News: Maumee firm builds prototype of electric vehicle

General Discussion about electric vehicles.

News: Maumee firm builds prototype of electric vehicle

Postby TylerDurden » Mon Jun 16, 2008 11:52 am

Maumee firm builds prototype of electric vehicle
New Ohio law makes it street-legal:
Thanks to a recent Ohio law change, three-wheeled vehicles like this prototype electric car designed by Applied Technologies Inc. can be built without some standard safety features.
By LARRY P. VELLEQUETTE
BLADE BUSINESS WRITER

Image

Craig Winn has been around the automotive industry long enough to realize that transportation revolutions aren't necessarily sparked in the boardrooms of giant automakers.

They often begin with ideas, and they usually flow from quirky, small companies.

This morning, Mr. Winn will roll another man's idea out of his Maumee engineering firm and give the world a four-hour sneak peak at the new ZAP Alias, a three-wheeled, all-electric vehicle that might just send a shock through automakers around the world. It is a prototype, and when completed, it will carry two people and be road-ready.

"This is a step to getting to an electric car," said Mr. Winn, a former executive with Chrysler and Magna Steyr International Inc. He now owns Applied Technologies Inc. in Maumee's Arrowhead Park.

"My company's been in engineering 20-some years with the auto industry and suppliers, so this gives us a chance to play with some other solutions."

The vehicle Mr. Winn will roll out this morning is an exterior representation of the Alias - the kind of model auto companies put on display at auto shows to pique interest in their designs.

It will have no powertrain or interior features when it is shipped this afternoon to its Santa Rosa, Calif. owners, ZAP, a 14-year-old, publicly held company that produces and markets alternative modes of transportation.

"A lot of people say [makers of electric cars] have been waiting for technology, but in truth, we've been waiting for high gas prices," said Gary Starr, 52, founder of ZAP, an acronym for Zero Air Pollution.

The Alias, which ZAP plans to sell next year for about $33,000, has two seats side-by-side, three wheels, and a power pack that relies on advanced lithium-ion batteries. The company claims the highway-rated vehicle will be able to travel in excess of 100 mph, and have a range in excess of 100 miles before needing a charge, which Mr. Starr said would cost less than a dollar in most markets.

"The larger automobile companies want us to think about range, but 20 percent of all fleet usage is under 30 miles per day, and if there's a second car in the family, 80 percent of driving should be under 30 miles per day," Mr. Starr said. "It's intended as a second car."

Families, Mr. Starr said, would only take a gas-powered car when they are driving long distances.

Because the Alias has fewer than four wheels, it's technically classified as a motorcycle, which means that it doesn't have a lot of safety features standard on a car, such as air bags. The designation saves on development costs and is the reason a number of electric vehicles, including other ZAP vehicles and a competitor made in Ohio - Myers Motors NMG, or No More Gas - choose the three-wheeled design.

Just this month, the Ohio legislature approved a change in the law that will make vehicles like the Alias and NMG legal on Ohio's roadways. The vehicles were illegal until the legislature changed the word "saddle" to "seat" in the definition of motorcycle in the Ohio revised code.

"That's good news for Myers Motors," said Ron Freund, chairman of the Electric Automobile Association, a California non-profit that advocates for electric vehicles like those made by Myers Motors of Tallmadge, Ohio. "That gives them a leg up, now that their vehicles are now legal in their own state."

Like the Alias, the NMG has two wheels in the front for steering, and a wheel in the rear that drives the car. Its fiber-glass body is hand-shaped and is available in a wide variety of colors, and the vehicle retails for $36,000. However, while it can travel at highway speeds, its range is limited to about 30 miles because it relies on more traditional batteries, according to the company's Web site, http://www.meyersmotors.com.

Dana Myers, owner of Myers Motors, could not be reached for comment, but the NMG has a fan in Mr. Freund.

"I've driven them and they're amazing. The cars are so cool looking," Mr. Freund said.

