Animalector's 1000W F/S MTB Build

[Ypedal]

single speed is all you need ( got 3 rings in front for emergencies .. lol )

Duct tape is " ok " but for ultimate strenght get a roll of Filament tape
https://www.google.ca/search?hl=en&q=fi ... 6gGT5bXOAQ

stuff is very strong, will not stretch...

[Animalector]

Yeah, I agree single speed would be good - less complication, but the down side is currently I can only add pedal up to about 45km/h with a high cadence. With the single speed that would be even less given the number of teeth on my single speed, so I would have to get a massive crank ring gear or a 11tooth single speed which from reading here are hard to come by.

Or I could go nuts spend heaps and get a HighSpeedDrive 2.65:1 for the high speed work.. but then I might run out of options if I did have to pedal.

Batty box is being constructed. so the duct tape will be retired soon..

[Animalector]

well Cycle Analyst arrived.. and the battery box should be in the mail. So all systems go. It is good to have the CA to tell me how juch juice I've used up so I don't have to worry about whether I will run flat or not.

I've probably done 400 - 450km on the bike so far. and I have to say I am loving it. BUT.... I think I need more speed.. not much more just enough to scoot with the traffic in the 60 zones. 50 is still 'just' too slow to feel as though I am not holding anyone up.. If the Delta - WYE wiring from the other post works well I might consider hooking in a relay and doing the same. I've ordered a 48 tooth to replace my 44 tooth drive sprocket and hopefully that will help with the ability to be of use above 45km/h

Anyways I am getting around 18Wh / km for the commute.. I hope to improve on this with the better gear ratios.

More pics to follow when I get the battery box installed.

Question: If I get a big fat 2.3" road based tyre like the Schwable big apple or Crazy Bob http://www.chainreactioncycles.com/Models.aspx?ModelID=24556 I wonder how that would handle off road.. so I don't have to keep changin tyres if I want a little dirt squirt on the way home from work... or maybe these... http://www.chainreactioncycles.com/Models.aspx?ModelID=78368

Current TODO list:
Receive and fit battery box
New wiring (50A Andersons)
Take Wheel off - Kevlar Liner and new brake rotor
New Tyre (Big fat one to resist punctures) Or knobby..
more speed...

[Animalector]

Ended up buying these http://www.chainreactioncycles.com/Models.aspx?ModelID=12385


2.35" wouldn't fit in the bike (I tested with a knobby I had lying around.) ANyways these are 2.2 and loook like a good combination of road and trail.. just what I was after.

I just added some spacer washers under my rear brake caliper so now it doesn't rub anywhere near as much as it did.. that should be good for a few extra km range. Unfortunately I just Learned that the hole spacing for the disc brake on the Conhismotor kits are different from my spare original disc by a few mm.. I might have to modify the spacer ring I ordered, or leave the washers in there (undesirable)

Latest mod also is to add some weatherproof connectors near the motor so I can easily remove the rear wheel without having to remove the entire length of cable up to the controller.

Updates to follow when I get my batttery box.

Andy

[Animalector]

well the tyres I got for my B-day are quite good. very quiet on the road, and nice and sticky. the treads look pretty deep so should be ok for light trail use.

Just a couple of Video updates


and some late night fun



Guy doing the battery box was too busy to complete the job and has refunded my money.. so I have to start that job again and find someone who can do it.. I am thinking about sending out to a Laser / water jet company and getting some ABS panels cut to assemble my own box. Let me think about that for a day or so.

Andy

[Animalector]

So what are people's thoughts on the following:

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Assembly would be an epoxy / adhesive of some sort. SOmething like a Scotchweld, Araldite, Polyeurothane maybe? suggestions?

Ta
Andy

[Animalector]

Hey all.. a quick update.

Received the battery box back from the routers made out of grey PVC. Had to work each of the internal corners with a dremel to make them square. in the end it was a tight fit, but all pieces pressed together nicely.

Now, the good and bad and kinda good news

Good:
The LiFePO4 battery fits inside the box no problems in it's raw state (unglued)

The Bad:
On assembly I started glueing and couldn't stop (since the glue was going off very quickly. so missed the step of installing the battery inside the box prior to final assembly. Now I cannot get the battery through the opening.

