KMX tadpole trike with canopy, Windwrap, cromotor, 10KW

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KMX tadpole trike with canopy, Windwrap, cromotor, 10KW

Post by adam333 » Jul 18, 2013 2:31 pm

Here is the result after 10 month of on and off work:

Image
Edit: I recently made a front suspension for any adult KMX Trikes:
Here is a 2 min video of the suspension in action:

Details can be found at https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewt ... 31&t=78893

With the increased width from the suspension, it is now possible to install 4" fat tire:
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Edit: LED Flagpole rev 2


E-KMX tadpole trike canopy
Without Windwrap:
Image
Rear view:
Image
To get on the bike, you simply release the 2 front clips. The canopy's rod are made out of Fiberglass and always return to their "straight" shape. This is also what allow the fabric to stay stretched. I tested up to 60km/h and there is no flapping noise or deformation.
Image

2 min Video:


This is not my design though, I was inspired by Ed miller to create this canopy: https://tadpolerider2.wordpress.com/tag ... ke-canopy/
Image

See bellow for pictures of each components.

There is still improvement to be done, like suspension and front mudguards...

Bike: KMX typhoon
Motor: Cromotor V2 with a temperature sensor from Methods
Rear wheel: Mopped 16" alu rim with a motocross studded tire laced by JRH.
Controller: Lyen 10kW 24 FET modified by Zombiess.
Battery: 18s4p Lipo ( 75V, 32 Ah )
CA: Cycle analyst V3

I also want to make a low center of gravity battery box. It will be as much waterproof as possible.

Here is a few pictures of the ongoing design:

The battery box will be made out of 12ga alu 5052-H32. It will be as low as possible and the weight will be distributed.
The chain path is changed and the pedal crank arm will be reduced from 170 to 95mm.
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Here with the top panels, made out of 1/16" alu.
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This one show how it look on top of the point cloud of the KMX Typhoon: ( shown with 170mm crank arm )
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More to come.
Last edited by adam333 on Apr 17, 2017 8:39 pm, edited 14 times in total.

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Re: KMX Typhoon trike, cromotor, 10KW controller, winter des

Post by Doctorbass » Jul 18, 2013 2:56 pm

Great project :wink:

Some advices:

Try to avoid area on the frame that act like pocket that retain snow or water... including your battery box. the snow that splash from the tires really goes everywhere!.

Also during winter your lipo battery will have their internal resistance increasing if you dont have heat insulation aroud them. To solve this you have 3 choices:

-driving low power ( less voltage sag and les torture on the battery at low temp.
-using the best nanotech lipo that already have a very low IR so at cold temp they will still hol dthe voltage
-using some LifePO4 cells that are less sensitive to low temp.

One more advice: with the snow that make the ground with various level of snow, you will ahve snow hitting the square tuve of the frame that hold the front wheels. i suggest to install sme nylon plastic deflector to let your trike to slide on these snow accumulations or bump otherwise the T frame will brake when hitting these snow bump.. well it depend on the wheel size on the front you have... in my case it was 16" wheels.. or ski =)

Doc
CURRENT PROJECT: 2WD duo MXUS/Max-E ebike 32kW
https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewto ... =3&t=65764
-Fastest speed record 117 km/h on flat
-Fastest 1/4 mile@ 114km/h on flat and 16.316 sec
-Succeded to haul a 19200 pounds schoolbus!
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Re: KMX Typhoon trike, cromotor, 10KW controller, winter des

Post by adam333 » Jul 19, 2013 12:42 pm

Bonjour Doc :D

Thanks for the advices. I already experienced the poor performence of the battery at low temperature on my A-line and I will likely go with the "low power" suggestion since I already bought the Lipo zippy flightmax 6s 8Ah long time ago.
One more advice: with the snow that make the ground with various level of snow, you will ahve snow hitting the square tuve of the frame that hold the front wheels. i suggest to install sme nylon plastic deflector to let your trike to slide on these snow accumulations or bump otherwise the T frame will brake when hitting these snow bump.. well it depend on the wheel size on the front you have... in my case it was 16" wheels.. or ski =)
yep, I should have shown the bottom view also. The bottom will be waterproof and should act as a big ski. The crazy carpet idea is realy good.