ZAP also makes lower-cost three-wheeled electrics, such as its Xebra Sedan, which has two seats, a range of about 25 miles, a top speed of 40 mph, and a price tag of $11,000. Unlike the NMG, the Xebra isn't legal on highways.

Electric cars aren't new. In fact, the earliest electric cars appeared on the market about the same time as did General Motors Corp. 100 years ago. The early electric cars were appealing because they contained fewer moving parts than cars with internal combustion engines and were far less prone to breakdown. The Anderson Electric Car Company sold Detroit Electric-brand vehicles in the United States from 1907 until as late as 1939.

Both electricity and steam were considered viable fuel alternatives for the automobile early on, but gasoline won out because it was readily available, easily transportable, and inexpensive.

Those electric vehicles suffered from two main problems: range and refueling. The key is the battery.

Efforts are under way to find new battery technology - such as lighter-weight lithium ion batteries - to high-demand uses such as automobiles while controlling costs. But recent electric efforts, such as GM's Chevy Volt, set to make its debut next year, are struggling with power requirements, weight, and cost.

ZAP's Mr. Starr said efforts are under way to secure a manufacturing facility for the Alias and the company's other electric vehicles, and he did not rule out bringing such a facility to the automobile industry's traditional home in Michigan and Ohio. The company previously purchased the rights to the Detroit Electric brand. Just last week, ZAP sold half of its battery systems business to concentrate the company's efforts more on electric vehicles.

"In April, we announced that we have already sold more than 700 vehicles for the year, and that's more than we sold for all of last year," Mr. Starr said. "We also announced that we've got back orders of more than $6.8 million. Every week is a record-breaking week right now for orders."

Mr. Freund sees large-scale acceptance of electric automobiles on the horizon, thanks to recent developments in battery technology.

"It looks like Silicon Valley is going to be showing Detroit how to do it again," Mr. Freund said. "Detroit was caught flat-footed once more."

Contact Larry P. Vellequette at:
lvellequette@theblade.com
or 419-724-6091.


http://www.toledoblade.com/apps/pbcs.dl ... /806160335

edit: forgot to paste title :roll:
Last edited by TylerDurden on Mon Jun 16, 2008 3:54 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Have a Nice Day,

TD

___________________________________________________________

FYI: Adding pictures?

Please post your Watts-at-speed in the survey.
User avatar
TylerDurden
100 GW
100 GW
 
Posts: 6254
Joined: Thu Jan 04, 2007 5:50 pm
Location: Wear the fox hat.

Re: News:

Postby Link » Mon Jun 16, 2008 2:12 pm

Just this month, the Ohio legislature approved a change in the law that will make vehicles like the Alias and NMG legal on Ohio's roadways. The vehicles were illegal until the legislature changed the word "saddle" to "seat" in the definition of motorcycle in the Ohio revised code.


One word difference makes a whole other type of vehicle legal. Wow, law is a PITA. :?
ಠ_ಠ
Packcycle 2.0 - Scwhinn S-Go
Do you wumbo?
My mind is an enigma. So much so that, sometimes, even I don't know what I was thinking.
User avatar
Link
1.21 GW
1.21 GW
 
Posts: 3589
Joined: Sun Dec 09, 2007 8:46 pm
Location: The Roxbury

Re: News:

Postby TylerDurden » Mon Jun 16, 2008 3:34 pm

I buzzed over there to get a look...

