Specialized Enduro Comp / BMC Build Thread

[oatnet]

I've had an itch to do a full suspension bike for a while, and came across a great deal on this silver Enduro Comp. It's a beuatiful frame, Avid Juicy's, Fox R air shock and RL forks, and is light as a feather... for now. The skinny seat hurts my old ass, so I am gonna put a cloud 9 seat on there pronto, but I think I can forgo the thudbuster.

I wanted a great air fork, and since been having success with using RockShox Boxxers as battery mounts, new Boxxer World Cup's seemed natural. The ride on this street machine should be... plush.

I'm going to use the BMC V3 motor from this thread: http://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=6&t=12461
assuming I have successfully rewired the halls/phases, and can limit current to 35a. If that doesn't sort out easily, I'll get a BMC V2 from Ilia at http://ebikessf.com/. 48v of 16ah prisimatic a123's will go in an ammo can on the forks. Controller options depend on the motor, with the V2 I could run one of those lightweight analog xlyte bullet-shaped controllers that would be very stealthy.

Here are some pics, more as it sorts out.

-JD

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[torker]

Watching with much interest. Any more progress? There is one of those bikes on craigslist here . I think he dropped it to 575 Is that a good price?

[oatnet]

Some progress, thanks.

On the first day, I got basic comfort features, like the on-one mary handlebars, dimension adjustable stem, ergo grips, and a nice gushy cloud nine seat. I pumped up the air shocks in the fork and rear enough to handle my 250+lbs, and the bike handled really well. I jumped off a few curbs (feeling silly at my age) and didn't feel the bump.

-JD

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[oatnet]

On the next time I worked on the bike, I got the Boxxer's on the front. Look at that frikken clearance! New caliper brackets front and rear, one to accomodate the Boxxer forks, and another to take the rear disk up to 203mm like the front. I don't so much need more brake back there, but it nicely conceals the motor, which I jammed into the frame for the pics.

The rear dropouts are disturbingly shallow - they don't even cover the breadth of the axle. Ilia just sent me a pair of torque arms, which I hope will help keep the axle in place. Mounting one on the derailliur side will be tough, as there is no clearance, I might have to build something in my machinists class. Since this is a 4-bar suspension, I'll have to mount the torque arms to the upper triangle members.

Sometimes I wish I could scrape the thick decal off the boxxers to stealth it up, sometimes I want to use it as a basis to put red rotors like these on there. I'm not sure if it would hide the motor further, or call attention to the hubs.

-JD

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Motor disappears behind a 203mm brake rotor!

what motor IMG_1657.JPG (243.57 KiB) Viewed 4428 times

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[oatnet]

I am using a Pelican model 1300 box to house the battery pack/breaker/power switches for this build. It weighs 3lbs, 3.3 oz, and (4) aluminum clamps weigh 13.35 oz, so my mounted battery housing will be a hair over 4lbs. This is lighterthan the ammo boxes I have been using, which were 9.8lbs mounted. It will carry a 15lb pack 16s of 16a Prisimatic a123 (48v16ah nominal, 58.4v off the charger).

Click on the pic to exand to full height. Here is the box head on. The base of the box is bolted to the stanchions of the triple-crown forks. The Lid is facing forward, not up. The latches for the lid are on top, so the lid swings down when opened, providing easy access to the battery. However, I will probably put bolts throught the two padlock features to keep people out.

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Here is the box from the back, with only the top clamps secured.

pelican_box_1683.JPG (190.41 KiB) Viewed 4331 times

Yeah, look at those phase wires flying free.

Pelican_side_1685.JPG (247.23 KiB) Viewed 4331 times

The pelican 1300 (3lbs 3.3oz) is on the top, the 2075im (3lb 7.5oz) is in the middle, and the ammo can (@6lbs) is on the bottom. The im2075 will go on the my methods 8x8 times methods 100v100a cruiser, and I am hoping to squeeze 27-28s of the 16ah a123 prisimatic for a very potent ride.

[oatnet]

The amped-bikes torque arm does not clear the deralliur.

I cleverly took it to my machine tools class, where I have an independant study gig that lets me use the machines on the stuff I want. As you can see in the first picture, I simply and cleanly cut off the offending material. I didn't bring the "star" with the cutout for the axle with me, didn't want it to fall out and get lost.