Image

btw, where did you bought the front fenders? and do you remember the price?

Oh, and the blue leds, they come from hobby king? did you had any issue with cops about those?

Do you actualy have the posibility to go reverse with your controller?

En passant, tu est une grande source d'inspiration pour beaucoup de personne au quebec, keep up the good work :D
Last edited by adam333 on Apr 17, 2017 8:40 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: KMX Typhoon trike, cromotor, 10KW controller, winter des

Post by adam333 » Sep 18, 2013 1:53 pm

after a lot of work, here is some pic to show the current progression....

Since i am not going to invest a 1000$ on a Schlumpf High speed drive for this bike, the pedal are only there for the "legal" aspect. Therefore, I shortened the length from 170mm down to 95mm long.
Image

I had to move the small gear near the chair to make some battery space. I replaced the original gear with a newly machined one.
Image

5000 lumen led light bought from Ebay. I made a delrin adaptor for both.
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Strong CA adaptor for the trike
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Adaptor made from Delrin to hold the chain tubes
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7075-T6 alu bracket for the battery box
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Switch, ignition and temperature panel made from delrin
Image

I got the 16" rim laced with a Cromotor v2 from JRH, 10/11ga spokes
Image

I am working a LED flag pole to increase visibility. 3 white row at the front and 3 red row at the rear. ( not finished yet, more pic later )
Image
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The wire clearance on cromotor is a real issue when you want the brake to be functional as well. I had to buy and modify an ATV 6" rotor brake to solve the problem.
the rotor thickness is 2 mm thicker compare to a bike disck brake. I got rid of the adaptor that came with the cromotor.
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I made a 2mm thick adaptor for the calipper from alu.
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The 6 speed freewheel is replaced by a 17T single gear freewheel, derailleur is also discarded.
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I cutted the KMX dropout in order to fit a custom designed set made out of 7075-T7 aluminum.
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brake adaptor, 7075-T6 aluminum
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A few pic of the assembled rear wheel with the brake:
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I got the custom battery box made from 5052-H32 aluminum. Powder coat black paint.
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a few pic of the current status, more to come...
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Last edited by adam333 on Apr 17, 2017 8:55 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: KMX Typhoon trike, cromotor, 10KW controller, winter des

Post by parajared » Sep 19, 2013 9:36 am

That thing is looking amazing so far. Are you going to do the motorcycle torque dampener mod to keep things stable at high speeds?

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Re: KMX Typhoon trike, cromotor, 10KW controller, winter des

Post by xenodius » Sep 19, 2013 10:41 am

Very amazing. I LOVE the replacement dropouts, I'm definitely jealous. Are you going to seal them to the frame with some kind of paint, rubber dip, or braze? I imagine if you're doing very wet riding that some water might make it's way inside the frame. Wouldn't want it to rust from the inside out!

Gorgeous work. I wish I had the tools you do.

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Re: KMX Typhoon trike, cromotor, 10KW controller, winter des

Post by shenzhen_ex » Sep 19, 2013 10:58 am

Ohh my GOD :mrgreen: ! I want one. We don't have snow here but we have bumps! I would add full suspension for my riding.

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Re: KMX Typhoon trike, cromotor, 10KW controller, winter des

Post by xenodius » Sep 19, 2013 11:14 am

As soon as 20" single-sided loopwheels come out, well, that'll handle my suspension needs =)Not sure what I'd do for the rear though.