ATI is a technical-design firm that created the mockup of the Alias. They built it from artists' renderings into a full-scale fiberglass shell in only ~10 weeks. They also have the capability to scan car-sized objects into CAD applications. They're nice folks, and let me take a few pix while the pro shooters were taking a break:
IMG_3452_sm.jpg
IMG_3452_sm.jpg (45.49 KiB) Viewed 1210 times

IMG_3447_sm.jpg
IMG_3447_sm.jpg (38.07 KiB) Viewed 991 times

IMG_3446_sm.jpg
IMG_3446_sm.jpg (45.56 KiB) Viewed 986 times

IMG_3448_sm.jpg
IMG_3448_sm.jpg (37.57 KiB) Viewed 985 times


So, while it ain't the real McCoy, it is a step in the right direction. Zap is spending on development beyond the drawing-board.
3D spin: http://www.toledoblade.com/assets/wmv/TO48378614.WMV

FWIW, I don't think anybody would feel ashamed to ride in a buggy that looked like that. (I sure can't say the same for a CitiCar. :lol:)
Have a Nice Day,

TD

___________________________________________________________

FYI: Adding pictures?

Please post your Watts-at-speed in the survey.
User avatar
TylerDurden
100 GW
100 GW
 
Posts: 6254
Joined: Thu Jan 04, 2007 5:50 pm
Location: Wear the fox hat.

Re: News: Maumee firm builds prototype of electric vehicle

Postby dogman » Mon Jun 16, 2008 4:13 pm

Lots nicer than a volkswagon trike! Realy though, the law needs to catch up, and let nev's go at least 40 mph, and drive on a 50 mph road. I don't see how a fast three wheeler is safer than a four wheeler, yet one is legal, one not. They need a less strict crash standard for a 40mph nev, like no airbag, but passive restraint seatbelts. I guess I just don't understand why you can hang it all out there, in my state with no helmet even, but you can't have a decent nev. Unless this vehicle has some pretty sophisticated suspension, people will start flipping them like the used to flip corvairs. Does it have the tilting wheels? Also I'd be proud to ride in your citicar.
BE THE PACK LEADER

Front hub Ebikekit 6x10 motor commuter bike on FS Giant OS3 frame.

Rear hub 6x10 9 continent dirtbike on FS Mogoose frame

Front hub 9x7 ebikekit street racing bike on Quicksilver Denali frame, Lyens 72v 12 fet controller.

5600 miles, Aprox 530 cycles on v1 36v 20 ah ping, 50 cycyles on 48v 15 ah ping. 72v 5 ah Turnigy 30c lipo on the race bike.
User avatar
dogman
100 GW
100 GW
 
Posts: 7928
Joined: Sat May 17, 2008 12:53 pm
Location: Las Cruces New Mexico USA

Re: News: Maumee firm builds prototype of electric vehicle

Postby TylerDurden » Mon Jun 16, 2008 4:19 pm

dogman wrote: Unless this vehicle has some pretty sophisticated suspension, people will start flipping them like the used to flip corvairs. Does it have the tilting wheels?
IIRC, the Alias is not a leaner.

As for the writ of law, who da hell knows. I wuz reading the stats last night on traumatic brain injuries in "repealed" states... Darwinian logic at it's finest. :roll:
Have a Nice Day,

TD

___________________________________________________________

FYI: Adding pictures?

Please post your Watts-at-speed in the survey.
User avatar
TylerDurden
100 GW
100 GW
 
Posts: 6254
Joined: Thu Jan 04, 2007 5:50 pm
Location: Wear the fox hat.

Re: News: Maumee firm builds prototype of electric vehicle

Postby dogman » Mon Jun 16, 2008 4:28 pm

One other pet peeve of mine. " the cost of a charge will be under a dollar in most markets" says the press release. for gods sake don't even think of dividing cost of the battery by its expected lifespan. If the lipo4 cost $20,000, and you got 2000 cycles, each dollar charge up uses ten dollars of battery wear. so 11 bucks for a 100 mile ride is not so cheap. It's why I have an ebike, not a car conversion. Not that e cars aren't a good thing, its just that to sell something expensive, by saying it's cheap comes back to bite ya when people do the calculation. People don't trust ev's yet, I wonder why when range is stated in the ad, based on a 8 mph speed, but they talk about 25 mph top speed.
BE THE PACK LEADER

Front hub Ebikekit 6x10 motor commuter bike on FS Giant OS3 frame.

