Puma 500W Rear-140USD. 500W Front, 350W 135USD

[cell_man]

Yeah water cooling would be nice, but can't see it happening just yet, it would be very involved. I will try to get some bigger Mac motors built, but just some samples initially and it is at least a few months off I'm afraid. A wider motor based on the same stator design and yoke but double width is very possible. I am often discussing it with the engineer in Mac so hopefully they'll give in some time soon and give me what i want

I may also have a few things up my sleeve for the standard Mac, but don't want to say too much until it's closer to reality.

Thanks guys for the support

[o00scorpion00o]

Yeah water cooling would be nice, but can't see it happening just yet, it would be very involved. I will try to get some bigger Mac motors built, but just some samples initially and it is at least a few months off I'm afraid. A wider motor based on the same stator design and yoke but double width is very possible. I am often discussing it with the engineer in Mac so hopefully they'll give in some time soon and give me what i want

I may also have a few things up my sleeve for the standard Mac, but don't want to say too much until it's closer to reality.

Thanks guys for the support

Hey Paul no problem!

Well I can wait anyway as I've used up all my funds for some time, I can see this E-Bike hobby ruining many a marriage!

Bigger motors are fine, but would be a lot heavier.

Again I don't think there would be any need for the clutch and free wheel and that should save some space. I doubt anyone would be concerned about free wheeling, that's where the current mac comes in!

If they could make a mac, big or small that could take 3+ kw continuous and wouldn't burn going up a mountain, then I think they would make the development costs back in a very short time!

[neptronix]

Again I don't think there would be any need for the clutch and free wheel and that should save some space. I doubt anyone would be concerned about free wheeling, that's where the current mac comes in!

Ya know.. it won't save much space in reality. You still need a good sized keyway surface for the planetary gears. Thus, the planetary gear assembly won't be able to shrink by much.

No clutch/freewheel would make for a motor with a lot of drag anyhow. It would appeal to a limited set of customers and i doubt that MAC would see a profit in it.

Liquid cooling coming out of the freewheel side would take my vote. The space required for the coolant tank and 'radiator' would be quite minimal. Just look at any high performance PC liquid cooling setup.. quite compact.

[o00scorpion00o]

Liquid cooling coming out of the freewheel side would take my vote. The space required for the coolant tank and 'radiator' would be quite minimal. Just look at any high performance PC liquid cooling setup.. quite compact.

You mean ditch the sprocket for a single speed ? that would be fine by me for a set up that is just for getting around and not for cycling!

PC's don't have the amount of heat that would be generated in a hub motor @3KW+ constant or climbing a mountain, I could imagine it having to be big enough, and would cause a fair bit of wind resistance. It would also have to have a temperature controlled fan at times when the bike would be going too slow!

[neptronix]

No, i'm talking about having the liquid cooling on the outside of the motor - the only place where it is effective!

[o00scorpion00o]

No, i'm talking about having the liquid cooling on the outside of the motor - the only place where it is effective!

Of course, but what I mean is the radiator would have to be big to cool a motor going up hill, and would need a decent fan to keep it cool if you stop half way up or have to slow down!

[veloman]

I think the Mac motor as it is, is great for an E-*BIKE*. Not too many people need to go 30mph up mountains.

Not saying don't develop stuff, but I am saying I'm very happy with my Mac, even on 1000 watts.

[o00scorpion00o]

I think the Mac motor as it is, is great for an E-*BIKE*. Not too many people need to go 30mph up mountains.

Not saying don't develop stuff, but I am saying I'm very happy with my Mac, even on 1000 watts.

Yes the mac is a super motor for sure!

And we know we're pushing them to the limits they are simply not designed for! But that's part of the fun and if mac can make motors that can take that abuse then isn't that good for everyone ?

[cell_man]

My plan is to chip away at the present motor and hopefully come up with a few new options and improvements in the next few months. Hopefully at the same time I can get some of the custom parts arranged for the bigger motors. Just have to see how it pans out. The only way it will likely happen is if I put my money where my mouth is and meet the MOQ from Mac's suppliers for parts and/or pay machining/tooling costs.

