Lawn Tractor Conversion New new new..."Final Video"

Tommy L

Tommy L

100 kW
Joined
Dec 23, 2010
Messages
1,124
Location
Saint Augustine, Florida USA
My Sears 15hp motor is toast. I could rebuild it, or........make it electric.
There is a package at Electric Motor Sport dot com
for 8hp cont 15peak hp.
Chime in with some input for me!
The video below is a cool electric dragster lawn tractor! :)

Thank you!

Tommy L sends.....[imghttp://www.vtxcafe.com/images/smilies/mosh.gif][/img]
emc_r_02.jpg


[youtube]rrCoGoJtovQ[/youtube]
 
A lot depends on what you intend to do with it. At normal lawn speeds it takes a surprisingly small power for propulsion, probably less than 1kW. But mowing, the blade(s) can take 15 to 20kW. I have an old Sears lawn tractor I have been running on battery for over 15 years. I have never mowed with it; never had a deck. But I tow a wagon around the yard and sometimes the lawn sweeper. The sweeper is my heavy load and gets me up into the 40A range. Even towing a wagon of firewood is less than 20A. I'm using 45V. Kept the 3 speed axle. On the yard; 2nd only. On the road 3rd gets me about 25mph.
 
Thank you Major!

Seems that your heaviest load (sweeper) is 1.7kw. I'm thinking if my 15hp sears motor has been doing this dual blade 42" deck, then
15hp = 11.19Kw. I'm sure that the sears 15hp must be a peak rating, so I'm hoping that a 15hp peak electric with 8hp continuous would
work. I just don't want to under power this conversion.

Tommy L sends.....
mosh.gif
 
with some more digging I found a ME-1004 200amps 400amps 6.4kw continuous and 16kw for 1 minute.
Here's the description:

The ME1004 is a same motor as the ME0708 but it has a double brush set to handle 200 amps continuous. This is a Permanent Magnet, Brush Type, DC Motor with Neodymium Iron Boron Magnets. The 1" shaft is similar to the shaft on most Lawn and Garden Tractor engines. This motor is perfect for an engine replacement on a Lawn and Garden tractor when converting the tractor to electric propulsion. No motor control is necessary for an engine-swap, but you will need to add a Contactor, Fuse, and 48 VDC batteries. For applications where a motor controller is required, we recommend that you use an AXE4855 and a solenoid that is rated for 400 amp continuous like the MZJ-400D with the appropriate diode & pre-charge resistor.Capable of 200 amps continuous, and 500 amps for 1 minute. The efficiency is 90%.

And......no controller. This makes for interesting replacement. Any thoughts?

Tommy L sends....
mosh.gif
 
Tommy L said:
with some more digging I found a ME-1004 200amps 400amps 6.4kw continuous and 16kw for 1 minute.
............
And......no controller. This makes for interesting replacement. Any thoughts?
Click to expand...

Don't let your grass get tall or wet. That motor looks good on paper, but the larger commutator PM motors prove to be fragile in application where overload is common and durability falls short. If you're replacing a 15hp gas engine and expect to do the same mowing duty, get a wound field motor. At least the size of a golf cart motor; next size bigger would be better. Ever wonder why they don't use PM motors on golf carts? Ask Briggs & Stratton. Etek :cry:
 
Hi Major!

Are you the same major and on diyev? If so, I've read through your posts while researching. :)

I'm pretty good with electrical, but choosing a motor proves to be out of my league. Under Wound-Field DC Motors I now have a choice of
4. Series, Split Series, Compound and Shunt wounds.

If I'm replacing a 15hp Gas, then I would like it to perform as such or what would the point be? lol Yes, of course some people may take the deck
off and use the tractor for LSV and/or pulling around a cart, in which a couple of hp would do the job. I didn't realize that spinning the cutting
blades required tons of hp. I was thinking that electric torque would be the ticket, and therefore, you'd be able to down size the motor. But
apparently not :( Ok......so what is my best choice, and with your pick, controller or no controller?

Thank you kindly!
Tommy L sends.....

http://www.dcmotorsinc.com/wound-field-design.php
 
That's why I mentioned it. The blade is the bitch of loads. Load curve is that of a fan: Power increase to the cube of RPM. Then throw in chopped vegetable matter and it gets ugly in a hurry. Propulsion is a breeze compared to that, especially on flat yards. Mower blade drives are such a bitch for electric motors I typically avoid working with them. If I get cornered, I recommend a big electric motor. Here's a case in point. We did this for my friend Tony on an ElecTrak retrofit.
file.php



The tractor has its own propulsion motor and then the deck has has this 7.2 inch diameter compound wound motor belt driving 3 blades at 60 inch. A true monster deck.