However, as you can see in the second picture, the torque arms cutout for the start twisted while being machined - my bad, I should have left the star in. I tried to repair this one to no avail, I'll try it again on a spare, with the star in place.

-JD

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It matches up perfectly on the bottom, but the top has been pushed down by the machining process.

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[StudEbiker]

Wow, that's going to be one fine bike!

[beast775]

very nice build,great spot for batteries!

[oatnet]

Gave up on the BMC V3 - that thing just never worked right.

Picked up an unlaced BMC V2-T from HiPowerCycles sale. The T from this sale is a new version allegedly has new gears, clutch, and came with 2x14ga wire per phase that is supposed to approximate 11ga. I swapped the T into the case for my V3, seeing as how that was all laced into a nice rim.

I couldn't get the front cover off the motor, I just pulled the whole assembly out, and bolted the new front cover onto the old case. Along the way I saw that the new gears are BLUE. I had never removed the clutch gear assemble from the motor, but this one just fell off. Took me a while to find the key and get it all assembled again. Here are some pics, VT-2 gears are Blue and V3 gears Green. I am a little concerned that the case for the V2 had a larger machined circle around the bearing, and the wheel seems a bit more reluctant to freewheel than I might expect, but I've since spun the motor up and don't get the sense of any grinding, hopefully it just needs some break-in.

-JD

[kfong]

I got my V2T BMC from HiPowerCycles, haven't had time to take it apart, bought it as a spare. Good to see internal pics of it. Oatnet, I like the new pelican battery box you came up with. Sounds like a good approach with bikes without a triangle frame. Nice FS bike, air shocks is on my list to upgrade someday. Very happy with my current BMC setup for now.

[oatnet]

I got my V2T BMC from HiPowerCycles, haven't had time to take it apart, bought it as a spare. Good to see internal pics of it. Oatnet, I like the new pelican battery box you came up with. Sounds like a good approach with bikes without a triangle frame. Nice FS bike, air shocks is on my list to upgrade someday. Very happy with my current BMC setup for now.

Thanks kfong!

I've even been putting the battery up front on bikes with a triangle, because it puts the extra mass in my hands and I really like the control and balance it gives me. The most extreme contrast I have is my xtracycle bike, which has the batteries and X5 so far back, I feel the frame flex with every steering input, and I have to worry about providing steering input that the bike just won't follow... OTOH this configuration doesn't work for folks who like to do wheelies, so it isn't for everyone, but it has worked great on some light trail riding.

After seeing the feedback in your build thread, I chickened out on using a 35a controller. Instead I tried my little 36v20a frame-mounted controller, and unlike every other 36v analog xlyte I have messed with, it barfed on a 48v pack. Today I should get an identical frame mounted controller from Ilia that is rated for 24-72v and I'll give the V2-T conversion a road test. This will be the lowest-powered bike I have ever built.

I am a little concerned though - since clutch assembly slid right off when I opened the case, my clutch didn't have a c-clip retaining the clutch assembly, like I saw on Ilia's dissasembly thread: http://ebikessf.com/disassembled-bmc-motor No sign of it floating around the case, so I am not sure if this is a feature of the new clutch assembly, or a manufacturing error. I could harvest the c-clip from my V3 fail, but I trimmed the motor leads fairly short, and I just got the torque arm stuff sorted out, so I am not looking forward to taking it all apart again to sort it out...

-JD

[oatnet]

I just asked hipowercycles about the new clutch assembly not being retained by a c-clip like my old V3, and he reported that is part of the new design - and that they were a bit suprised when they opened their first new V2-T and the clutch came off. WHEW, so glad I don't have to unmount the wheel and open the case!

He also said the faceplate is meant to come off, so in my case it was probably just binding, that isn't part of the new design... Hopefully since I am running only 20amps I'll never have to open it again anyhow.

-JD

[oatnet]

Since I am on vacation this week, I finally got a chance to wrap up this bike - it is a runner, and its a blast! The ride is phenomonally plush, I have to get used to full suspension, and probably could tweak it more.

If you didn't know, could you even tell this is an ebike? That is the stealth I am looking for, and a level of finish quality that should have this mule in service for quite some time. 60v(20s) 16ah a123 Prisimatic Life for over a KW of capacity that I can recharge in an hour. A lightweight BMC V2-T, driven by a tiny 20a controller, for30mph and strong hill climbing while only sipping @1300w. I whaled on it tonight, got 30wh/m.