I'm bound to be biased, but I do like how the Mac performs and do prefer it to a DD motor, but my experience with DD motors is limited to the MXUS DD. To me the Mac is plenty fast enough for a bike and seems to produce much stronger acceleration for similar input power levels when compared to the DD, or at least it certainly feels that way to me. The problem with speeds much over 30mph is that it requires a lot of power, so you've either got a small range or a big expensive battery. A cruising speed of low to mid 20s mph is a good compromise IMO, you can get a reasonable range with a moderate sized battery and travel time is still pretty good. It's nice of course to have the potential for quick acceleration and high speeds when required and from my experience, the high speed Mac Kits still deliver good efficiency when speeds are reduced and power used moderately. Just set it to speed 1 and you'd never know you were running a high power setup, apart from the rather brisk acceleration of course and that can be easily tamed with a gentle throttle hand.

[o00scorpion00o]

Hi Paul,

Yes I completely agree, for the same power the mac is defiantly without doubt more powerful!

The magic pie is a great motor too for a dd, lots of torque but it will only do 32-33 mph max, where the mac does 38-41 mh max!

The pie doesn't get hot either unless going up a16% mountain full throttle!

I get around 10-12 miles max out of my 16s 10 ah pack at about 35-40 mph, and that's not bad really.

I could probably get 20 miles at 20 mph. At that speed the mac only uses around 400-500 watts on level ground which is good and it's nice sometimes to go slow and take in the scenery!

I think if the current mac could be water cooled rather than a bigger motor, which would probably still burn if going up a long mountain might be a lot better and maybe not so expensive to modify the current motor ?

A free wheeling mac capable of sustained 3-4kw, just imagine ?

Paul maybe you could start a new thread when you have decided what you will do, just to get feedback from everyone on weather they would be interested in such a motor. It might give you an idea if it would be worth while ?

[richmpdx]

I am also very interested in improved MAC hubmotors. I am using an Ezee hubmotor, running at about 1000 watts. As others have said, I don't need more speed, 20 mph is plenty for me for a bike. But I think that I need the ability to run higher continuous power. My commute has some relatively steep hills and at 1000 watts the Ezee slows down too much into the very inefficient range even with me pedaling vigorously. So I have to go by a less desirable route with a lot more traffic. At the current power levels I am probably pretty close to limit as the I have replaced broken hubmotor gears twice. I could use a metal gear, but I am not so keen on increasing the sound of the geared hubmotor. It seems like the new gears in the MAC motor may be able to take more continuous and burst power than my Ezee hubmotor. But it also seems hard to compare the experiences of others as we all use the bikes differently and hill steepness seems to get reported variably. In any case, I still think geared hubmotors offer a relatively simple and very useful approach and modest increases in power handling would motivate me to try an improved MAC.

Rich

[chroot]

@o00scorpion00o - Which one did you get torque or speed MAC geared motor. I saw Paul (Cell_man) website has new 1000 watt hub motor and I am not sure if it is an geared or direct drive because Paul haven't update his website.

I am going order one for my ebike soon. Let me know thanks.

[o00scorpion00o]

@o00scorpion00o - Which one did you get torque or speed MAC geared motor. I saw Paul (Cell_man) website has new 1000 watt hub motor and I am not sure if it is an geared or direct drive because Paul haven't update his website.

I am going order one for my ebike soon. Let me know thanks.

Hi chroot,

I got the 8T 320 rpm motor!

I think the fastest motor is really for flatter terrain.

The 8T 320 rpm will do 28 mph on 12S LiPo and 41 max on 16S all hot off the charger, and 120 % settings in controller.

I have the new 12fet EB 320 controller.

[neptronix]

That "1000 watt" motor is the 6t, which is basically a high speed wind version of the MAC.
Same continuous power handling as far as i know.
Yes, they are far better for flat terrain; they put out a lower amount of torque but a higher speed. The 8T middle of the road winding is quite good for every use. The 10T is good if you have *monster* hills, like 7% grade and higher..

Rich: i lived in Portland and my 8T MAC motor conquered everything there.. used to ride from Beaverton to Portland quite often. You will find it to be very suitable for the terrain.

Geared motors are the best. Especially when you have to haul your bike up a flight of stairs every day. That extra 4-6lbs off the motor really counts. And quite a bit more power you put into the motor makes it to the road.

[chroot]

Thanks for the info. Last question - I promise! Okay I wanna use 20" wheels and Should I go for fastest winding geared motor such 6T? I am going use 16S4P (66v nominal and 20Ah). I aim for between 2500-3000 watts (50A and 100A burst) on 6T. It should be very quickly acceleration and fast! I live on flat terrains and if i am encounter the hills and it should not give me any problem with the 6T on 20" wheels.

