mon-goose to MON-STER

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pendragon8000
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mon-goose to MON-STER

Post by pendragon8000 » Sat Feb 02, 2013 7:03 am

mongoose01.JPG
mongoose01.JPG (59.16 KiB) Viewed 15525 times
Motor:
HT3525
Image

Controller:
Lyen 18 x 4115fet (45amp stock, moded to 60amp)
Image

Battery:
Hobby King lipo , 8 x 6s 5ah 20c in 24s 2p 10ah configuration
Image

Tyres:
rear: hookworm 26" x 2.5"
Image
front: crazy bob 26" x 2.35"
Image

Forks:
120mm travel rock shox
Image

Rear shock:
Manitou Radium R Shock 2010
Image

Im making a custom light for front and back with leds from hydroponic grow light suplyer from ebay. for the front i will have 2 rows of 5 in series switchable indipended for low/hi beam (narow/wide) using 10º, 22º, 45º reflectors.
powered by mains smitchmode plug packs.

Battery compartment will be made from 120mm x 120mm x2mm channel section welded open side down into the down tube. the frame is steel and weldable with arc. ill remove a significant portion to fit this box in and will be a moderately laborious task, however it should increase the frame strength if do it correctly. some triangle pieces will be added at the ends to hold the shape of the box under stress (so it doesnt stretch out) . bottom side will be hinged at front and a number of latches and or bolts will hold it closed.

front steer tube is bigger than standard and frame needs to be modded there to. long story short; i got the wrong forks for the frame, but they are awsome and were cheap- so the frame gets modded. need tube and bearings, both have been sorted, bearings are on there way but $70 later :/ ... should see a top speed of 65kph but the torque off the line will be 175nm and peak power output at 40kph is 2.5kw (aprox) making it about the same as a 160cc pit bike in peak power output.(they are like mini dirt bikes)

ill be getting a ca v3 to help controll the power and smooth out the throttle.

probly use black epoxy paint. not a great finish but very hardy, and might cover up my shity welding.

still have to upgrade front wheel and get 203mm disk brake for it. and head stem and bar.

should be an interesting "experiment"

please give advice or ask questions....
Last edited by pendragon8000 on Fri Mar 28, 2014 9:27 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: mon-goose to MON-STER 6KW

Post by Trackman417 » Sat Feb 02, 2013 11:01 pm

You sure your bike will be able to handle the power you will put into it? I am not trying to dis you but maybe something with disc brakes?
Other then that, no suggestions here! Looks like you know exactly what you need. Good luck and have fun!
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Re: mon-goose to MON-STER 6KW

Post by pendragon8000 » Sat Feb 02, 2013 11:33 pm

Trackman417 wrote:You sure your bike will be able to handle the power you will put into it? I am not trying to dis you but maybe something with disc brakes?
Other then that, no suggestions here! Looks like you know exactly what you need. Good luck and have fun!
Yes that's a very important factor and if you read above : "still have to upgrade front wheel and get 203mm disk brake for it. and head stem and bar."

rear will have the longest v brake pads i can get (72mm) and regen braking so yeah i would prefer discs all round but it should be okay.
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Re: mon-goose to MON-STER 6KW

Post by neptronix » Sat Feb 02, 2013 11:49 pm

Not bad.
What are your plans for a torque arm/plate in the rear dropouts?
My first major build: 8T MAC motor on a Trek 4500.
The new all-arounder: Leafmotor 1500w on a Turner O2 full suspension.
The wheelie machine: 20" Rear Magic Pie II on a Trek 4300 MTB

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Re: mon-goose to MON-STER 6KW

Post by pendragon8000 » Sat Feb 02, 2013 11:56 pm

neptronix wrote:Not bad.
What are your plans for a torque arm/plate in the rear dropouts?
Good question. I'll do the same as my 29er build. Its a 10mm thick flat bar cut to take axle and fit under chain stay. Then 2 5mm bolts on the open side clamping it closed on the axle flats. Then hold to frame with a length of that builders plate stuff that has holes in it and a fat bolt clamping it tight. I could weld it on but there isn't really a need to. And also there is a small threaded hole I can use on the dropouts.
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Re: mon-goose to MON-STER 6KW

Post by pendragon8000 » Mon Feb 04, 2013 6:26 am

yes its a car seat on a pc seat base.. neat bag from crystalyte with motor and wheel inside..
th3525_on_pc_car_seat.JPG
th3525_on_pc_car_seat.JPG (35.63 KiB) Viewed 15228 times
fat rim.. anyone know if these are ok? its 38mm wide and looks quite thick, might be cheap alloy though
38mm wide rim.JPG
38mm wide rim.JPG (44.91 KiB) Viewed 15228 times
had to sand down the steer tube to get rhese mo-fo's on there
BEARING BOSS.JPG
BEARING BOSS.JPG (31.65 KiB) Viewed 15228 times
fat bearings.JPG
fat bearings.JPG (21.27 KiB) Viewed 15228 times
now need the fat housing piece for them, its ready for me to pick up just have to ride over there after work :)
8)HYENA high power ebike kits
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scott 29er + Hyena kit, mon-goose to MON-STER 6KW, Free Agent RC Mid Drive, videos

my bike goes so fast 'cos it charges the battery while I pedal

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Re: mon-goose to MON-STER 6KW