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Re: KMX Typhoon trike, cromotor, 10KW controller, winter des

Post by wojtek » Sep 19, 2013 1:00 pm

impressive build indeed! this is the beauty of having workshop and skills..

few years back Matt was doing wonders with Typhoon, now you have taken over! Dropouts are really great! i have made Doc's steel dropout welded + using dropouts on both side but the nuts are still getting loose.

the tire looks really good - what brand is that please?
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Re: KMX Typhoon trike, cromotor, 10KW controller, winter des

Post by adam333 » Sep 19, 2013 3:42 pm

Thanks for the good words guys =)
parajared wrote:That thing is looking amazing so far. Are you going to do the motorcycle torque dampener mod to keep things stable at high speeds?
The dampener will most likely be installed. I want to see how it feel at high speed before taking a decision.

Very amazing. I LOVE the replacement dropouts, I'm definitely jealous. Are you going to seal them to the frame with some kind of paint, rubber dip, or braze? I imagine if you're doing very wet riding that some water might make it's way inside the frame. Wouldn't want it to rust from the inside out!
Good point, I will use a line of black silicone all around to seal the interface between the frame and the dropout. I also painted the inside of the frame, it had already some traces of rust and its brand new....

As soon as 20" single-sided loopwheels come out, well, that'll handle my suspension needs =)Not sure what I'd do for the rear though.
Nice find... I will have to try those.
the tire looks really good - what brand is that please?
The MX tire: K760 90/100-16 ( 46$ ): http://www.canadasmotorcycle.ca/kenda-k ... -tire.html
The alu rim: 2.15, 16, 36 holes, ( 65$ ): http://www.mikesxs.net/product/34-2016.html

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Re: KMX Typhoon trike, cromotor, 10KW controller, winter des

Post by Doctorbass » Sep 20, 2013 12:01 am

Excellent work!! :wink:

if you use it during winter and REALLY want to enjoy the full power of your battery without the effect of battery cooling with low temp, i suhhest to but some electric blanket or warmer pad to put under the battery. then power them with the same battery. the effect of heating them to maintain them above 20 celsius will make them to preserve great internal low resistance and you wil get all the Ah of your pack. More Ah than the consumed Ah by the heater. A great batteri insulation is aso important!

During winter the front narrow rims will not make any effect, but during the summer you will hate them... when that will happen just order two new OEM rims from KMX and glue them to teh actual rims to make one doublewide rim per side. This improove ALOT the handling when cornering!!!

Doc
CURRENT PROJECT: 2WD duo MXUS/Max-E ebike 32kW
https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewto ... =3&t=65764
-Fastest speed record 117 km/h on flat
-Fastest 1/4 mile@ 114km/h on flat and 16.316 sec
-Succeded to haul a 19200 pounds schoolbus!
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Re: KMX Typhoon trike, cromotor, 10KW controller, winter des

Post by adam333 » Sep 20, 2013 11:04 am

Thanks Doc =)
i suhhest to but some electric blanket or warmer pad to put under the battery
This is a realy good point. I would have bought the Aerogel spaceloft insulator if 5 mm thickness was available easily: http://www.ebay.ca/itm/Aspen-Aerogel-SP ... 2a1c1d6e13

Now I will have to use heat reflective air bubble insulator, which is far from the above performences: http://www.mcmaster.com/#thermal-insula ... ts/=ol9von

As for the heating blanket, I could use a heating wire that we put on roof to get rid of snow during the winter.
order two new OEM rims from KMX and glue them to teh actual rims to make one doublewide rim per side
Interesting... I was thinking about buying the 43mm wide 16 inch rims from recumpence. Did you kept the same tire?

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Re: KMX Typhoon trike, cromotor, 10KW controller, winter des

Post by samoloh » Sep 20, 2013 1:06 pm

looking good, The winter in Winnipeg is insane tho, build an ebike for the conditions here will be a hell of an achievement
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Re: KMX Typhoon trike, cromotor, 10KW controller, winter des

Post by Doctorbass » Sep 20, 2013 3:38 pm

adam333 wrote:



Interesting... I was thinking about buying the 43mm wide 16 inch rims from recumpence. Did you kept the same tire?
I believen that his rim are 16" rim for 20" tire.. The typhoon is using 12" rim and 16" tires..