This is pretty much what the battery box looks like, in the second shot it looks huge, perspective I guess.


The battery box is not this big!


The mega gear on the the cluster hides the motor nicely. I upgraded the rear brake to 8" mostly to hide the motor.


The dropouts in this bike were not very deep, so I put torque arms on both sides. Overkill.


I was pleasantly suprised to see that the controller from Ilia came with a connector for cruise control. I deployed one with my Methods controller/8x8 bike, and this morning I realized I had a 2nd cruise control switch in my stash, I installed it and loved it. I love riding the beach path with cruise control on, standing on the pedals, and flying.


The battery box has two power switches. The right side is positive, and when I flip it on, it slowly charges the caps through the resistor on the other switch. The second switch is on the left side (negative), and when I flip that the system gets full power, without spiking the controller. The battery pack weighed 20.4 lbs when it was 16s, including the case, the clamps to mount to the forks, 8ga wiring throught and all the way back to the controller, and a 50a breaker in the middle of the pack to split the voltage. I wanted a higher top speed, so I added a another 4s (20s total) which added 3lb 12.7oz - so roughly 24lbs overall. The case assembly weighs 5.56 lbs, and the a123 packs weigh 18.44lbs - not bad for a KW of LiFe.

Here is the left side of the battery box

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Here is the right side power switch.

7 right power IMG_3023.JPG (52.33 KiB) Viewed 3892 times

-JD

[jonathanm]

This is my favorite ebike so far....love the stealth, and love that frame!

[torker]

+2 on the bike and stealth. Those BMCs are pretty small. Looks like you have an awesome place to ride too.

[Whiplash]

YEP, if I had never tried an R/C drive, I would DEFINITELY use a BMC or even better a MAC. Especially the new 1000W version from Cell Man with the wider gears and such! My brother has a High speed version of his on a nice F/S Giant that goes 37MPH on only 44.4V Lipo with 30A!!

[oatnet]

Thanks for the kind words, guys!

I finished dialing in the bike yesterday. I had the triple-clamps at the very top of the fork stanchion to raise the bike, but it was throwing the geomtery off. I lowered them about an inch and the bike is more stable. Adjusting the compression and rebound helped too. I drilled 2 more holes in the case, and moved the battery charging plug outside the case so I don't have to open the case for every charge. Best of all, I managed to peel off the awful, bright-red BOXXER stickers from the forks, now they are just a nice white that goes well with the silver frame.

I weighed the bike - lock, lights, bell, etc in place, everything for a normal ride - and got 78lbs for a bike that started at @35lbs, 43lb gain. Well, you add 18lbs for 1000wh of battery, 10lbs of motor, and 7 lbs of case/controller/cyclanalyst, I can account for 35 lbs right there. The other 8 pounds comes from choices for durability, like the hookworms, DH tubes, kevlar liner, and DX-32s, or comfort, like the Cloud9 seat, ergon grips, lock/lights/bell. It adds up fast.

I took it for its maiden voyage today, covering 24.22 miles at an oaverage off 29.3 wh/m, despite heavy winds, sandy paths, and a number of WOT runs. I started dropping voltage faster than I expected at @10ah, and when I got home, the 2 end cells in the 4-cell booster pack I just built were puffy and HOT, so they were over-discharged. They were cool and flat at the halfway point, so I don't know if they got crushed against the box during intial fitment, or if I got heat into them when soldering on the power leads. I'll have to play with them, worse comes to worse I have spares.

On the ride, I came across a kid on skates who had built a power puller using 4 lead-acid batteries, a triple-crown fork, a motor/chain/small wheel. Nice finish and really impressive, wish I'd gotten a picture. I did get a few shots of the bike. The forum seems to cut the pictures off, but there are clickable links at the bottom of the thread.

-JD



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[nicobie]

Clean bike! I like how the wireing came out.

Keep it under 1500 watts and it will last forever.

[jdbauman]

Hi Oatnet,

I am totally inspired by your build. I would really like to build a similar bike. I have been looking for Enduro Comp frames on Craigslist. I was wondering what you thought of this bike on Craigslist.

http://losangeles.craigslist.org/sgv/bi ... 55520.html

I was also wondering if you know of any good sources in the U.S. for getting a MAC geared motor. Thanks.

Jerry

[jonathanm]

Shame about the cells......

