My Bafang Ultra Mountain Bike! Frey AM1000

robocam said:
Hold on a second here. You asked for $130, got your $130, and now you’re complaining and want more? That doesn’t sound very reasonable or fair.

This was well before the total cost of the replacement was known. If it would have been only the freehub it would have been $130. The claim was changed accordingly in Alibaba when the real extent of the issue that the whole rear wheel must be re-built was discovered.

Secondly the bike was almost new. 2 weeks, 200km’s. Thus it’s reasonable that Frey covers all the costs.
 
Are you in private communication with Frey about this? Did you even give them a chance to respond?

What I think would be fair is to have them either send you a new wheel (we’er past that in this case), or if they’re ok with it, pay a reasonable cost to cover the labor to install your own hub (~$60) and pay you the actual cost (what they pay) of the Quanta hub.

I have no doubt Frey would want to make this right because it’s in their best interest to do so but you have to be reasonable.

FlyingFinn said:
robocam said:
Hold on a second here. You asked for $130, got your $130, and now you’re complaining and want more? That doesn’t sound very reasonable or fair.

This was well before the total cost of the replacement was known. If it would have been only the freehub it would have been $130. The claim was changed accordingly in Alibaba when the real extent of the issue that the whole rear wheel must be re-built was discovered.
 
robocam said:
Are you in private communication with Frey about this? Did you even give them a chance to respond?

What I think would be fair is to have them either send you a new wheel (we’er past that in this case), or if they’re ok with it, pay a reasonable cost to cover the labor to install your own hub (~$60) and pay you the actual cost (what they pay) of the Quanta hub.

I have no doubt Frey would want to make this right because it’s in their best interest to do so but you have to be reasonable.

FlyingFinn said:
robocam said:
Hold on a second here. You asked for $130, got your $130, and now you’re complaining and want more? That doesn’t sound very reasonable or fair.

This was well before the total cost of the replacement was known. If it would have been only the freehub it would have been $130. The claim was changed accordingly in Alibaba when the real extent of the issue that the whole rear wheel must be re-built was discovered.

Yes I’ve been in full contact to them in AliBaba messages. They’ve responded there as well except to my last messages. I’ve provided the full arsenal of photos to them as attached to the refund claim.

They’ve made the decision to decline my 311$ refund application so we can assume they’ve had enough time to respond. The time to respond in Alibaba is around 7 days.
 
Why do you think they owe you $311? I mean, it sucks that this happened to you but let’s see if we’re being reasonable customers here.

FlyingFinn said:
...They’ve made the decision to decline my 311$ refund application...
 
robocam said:
Why do you think they owe you $311? I mean, it sucks that this happened to you but let’s see if we’re being reasonable customers here.

FlyingFinn said:
...They’ve made the decision to decline my 311$ refund application...

Because that’s the price how much it cost for me to put the bike back to working order. 224$ for parts and 87$ for work.

I don’t know how you define warranty but to my knowledge it means fixing stuff back to working order at the expense of the seller.
 
What did the $224 in parts cover? What specific parts did you buy? Was it an upgraded/different hub?

FlyingFinn said:
Because that’s the price how much it cost for me to put the bike back to working order. 224$ for parts and 87$ for work.

I don’t know how you define warranty but to my knowledge it means fixing stuff back to working order at the expense of the seller.
 
robocam said:
What did the $224 in parts cover? What specific parts did you buy? Was it an upgraded/different hub?

FlyingFinn said:
Because that’s the price how much it cost for me to put the bike back to working order. 224$ for parts and 87$ for work.

I don’t know how you define warranty but to my knowledge it means fixing stuff back to working order at the expense of the seller.

I bought a DT Swiss 190mm rear hub. As it was the last example of 190mm rear hub with thru-axle in the whole of Finland (only 5.5M inhabitants) and the rear wheel was already sitting dismantled in a different bikeshop I understandably didn’t have much choice. The receipt of the hub is in the message above.
 
So you think it’s fair to ask Frey to pay the full cost of your upgraded DT Swiss hub?

FlyingFinn said:
It was a DT Swiss 190mm rear hub. As it was the last example of 190mm rear hub with thru-axle in the whole of Finland (only 5.5M inhabitants) and the rear wheel was already sitting dismantled in a different bikeshop I understandably didn’t have much choice. The receipt of the hub is in a message above.
 
Just for your information, i accepted the 130USD hub replacement money in my case, which is far more than the value/actual costs. Then I bought an upgraded DT swiss wheel myself. Going around the warranty process and start replacing your broken parts and then expecting them to pay is not reasonable nor agreed upon beforehand from what I read. Them sending a new rear wheel would have been the warranty coverage you're talking about or sending a hub and pay for the costs of changing/rebuilding.
 
Hardcore said:
Just for your information, i accepted the 130USD hub replacement money in my case, which is far more than the value/actual costs. Then I bought an upgraded DT swiss wheel myself. Going around the warranty process and start replacing your broken parts and then expecting them to pay is not reasonable nor agreed upon beforehand from what I read. Them sending a new rear wheel would have been the warranty coverage you're talking about or sending a hub and pay for the costs of changing/rebuilding.

