Voicecoils's 2nd build: Giant DH Team

[voicecoils]

It might be a good idea to make up a couple of cloth sacks filled with sand (use the legs from a worn out pair of pants) that each weigh about as much as one of your battery packs. Then try riding your bike with the sacks in tied in the different possible positions (you might want to pay attention to how subject the locations are to wheelies). This way you will be absolutely sure you are making the choice you prefer. This will be much easier than changing the mounting location later if it turns out to ride badly with your first choice.

Hi MitchJi,

I'm going to try the bike with the batteries as pictured and see how handling feels. Perhaps temporary mounting. Sandbags are not a bad idea, but I won't be able to pedal the bike up to the speeds and acceleration it will have when powered.

I *want* to make the batteries work in the main triangle. It's a good secure spot that keeps the bike as stock looking as possible, and requires the least battery containment building.

[voicecoils]

small update:

I've removed the swingarm and have posted it off to be modified and reinforced to accept my X5 hubmotor
Very excited!

Getting the swingarm off was a pain but with a bit of muscle in the end it came out. I learned something that I should have figured out already: the suspension bearings are stuffed. Not a huge deal, they all turn but some quite roughly. I've put in a purchase request for a new bearing set from diymtb.com.au

Soon I'll hack off the cable guides in the main triangle to make more room for the battery packs. I'm still not sure how I'll enclose them and secure them to the frame. At the moment I'm thinking of using appropriately sized rubber mounted p-clamps and thin walled aluminum sheet.

I'm still looking into the best way of getting my Xt wheel laced up, but I've got a few leads.

[MitchJi]

small update:

I've removed the swingarm and have posted it off to be modified and reinforced to accept my X5 hubmotor
Very excited!

Getting the swingarm off was a pain but with a bit of muscle in the end it came out. I learned something that I should have figured out already: the suspension bearings are stuffed. Not a huge deal, they all turn but some quite roughly. I've put in a purchase request for a new bearing set from diymtb.com.au

Hi VC,

Who is doing the mods, what changes are they making and about how much will it cost? The reason I ask is I am considering having the length of a swingarm increased to move the rear wheel back about 3" or 4" to make more space for mounting an RC Motor.

It might not be a huge deal that the bearings are shot, particularly since you are removing the swingarm anyway but its great you discovered it

[voicecoils]

Who is doing the mods, what changes are they making and about how much will it cost? The reason I ask is I am considering having the length of a swingarm increased to move the rear wheel back about 3" or 4" to make more space for mounting an RC Motor.

It might not be a huge deal that the bearings are shot, particularly since you are removing the swingarm anyway but its great you discovered it

Dropouts will be cut to be used like a vertical dropout, not the original 12mm thru axle. Then torque arm/plates will be fabricated to bolt to the outside on each side. Not sure what will happen with the "pinched" tubing yet. It will be easier to show before & after then explain what's planned.

I got an offer from someone with extensive metalworking experience to give the repair/mod a go at no charge, an offer I couldn't refuse!

However I had done a bit of shopping around before then and the cheapest quote I got was AU$250 w/out repainting. In your case, I would budget at least $300-400 for the swingarm lengthening if it's aluminium and need heat treating and then repainting. Otherwise, if the swingarm attachment points are not too complex, having a CroMo swingarm fabricated from scratch might be a better option. It would be stronger, easier to weld and/or braze on mounting tabs etc. Although labour is much cheaper in the States, you might be able to find a cheaper quote...

Re the bearings: They are all sealed so once they no longer spin freely they need replacing. They can't just be repacked with grease unfortunately. I could leave them as is but it's like Hank Hill's father in 'King of the Hill' who had his kneecaps blown off in battle, sure he can still walk but...

Anyways, replacement bearing kit is $81 for 8 bearings, I'm about to put in the order The bike was $5.5k in 2004, so I don't mind spending a little get it running in tip top shape.

[voicecoils]

I have not heard from Kurt about my swingarm. I'm hoping he's OK

The threaded sidecover from John @ http://www.stealthelectricbikes.com.au has arrived today.

I will work this weekend on changing the sidecover thereby making my X5 disc compatible.

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[HAL9000v2.0]

hi voicecoils: same thing I did on a x4 and I must add 2mm plate to get 17mm from disc to cover. I was using threaded cover with disc adapter. Then I fitted avid juicy 7 which is 14mm from inner side of disc. It will go without plate but i do not like to have less then 1mm space from cover to caliper.

[voicecoils]

hi voicecoils: same thing I did on a x4 and I must add 2mm plate to get 17mm from disc to cover. I was using threaded cover with disc adapter. Then I fitted avid juicy 7 which is 14mm from inner side of disc. It will go without plate but i do not like to have less then 1mm space from cover to caliper.

Ahh good. I have a juicy 5 caliper.

I'll have to make a small spacer to keep the disc spaced out far enough. Perhaps I will use loctite on the threads as well.

Good to hear it can be done!!!

[HAL9000v2.0]

You do not need Loctite. It is hard to unscrew it anyway.

[voicecoils]

NEWS

Kurt's gotten back to me on the swingarm. Sounds like it's not too far off being ready to post back.

WOOHOO!

Then I can get it laced up to the rim I've got waiting.

Things are starting to come together, pretty happy about it

[recumpence]

Very cool!

I know what it is like on the front end of a large project. It feels good to get the project under way and nearing completion.

Matt

[voicecoils]

Very cool!

I know what it is like on the front end of a large project. It feels good to get the project under way and nearing completion.

Matt

Thanks! My project should have been straightforward for the most part. However the frame, hubmotor, and controller all required modifications. That combined with the need to order many small parts from all over the world has slowed things down.