The Kinda Good:
I can still fit the box in the frame, so it will be good for LiPo's when I decide to go that way. (which will be soon)

In the meantime, I have changed jobs and moved from brisbane to Melbourne. Looking to start riding to work again as soon as I get used to the weather

Later
Andy

[sethgl]

Hi
Nice build, I think it should look good. I have a stealth fighter and your battery box is similar. I am about to electrify a Giant Reign. Not sure what size motor I was thinking about a 2000w. May I ask where you purchased all your parts, and did you find fitting all the components all fitted reasonably easy. Kind regards.

[Animalector]

It is a conhis motor kit. I am very pleased with it actually, for a 1kw kit, I see 1400 peaks and 1300w stable up a hill. In retrospect I would customise the kit and not worry about Pedalec, or the oversize twist throttle. But battery capacity is as rated, and price is very competitive.

I replaced all my drive line at the same time, and got alivio shifters to match the 6spd cluster so had no problems with shifter or alignment.

Again in retrospect, I would get a slim thumb throttle and a grip shifter for better handlebar layout.

Hope your new conversion goes well, I would love a stealth fighter but currently out of my budget.. Unless I sold all my other bikes.... Hmmm....

Andy

[Animalector]

Pics of the battery box to come, but here's my latest 'tidy up'.. it's still duct tape under there but at least nobody will know, I don't know what else to use to get the rigidity and stability of the main battery... maybe some material straps (like movers / removalists strapping)

The material is a semi-elastic from Spotlight which stretches in one direction more than another. I saw a lycra and a spandex material there which stretches equally in all directions, however the stuff I got was a bit cheaper at around $15.99 / linear meter. I managed two covers out of that much material. (first failed). Then the velcro is attached using a 'no sew' adhesive which you place between the material and the sew-on velcro strip and then heat with an steam iron. pretty easy in the end.

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Lastly, here's my storage solution (my DH bike is still in the box from the move to Melbourne). Since I wasn't allowed to make holes in the walls, the timber is bracketed to the shelving and is all quite sturdy (I will put one dyna-bolt in the top corner however just for safety's sake, when I get permission of course. So that is all my tools and bikes in one corner of a small single garage.

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Andy

[Animalector]

Update Time...

I just upgraded to a 203mm Front rotor. Braking performance is much better than before, although I am concerned about my front forks, they are 'getting on', and tend to flex under load. I am looking into dual crown 180mm options from DNM the USD180 http://www.dnmshock.com/bike-front-forks/usd-180.html. THey look like a solid fork, and for the money would probably be adequate. Otherwise it's almost a double jump in price to maybe >$800 for anything else. not really looking second hand I don't really want other peoples problems. Anyone in Melbourne want to group buy on the Forks with me to save a few dollars??? (can get adj. seat posts and rear shocks from them too)

Question time...
I'm considering upgrading a few items, (forks, motor, controller, batteries, bike, etc.) but will probably just end up finally fitting my battery box. For this, I am considering purchasing the HK 5000mAh LiPo Cells at 14S so I can use my existing 48V LiFePO charger. http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/store/__18560__Turnigy_5000mAh_1S_20C_Lipoly_Single_Cell_.html eventually I will go for a Mini Monster Controller for more amps (> 30A), and probably switch to a BPM motor, as my one currently has great speed (45km/h avg - 50km/h tucked in) but pretty poor torque..

THese show 5800mAh cells, but the 5000mAh cells are a tad narrower and shorter (Same thickness)

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The questions is... is it worth purchasing a LiPo BMS for this or should I just pre-balance the pack, bulk charge, and re-balance the packs from time to time with one of Hyena's Super-Duper balance chargers?
Here's a link to the BMS from batteryspace http://www.batteryspace.com/pcmwithequilibriumfunctionfor518vli-ionbatterypackat40alimit.aspx

I have the enclosure all made up already and it's just sitting there not being used. I should take a photo...

Anyway, enough rambling. Any advice, opinions etc welcomed.