Rear hub 6x10 9 continent dirtbike on FS Mogoose frame

Front hub 9x7 ebikekit street racing bike on Quicksilver Denali frame, Lyens 72v 12 fet controller.

5600 miles, Aprox 530 cycles on v1 36v 20 ah ping, 50 cycyles on 48v 15 ah ping. 72v 5 ah Turnigy 30c lipo on the race bike.
User avatar
dogman
100 GW
100 GW
 
Posts: 7928
Joined: Sat May 17, 2008 12:53 pm
Location: Las Cruces New Mexico USA

Re: News: Maumee firm builds prototype of electric vehicle

Postby dogman » Mon Jun 16, 2008 4:32 pm

No shit. I call them murdercycles when a car hits em, but suicidecles when they don't wear a helmet, or biff it doing tricks drunk. I got off big bikes in the eighties so I wouldn't be a suicide. I was 90 in the 25 zone, all the time then. Little angel on my shoulder all that time i guess.
BE THE PACK LEADER

Front hub Ebikekit 6x10 motor commuter bike on FS Giant OS3 frame.

Rear hub 6x10 9 continent dirtbike on FS Mogoose frame

Front hub 9x7 ebikekit street racing bike on Quicksilver Denali frame, Lyens 72v 12 fet controller.

5600 miles, Aprox 530 cycles on v1 36v 20 ah ping, 50 cycyles on 48v 15 ah ping. 72v 5 ah Turnigy 30c lipo on the race bike.
User avatar
dogman
100 GW
100 GW
 
Posts: 7928
Joined: Sat May 17, 2008 12:53 pm
Location: Las Cruces New Mexico USA

Re: News: Maumee firm builds prototype of electric vehicle

Postby TylerDurden » Mon Jun 16, 2008 4:40 pm

My friend the neurosurgeon calls 'em "DonorCycles". Organ harvesting is the only benefit of repealed helmet laws.
Have a Nice Day,

TD

___________________________________________________________

FYI: Adding pictures?

Please post your Watts-at-speed in the survey.
User avatar
TylerDurden
100 GW
100 GW
 
Posts: 6254
Joined: Thu Jan 04, 2007 5:50 pm
Location: Wear the fox hat.

Re: News: Maumee firm builds prototype of electric vehicle

Postby dogman » Mon Jun 16, 2008 5:35 pm

Fortunately they aren't looking for brain donors. I'd be off the list anyway if they were. It'd be pretty funny if somebody got my huge adrenaline gland.
BE THE PACK LEADER

Front hub Ebikekit 6x10 motor commuter bike on FS Giant OS3 frame.

Rear hub 6x10 9 continent dirtbike on FS Mogoose frame

Front hub 9x7 ebikekit street racing bike on Quicksilver Denali frame, Lyens 72v 12 fet controller.

5600 miles, Aprox 530 cycles on v1 36v 20 ah ping, 50 cycyles on 48v 15 ah ping. 72v 5 ah Turnigy 30c lipo on the race bike.
User avatar
dogman
100 GW
100 GW
 
Posts: 7928
Joined: Sat May 17, 2008 12:53 pm
Location: Las Cruces New Mexico USA

Re: News: Maumee firm builds prototype of electric vehicle

Postby mvadventure » Wed Jun 18, 2008 5:59 pm

Back when I had no sense, lot of courage, thought I couldn't die, wasn't afraid of pain and lacked a bride I was involved in a little motorcycle shop in Orlando. (Fl) Needless to say this was more than 40 years ago. Having virtually no money and frequently robbing the coke machine to ride with my buddies on a Friday night I tried my best to take every opportunity to buy cheap and sell reasonable in order to pay the rent. This resulted in a lot of, literally, two dollar basket bikes. A basket bike is one you buy that someone has taken apart to repair and been unable to put back together.

