Renault Twizy

[sk8norcal]

[Matthijs]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_fCTufq49qQ&sns=em

Saver than a scooter..

[o00scorpion00o]

HE SAYS 12 HOURS TO CHARGE IN THE U.K WTF ? WRONG!!!

What kind of idiot is he ? please forgive me if I heard this wrong, but at around 5:20 he says it takes 12 hours to charge in the U.K, well the U.K and all of Europe has 220 volts means Twizy charges in 3 hours!

He should have researched this!

[knoxie]

What a great Little car

Only just read about this little car yesterday, wow! what a fantastic little unit this is, the price and style are killer IMHO, it beats the pants off the Gwhiz even without the doors, there are 2 versions, the lower power one kids can drive without a licence, although the car is speed limited to 28mph, they will still need insurance which will be the killer for most kids, at first here in the UK Renault said that they were not going to import the slower version because currently our laws (UK) don't allow 16 years olds to drive them however they are looking at changing this from next year, that brings a whole new sport to ebikers!! racing Twizys! ha ha.

I really like this little car, in time I am sure that the battery lease thing will be dropped as 3rd party suppliers start making packs for them, whilst I couldn't justify buying one having a wife and 2 kids I am sure that there are city folks that never liked the idea of a moped, hated the charges associated with cars (particularly the high cost of fuel and congestion charges here in London) that are going to jump at the chance.

I am a little concerned with the security side of the car though, without doors it's an open invitation for folks to get in the car and mess about, there isn't much they can fiddle with but folks will for sure, the charging time at only 3 hours is very respectable and as more charging bays start coming on line I can see them really taking off.

Hats off to Renault, it is a bold step indeed! this is one of those cars I still cant quite believe that they have made? as very often cool looking prototypes never go in to production. in a few years time you could pick one of these up for 3K or so, that's pretty amazing for an electric car.

Here in the UK our government has an incentive scheme whereby they will give you 5K off the price of an electric car, they don't class this as an electric car though? they class it as a quad? I don't understand the distinction here. it has 4 wheels? a steering wheel? you sit in it and it has peddles for the throttle and brake? at what point is this not a car? if it was classed as a car it would drop the price down to 2K new! you can be damn sure the insurance companies will treat it as a car when a 16 year old comes to insure one!

I am looking forward to seeing many of these things on the road in the UK.

[o00scorpion00o]

Yep I like it too,

Though for me my bike offers the best alternative, I would love to know the cost of insurance. I might ring the insurance company later today or tomorrow for the laugh. I bet it will cost somewhere around 400 Euro's!

I'm sure full doors will be an option at a later time, And gas heater would be cool, a small tank is all you would need for the times you really do need heat, then you won't be tempted to use it all the time as you would if it were electric.

I really hope they sell well, I would love to see people change to alternative forms of transport, so many cars with just one person is madness!

[Hillhater]

....there are 2 versions, the lower power one kids can drive without a licence, although the car is speed limited to 28mph, they will still need insurance which will be the killer for most kids,...

Actually i think .."the killer for most kids".... would be allowing then on to the roads in any vehicle without a licience .(provisional / training).
It is madness to think that any 16/17yr old is responsible enough to be in control of a vehicle on public roads without effective training and assessment.
Its not just the speed that kills, its the lack of "responsibility" that youth is endowed with.

[Matthijs]

Delivery is "greener" as well because a bunch of them just fit in a truck:

[knoxie]

....there are 2 versions, the lower power one kids can drive without a licence, although the car is speed limited to 28mph, they will still need insurance which will be the killer for most kids,...

Actually i think .."the killer for most kids".... would be allowing then on to the roads in any vehicle without a licience .(provisional / training).
It is madness to think that any 16/17yr old is responsible enough to be in control of a vehicle on public roads without effective training and assessment.
Its not just the speed that kills, its the lack of "responsibility" that youth is endowed with.

From what I can tell at least here in the UK if they do go ahead with it they will still have to take the CBT which is a test that kids have to take before they are allowed out on mopeds, for me I cant see too many taking one up as they only have to wait a year more and they can get a normal car, if your going to pay insurance you might as well have a proper car. For adults with full no claims bonus it looks like they are going to be classed in insurance group 1 which is the lowest cost group for a car and you wont have to pay road tax which helps.

I can see them being really popular especially in London, the Gwhiz has been quite a success however this is a much cooler looking option and there looks like there might be a bit of scope for some performance upgrades! ha ha, will see if Jozzer gets his hands on one! pretty sure he may do

Neat photos of them in the back of that truck too!! I tell you I would happily use one of these little cars, the more I see of them the more that I like them and to be honest I am pretty sure I would get less looks from folks than I do when I ride my KMX on the road.

[Lebowski]

about being used by youth, maybe they're clasified as 'quads' with a roof, not as cars ?

anyway, I would love to have a Twizy, main issue is not the price but that
I've no room left in my garage (with the 4 bicycles & 3 motorcycles it's
basically full...). I would need to trade in my 2011 R1200R to make room
but I'm not willing to do that, maybe in a few years time.

[Matthijs]

Today I drove the Twizy for an hour! At around 10 c it is doable but I needed thicker clothing and thin gloves. The ride is pretty hard but it feels one with the road. At the limit you just get easy correctable understeer. It is just a blast to drive! One little thing I noticed was the cabin is too wide to put your arm outside the window.