Andy

[kentlim26]

your troque arm ideal is wonderful !, thanks you for sharing. my is also a conhismotor 48v 1000watts. i have been running this since 2years back. Now im upgarding the controller again, twice. 1st one is standard, but i get very fast lose interests the speed and troque especially. so i upgrade to 60v controller, Now , i order a 18fets, 4110controller, green time controller which is coming soon. I will be trying for 80v ~ 90v for a very short distance, maybe 5mins BURST? i have open up the motor and also changed the phase wires. Much thicker wire 12awg, but take a lot of pain sloting in through. i have also spray the hub motor the inside , just to prevent rust. it is hi- heat paint on them. this hub motor is okay to run abit higher volts to 61, 63v.. unsure if is okay for 80- 90 volts or not ? to find out, i will go for test

ken

[Animalector]

Yeah the Torque arm was just the brake caliper bracket they sent rotated and drilled to work as a torque arm. I think it works well.

What sort of current were you running at +60V? I wouldn't mind seeing how the motor performs at 48V but with 40 - 50amps. I think it would offer more torque where it is currently lacking.. with the top speed quite similar.

Pics of the battery box. I have hand routed some sections for extra clearance where the cables / suspension come close to the box,

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Andy

[full-throttle]

That's a nice looking box! Did you cut the plastic by hand?

The questions is... is it worth purchasing a LiPo BMS for this or should I just pre-balance the pack, bulk charge, and re-balance the packs from time to time with one of Hyena's Super-Duper balance chargers?

I'd advise against any BMS with discharge-through circuitry. Lipo stays well balanced if looked after. Bulk-charge to 4.15 and don't discharge below 3.6~3.7, etc.. A couple of Cell-logs with alarm output can be a very effective alternative to BMS.

I know it's not what you are designing for, but still worth considering jonescg packs. He's got a couple of boards left viewtopic.php?f=31&t=38252&start=105#p641646 they are for 3p of the 5Ah 40C cells

BTW I've got 35 of the 20C cells here in case you need a dimension check

PS off topic: Pete came 6th in his class after being held up by a slow rider and missing out of the podium spot by a few seconds

[kentlim26]

it needs Both side for troque arms. it took me many hours to figure out, it can drop off or damage the drop off. if you have only 1 side troque arm, you can be surprised the other side without troque arm, the big nut will drop off itself . the inner i build another hub motor holder. My ebike alloy drop out i can see is weak so i add another steel plate at Both side ( center is the alloy drop out). using 2 type of steel epoxy and test it out. i couldn't find the 3M ones.

kent

[kentlim26]

my test for huatong 48v controller 42amps ,2100watts ~ 2200watts peak give max speed is similar speed like 50km/h+ 42amps my range become much more shorter by less 10km ?
i bought another huatong controller 60v 1800watts On lifepo4 + 2more lipos 20amps cells i got a Better speed up max 58km/h or on flat i can get 55km/h. On my next project im doing is 48v lifepo4 + 8 lipos cellls of 10amps. But now im waiting my controller to fly over, top speed i don't know Until i go for a test. My coming is green time controller 60amps 18fets 4110. On 80v+ , 90v ~ 100volts How fast ? anyone knows . I will be testing this project by next week. controller has been just send out, so probably i will received them by 1 week. Well, the FUN is coming,, . my torque arms has been upgrade again too, more robust. Build it to the maximum of my ability. I'm joining 85v ~ 100volts club !!.

2 years back+, I first upgrade this controller to 48v 18fets 2000watts, i test/run on my hub motor few weeks only.it is too slow for me, so i upgrading the 60v 1800watts controller seem interesting , is much faster and better troque. this controller can take volts up to 70v. i saw the caps in huatong 60v is 75caps. so must stay always below., the controller work well because my max volts i run is 65v and below. i run this 60v 1800watts for more then a year+ or more. Now upgrade again. I think my final ideal choice of speed is 55km/h ~ 60km/h.

ken

[Animalector]

The main pieces were routed out, but due to the nature of routers I had to "finish" all of the internal corners to square with a dremel. It didn't take too long in the end and didn't cost me much to have it cut.. Which is lucky because I paid a forum member to build me a metal box which he never delivered on. Bummer.

