BMSBATTERY Customer Experience LiFeP04

[dlocke49]

I am starting this discussion to report my current experience with BMSBATTERY.com customer service. I placed an order with them on 3/3/11 for two 16AH 48V LiFeP04 battery packs and a 2000 watt charger. The purpose is also to inform other buyers about what kind of service to expect when ordering from this company. Today is 3/25/11 and my order has still not shipped. I keep asking them when it will ship and all they say is that they are testing the pack. How can it take over 3 weeks to test a pack? Before I ordered anything I asked them how long it would take to ship and they said 6 days.

I am looking at 22 days now and they still have not shipped! Very frustrating to say the least when the weather here in Dallas is so nice and I can't ride the bike. They say that the very expensive shipping only takes 2-3 days but I seriously doubt that will really happen. I have informed them that this is not acceptable and all they do is say sorry and that it will ship tomorrow. I think this is not good when the order amount is over $1,300 and all this seems so fishy. I would understand if they would just answer my questions about why it has not shipped but they flat won't do it.

I understand things happen sometimes but at least tell the customer the truth and what is going on. I have communicated all this to them and even told them I would report my experience with thier company honestly good or bad on this website. Jack is the guy that seems to run the place but I really don't know. All my experience with ping at ping batteries have been excellent. He promises 1 week to build it and 1 week to ship it. I have ordered 3 packs from him. The only problem with pings are that they are low C rated at 1? The bmsbattery pack is supposedly 10C.

I will keep adding to this discussion as things happen. They promised they would ship today after I opened a paypal dispute resolution ticket so my fingers are crossed..... I read some comments on this site about their poor customer service AFTER I place the order. Wish I had seen them before. Oh well... An informed buyer is a good thing.

Here is the scoop from my point of view and opinion:
Pros:
1. Nicely designed website that looks legit and easy to get the order into the cart.
2. Prices are fair execpt for very high shipping costs.
3. The battery packs appear to be good quality with the right BMS.
6. The bike motors and kits appear to be a good value.
7. When I ordered this company seemed to be the only source for the cylindrical cells that I think are called Headway cells. Since this bad experience I have found other sources though.
Cons:
1. The payment method screens are not well designed and you cannot pay with a credit card. You may be able to with a mastercard but I don't have that one. The paypal deduction from your checking account takes 3 to 6 business days to go thru. I think that is too long and don't know why that is..... It took 6 calender days for mine to go thru. That is wasted time and a hassle.
2. The online chat feature is a great idea but the people on the other end of this one are VERY clueless. They ask you if it is ok for this or that and will not answer almost all questions direclty. Seems fishy and not an english/mandarin translation problem.... I could not get a straight answer from anyone. All they do is ask unrelated sidetrack questions of the customer and never answer yours. Not a fun game to play.
3. Shipping cost are outrageously high. China is half way around the world though and everything goes on a plane instead of a slow boat.
4. Would be nice to have better and multiple pictures of packs and other products for viewing.
5. They may delay orders for many weeks due to lack of inventory based on just in time ordering. They don't tell you either so its a crap shoot.
6. Chinese companies will do well to learn that customer service is the most important part of growing a business and making more money. Quality of products is next but if the customer service is bad they will get the same product somewhere else EVERY time!

If you have ordered from them, please let me know how your experience went. I am kind of worried at this point about mine.....

[adrian_sm]

I have ordered chargers from them before. It all took a very long time, but I got what I wanted in the end. I wasn't in a hurry so I didn't care.

Communication was slow, and took a lot more effort than I expected. I got the distinct impression that they did not actually stock anything at all. That when you placed an order, they then went out and tried to source your parts from some of their local suppliers/distributors/factories whatever.

So if you don't mind these people being your middlemen in a far away land, dealing with the endless questions, and slow delivery, for the final price + shipping price, go for it. But most of us from a western society expect a store that stock real products.

I could be wrong, but based on the sort of experience others have had I think my guess may be right.

