GT i-drive 2.0 Build

[Sacman]

so i opened the hs3540 and am @%^#)% shocked at how poorly it's resisted water! a pile of calcification poured out. rust everywhere.

IMG_20120211_133840.jpg

Holy crap... that IS a lot of crap. I've never seen so much junk build up on the inside of a motor with so few miles on it.
But then again I live here in California and I'm glad I don't have to deal with the weather and salted streets here that you got there.

[grindz145]

Dude that's awful! you HAVE to drill holes in the side covers.

[grindz145]

PS spay the whole stator down with ACF-50 too!

[Alan B]

Or run a little oil in the hub and change it often. I wonder if the machining oil that mixes with water would be good for this. It would transfer heat well and keep the rust down, it is inexpensive, and it is compatible with water.

[GCinDC]

Dude that's awful! you HAVE to drill holes in the side covers.

and you think that will help?? maybe w/ cooling, yeah, but how's that going to help w/ water?

[kfong]

Greg, I would put a vent hole. It's the moisture that condenses inside once the motor cools sucking moist air when cooling through the wire exit over time as well as any other small openings. Use the same hole to add light oil to keep rust from spreading. A rubber cap or threaded cap would be easy to remove. The other option is to drill vent holes, but if the city uses salt. You might have to deal with this as well. You could seal it with a small amount of light oil, but over time you will have to replace the water and oil mixture, but I believe the oil will still act as a barrier.

Maybe a cyclone setup would work out better for winter riding. No air volume to deal with. That and a Nuvinci hub with electronic shift points would be my take on an all weather commuter. Not sure how they last at high speeds though, but Matts 4" RC motor is looking promising.

[electr0n]

How difficult was it to open up the motor? Did you open the wire side or the other? Any tips? I had some trouble getting my covers off my 400 series crystalyte. I had to use a thin bladed knife to cut the paint around the perimeter before I could get the cover off and it took forever.

I just picked up an HS3540 laced in a 26" wheel and I suppose I should open it and treat it with some stuff to avoid that rust and eventually install a temp sensor alarm. You were only running 74v 40 amps when you had your meltdown and I was planning on running 88.8v and 50 amps... hope I don't kill it. Hope you get your motor back up soon. Your thread is a great resource.

[GCinDC]

thanks, yo. i think i'll be drilling holes soon, and you will take pics for you..

How difficult was it to open up the motor?

i was terrified about gouging the wire! i used a screwdriver to pop off the plastic housing near the wire. i unscrewed the wire side cover, then banged a chisel end into the gap all the way around to break the seal.

then i used the claw side of two hammers to work it off a bit, but not over the wires. i then saw that the halls were on the opposite side, so removed that cover, chiseled the cover loose, wedged it off a touch, then held the wheel firmly and smashed the axle (with a nut on the end) onto a block on the floor to free the wheel...

mostly brute force. no idea if this is the recommend approach, but how i do the 9Cs..

in other news, we had a bit of snow last night, mostly gone by morning, but i took a drive and was appalled at the amount of salt they put out. what is wrong with these people?

IMG_20120212_094522.jpg (134.22 KiB) Viewed 956 times

IMG_20120212_094115.jpg (143.86 KiB) Viewed 956 times

[sn0wchyld]

How difficult was it to open up the motor? Did you open the wire side or the other? Any tips? I had some trouble getting my covers off my 400 series crystalyte. I had to use a thin bladed knife to cut the paint around the perimeter before I could get the cover off and it took forever.

I just picked up an HS3540 laced in a 26" wheel and I suppose I should open it and treat it with some stuff to avoid that rust and eventually install a temp sensor alarm. You were only running 74v 40 amps when you had your meltdown and I was planning on running 88.8v and 50 amps... hope I don't kill it. Hope you get your motor back up soon. Your thread is a great resource.

i'd recommend a 3 jaw gear puller. I took 1 cover off using other tools and slowly working it off before buying the puller, took me a good 30 min. I then went out and bought the puller, and the 2nd side cover took me about 30 seconds. I took apart a second motor with it with the same speed! well worth the $30, particularly since there's less risk of damaging parts of your motor.

[GCinDC]

thanks, snow. do you still first need to pry the lid up or no? got a link/pic of the puller?

i put the motor back together btw, and here's a crappy vid of the diagnostics:

green hall looks shot, huh? light stays on all the time...

top faint row are phase wires, middle bright ones are halls. nevermind the bottom ones... couldn't get a position to see w/o glare!

[sn0wchyld]

thanks, snow. do you still first need to pry the lid up or no? got a link/pic of the puller?
...

heres the one I bought on special http://www.supercheapauto.com.au/online-store/products/Stanley-Gear-Puller-3-Jaw-150mm.aspx?pid=12541#Description

you can find similar on ebay / local auto stores. get a 150/6" one, as the 100mm/4" ones could be a little small, I had to move my 150mm one to its 'longer' position in order to reach.

No need to pry, I just hooked the arms onto the spoke flange, and pulled the freewheel side + magnets off the stator and 'break side' side cover. Then you can just flip the stator over and pull the remaining side cover off (still using the puller). its great cause you can take it really slowly if needed to make sure you dont break/graunch any wires etc.

hope that description makes sense.

ps
I even used mine when putting the motor back together. I bolted the freewheel sidecover and magnets together, and then 'lowered' them onto the stator, so I could avoid it snapping shut due to the magnetics and damaging the stator teeth/windings.

edit
pps
I also drilled a hole in my workbench with a 15mm bit, that way it holds the motor on its side by the axle, makes it really easy to work with.