Post by Trackman417 » Mon Feb 04, 2013 9:31 pm

pendragon8000 wrote:yes its a car seat on a pc seat base.. neat bag from crystalyte with motor and wheel inside..
th3525_on_pc_car_seat.JPG
fat rim.. anyone know if these are ok? its 38mm wide and looks quite thick, might be cheap alloy though
38mm wide rim.JPG
had to sand down the steer tube to get rhese mo-fo's on there
BEARING BOSS.JPG
fat bearings.JPG
now need the fat housing piece for them, its ready for me to pick up just have to ride over there after work :)
Nice Chair :D 8)
Very creative mate. Love to see what you would do with this bike now lol.
The motor came laced from crystalyte? Then yeah that is your problem, but they are sturdy rims man. Heavy, but sturdy. The spokes they use aren't a joke ether, have you tried to cut those things with wire cutters?! My hand was getting numb from all of the squeezing :shock: .
Very lousy question, but do Lyen controllers have power buttons on the front? :lol:
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Re: mon-goose to MON-STER 6KW

Post by pendragon8000 » Tue Feb 05, 2013 5:44 am

Cheers mate :)
I make things that I haven't seen b4.
Lyen... good Q' actually don't know. Well I was looking at the online instruction manual the he asked not to disclose and respectfully won't... but I recall there being a power on wire. Just a red wire. Haven't got the unit yet but shouldn't be far away...

QUESTION.....
I have those bearings on the steer tube but strangely it flanges/tapers out from 1.5" (38.1mm) to 39.5mm toward the fork and so there is a gap of 40mm from bottom bearing to fork top horizontal bit. I can use a spacer to go from fork to bearing and take pressure off bearing into tapered bit so it doesn't cut into steer tube over time. I got a slab off black nylon and can cut some spacers with my hole cutter, or get a length of steel tube that fits over it, or use .15" steer tube specets. I like the nylon idea 'cos it can touch both teer tube and sorrounding frame tube and act ad a low friction pivot piece and may reduce the severity of of a critical failure in a crash or bigger than I expected drop/gap.... the frame piece is 4.5mm thick wall so that's not an issue, the weakest point is the steer tube at where the bearing is.
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my bike goes so fast 'cos it charges the battery while I pedal

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Re: mon-goose to MON-STER 6KW

Post by pendragon8000 » Wed Feb 06, 2013 6:27 am

IMG_20130206_211930.jpg
IMG_20130206_211930.jpg (50.72 KiB) Viewed 15064 times
IMG_20130206_212002.jpg
IMG_20130206_212002.jpg (37 KiB) Viewed 15064 times
progress....
got the piece to hold the bearings. had to hunt arounf the metal store to find the right size but the old bloke in there was a champ and found it and so after i dremeled out the seam , the bearings slid in with no play :)
win
then made a spacer with my hole cutter bits and a block of nylon, not thick enough so ill make anothery and cut it in half so the bearing sits as close as it can the the fork (crown?) and this will help redgidity strength and also stop critical failure of structural integrity of steer tube...
anyway im happy so far except i think i breathed in nylon dust when angle grinding the spacer and coughed up blood :( :shock: hope im ok..
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Re: mon-goose to MON-STER 6KW

Post by pendragon8000 » Wed Feb 06, 2013 9:33 pm

Excessive coughing was likely due to highest pollen count in 50 years.
Just ordered battery box custom made 2 mm thick 350 x120x120 with lid for inside bottom. From green steel in hind marsh $40
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Re: mon-goose to MON-STER 6KW

Post by pendragon8000 » Thu Feb 07, 2013 3:31 am

Got a post office note. Should be lyen controller and extra goodies :) just in time for the weekend.
Unfortunately i I'll have to wait a couple weeks b4 I buy batteries 'cos I have to pay a few bills and such but I have many pieces to put together till I need them anyway. This was supposed to be an Easter project but I'm actually ahead of schedule 8)
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Re: mon-goose to MON-STER 6KW