[auraslip]

That's crazy. I've had the exact same experience and I live in dallas too! Denton to be exact... where do you live?
Anyways I ordered on 2/27 and they still haven't shipped. They didn't respond to my last e-mail either....
I really wish I payed with a credit card! I payed with my debit card through paypal. I hope there is some sort of protection through that.

It is really frustrating! Just a tiny bit of honesty and communication would make the process so much easier. Just a little note on items not stocked that explains how long it can take!

[dlocke49]

Hi Auraslip,

Well it looks like we are in the same boat on this. I live in Richardson. Small world. We will have to get together and ride sometime if you want. We have a small group here in Dallas that go riding on the trails and have fun. See: www.daltools.com/deba. Dallas Electric Bike Association. What did you order and what kind of bike do you have? You can contact me privately through the web site if you like.

I started a paypal resolution to see about getting the money back if I have to. Would rather they just do what they said they would do though. Maybe they eventually will I don't know. I did the same thing as you and put it on a debit card from my bank through moneybookers. I have never had a problem before like this so let's hope they come through. I think they wait for enough orders to buy in bulk and then ship out the orders. I hope they do not buy seconds from the manufacturer.......

[auraslip]

Awesome! I had no idea about deba! Very excited!! As far as I know there are a 3-4 other ebikers on the forum that live in the DFW area.
I would love to go to a group meeting, unfortunley I live in Denton and don't have a car, so I'd have to have my GF drive me down.

[thewmatusmoloki]

"There is a new web page,, call

<fake one.>
http://ebike-bmsbattery.com/index.php

the real one, is below here.
http://www.bmsbattery.com/index.php?mai ... cPath=1_10

I thought it was belong to Bmsbattery !.. it wasn't , i re-confirmed with the real seller bmsbattery.com they told me, it was a fake web site. 100% fake. the bmsbattery.com has just launched his opening web site. i think he is just a reseller only hoping somebody will order from him, he will source from bmsbattery.com or from some where else.

cheers
kentlim "



This warning is in the "manufacturers to avoid thread"
Which website did you buy through ?

[dlocke49]

I ordered from the "real" one, www.bmsbattery.com

I can't imagine how much longer it would take to get stuff from the fake one if he goes through the real one!

[dlocke49]

Update: Got an email this morning that it shipped Saturday from Hong Kong! They were correct when they say 2-3 day shipping because I should get it today (Monday) since the tracking says it is here in town out for delivery. That is very fast shipping by plane but it still took 25 days total to get it. I would not be so disappointed if they would have just said that instead of promising it would be only 6 days before I ordered. Oh well....

Anyway, I will report back with updates on the pack and charger quality once I can take a look and test. Will include pics too if anyone wants to see.

[auraslip]

I just got off the phone with paypal. I filed a dispute....
Most be all the random stuff I ordered that slowed down shipping. Still, I e-mailed three days ago offering to swap out of stock items for in stock items to expedite the process. Still haven't heard anything.
In any case, glad you are getting your stuff.

[dlocke49]

I don't know if the paypal dispute I opened on the web expedidited things or it was just a coincidence that they shipped the very next day after that. It was very easy to open the dispute on the paypal website. I have heard from other people that it is possible (easy) to get money back from paypal when things go wrong. Maybe they don't like disputes with paypal and that gets the skids rolling. I wonder if paypal holds the money in an account until a certain amount of time has passed to make sure the customer is taken care of accordingly before the merchant is paid.

Good luck with yours.

[dlocke49]

Wow, DHL shipping is great. 3 days over the weekend from China. Amazing. My little girls asked me the other day out of the blue if you drilled through the earth would you be in China. I said theoretically yes but we don't have a drill that long! They learned a new word too.