I'm very grateful to have:
* Received a FREE X5
* the frame modified by forum member Kurt
* custom X5 screw on sidecover from forum member getadirtbike (http://www.stealthelectricbikes.com.au)
* Advice and guidance from many on E-S

I'm looking forward to the first ride and sharing the results and photos on E-S

[deecanio]

Hi Voicecoils,

hang in there bud, theres always a slight delay in accumalating all the right parts the all of a sudden the project comes together and is completed
looking forward to seeing the giant in action

Cheers,

D

[voicecoils]

Cheers D! I'm meeting up with Andy from evmotorcycle.org Monday to check out an electric motorcycle rider in Sydney. Should be quite fun

Got my X5 screw sidecover installed today so I can run a disk brake.

I used a small 100mm gear puller to pull against a Dura Ace fixed gear sprocket screwed on to the drive side of the X5. Screwed up nicely and made a great POP when the paint and glue broke. Ended up being pretty straighforward. I was expecting major dramas.

To top it off, the Dura Ace sprocket seems like the perfect spacer for clearance of my Juicy 5 caliper. Kurt tells me the swingarm could be ready Monday or Tuesday to be posted back.

Now, Pictures! (You have to be logged in for the first 3 pictures to show up. There are 5 photos in total.)

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[voicecoils]

HQ version here

Might hurt your ears, the camera mic didn't like the motor sound at full throttle, dang.

[methods]

Did you not have that bolted down

I can hear the wife screaming at you now while you try to explain the scuff marks going all the way across the room.....
Would have made for great video!

So was that wobble caused by the axle sliding side to side in the stand or from hub being off axis?

-methods

[voicecoils]

Did you not have that bolted down

I can hear the wife screaming at you now while you try to explain the scuff marks going all the way across the room.....
Would have made for great video!

So was that wobble caused by the axle sliding side to side in the stand or from hub being off axis?

-methods

On an unrelated note, I came across a bizarre sea creature while image.googling for something totally different:


Now, back to the topic at hand. If I had bolts I'd bolt it down. Gotta get some lug nuts from supercheapauto, thanks for the heads up.

The wobble was mostly from the truing stand not being stiff but a little in the disc / sidecover. I have to double check that the disc is dead flat. If it is, I'll pop the sidecover off and 'shim' it from underneath. Probably a bit painstaking but the result should be a dead straight / true disc.

My girlfriend was not around to roll her eyes and run for cover.

[methods]

Good thing about automotive lug nuts is that they are longer.
Grabs lots of threads so the chances of stripping becomes much smaller.

Today I disassembled my office chair, shimmed the piston on the bottom, and bolted it into the seat post hole on my chopper bike.
Rode up and down the street like a Gangster.
I have no idea why but my 36V 20A Crystalyte just popped 1Ah into the trip.
Was totally lame trying to pedal a chopper bike while sitting in an office chair. . .

-methods

[Almasi]

Can you please post picture to the frame drop out modification...I'm going to see a used 2004 Team DH tomorow...I probably buy it...so let me know how hard it was to do!

Robin

[voicecoils]

Can you please post picture to the frame drop out modification...I'm going to see a used 2004 Team DH tomorow...I probably buy it...so let me know how hard it was to do!

Robin

I don't have a photo for you yet because I don't have the swingarm back.

What's involved is tig welding the thru-axle set screw slot closed and then cutting a vertical dropout into the frame. This will let the hubmotor sit in the frame but because the thru-axle is 12mm and the X5 has 10mm axles it's not strongly secured. So, what's being done is 5mm plates of stainless steel are being made to bolt to the outside of the back of the frame. They securely hold the 14mm X5 axle with 10mm flats and act as torque arms.

If you have time and a workshop and can weld aluminium work with steel then you should be fine

If not, consider it a big job to get someone else to do. The X5 weighs a tonne and generates a heap of torque against the frame so it has to be secured properly.

Newer DH Comp / DH Team frames have 150mm axle spacing so that's another thing worth considering. It would give you more space to fit a disk brake rotor, 8spd screw on cassette and wide torque plates / torque arms.

Cheers!

[voicecoils]

Was totally lame trying to pedal a chopper bike while sitting in an office chair. . .
-methods

You must be in a unique neighbourhood if that gets you street cred

You need to get a trike with a nubmotor, then just tie two strings to the handlebars and ride behind it in an office chair. Maybe carry a whip?

[Kurt]

I am wrapping the swing arm up to post to voicecoils tomorrow morning.The job shouldn't have taken very long at all .Turns out it was bad timing for me. After some natural disasters in my area, x mass obligations and the need to look after my 2 year old daughter. I found myself short of spare time. Sorry for the hold up.

Fortunately Voicecoils has been very understanding and I hope it works out for him. I took a couple of pics before wrapping it up.




Kurt.

[voicecoils]

That looks awesome !!!



I'm very impressed and excited to get the bike going. Looking forward to picking it up at the post office later this week.

THANKS KURT

[deecanio]

now they look like some proper dropouts for an x5, nice job

[voicecoils]

now they look like some proper dropouts for an x5, nice job

Does look like a great job. They'll be quite a bit of ally and stainless holding the X5 in it's place

The plates Kurt made up will act as torque arms, in the first pic he posted you can see at the back are ''dowels" between the swingarm members. They'll prevent them from twisting along with the set screws holding the stainless plates in place. It's a good solution he's come up with IMO.

Can't wait to pick them up at the post office.

[Almasi]

The only thing I'm worry is were he welded....all Aluminium Mountain Bike get a heat treatment to remove the stress caused by those weld...otherwise it crack very easy.

That's what I'm concern with my team DH, do I get the back end re-welded or just make some nice stainless plate over it...if I get it welded, then I would probably go for Heat treatment or Cryo treatment.

Robin