Post by dan974 » Fri Feb 08, 2013 5:47 am

pendragon8000 wrote:
neptronix wrote:Not bad.
What are your plans for a torque arm/plate in the rear dropouts?
Good question. I'll do the same as my 29er build. Its a 10mm thick flat bar cut to take axle and fit under chain stay. Then 2 5mm bolts on the open side clamping it closed on the axle flats. Then hold to frame with a length of that builders plate stuff that has holes in it and a fat bolt clamping it tight. I could weld it on but there isn't really a need to. And also there is a small threaded hole I can use on the dropouts.
wait to see that with interest, if I were you I would put disc brake @rear too if you put torque arms...trust me having a 203@front and Vbrake @rear is weaked there's too much difference of power braking having to put 1 finger on front and 2 on the rear ask a good skill in critical or technical situations ...@least put a 160 or 180 @rear for different feeling you can't put the same torque by braking on rear as the motor because of mass transfert to the front so you loose adherence...cause there's less vertical load on the rear wheel :wink: mechanical stuffs...sigma Loads = Mass x Ac(Dec)celeration...

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Re: mon-goose to MON-STER 6KW

Post by pendragon8000 » Fri Feb 08, 2013 7:26 pm

Thanks, I'm glad someone else said it. I though I might get to many ppl saying you can't weld disc brake mounts on 'cos they have to be perfect and the stress might brake your welds.
So I'll keep it in mind and test it.
Also got Lyen's package delivered today.
I'll post a couple pics...
8)HYENA high power ebike kits
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scott 29er + Hyena kit, mon-goose to MON-STER 6KW, Free Agent RC Mid Drive, videos

my bike goes so fast 'cos it charges the battery while I pedal

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Re: mon-goose to MON-STER 6KW

Post by pendragon8000 » Fri Feb 08, 2013 8:31 pm

delivery on a saturday.JPG
delivery on a saturday.JPG (28.22 KiB) Viewed 14841 times
lyen package.JPG
lyen package.JPG (47.27 KiB) Viewed 14841 times
only concern is the phase wires have large spade lugs as conectors, i doubt they will be able to handle high power for any significant length of time.. mayby solder them as well, or biger bannana plugs or just solder with no plug..
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my bike goes so fast 'cos it charges the battery while I pedal

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Re: mon-goose to MON-STER 6KW

Post by Trackman417 » Fri Feb 08, 2013 9:48 pm

Out of all of the controllers there are the 18fet infineons, I think, are the coolest looking 8) .
I wouldn't worry about them not being able to handle power for a long amount of time. Your motor won't be pulling a ton of amps for any worrying length of time to worry about. Maybe in the H3540 not the 3525. But you are packing some serious voltage :? . Disregard that last comment :mrgreen: . What is your plan with the connectors anyway? You plan to keep them or replace them? I guess it is time for you to tell me if lyen controllers have a power switch up top :mrgreen:
Lets see some mounting action! :mrgreen:
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Re: mon-goose to MON-STER 6KW

Post by pendragon8000 » Fri Feb 08, 2013 10:30 pm

Trackman417 wrote:Out of all of the controllers there are the 18fet infineons, I think, are the coolest looking 8) .
I wouldn't worry about them not being able to handle power for a long amount of time. Your motor won't be pulling a ton of amps for any worrying length of time to worry about. Maybe in the H3540 not the 3525. But you are packing some serious voltage :? . Disregard that last comment :mrgreen: . What is your plan with the connectors anyway? You plan to keep them or replace them? I guess it is time for you to tell me if lyen controllers have a power switch up top :mrgreen:
Lets see some mounting action! :mrgreen:
Lol nah no switch. Just a wire. They are a tidy package. Well the motor has a mini din for halls but the controller comes with male+female big square plug on halls. I'll look at getting a mini din for controller, much neater. And phase I will use the plugs that came with the controller and solder them together. As for not sucking power, we will see... doing burn outs in dirt seems to take a fair bit of current :) also I want my old mate trav to try this one in the adelaide hills, he weighs about 100kg Scottish/leboneese/Egyptian staunch mofo. Hopefully if it handles his punishment he will eventually get his own bike to :)
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my bike goes so fast 'cos it charges the battery while I pedal

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Re: mon-goose to MON-STER 6KW

Post by Ozjet » Sat Feb 09, 2013 8:48 am

That looks like it will be fun .
Got some interesting work ahead of you too.
I'm thinking I might do a powerful dh bike before long. I will be on the lookout for something suitable.
I seem to have forgotten about the planes.
Really enjoying this ebiking, now riding too ,love it.
I'm keen to get something secondhand that I'm not to scared to hack into
No smoking please.

