate description of where i just tested it would be that the road was slightly (and i mean only just slightly) downward sloped. Yesterdays commute would have been the same. There are some slight up and downs in my ride, but most people would call my commute flat. So that in mind, i think your 52km/h speed limit might be right on a proper level road.

The upgraded phase wires came fitted to the mac from cell_man. That is, i didnt do the upgrade myself, but when i bought the kit, Paul told me he had some in stock with the upgraded double phase wires. I think he was able to fit two wires per phase better than just trying 1 thicker wire per phase at a guess.

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So far so good in that nothing has even gotten warm, but my rides are fairly short (<5km) so far, and i am never at 1500W for long as this area is fairly flat.

I just tested my cheapo helmet camera, so will see if the recording worked and if i can figure out how to load the vid up.

cheers,

Ed.

Edit: just checked my video and it was 53.1km/h. I am the worst camera man ever. The Camera was mounted badly on my helmet pointing downwards, so you couldnt see the sight seeing. It was my first go at the camera, so it can only get better..

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[gm6046]

G'day Ed,
You've done a great job on getting it all together and running. I look forward to seeing a video or two of it!

-Stu

[stripedtuna]

Thanks Stu,,

I finally figured out how to upload a video.. Not hard now that i know how.. Now i just have to take better footage.. I think i have the camera mounted a bit better for my next go. I have packed the mount beter with non slip stuff, and strapped it down better...

cheers,

Ed.