I dont suggest moving to 20" tire on front if you want to not flip over all the time!


Doublecheck with him if these are 16" rim dia or rim made for 16" tire.
Doc
CURRENT PROJECT: 2WD duo MXUS/Max-E ebike 32kW
https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewto ... =3&t=65764
-Fastest speed record 117 km/h on flat
-Fastest 1/4 mile@ 114km/h on flat and 16.316 sec
-Succeded to haul a 19200 pounds schoolbus!
113kmh Gianthttp://www.evalbum.com/3406
Mongoosehttp://www.evalbum.com/1947
YOUTUBE---https://m.youtube.com/user/Doctorbasss
http://twitter.com/DocbassMelancon
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Re: KMX Typhoon trike, cromotor, 10KW controller, winter des

Post by adam333 » Sep 23, 2013 9:38 pm

Doublecheck with him if these are 16" rim dia or rim made for 16" tire.
Doc
He is out of stock, but they were 16"

Doc, do you have any picture of your "double rim"? and what about the mudguard?

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Re: KMX Typhoon trike, cromotor, 10KW controller, winter des

Post by xenodius » Sep 24, 2013 12:35 am

On recumbents.com I recall a thread about using some other brand of fenders on a KMX... they were wider, with solid black supports + everything. You might be able to find some suitable alternatives to stock mud guards. I'm still debating them for mine, I figure spray won't hit me unless I'm turning hard anyway. I would want them for a dedicated snow trike though. :-)

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Re: KMX Typhoon trike, cromotor, 10KW controller, winter des

Post by Doctorbass » Sep 26, 2013 7:59 am

adam333 wrote:
Doublecheck with him if these are 16" rim dia or rim made for 16" tire.
Doc
He is out of stock, but they were 16"

Doc, do you have any picture of your "double rim"? and what about the mudguard?
Here is the thread about that project.https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewto ... mx#p654510

I am very proud of the result of that upgrade!

It not just improove alot the handling and cornering but also it give an emergency solution in case if one of the front wheel tire become flat. sicne there is dual tube inside ( one left and one right on each wheel, if one of the tube is flat the other can easyli compensate and it already happened and i was still able to ride the trike with only one tuve inflated on that wheel.

The wheel is REALLY strong and dont think that this wheel could break apart, the epoxy is stronger than the aluminum of these rims!!

the goal is that the tire instead of having a baloon shape like the big Apples, shal have a half moon shape wich increase the handling.the tire want to stay aligned to teh rim while lateral force happen when cornering.

I recommadn that upgrade to anyone with that own a KMX!

Doc
CURRENT PROJECT: 2WD duo MXUS/Max-E ebike 32kW
https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewto ... =3&t=65764
-Fastest speed record 117 km/h on flat
-Fastest 1/4 mile@ 114km/h on flat and 16.316 sec
-Succeded to haul a 19200 pounds schoolbus!
113kmh Gianthttp://www.evalbum.com/3406
Mongoosehttp://www.evalbum.com/1947
YOUTUBE---https://m.youtube.com/user/Doctorbasss
http://twitter.com/DocbassMelancon
I speak FRENCH and english

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Re: KMX Typhoon trike, cromotor, 10KW controller, winter des

Post by Ypedal » Sep 26, 2013 8:29 am

wow... nice work !

I love the dropouts...... something you can run thru a CNC program ?.. or you mill those by hand ?... not sure i even want to know how much it would cost.. but damn.... envy..
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Re: KMX Typhoon trike, cromotor, 10KW controller, winter des

Post by adam333 » Sep 26, 2013 9:21 am

Here is the thread about that project.https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewto ... mx#p654510

I am very proud of the result of that upgrade!