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Re: mon-goose to MON-STER 6KW

Post by pendragon8000 » Sat Feb 09, 2013 5:53 pm

yeah that was prety much how this one happened, wanted more power but just enough speed to go on main roads and keep up with cars. I had this bike as my every day comuter from 10 years ago.. I road it every where for a couple years back then. i checked the fram with a magnet and seemed to be steel, then fliped her over and welded a bolt to the bottom of the frame behind the bottom bracket and it was confirmed _steel_ :) and so it began.. the only major issue is what dan974 said about disk brakes all round...
I should get my shit together and do some more work on it today... girlfriend's gone out for the day to so definately should get stuck into it.
I wont touch the motor yet, I am going to investigate getting the side covers cnc milled for air cooling. I want to do a large number of small slots giving more strength (i think) and more venturi effect. something like 4 slots between every screw(8 screws) 32 slots. and a few holes near the axle. ill t9 spray the guts while the cnc guys do their thing..
I guess i have to do the steer tube. only thing is i use this bike sometimes to go get beer or go to post office so it will be a bit anoying if its hacked up and not ridable, but i guess ive only been riding it cos i have been looking at it to motorize it.. mayby ill comit and cut the steer tube off today. still have to make torque arms so i can do that first.
I dont have compatible head stem and bars for the larger steer tube so thats a bit anoying if i do the steer tube now.

gota get one of these: Image for halls on controller.
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Re: mon-goose to MON-STER 6KW

Post by pendragon8000 » Sat Feb 09, 2013 11:30 pm

torque arm on drop out- mesuring.JPG
torque arm on drop out- mesuring.JPG (60.66 KiB) Viewed 14453 times
torque arm in vice.JPG
torque arm in vice.JPG (46.4 KiB) Viewed 14453 times
getting there..
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scott 29er + Hyena kit, mon-goose to MON-STER 6KW, Free Agent RC Mid Drive, videos

my bike goes so fast 'cos it charges the battery while I pedal

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Re: mon-goose to MON-STER 6KW

Post by pendragon8000 » Sun Feb 10, 2013 1:51 am

1 done:
brake side torque arm complete.JPG
brake side torque arm complete.JPG (43.11 KiB) Viewed 14449 times
this is a clamping troque arm with a bolt holding it to the drop out. about 12mm thick.
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Re: mon-goose to MON-STER 6KW

Post by dan974 » Sun Feb 10, 2013 2:23 am

I would recommand you that king of geometry too :
Image
seen onhttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7Y7hg3i-O2k
(which code url/adress do you use ti embeded the youtube vid ?)

for the dimensions to put a discbrake and use a post mount for a 203/180or 160 you need to respect those dimensions : I git them from the DH team :
Image

78.2/51/39.8 mm : the key, next you have to check were the load of the torque would go as a force to your frame so it goes in the frame the way it resist the more but again not that much torque on the rear brake...

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Re: mon-goose to MON-STER 6KW

Post by pendragon8000 » Sun Feb 10, 2013 2:58 am

thanks allot.. nice diagram.. to be honest ill more likely get an adapter for 203mm disk and weld bolts in place while they are in the adapter and then weld the bolts(on a right angle bracket) to the frame after the caliper is lined up with the disc.. but those mesure ments will be a good help.
to do you tube, hit the button
yt.JPG
yt.JPG (5.7 KiB) Viewed 14417 times
then in between the brakets put all the charictors after the = and make sure no spaces ;)
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Re: mon-goose to MON-STER 6KW

Post by NeilP » Sun Feb 10, 2013 9:21 am

Lyen sells the mini XLR din style plugs that match the Xlyte motor. I always a few more when ever I order from him. I use them as standard all the time now.

As for the big spade terminals, I use them all the time too. Again Lyen sells them and whenever I get an order from him, I always get a few more of the same. If you look at them internally on the female side that have a flat tongue, so you have a full width connection on both sides of the male part. I have never had problems with them, running 100volts with a 18 FET 4110 at 80 or 90 battery amps and 270 phase. I use them on the phase wires too. Beats the big andersons hands down. They don't have plastic shroud to melt like andersons, and they are far more compact. The crimp end seems to come in two sizes, and it does seem to be pot luck what size you get. The bigger size will probably handle 8 or 6 gauge wire.
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Re: mon-goose to MON-STER 6KW

Post by dan974 » Sun Feb 10, 2013 11:04 am

yes a good issue to solder mini Din on balance wire, XT150 connector are High amp rated too (for 8AWG too)

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Re: mon-goose to MON-STER 6KW

Post by pendragon8000 » Sun Feb 10, 2013 1:59 pm

Thanks guys, so what's the verdict with halls? Xlr? I thought lyen would set up the unit with plugs for the ht3525. Not too fussed though. He was good to deal with, fast delivery and YouTube test video is a nice touch.
So NeilP, you got ideas about amp limit and phase limit?
Anyone got tips for running this beast? I'll trial and error that in a few weeks anyway.
8)HYENA high power ebike kits
My builds
scott 29er + Hyena kit, mon-goose to MON-STER 6KW, Free Agent RC Mid Drive, videos

my bike goes so fast 'cos it charges the battery while I pedal

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