[Sacman]

thanks, snow. do you still first need to pry the lid up or no? got a link/pic of the puller?
...

heres the one I bought on special http://www.supercheapauto.com.au/online-store/products/Stanley-Gear-Puller-3-Jaw-150mm.aspx?pid=12541#Description

Yikes! $50 for one gear puller?
Harbor Freight has a set of 3 them (different sizes 3", 4", 6") right now for just $16
http://www.harborfreight.com/3-piece-th ... 32184.html

[Sacman]

And Snowchyld is right .... you don't need to pry anything but a little technique is required to using the gear puller properly.
A video is probably best to show how it's done.

[sn0wchyld]

thanks, snow. do you still first need to pry the lid up or no? got a link/pic of the puller?
...

heres the one I bought on special http://www.supercheapauto.com.au/online-store/products/Stanley-Gear-Puller-3-Jaw-150mm.aspx?pid=12541#Description

Yikes! $50 for one gear puller?
Harbor Freight has a set of 3 them (different sizes 3", 4", 6") right now for just $16
http://www.harborfreight.com/3-piece-th ... 32184.html

yea this is Australia, where things like tools are often stupidly expensive compared to places like the USA. I only bought it 'cause it was on special and I didnt want to wait, otherwise ebay has a pretty good cheap selection too! but $16 for 3 is a steal!

[adrian_sm]

I just take out the screws on the side cover, put the wheel on the ground, then stand on the rim.

The axle then pushes on the ground, pushing the stator up out of the rotor/wheel. Then just lift the stator with top side cover out before the magnets pull it back in to place.

[Sacman]

I just take out the screws on the side cover, put the wheel on the ground, then stand on the rim.

The axle then pushes on the ground, pushing the stator up out of the rotor/wheel. Then just lift the stator with top side cover out before the magnets pull it back in to place.

Lol.... that's pretty good!
I had to think about it for a while to make sure nothing was being damaged but looks like that would work.

[adrian_sm]

It is doing just what the gear puller does, but in a slightly less controlled manner, and putting the stress on the stator via all the spokes, rather than three spots the puller hangs on to.

The bigger trick is reassembling it in a controlled manner. Never quite got the hang of that. But you can sort of do the reverse. Put the wheel on the ground with attached side cover side down. Then lift the stator up by its axle, place one foot on the rim, and your other hand on the rim directly opposite your foot, then place stator axle through side cover hole attached to the wheel. This centralises the stator via the side cover bearing, then slowly, slowly lift the rim up waiting for the magnets to grab promptly shoving the rim up into your hand as the stator tries to snap into place.

Just makes sure you hands are well away from the gap between stator and rotor, you really don't want you fingers pinched.

[sn0wchyld]

I just used the 3 jaw puller to lower it back onto the stator, makes it easy as!

[Sacman]

It is doing just what the gear puller does, but in a slightly less controlled manner, and putting the stress on the stator via all the spokes, rather than three spots the puller hangs on to....

The bigger trick is reassembling it in a controlled manner. Never quite got the hang of that. But you can sort of do the reverse....

Just makes sure you hands are well away from the gap between stator and rotor, you really don't want you fingers pinched.

Yeah you're right it does do the same thing as a puller.

You're also right that the magnets are so powerful you could chop a finger off if you're not careful at reassembly.

So the SAFEST reassembly technique I found is to put the center axle on the ground, grab the wheel with your hands on the outer rim (away from the center), then lower it slowly onto the axle. This keeps your hands away from the dangerous action at the center.

You can actually look thru the little hole in the center of the wheel cover and see the axle while you are lowering so you can guide yourself down onto it. As long as you can see the axle thru that hole you are centerred properly. When you get close enough the magnets will pull the axle up and it will fly up and into the rest of the wheel you are holding.

[adrian_sm]

Yeah did that once, but was worried what the final impact is doing to bearings or whatever is stopping the flying stator.

[grindz145]

Greg that salt is rediculous ! even by nys standards.

[Sacman]

So the SAFEST reassembly technique I found is to put the center axle on the ground, grab the wheel with your hands on the outer rim (away from the center), then lower it slowly onto the axle. This keeps your hands away from the dangerous action at the center.

I should revise this... I meant that is the safest way WITHOUT a gear puller.
The safest way to do it really is WITH A GEAR PULLER.

Anyway, I think we went off into our tangent discussion long enough.
Hey Greg did you figure out how to use that motor/controller/throttle tester from Lyen properly?
I just got mine in Friday from Lyen but I haven't tried it out yet.
Which green light is staying on constant...the center one? They all look red on your video.

[GCinDC]

replaced the hall. resistance test was to check Black/Red/Blue wires (even though it looks like i'm touching same spot on hall):

motor spins fine, but is really crunchy. has been for a while. i gotta think it's the bearings. wasn't like this before. considering rust, i guess i shouldn't be surprised....

replaced a broken spoke while i was at it.

unfortunately, ebikes.ca doesn't carry bearings. but gave me a reference.

eventually to do:
-replace bearings
-drill holes
-paint inside
-lace 24" wheel...

[John in CR]

Bearings are simple to source locally, and with the absolute crap bearings that Crystalyte and 9C use it's a mistake not to replace them the first time you open either brand.

[dbaker]

Looks like it tests OK and runs. Rim trued?