The compound motor is nice as it has the finite no load speed, but yet the strong overload like a series motor. They may be hard to come by. Since you mention the DIY EV forum, search it for mower and you can see some attempts. Also, I noticed this: http://www.diyelectriccar.com/forums/showthread.php/briggs-stratton-etek-crown-forklift-motor-86510.html That Crown motor would be a decent candidate for you. I'd recommend a controller with it and a overspeed protection circuit.
 
I just finished speaking with John at Motenergy.com. He said that he designed the ME-1004 for just that purpose. Longer shaft and is
convinced that the ME-1004 will replace my 15hp with no problems. He use to work for B&S and says they had him doing electric motor conversion
tests/comparisons every few years, but because some people cut grass for 1/2 hour and others for 7 hours, electric is not there in the market.

I'll try the ME-1004. If it works, great! If not, it becomes a motor for a mid-drive project. :)

John truly believes that 100amps at 48v is plenty for cutting/driving without hills in the mix. So 5kw. It's continuous duty is 10kw.
My watt meter will be sucking my 36.8ah 51.2v pack dry 0.37hours (22 minutes). Also, I could make the pack 46ah 51.2v and go for 28 minutes! lol
Wow! No wonder a car needs a huge Kw pack. 28 minutes is 2.3kw of juice. A long extension cord may help.....lol :)

Tommy L sends....
 
Tommy L said:
I just finished speaking with John at Motenergy.com. ... is convinced that the ME-1004 will replace my 15hp with no problems.
Click to expand...

Good luck with that. Get a money back warranty in writing from him :wink:
 
major said:
Tommy L said:
I just finished speaking with John at Motenergy.com. ... is convinced that the ME-1004 will replace my 15hp with no problems.
Click to expand...

Good luck with that. Get a money back warranty in writing from him :wink:
Click to expand...

Hmmmmmm, Major, it sounds like you would believe that it's not the right motor for the job. :shock:

and not shocked :(

Dang, I like to do it right the first time.

Search continues ........ Do let me know if there is a motor that you'd like or find.

Thank you Major!

Tommy L sends.....
 
You know Tommy, it might work. But where I live the grass grows tall and fast in the spring. Even trying to keep up with it several times a week I manage to stall my 17hp Kawasaki at will with a 48" deck. I've never owned a mower I couldn't stall without even trying. O.K. Maybe you live with wimpy thin grass and mow way too often and that PM motor will do just fine.

That guy does make some nice motors for what they are. But he is trying to sell you one of his motors. I'm giving you free advice. Maybe it's worth what you pay for it. But I'd like to see that guy he is talking about who mows for 7 hours with an electric :?

I linked you to a DIY classified 6.6" series motor for sale. That is golf cart size with sturdy comm from a small fork truck. You'll need a controller. An Alltrax or Curtis 1204 and overspeed cutout circuit would do. And you could smoke that motor as well, but I'm bettin' it would last a hell of a lot longer.
 
major said:
But I'd like to see that guy he is talking about who mows for 7 hours with an electric :?
Click to expand...

Hi Major,

No no no, misunderstanding. B&S would test electrics against gas, but they know the market could have people cutting from 1/2 hr to 7 hours.
So because people have a wide range of cutting times, to sell an all electric rider would only work for a few people.

I'll try the ME1004 and report back here. :) Ordering today. Simple conversion, no controller. Yes, I have wimpy grass here. lol :)

Tommy L sends....
 
Go to evalbum and check out the tractor conversions there. There are a lot of people using the motenergy motors. I am interested, because whenever my 12.5 hp briggs and straton craps out on my 40" murray riding mower I will electrify it. Electric has a hell of lot more usable torque than a gas mower. :?: :?: :?: :?:
 
wineboyrider said:
Go to evalbum and check out the tractor conversions there. There are a lot of people using the motenergy motors. I am interested, because whenever my 12.5 hp briggs and straton craps out on my 40" murray riding mower I will electrify it. Electric has a hell of lot more usable torque than a gas mower. :?: :?: :?: :?:
Click to expand...