One of those was like the one in the picture here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Messerschmitt_KR200 Talk about fun! It had four speeds forward and when you wanted to back up you turned it off, pushed the key in and the two cycle motor started backwards giving you four speeds in reverse. It was fun to come into an intersection at speed and simply crack the wheel while shifting down and pushing hard so the rear end would come around. You had to be careful or it would come around too far but once the technique was learned it was a sure fire way to scare the crap out of an unsuspecting passenger. It was a long time ago but if my memory is close I sold it for around $150.00. Wonder what it'd be worth today.

Mike
User avatar
mvadventure
1 kW
1 kW
 
Posts: 492
Joined: Wed May 02, 2007 5:05 pm

Re: News: Maumee firm builds prototype of electric vehicle

Postby paultrafalgar » Thu Jun 19, 2008 10:11 am

Funny you should bring up that "bubble car". I have just been thinking that would be ideal for an electric conversion.
If we knew what it was we were doing, it would not be called research, would it? Albert Einstein
A paranoid is someone who has SOME idea of what's going on. Allen Ginsberg(?)
If the greatest pleasure is giving, be selfish - give pleasure.
User avatar
paultrafalgar
100 kW
100 kW
 
Posts: 1114
Joined: Fri Feb 15, 2008 5:41 am
Location: Forest of Dean, UK

Re: News: Maumee firm builds prototype of electric vehicle

Postby Lock » Tue Feb 03, 2009 5:36 pm

BUMP
http://www.worldcarfans.com/9090123.031 ... n-unveiled

Coupla snips:
Car salesmen attending the National Automobile Dealers Association expo in New Orleans are being treated to a pre-production model of the ZAP Alias. The company is also introducing an all-electric van and truck to show alongside the two-seater electric Alias.

Pricing for the Alias is expected to come in under $35,000, roughly $5,000 more than the company previously announced. ZAP plans to make a limited edition "Signature Series" available by the end of 2009.

tks
Lok
Image
human-electric hybrid pedestrian
Alive, and kickin', in TO
User avatar
Lock
10 MW
10 MW
 
Posts: 2420
Joined: Thu May 24, 2007 5:46 pm
Location: Toronto Harbour

Re: News: Maumee firm builds prototype of electric vehicle

Postby Toshi » Tue Feb 03, 2009 7:59 pm

now seems as good a time as ever to repost Wired's expose of the scam-artists behind Zap:

http://www.wired.com/cars/futuretranspo ... ntPage=all

Over the years, ZAP has taken millions from investors and dealers eager to see the company's line of green cars hit the road. But that line has never materialized. Of nearly a dozen groundbreaking eco-vehicles ZAP has promised in public announcements and on its Web site, only the Xebra and its sibling, a truck version, have ever made it to market. As a result, fans of electric cars have grown disillusioned, while individuals like Youssef have been financially devastated. What's more, investment firms around the country have become cautious about financing electric vehicles after being repeatedly misled by one of the industry's most visible companies.


Image
User avatar
Toshi
10 kW
10 kW
 
Posts: 602
Joined: Tue Apr 08, 2008 9:33 pm
Location: Long Island, NY

Re: News: Maumee firm builds prototype of electric vehicle

Postby TylerDurden » Tue Feb 03, 2009 8:55 pm

Holy crap...
Have a Nice Day,

TD

___________________________________________________________

FYI: Adding pictures?

Please post your Watts-at-speed in the survey.
User avatar
TylerDurden
100 GW
100 GW
 
Posts: 6254
Joined: Thu Jan 04, 2007 5:50 pm
Location: Wear the fox hat.

Re: News: Maumee firm builds prototype of electric vehicle

Postby Lock » Tue Feb 03, 2009 9:08 pm

Yah, history of BS, but w/changing times they would have to be complete fools not to actually be able to produce a real EV *something* at this point.
human-electric hybrid pedestrian
Alive, and kickin', in TO
User avatar
Lock
10 MW
10 MW
 
Posts: 2420
Joined: Thu May 24, 2007 5:46 pm
Location: Toronto Harbour

Next

Return to E-Vehicles General Discussion

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 2 guests