Steel-geared hub motor?

if you think helical makes no noticeable difference to power, their is a good example on the currie motors

http://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=28&t=33816&start=25

For the older MY1018z with strait cut gears and the the newer XYD-16 with helical gears.

Both motors are the exact same size and the only difference is the gearbox teeth.

Postby veloman » Tue Sep 04, 2012 2:50 pm

What makes the newer currie motor less powerful? It's the same size I believe. I just picked up a cheap ezip ecoride on craigslist, for the quiet currie motor on it. I plan to either add it on my main 9c ebike, or do a lightweight build with it as a mid drive to the front chainrings like my old ebike builds.

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Re: Currie-EZip ebike Kit $289.88 - Amazon.com

Postby DrkAngel » Fri Jul 22, 2011 1:32 pm

I finally had a chance, to take a good look at the motor on my latest EZip.
I felt it to be different for 2 reasons.
1. It seemed to have slightly less power, than earlier motors.
2. It was, comparatively, extremely quiet.

Closer inspection revealed it to be a totally different motor.
Previous models used the MY1080Z motor.
This model used the XYD-16 motor. Top speed, with the XYD-16, is approximately 10% slower, than the previous MY1080Z model.
21mph, motor only, cruising speed vs 23mph. (25.9v Li-ion w/16T modded)

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by neptronix » Sat Aug 13, 2011 7:59 pm

The helical gears are what's reducing the noise, half of the noise that the older eZips produces is gear noise alone.
Helical gears are less efficient. That could be where you are losing your power

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So yes helical is quiet but that comes to a bit hit in power and efficiency that is definitely noticeable.

Please stop this offtopic and bs. Not place nor time.

after the success with delta conversion on this motor [ BIG BLOCK GNG alternative Motor ] http://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=28&t=57483&start=125#p899408
The BigBlock pulls exactly the some no load Power in Delta as in WYE for the same rpm. The Bafang BPM2 did pull ~7% more in Delta which was no good sign so I switched back to WYE.


i'm willing to try it with this one now... let's see if this works in Delta as good as in WYE

bad news. i just climbed the local hill, before i wanted to start the Delta conversion this evening. The hill is 10-15% and ~3.5 km distance from bottom to the top. i run it 25A with the KU93 controller with 12s lipo 44.4V niminal, it still had 46V no load when the motor died. it died only 50m in front of the top

checked on motor temp in the middle of the hill...was still ok. could touch it. On top of the hill when it burned i could not touch it. Smelled only slightly

i'll have a look inside tomorrow, but i guess that at least one phase has burned

damn...

Received bafang BPM motor today. Wow, have not seen so good quality chinese hub motor yet. Can't compare to this one.

BPM is great.. best one I now. But then have a look at the CST... it even comes with temp probe wire (white one, not connected in stock) and 0.3mm lams

i got a new one about a month later last year. It worked fine till February 2015 (sensorless, 13s 48V, 15A), then the axle twisted. I did not notice my torque arm was cracked. Replaced the axle, after 200m it broke again, since my TA was broken Bought a MAC motor the next day

I have rewound mine to 2x speed (~50km/h at 36V 24") and did not use it much... PM if anyone interested.

4 years later.... Are there any steel helical gears out there?
Anyone has ideas where to salvage a full gearset from, cheaply, just to test the concept?

http://www.topsecretev.com/helical-cut-steel-planetary-gears-for-hub-motors/
Looks like these guys tested it and it was "loud like hell". Mh....

circuit said:

Looks like these guys tested it and it was "loud like hell". Mh....

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cant find that quote. Cant find a source for those BPM helical gears either.

A BTM isnt that loud anyway, the weak point is the clutch, my BPM all had a clutch failure (gets stuck or slipps) or the bearings of those blue nylon gears failed. So where is the matter?

crossbreak said:

circuit said:

Looks like these guys tested it and it was "loud like hell". Mh....

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cant find that quote. Cant find a source for those BPM helical gears either.

A BTM isnt that loud anyway, the weak point is the clutch, my BPM all had a clutch failure (gets stuck or slipps) or the bearings of those blue nylon gears failed. So where is the matter?

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Here:

motor noise just screams at anything over 500~750 watts

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BPM is a really bad example. I have one, and it is extremely weak, produces around 15Nm of torque, just like small front mount hubs at 2kg.
My intention is to make a custom, powerful motor. As stated in a first sentence of post #1.

My intention is to make a custom, powerful motor. As stated in a first sentence of post #1.

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which thread? link?

crossbreak said:

My intention is to make a custom, powerful motor. As stated in a first sentence of post #1.

Click to expand...

which thread? link?

Click to expand...

Try clicking on [1] at the bottom of this page. It will send you to the thread.

your first post:

Anyone seen those anywhere?

I am planning a 2kW+ build with 12" wheels. Apparently nylon gears will not work. My desire is to find something similar to MAC motor, but with steel helical gears and oil-filled.
* steel means strength and reliability
* helical means silence
* oil means good lubrication and cooling

I have searcher for a few months now, and was able to find only one such motor.....

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no word about building a motor

circuit said:

BPM is a really bad example. I have one, and it is extremely weak, produces around 15Nm of torque, just like small front mount hubs at 2kg.

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which small 2kg hub? I want that one! the only motor that comes close to the BPM i know is the MAC. Maybe your had a damiaged phase wire or somethin

crossbreak said:

circuit said:

BPM is a really bad example. I have one, and it is extremely weak, produces around 15Nm of torque, just like small front mount hubs at 2kg.