Also, I saw from thier tracking web site that the truck came by my house this morning and nobody was home. They left a tag on the door to sign and they would drop it off unattended tomorrow. So at lunch I went home and put the note back on the door. Guess what? The guy came BACK AGAIN and saw that the note had moved from where he placed it. So without a request from me he came by twice in the same day to deliver. That is what I call excellent service! YES!!!! I can't wait to get home and see how the packs and charger look. I feel like a little kid before Christmas.

[auraslip]

Paypal refunded me my money in less than a day...odd.

[Kin]

What's the word on this?

BMSbattery is *cheap*, cheaper than ping batteries...It seems very appealing but I don't want to get complete junk.

[dlocke49]

I opened the packages last night and took some pictures. This stuff is not cheap and it is definately not junk. I will post some pictures to show you what it looks like tonight. I put the pack on the bike last night and everything works. One of the 2 fans on the charger was broken in pieces when it arrived. I went down to Fry's and bought another one so that problem is solved. They could have packed it better with much more foam in the box. That thing is very heavy and was probably bouncing around in the box.

Right now I am happy with the pack quality. I even opened one up last night to look inside because I could not help myself. Pretty cool looking and the assembly and cells look to be very high quality.

Stay tuned for more information.

[dlocke49]

Here are some pictures of the pack and charger:

[dlocke49]

BTW. The 48V 16AH pack weighs 19.4 pounds and is 12x5x8 inches.

The charger will output 2000watts (48V at ~30amps) so I believe that means an input current requirement of around 18Amps at 110V. So I used a heavy duty standard RV 110V 30 amp plug. I did not want to trip the standard 15amp house breaker, dim the lights or burn the house down! Will probably add a 20 amp breaker in the garage with the bigger 20 amp wiring and unique plug box receptacle later. Good for running heavy duty power tools also. It uses a standard 110 plug except the hot pin is perpendicular (-||). Cool design because regular lower watt appliances can still use the same outlet. Have not charged the pack when empty yet but maybe it will get to full charge in about 30 minutes?

[patrickza]

You'll be charging at nearly 2C. I know te headways can handle that, but for longevity you should probably charge them slower and avoid any heat buildup. In an ideal world you'd charge as slowly as possible to get a full pack just before you next need to ride, but I'd probably make 1C my upper limit. Does that charger have a trim pot for adjusting the charge current?

Otherwise why not buy one of their $30 240w chargers for normal use and use the $250 2000w charger for when you're in a big hurry. From my experience having a backup charger is a must anyway!

[dlocke49]

I used the 2kw charger last night and it was amazingly fast. Good idea about getting another lightweight charger. I have a soniel from the lead acid days I can use since the pack has the bms built in. Nice and light so I can carry it and recharge on the go. Have you read about the Phoenix II that electricrider.com will have for sale next month? 1/2 the weight and no phase control required. It senses the back EMF from the motor. I have had a Phoenix racer for many years but want the new Cruiser II when it comes out.
Good times,
Dal

[GrayKard]

Here's a link to one of the threads discussing the new Xlyte motors: http://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=24593

I assume one of these are what electricrider is calling the Phoenix II

Gary

[dlocke49]

The bike is running good and FAST. I am very happy.

Question for anyone that knows: I wonder if I need to keep the charger plugged in to let it balance the cells after the green light comes on? There are 2 leds. When it is charging both are red and then the green one comes on when it is charged. The amp display goes down from 29.67 to about 1.9 at that point. Does the BMS self balance at that point on its own or does it still require the charger voltage to be applied? Wonder what tells the charger to turn on the green led? Voltage or current going into the pack? I am going to check what the current displays in the morning. If it is zero then I probably need to leave the charger plugged in for awhile after the green light comes on?

The next thing I am going to look up on this web site and others is how to charge with a solar panel. Fry's has some that are about 2x4 feet. Forgot what the watts were but maybe 160? Thinking of putting this on the RV roof. It could charge the lifepo4 bank to provide power for the laptop and fans in the summertime. How would I connect to the pack?