I had a look around for those frames, there are some for sale here and there, but it is amazing how different the frame looks with a paint job and decals. I saw a yellow one on ebay that looked awful....it makes me wonder how many other frames I've turned my nose up at which would have looked beautiful with a sandblast and/or respray...This yellow one looks awful.....

http://cgi.ebay.com/Shimano-Specialized ... 1c1c1dce60

[torker]

Hi Oatnet,

I am totally inspired by your build. I would really like to build a similar bike. I have been looking for Enduro Comp frames on Craigslist. I was wondering what you thought of this bike on Craigslist.

http://losangeles.craigslist.org/sgv/bi ... 55520.html

I was also wondering if you know of any good sources in the U.S. for getting a MAC geared motor. Thanks.

Jerry

Jerry, I also built an FSR Comp . I have some pics on my thread and more saved if you get one. Let me know. I bought mine, beat up and well used for 250. It does not have the good Fox float shock like the one you linked. Mine is older, probably mid 90s not sure. I've seen one like Oatnets for 550 here on CL.so the price seems close. Maybe you can offer a little less, never know.

[oatnet]

Hi Oatnet,

I am totally inspired by your build. I would really like to build a similar bike. I have been looking for Enduro Comp frames on Craigslist. I was wondering what you thought of this bike on Craigslist.

http://losangeles.craigslist.org/sgv/bi ... 55520.html

I was also wondering if you know of any good sources in the U.S. for getting a MAC geared motor. Thanks.

Jerry

Wow, thanks Jerry!

That FSR looks good, it is a different frame, not sure how well it is equipped. My only concern about this frameset (2005 Enduro Comp 130) is that the dropouts are not very deep, part of the axle flats stick out. This constipated the build for a long time, until I addressed it with dual torque arms to prevent movement, and long, stabilizing torque arm mounts to retain the axle in the dropouts. I don't think this wheel would move even if I pulled out the bolts.

I have made (3) purchases of a123 prisimatics from cell_man in China, who also sells the MAC motor at a screaming good price, and would be my recommendation for a MAC purchase. For a BMC, I highly recommend Ilia for the best prices. I got this motor core on HighPowerCycle's sale, which was stunningly cheap, but I think the sale is over.

Jonathonm, it was a bummer about the booster battery, I lost (2) cells on it. I am still not sure if I didn't charge it to the same state as the 48v pack, or if it was damaged fiddling about in the case. I built a new 4s pack, ridden it to work a few times this week, but haven't given it the full drain yet. Yeah, I also prefer the understated factory color scheme/lack of decals on the silver frame, and the white boxxer forks too now that I have stripped the decals off.

This is my first full suspension ebike, and I really love it, hard to decide between this and the Vectrix in the morning.

-JD

[jdbauman]

Oatnet,

Where in SoCal are you located? Some of the Pics looks like Corona Del Mar... That's cool that you have a Vectrix too... Have you posted any Vids of it? I would love to see some pics or vids...

Did you lace your own rim on your BMC motor? I'm not sure I would trust myself doing that, but most of the LBS's where I'm at don't really want to mess with lacing electric hub motors I've noticed.

I may have to pick your brain on the cool upgrades you did. I really like the handlebars and seat that you put on your bike.

My idea for my build would be:
1. Specialized Enduro Comp Bike
2. MAC motor (maybe the 1,000 Watt beast from Cell_Man - How long does shipping take from Cell_man, I guess he ships from China?)
3. A Cycle Analyst
4. A LiPo battery pack. I would like to start with a 44.4 V (10Ah) and then maybe upgrade to a 66.6V (10Ah) pack at some point.

Any thoughts or suggestions? I can't wait to get started...

Jerry

[mvly]

how is the weight distribution? How hard is it to turn? I have mine just finished with the battery in the center (triangle area). How do you lock up your bike? In one of the picture it looks like you have a cable lock. Looks like a clean build. Any idea on Top speed and range on those battery you got for it?

[oatnet]

Random Pictures from the 4th and 5th - Mrs Oatnet's ebike, with 8" front disk, bafang rear, 16s3p a123 M1 battery in, and controller on, the ammo Box up front - for a stealthy, pedalable ride. On a 21 mile ride today she used 182wh, for 8.66wh/m.

Our rides locked together. This beach is usually empty but it was PACKED for the 4th.

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Just a shot I took at the beach that I thought was fun. AFAIK the 69 bikes are not electrified.

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