I saw the jonescg packs, I think 3p is a bit much, but like the idea and could do my own pcbs if anyone is keen for some 2p6s or 7s maybe

These 35 cells you have, are they surplus to requirements? Our have you got them planned for some pack you are making?

Oh yeah, congrats to Pete.
Andy

[full-throttle]

Those cells were part of the group buy intended for Kona Bass, same to voicecoil's viewtopic.php?f=9&t=40043
But the frame cracked before the cells arrived
Now they are just sitting waiting for the next pack to be built.

Let me know if you are making the PCBs - I still got all the files handy, so can modify for a 2p in no time.

Speaking of BMS - check out what landed on my desk at lunchtime viewtopic.php?f=3&t=37377

[Animalector]

Looks awesome, let me know how you go learning how to drive it

$ per Watt-hour, the Zippy's from HK are basically the same price as the bare LiPo cells, but the zippy's come with balance leads and main leads. Too many options... When I know what I want I'll let you know.

My tax return didn't quite suffice, so I need to save up for future upgrades.. (could always sell my carbon racer... any takers?)

Andy

[Animalector]

Well, the bike is operational after a bit of an upgrade. I decided to put my battery box into action. Unfortunately, it required a lot of additional cutting to get the big LiFePo in there, but it's all in, the controller is in there too.. I will have to do a few rides to see how hot it gets. I am only running about 35 amps through it max so hopefully it will be ok in there. Most of the time I have to limit to 15Amps so I can make it to work and back on a single charge.

Upgrades:
New phase wires with 4mm gold bullets
New Battery / power cables with andersons.
Pre-charge Button/ resistor
3 speed switch
Regenerative braking
still unable to program the controller but it's working

At the very least it looks better than before.

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I decided to duct tape it up so I can take it for a test run, just to test the new controller. ultimately I will use long cable clamps into the box and back out around the bike frame.

Taking it for a test ride

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Andy

[Animalector]

Well back to square 1.

I was happy with the look and finish of the box, however, when riding the battery would jump around inside the box. A few particularyl large bumps caused some of the plastic joins to separate. nothing major but with such a heavy LiFePo in there I think it really should be a metal box.. so.... I went out and got a new heavy bracket, and will revert to the old setup but with some additions...

Battery and BMS have now been splash proofed
All cables / connectors between Controller and accessories will go into water proof housing.
Controller will be external but with cables pointing downwards it should also be splash proof
Try to avoid duct tape - I have some straps and cable clamps - but I think in the end there will be duct tape.

The new configuration is great, I get better economy, more power and the added advantage of regen with the new Infineon 12 FET. I still cannot program it however.. see http://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=27927&start=315#p655630

THe objective is to be able to commute reliably without the risk of serious damage if / when it rains in Melbourne.

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Andy

[Animalector]

I am going to try a new battery layout.
in the past i have positioned it parallel or perpendicular to the down tube... I think I might stand it perpendicular to the top tube (pic 2)
(note pics not to scale)

The advantage is I use more of the space close to the shock, and free up more space in the triangle at the front of the bike for controller and waterproof cable management

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have to devise some sort of bracket pics to follow. I need this running before the group ride in a couple of weeks,.


Andy

[Animalector]

regarding the pics above, I ended up building a wooden bracket, partially using the shock mount for stability and standing the battery upright (perpendicular to the top tube). This has been working great, I had all controller connectors in an enclosed mini lunch-box style case. to secure it all I had a few large pipe-clamps joined together and encompassing the frame and battery then tightened down, nothing moved it was pretty good..

So... Before I go on....

I got a flat the other day. Even with kevlar tire liner and puncture resistant tires this monster piece of glass just shredded through it all. Since i was just ducking down to the local squash courts, I didn't carry a patch kit. (oops). I did manage to score a lift home and then dive back with the ute to collect the bike. so not too bad in the end.

So anyway, yesterday I decided to patch the tire. Which got me thinking... "hmm, while I am working on it I might take another look at my battery box!!!"

Long story short. I have gone back to my battery box, however it is now reinforced with the above-mentioned pipe clamps series joined and wrapped around the perimeter of the box for structural integrity. The box is now pipe-clamped to the frame on each of it's 3 major sides and all tightened down.. it doesn't move.

Pics to follow.

Andy