Well atleast to pay the value of the orginal hub 100$? and replacement work 87$.
 
I have no idea about the costs of things, nor did I expect them to pay the replacement costs fully in my case as in Switzerland the hourly rate is simply too high compared to, for instance, China. So I was happy with my resolution as I got the bike up and running within 3 days. I don't know what else you can expect from them. If you believe you deserve a better deal by all means
 
Hardcore said:
I have no idea about the costs of things, nor did I expect them to pay the replacement costs fully in my case as in Switzerland the hourly rate is simply too high compared to, for instance, China. So I was happy with my resolution as I got the bike up and running within 3 days. I don't know what else you can expect from them. If you believe you deserve a better deal by all means

As I was told that this was the first case involving this particular issue after hundreds of sold bikes and you can’t afford to pay 300$ to cover your f*ck-up, I think you’re in the wrong business.

I do retail myself and would never treat my customers like this if the fault has been at my end. The key priority is to get the end product fixed asap and the client happy. If it involves more expensive labour then it does. In the end the client hasn’t chosen where it breaks. Client chooses only where he buys...

If you’re only covering to pay rates for an Asian wrench-wielding flip flop masterpiece then don’t call it a warranty. Then it’s something else like: Free spare parts for a limited time and the new part arrives after a month! Meanwhile you can enjoy walking...
 
When you contacted Frey, what options did they give you?

FlyingFinn said:
As I was told that this was the first case involving this particular issue after hundreds of sold bikes and you can’t afford to pay 300$ to cover your f*ck-up, I think you’re in the wrong business.

I do retail myself and would never treat my customers like this if the fault has been at my end. The key priority is to get the end product fixed asap and the client happy. If it involves more expensive labour then it does. In the end the client hasn’t chosen where it breaks. Client chooses only where he buys...

If you’re only covering to pay rates from an Asian wrench-wielding flip flop masterpiece then don’t call it a warranty. Then it’s something else like: Free spare parts for a limited time and the new part arrives after a month! Meanwhile you can enjoy walking...
 
Just curious about your opinion on how this is being handled.

formula101 said:
LOL, I sure hope for their sake Frey doesn't scam you on customer service. It would prove my point, but....
 
robocam said:
When you contacted Frey, what options did they give you?

Offered a new 36-hole hub to be installed on a 32-hole rim. Only a true genius would try something like that. Would had had to buy another rim on my own...

Or

130$ cash which I escalated to AliBaba.

Or

A new rear wheel which I don’t need since I already bought the new hub.
 
FlyingFinn said:
Offered a ......
130$ cash which I escalated to AliBaba.
.....
Please I really don't understand why you are dissapointed in Frey. You have reason to be dissapointed of the quality of (some) parts, but IMHO Frey has given your reasonable offers. That you didn't want two of these offers I can imagine.
Here in your first post you announced this problem:
FlyingFinn said:
]........
Had to buy a DT Swiss rear hub for 259€!!! ........
I opened a partial refund case for $130 in AliBaba. This episode is going to cost me atleast 350€ replacement work included!........
They offered this asked amount to you too and you have escalate it to a dispute.
I don't understand why there must be a dispute if Frey is giving you what your asking for.
 
Elinx said:
FlyingFinn said:
Offered a ......
130$ cash which I escalated to AliBaba.
.....
Please I really don't understand why you are dissapointed in Frey. You have reason to be dissapointed of the quality of (some) parts, but IMHO Frey has given your reasonable offers. That you didn't want two of these offers I can imagine.
Here in your first post you announced this problem:
FlyingFinn said:
]........
Had to buy a DT Swiss rear hub for 259€!!! ........
I opened a partial refund case for $130 in AliBaba. This episode is going to cost me atleast 350€ replacement work included!........
They offered this asked amount to you too and you have escalate it to a dispute.
I don't understand why there must be a dispute if Frey is giving you what your asking for.

They refused to pay that amount at first. Now when the real extent of the issue was discovered I’m not happy with that amount anymore.
 
FlyingFinn said:
...
They refused to pay that amount at first. Now when the real extent of the issue was discovered I’m not happy with that amount anymore.
OK, that explains something, but I can imagine that Alibaba conclude the same as I did first.
I hope for you it will be different.
 
When they refused to pay that amount, was this through the Ali messaging system or here in this thread? Was it before or after you showed them pictures?

FlyingFinn said:
Elinx said:
FlyingFinn said:
Offered a ......
130$ cash which I escalated to AliBaba.
.....
Please I really don't understand why you are dissapointed in Frey. You have reason to be dissapointed of the quality of (some) parts, but IMHO Frey has given your reasonable offers. That you didn't want two of these offers I can imagine.
Here in your first post you announced this problem:
FlyingFinn said:
]........
Had to buy a DT Swiss rear hub for 259€!!! ........
I opened a partial refund case for $130 in AliBaba. This episode is going to cost me atleast 350€ replacement work included!........
They offered this asked amount to you too and you have escalate it to a dispute.
I don't understand why there must be a dispute if Frey is giving you what your asking for.