One more thing I am going to try. With the extra 48v 16 ah pack I am thinking about connecting it so that I can pull 12v out. I would connect 4 sets of wires along the pack at 12 volt intervals so that the drain is applied accross all the cells evenly. Anyone ever do that? That way I could use the 12 to power an inverter to run 110 in the RV. I think that would be 12v at 64AH! I need to figure the watt hours at 110V. The packs would charge back in the day so I can run the fan and laptop at night. The bms would low voltage shutoff as not to damage the pack. The laptop would not shut off at the point because it has its own batteries too.

I love this wesite because I can share and learn lots of new stuff. Thanks for any comments you may have about the rambling above.

[dlocke49]

I rode around a local trail and lake last weekend and I went over 25 miles on the Phoenix Racer with the 48V 16AH pack from BMSBATTERY. I have to say it worked very well and never cut out even at full throttle nor did I feel any voltage sag. I don't know how much was left in the pack because it did not reach LVC. This pack so far has exceeded my expectations. I will order again from BMSBATTERY but I won't be expecting less than 3 week delivery time.

[kentlim26]

im a customer from Bmsbattery. They need at least 10days to build one pack of battery. when they had complete build the battery it was quite fast, when comes to delievery is abit slow. i forgot how many days it took to build the battery and send it to me, i remember total less then 3weeks. My battery is 48v 12hr , cells 38140s. now my total distance has drop to 32km ~ 35km or more. i run full throttle 50km/h most of the time. i think about one week later, they send me PHOTOS... about my battery build. they ask me was it Okay ? the new battery range is much better 45km per charged.

this pack battery 38140s, 48v 12hr gave me the top speed 54.1km/h , max watts >1599watts. not bad !! my goal is to stay around 45km/h ~ 50km/h.

i will still buy from them bmsbattery. Im hope they are still around. this pack battery + 1 vpower 48v 20hr i feel it can last me very long period. i might consider lipo one day. you got to tell them, PLEASE Hurry up... Not more then 3weeks, so slow how to survive in a fast pace business world ? LUCKILY you never try EVAssemble , it will take you at least One month + ONE wEEk . that is crazy long and totally unacceptable.

cheers.
kentlim

[auraslip]

Question for anyone that knows: I wonder if I need to keep the charger plugged in to let it balance the cells after the green light comes on? There are 2 leds. When it is charging both are red and then the green one comes on when it is charged. The amp display goes down from 29.67 to about 1.9 at that point. Does the BMS self balance at that point on its own or does it still require the charger voltage to be applied? Wonder what tells the charger to turn on the green led? Voltage or current going into the pack? I am going to check what the current displays in the morning. If it is zero then I probably need to leave the charger plugged in for awhile after the green light comes on?

What happens is the bms shuts off the charger when the first cell hits HVC. Then it bleeds off this cell to an appropriate voltage and the charger kicks back on. Repeat until all cells are the same. I'm of the opinion that unless the cells are seriously dis-balanced you won't notice and the battery pack won't care. Just one cell will hit LVC first and you'll lose a bit of capacity.

The packs would charge back in the day so I can run the fan and laptop at night. The bms would low voltage shutoff as not to damage the pack. The laptop would not shut off at the point because it has its own batteries too.

Mmmm you'd have to figure out a way to bypass the output of the bms. Maybe. It might be that if the total pack voltage is less than a certain amount it'll shut down even if the cells are above LVC. You'd have to test the bms to make sure.

I'm glad you're enjoying your pack, especially the fast chargers! Don't charge too fast though....

[miuan]

I also got a nicely done pack and charger from ecity.. they are slow to deal with but their products are good. My question is about the voltage. The BMS cuts out at 55V for a 16S pack, which seems too low considering a fully charged cell should have 3.65V. I need to see yet how much capacity I get from it, but it just seems too low to me.

[auraslip]

It cuts out while charging at 55v? That's not too bad. You only lose like %10 capacity, but extend the cycle life *2 or 3 or maybe even 4