It not just improove alot the handling and cornering but also it give an emergency solution in case if one of the front wheel tire become flat. sicne there is dual tube inside ( one left and one right on each wheel, if one of the tube is flat the other can easyli compensate and it already happened and i was still able to ride the trike with only one tuve inflated on that wheel.

The wheel is REALLY strong and dont think that this wheel could break apart, the epoxy is stronger than the aluminum of these rims!!

the goal is that the tire instead of having a baloon shape like the big Apples, shal have a half moon shape wich increase the handling.the tire want to stay aligned to teh rim while lateral force happen when cornering.

I recommadn that upgrade to anyone with that own a KMX!

Doc
ok, you convinced me :wink:

If you can, could you post a pic of the KMX with those tire please?

Thanks

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Re: KMX Typhoon trike, cromotor, 10KW controller, winter des

Post by madin88 » Sep 26, 2013 9:24 am

very nice work
the tire looks really badass. with that modded 24FET you must have very good acceleration offside from the streets. for winter and ice i think tires with spikes may have better tracion, but i dont now how the winter is like in you area and where you going to ride it :)
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Re: KMX Typhoon trike, cromotor, 10KW controller, winter des

Post by adam333 » Sep 26, 2013 9:25 am

Ypedal wrote:wow... nice work !

I love the dropouts...... something you can run thru a CNC program ?.. or you mill those by hand ?... not sure i even want to know how much it would cost.. but damn.... envy..
thanks Ypedal :D

I made those on my small CNC at home, but the dropouts are roughly 3 time bigger than the regular capacity of the machine. ( that was a 8 hours nightmare per piece )

I got some interest from members about those dropout and I have requested a quote. We will know soon how much they really worth.

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Re: KMX Typhoon trike, cromotor, 10KW controller, winter des

Post by adam333 » Sep 26, 2013 9:30 am

madin88 wrote:very nice work
the tire looks really badass. with that modded 24FET you must have very good acceleration offside from the streets. for winter and ice i think tires with spikes may have better tracion, but i dont now how the winter is like in you area and where you going to ride it :)
thanks Madin88 :D

I have yet to try the controler or even the bike with power. I expect a decent acceleration though :wink:

But yes, I plan to give it a few try as is then do like Doctorbass and purchase those spikes from Ebay.

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Re: KMX Typhoon trike, cromotor, 10KW controller, winter des

Post by adam333 » Sep 28, 2013 9:49 am

I got a quote for the dropout set:

A set include 5 pieces, ( 2 dropout, 2 adpator for the seat and 1 adaptor for a 6" break ) All made from 7075-T651 with Light bead blast finish

1 set: 1883$ ea + shipping
3 set: 1300$ ea + shipping
5 set: 1222$ ea + shipping

This is like buying another brand new KMX...

Edit:

I can now make a rear dropout set (black anodized) for 595 us$

see: https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewt ... 31&t=74881
Last edited by adam333 on Apr 17, 2017 8:59 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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Re: KMX Typhoon trike, cromotor, 10KW controller, winter des

Post by Ypedal » Sep 28, 2013 11:45 am

:shock:

holy c....

I was sort of expecting 500$ max.. :cry:
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Re: KMX Typhoon trike, cromotor, 10KW controller, winter des

Post by adam333 » Sep 28, 2013 5:55 pm

A few more pics...

More machined pieces:
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Alu plate to hold the batery box.
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Cable adaptor.
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Assembled chain wheel.
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Fit check underneath the seat.
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Top panels fit check.
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Rear chain fit check.
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Front chain fit check.
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Inside the box, we now see the 1/4" temperature isolation foam for the battery, all the cabling remain to be done :(
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here the fuse holder and the 5 pin connector for the charging.
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Here the key switch, Led switches, CA, and the 2x 5000 lumen front lights.
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Inspired by Doctorbass, some blue led underneath the bike :wink:
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Next part is the cabling... this will take a while...
Last edited by adam333 on Apr 17, 2017 9:05 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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