Wineboyrider,

Major bogs his 17hp ICE down, so I'm thinking that I'm going to give the ME1004 a shot. John at Motenergy.com designed and tested the ME1004
for 1,000 hrs at 8.4kw continuous. I'm thinking that if I run this unit on my lawn mower and watch my amps and watt/hours like I do on my Ebikes,
then all should be good. Ensuring that there is enough Battery amperage available so the cells do not sag, will keep the RPM up and the amps down
as long as the load is minimum. Kind of cool running this wide open, then when there is load, amps increase and battery gets sucked dry! lol
My guess is 2.5kw pack will get eaten up in 30 minutes. I'm in the process of making my LiFePO4 modular to run between the Ebikes and the Mower.

I will post pictures as this build progresses. I will order the motor, wire, contactor, fuse. I need to learn about using a shunt to monitor
watt hours.

Tommy L sends.....
 
Parts are ordered!

ME-1004 direct for B&S 1" shaft :)
Fuse Holder + Fuse
Contactor 600amp continuous (used in commercial applications for high current connect/disconnect)
2 gauge wire with lugs, heatshrink, crimper and big wire cutters
CA V2
High current Shunt

Up next...... Unboxing when packages arrive!

Tommy L sends.....
mosh.gif
 
Tommy L said:
Parts are ordered!

ME-1004 direct for B&S 1" shaft :)
Fuse Holder + Fuse
Contactor 600amp continuous (used in commercial applications for high current connect/disconnect)
2 gauge wire with lugs, heatshrink, crimper and big wire cutters
CA V2
High current Shunt

Up next...... Unboxing when packages arrive!

Tommy L sends.....
mosh.gif
Click to expand...


A month ago I was researching electric conversion for my 38" zeroturn. I concluded that the 1004 was the best/simplest/cost effective motor after a few hours of research. But in the end I decided against it as my motor probably has under a hundred hours and runs great. Plus my conversion would be about $1500 with lifepo4/lithium batteries of at least 20ah
 
stonny9 said:
A month ago I was researching electric conversion for my 38" zeroturn. I concluded that the 1004 was the best/simplest/cost effective motor after a few hours of research. But in the end I decided against it as my motor probably has under a hundred hours and runs great. Plus my conversion would be about $1500 with lifepo4/lithium batteries of at least 20kwh
Click to expand...

It seems like the ME-1004 will be good. I'll see once together and running. I'll take down the stats.

$1500 for LiFePO4 of 20kwh? Did you mean $15,000? or did you mean $1500 for 2kwh?

Tommy L sends.....
mosh.gif
 
Tommy L said:
stonny9 said:
A month ago I was researching electric conversion for my 38" zeroturn. I concluded that the 1004 was the best/simplest/cost effective motor after a few hours of research. But in the end I decided against it as my motor probably has under a hundred hours and runs great. Plus my conversion would be about $1500 with lifepo4/lithium batteries of at least 20ah
Click to expand...

It seems like the ME-1004 will be good. I'll see once together and running. I'll take down the stats.

$1500 for LiFePO4 of 20kwh? Did you mean $15,000? or did you mean $1500 for 2kwh?

Tommy L sends.....
mosh.gif
Click to expand...


Excuse my possible mistyping. From my calculations it was about $900 for the batteries at 48v and 20ah.
 
Rotary decks might be sucking most of the juice. If you can drag a cylinder mower, you might cut cost down on motor and Batteries.

ES member MyLittlePony used a 1000W brushie:
(Second half of vid has motor & mower shots.)
[youtube]vgQniLh9fEc[/youtube]

http://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=34&t=36179&p=586979&#p586979
 
TylerDurden said:
http://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=34&t=36179&p=586979&#p586979
Click to expand...

Awesome Thread!

Thank you TD!

Tommy L sends....
mosh.gif
 
Find yourself a nice reel like mylittlepony did and you're in business with almost any motor, but for goodness sake use a good hubbie stepped down with a good belt reduction and enjoy some silence. His rattletrap is even more annoying than a gasser, but it demonstrates what a crappy little 1kw brushed motor can do, so imagine how well something like my 2 speed MiniMonster would fare and give you 2 speeds with no tranny.

I've been looking for a decently priced wide reel or gang of 3 to do a tractor from scratch for the kids, but the reels are the sticking point and the golf courses aren't coughing up any of their used stuff. Some of those hover deck electric mowers with no wheels are so cheap that I'm tempted to gang 3 of them together and run a big inverter, so the tractor part is mostly a big battery carrier.

John
 
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