I am going make a bunch of orders lot stuff coming soon.

[veloman]

Thanks for the info. Last question - I promise! Okay I wanna use 20" wheels and Should I go for fastest winding geared motor such 6T? I am going use 16S4P (66v nominal and 20Ah). I aim for between 2500-3000 watts (50A and 100A burst) on 6T. It should be very quickly acceleration and fast! I live on flat terrains and if i am encounter the hills and it should not give me any problem with the 6T on 20" wheels.

I am going make a bunch of orders lot stuff coming soon.

I don't think you should be putting 50a constant, or 100a peak into a geared motor.

[cell_man]

Thanks for the info. Last question - I promise! Okay I wanna use 20" wheels and Should I go for fastest winding geared motor such 6T? I am going use 16S4P (66v nominal and 20Ah). I aim for between 2500-3000 watts (50A and 100A burst) on 6T. It should be very quickly acceleration and fast! I live on flat terrains and if i am encounter the hills and it should not give me any problem with the 6T on 20" wheels.

I am going make a bunch of orders lot stuff coming soon.

The 6T motor with the 12 fet controller on 48V in a 20" wheel will have good power and speed on around 48V. I think you are mixing up peak and phase current. 100A at 48V is almost 5KW, that is too much. The 12 fet controller is shipped with 40A battery current limit, that is plenty enough.

[joe tomten]

Does the 6turn MAC comes as a front hub?

Reason I ask is that I'm looking for a high speed lightweight front hub for a friends 16" Brompton conversion. I think the OLD (fork opening) is ~80mm which maybe we can stretch to 100mm or so. The 6T MAC would be a good option if we could stuff it in there, and maybe run it at 20S if top speed seems uninspired at 16s.

[chroot]

Hi- The answer is no, I have asked Paul (Cell_Man) about the front motor and He currently has 350 watt as a front hub motor. Mostly the rear hub motors that have capable higher watt. I think rear hub motors are more than 135-150mm wide axle. Paul or someone can confirm this.

Does the 6turn MAC comes as a front hub?

Reason I ask is that I'm looking for a high speed lightweight front hub for a friends 16" Brompton conversion. I think the OLD (fork opening) is ~80mm which maybe we can stretch to 100mm or so. The 6T MAC would be a good option if we could stuff it in there, and maybe run it at 20S if top speed seems uninspired at 16s.

[cell_man]

The front 500W can come in any of the windings, but I do not tend to keep the front 500W Mac in stock. For disc brake you can only go with the 350W front motor, the 500W is for rim brakes only.

I can add a particular front 500W to a future order, but it is difficult to commit to a time frame. I do try to keep the standard front and rear standard 350W Mac in stock (about the same speed as a 10T 500W) and various rear 500W from 12T to 6T. I've attached an outline drawing for the front 500W. The smallest rim I stock is 20", but 16" should be possible with stubby spokes, not something I can offer at this time though, plus the Mac is 36 hole, they don't generally make 16" with 36H.

[beast775]

hello cell_man,im looking to buy 2 rear 135 mm geared 500w hubs with controllers.ive emailed you from youre site but thought i would post here also.thanks. mark.

[cell_man]

hello cell_man,im looking to buy 2 rear 135 mm geared 500w hubs with controllers.ive emailed you from youre site but thought i would post here also.thanks. mark.

Mark, please PM with your email address, or just send your request by PM. I do not see anything in my Junk folder. Please use the hotmail address as listed on the site.

[Whiplash]

Hey Cell Man, I have a question, it may seem strange, but can the side cover from the rear hub be put onto the front hub? I am thinking of a MID drive for a bike and it would simplify the build if it would work.. Also, is the 500W front the same motor as the 1000W rear? What is the difference internally?

[gensem]

Hey ppl,

Whats the max gauge I can use for phase wires? Will 13awg fit inside the axl? if im not mistaken the original ones are 16awg.

[chroot]

Here Cell_Man's comment on wiring size.

I have some 6T available and I even have 1 that was fitted with double (6pcs) 2mm^2 phase wire so 4mm^2 equivalent on each phase (equivalent to just under 11AWG).

Hey ppl,

Whats the max gauge I can use for phase wires? Will 13awg fit inside the axl? if im not mistaken the original ones are 16awg.