They refused to pay that amount at first. Now when the real extent of the issue was discovered I’m not happy with that amount anymore.
 
I checked with a square this time (to make sure the ruler markings line up), and it is closer to 28-3/4" at the lowest point. The bike is flat on the ground unloaded. That's just about where you would be if you got off your seat. This is a medium framed X-1. Batboy, I'll try to measure my AM1000 for you soon.

IMG_0956 - standover-s.jpg


formula101 said:
Do you mind posting a photo? The question is what is the standover at the point where someone would actually stand over the bicycle not the lowest possible standover measurement obtainable.

In bicycle shoes, someone with a 28" inseam might improve their standover by half an inch.

Bikes these days (27.5, 29, 26 with fat tires) with suspension, aren't really designed to have much more than 29" of standover in a best case scenario...
 
robocam said:
When they refused to pay that amount, was this through the Ali messaging system or here in this thread? Was it before or after you showed them pictures?

FlyingFinn said:
Elinx said:
FlyingFinn said:
Offered a ......
130$ cash which I escalated to AliBaba.
.....
Please I really don't understand why you are dissapointed in Frey. You have reason to be dissapointed of the quality of (some) parts, but IMHO Frey has given your reasonable offers. That you didn't want two of these offers I can imagine.
Here in your first post you announced this problem:
FlyingFinn said:
]........
Had to buy a DT Swiss rear hub for 259€!!! ........
I opened a partial refund case for $130 in AliBaba. This episode is going to cost me atleast 350€ replacement work included!........
They offered this asked amount to you too and you have escalate it to a dispute.
I don't understand why there must be a dispute if Frey is giving you what your asking for.

They refused to pay that amount at first. Now when the real extent of the issue was discovered I’m not happy with that amount anymore.

It was in Alibaba before the pictures when the bikeshop wrongfully informed me that only the freehub needs to be changed.
 
So initially you wanted Frey to give you $130 when you thought it just needed a new freehub?

FlyingFinn said:
It was in Alibaba before the pictures when the bikeshop wrongfully informed me that only the freehub needs to be changed.
 
robocam said:
I checked with a square this time (to make sure the ruler markings line up), and it is closer to 28-3/4" at the lowest point. The bike is flat on the ground unloaded. That's just about where you would be if you got off your seat. This is a medium framed X-1. Batboy, I'll try to measure my AM1000 for you soon.

formula101 said:
Do you mind posting a photo? The question is what is the standover at the point where someone would actually stand over the bicycle not the lowest possible standover measurement obtainable.

In bicycle shoes, someone with a 28" inseam might improve their standover by half an inch.

Bikes these days (27.5, 29, 26 with fat tires) with suspension, aren't really designed to have much more than 29" of standover in a best case scenario...

Awesome, thanks for the followup robocam. :)

Geometry charts for e-bikes are typically barebones at best, and flat out inaccurate in too many cases. It's great to see real world measurements to verify.

robocam said:
Just curious about your opinion on how this is being handled.

formula101 said:
LOL, I sure hope for their sake Frey doesn't scam you on customer service. It would prove my point, but....

I think he should've contacted Frey first instead of throwing them under the bus online. How can they possibly address the problem if they don't know of it's existence in the first place?!? At least give them a chance to respond and make things right. Instead, he threw a fit online and fixed the problem himself and then gave a non-committal "I think they should do something to make it right" response without giving an indication that he'd even contact the company in the future for a follow up.

I don't even buy this argument that the hub was crap quality. Failures are commonplace with even the most expensive bikes and components. The highest end carbon and ti frames can and do fail. You can taco aluminum rims of any price. Conversely, I've bought many cheap components and even bikes that were reliable for many years. I recently bought a few replacement stems for $7 each, and aside from having to buy a couple of additional spacers, they are perfectly functional and of good quality. There is no consistent correlation between price and durability or performance.

As far as Frey, they were technically in the right asking for photos and whatnot, but as far as their PR game, it almost always makes sense to appease a customer who has the leverage to make you look bad online and thereby hurt your bottom line. Their failing was more of a practical rather than an ethical one.

The customer had a right to be upset and to note the problem but seemed more intent on causing drama online rather than do the right thing and solve this behind the scenes.
 
FlyingFinn said:
Elinx said:
FlyingFinn said:
Offered a ......
130$ cash which I escalated to AliBaba.
.....
Please I really don't understand why you are dissapointed in Frey. You have reason to be dissapointed of the quality of (some) parts, but IMHO Frey has given your reasonable offers. That you didn't want two of these offers I can imagine.
Here in your first post you announced this problem:
FlyingFinn said:
]........
Had to buy a DT Swiss rear hub for 259€!!! ........
I opened a partial refund case for $130 in AliBaba. This episode is going to cost me atleast 350€ replacement work included!........
They offered this asked amount to you too and you have escalate it to a dispute.
I don't understand why there must be a dispute if Frey is giving you what your asking for.

They refused to pay that amount at first. Now when the real extent of the issue was discovered I’m not happy with that amount anymore.

OK, this boy is flat out insane. I'm all in on Team FREY!

He is setting himself up for bad karma.
 
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