Click to expand...

which small 2kg hub? I want that one! the only motor that comes close to the BPM i know is the MAC. Maybe your had a damiaged phase wire or somethin

Click to expand...

BPM is nicely built, I can say that.
However, after very poor results, I have looked deeper in to it. Then I found a small MXUS XF07. Checked it's performance on ebikes.ca simulator, mainly looked at torque and efficiency curves, at much lower weight.

I repeat myself: I am looking for a hub motor or any other piece of hardware that I can take apart and use it's planetary gearset, maybe dual stage, to build a proper custom light hub motor.

thanks for the hint. the MXUS looks like a nice motor.

i have such a motor like you posted a link in the first post with burned windings. You can have it for 5 bucks if you want. The gears are nice

Check PM
Would be great to have two donors like that, to make a dual-stage gear.

hi all the steel gears are easily available, i did a search for hub motor steel gears on aliexpress and got these three links below they come in 28t and 36t flavors i have the smaller ones in an old swx? bfang motor 14t reterminatedin delta and filled with ealed bearings a custom breather pipe with an anti oil air gadget made from a small piece of alloy marker pen case and a felt tip pen nib with the felt removed that stops the oil spray getting in to the breather outlet in side the motor its all sealed up with automotive oil resistant silicine on the side cover and bearing journals in the motor case and doubled phase wires and breather pipe stuffed through the axel hole ( bastard of a job even lubed with said silicone) it does not leak and 40ml of atf inside makes no difference to the noload current. it is fed with an enerton vesc-x 4.2 55battery amps 75a phase from 12s lipo soon to be 14s a123 lifepo4 20 ah cells eats this all day towing my daughter and shopping up some fairly steep hills and commuting 6kms to work . i love oil cooled hubs ... i cant kill it. No idea how many kms ive done but after more than a year of daily use and it has killed my 20ah pair of mltistars they are trying to be a balloon and have been retired to a bleed resistor for final death before a 150kw ball of fire that lasts 30 seconds that is their full charge failure heat release rate if discharged in 30 seconds.

the gears i got i fitted with quality jap bearings before fitment and they are a little wider than the original plastic gears the chinese engineer made them with about 0.00mm clearance in the motor they needed the hobbing deformation and burrs on the sides lapped off with wetndry sand paper so they did not rub than they fit perfectly

only problem i had was in with the original motor in wye made so much torque it bruised damaged the keyway in the shaft but would climb anything even to the point of wheelying up things too steep to ride up and over 45a phase current it would freak the controller with saturation and the lame top speed was 28kmh. now in delta it is just a little less torquey but can eat all my tiny vesc can throw at it without saturating it is also setup sensorless so i could fit the breather pipe in the axel with the six phase wires(doubled for more amps) the problems with controller freaking were likely from dry solder poor joints on the wye termination that meant not all strands (5) of every phase were conducting i found this when i reterminated in delta .

links to steel gears that are available for all the older bafang hubs

this one offers all four sizes of gears, count teeth carefully before you buy 27t 28t 31t 36t

https://www.aliexpress.com/item/Ebird-Electric-Bike-Motor-Gear-For-Bafang-Hub-Motor-Plastic-Gear-Replacement/32801232911.html?spm=2114.search0104.3.277.4c7861870f06UF&ws_ab_test=searchweb0_0,searchweb201602_7_10065_10068_10130_10547_319_317_10548_10696_453_10084_454_10083_10618_10307_537_536_10131_10132_10902_10133_10059_10884_10887_321_322_10103,searchweb201603_35,ppcSwitch_0&algo_expid=ee845af7-2a7c-46fe-84a3-939046819e69-39&algo_pvid=ee845af7-2a7c-46fe-84a3-939046819e69&transAbTest=ae803_4


thisone is only the 36t but they are cheaper

https://www.aliexpress.com/item/3Pcs-36-teeth-38mm-Metal-Steel-Electric-Bike-Motor-Gear-For-Bafang-Hub-Motor-Plastic-Gear/32953212306.html?spm=2114.search0104.3.312.4c7861870f06UF&ws_ab_test=searchweb0_0,searchweb201602_7_10065_10068_10130_10547_319_317_10548_10696_453_10084_454_10083_10618_10307_537_536_10131_10132_10902_10133_10059_10884_10887_321_322_10103,searchweb201603_35,ppcSwitch_0&algo_expid=ee845af7-2a7c-46fe-84a3-939046819e69-44&algo_pvid=ee845af7-2a7c-46fe-84a3-939046819e69&transAbTest=ae803_4

this one only offers 28t and 36t but they are cheapest ive found

https://www.aliexpress.com/item/Planetary-Gear-E-bike-Hub-Motor-Gear-Nylon-Steel-Gear-28T-36T-XF07-XF08/32866725122.html?spm=2114.search0104.3.283.4c7861870f06UF&ws_ab_test=searchweb0_0,searchweb201602_7_10065_10068_10130_10547_319_317_10548_10696_453_10084_454_10083_10618_10307_537_536_10131_10132_10902_10133_10059_10884_10887_321_322_10103,searchweb201603_35,ppcSwitch_0&algo_expid=ee845af7-2a7c-46fe-84a3-939046819e69-40&algo_pvid=ee845af7-2a7c-46fe-84a3-939046819e69&transAbTest=ae803_4

3 hp out of a 250w advertised hub aint half bad... happy hotrodding

the are all not helical

I have welded my bafang. All fine.

I used a TIG machine (which is a precision instrument in welding world) to place a bead around shaft.

These are not helical and wil be loud as hell...