I have to say overall I get the impression that the Twizy could be sold for a lot less. The materials used are just not really convincing. At topspeed you really miss that side window and you just want to go that littlebit faster. I just smiled the whole way in the Twizy but after one hour you start to wish a little more comfort and I noticed in the city you are taking in quite a bit off exhaust fumes. I took picture of the Sevcon but could not find out which one it was. The sales lady could not tell me more about it.

One almost dealbreaker. You NEED to rent the battery for the LIFETIME of the vehicle!! Even when the batteries get a lot cheaper you still pay premium. Service is only €50 per year. So no tweaking or tuning a Twizy. Really sad.

[o00scorpion00o]

Nice!

Surely you can sell Twizzy and throw the battery back at Renault if you want ? Surely another owner can buy it 2nd hand without having to buy Renault's battery ? That would piss me off!

You either own it or not!

I still can't understand why they didn't have full doors as an option. It would mean less wind. I'm sure they will offer that in a while. Having said that Being out on my bike the last few days, once wrapped up it's not so bad. I can only imagine it wouldn't be as bad in Twizy as the bike, you get full blast of the elements on the Bike!

[Matthijs]

Nice!

Surely you can sell Twizzy and throw the battery back at Renault if you want ? Surely another owner can buy it 2nd hand without having to buy Renault's battery ? That would piss me off!

You either own it or not!

No can't do. The twizy is connected to Renault and the battery hire for the lifetime of the vehicle! Also acros all the owners! When I started about a little more speed etc and my own pack you could see her face turn a bit pale and she came up with regulations, type approval, insurence coverage etc. to seriously talk you out of it and to make really clear that you always rent the battery from them. You can only stop payment if you temporarly dismiss it. Really a bummer because if you own it for 10 years you almost pay a second Twizy.

[Lebowski]

Nice!

Surely you can sell Twizzy and throw the battery back at Renault if you want ? Surely another owner can buy it 2nd hand without having to buy Renault's battery ? That would piss me off!

You either own it or not!

I still can't understand why they didn't have full doors as an option. It would mean less wind. I'm sure they will offer that in a while. Having said that Being out on my bike the last few days, once wrapped up it's not so bad. I can only imagine it wouldn't be as bad in Twizy as the bike, you get full blast of the elements on the Bike!

Full doors means you need a ventilation system with a fan etc etc...

[Matthijs]

Full doors means you need a ventilation system with a fan etc etc...

Well not quite because the Twizy is very open anyway. It doesn't have any seals so ventilation enough. It has a heated front window.

[o00scorpion00o]

I still can't understand how you can buy twizy, you legally own it, but you can't install your own battery ? I don't understand how they can legally do this ?

So when Twizy is 3 years old they will still charge you 50 euro's a month for only 4600 miles a year. That's not a lot of miles really ?

[Matthijs]

I still can't understand how you can buy twizy, you legally own it, but you can't install your own battery ? I don't understand how they can legally do this ?

So when Twizy is 3 years old they will still charge you 50 euro's a month for only 4600 miles a year. That's not a lot of miles really ?

I think it is because they can. The saleslady told me it is for the lifetime of the Twizy and all owners so if you buy my secondhand twizy after 1,2,3,10,15 years it still comes with the battery rental. I am hoping for belgium where combined sales of services is not allowed. If you want to drive more you pay more.

[o00scorpion00o]

I still can't understand how you can buy twizy, you legally own it, but you can't install your own battery ? I don't understand how they can legally do this ?

So when Twizy is 3 years old they will still charge you 50 euro's a month for only 4600 miles a year. That's not a lot of miles really ?

I think it is because they can. The saleslady told me it is for the lifetime of the Twizy and all owners so if you buy my secondhand twizy after 1,2,3,10,15 years it still comes with the battery rental. I am hoping for belgium where combined sales of services is not allowed. If you want to drive more you pay more.

HMmm, I wonder is this true ? maybe she is not fully aware of the situation ?

Surely I can sell Twizy 2nd hand and hand back the battery to Renault ? surely I can sell it 2nd hand and the new owner can do what he wants with it ?, I shouldn't have to tell Renault I'm selling it or to who I'm selling it to!

Having said that though, I couldn't imaging forking our for the full price of making my own battery out of LiPo!

[knoxie]

Yes I think Renault might struggle here with the legality of the battery issue, it depends on the contract law in what ever country they sell them in, they might not be able to do it in all countries.

I dont see what's to stop you taking the battery out of the car and sending it back to Renault? they need to be careful here because people dont like being tied in like this, the other option is they offer you the car without a battery, EU law is very strange and does allow this kind of practice though, high end Ferrari race cars are sometimes sold like this whereby you cant sell the car without their permission, the car is kept by Ferrari and you just get to drive it? very bizarre.

I imagine the car would cost a lot more if they didnt get the return on the battery like this though.

[JennyB]

Delivery is "greener" as well because a bunch of them just fit in a truck:

Somehow that reminds me of the scene at the start of Butch Cassidy and the Sundance Kid, with the posse's horses on the train.

That got me thinking: No one would want to drive such a light vehicle on a freeway - but who wants to drive on a freeway anyway? Ideally you could rent a Twizy, drive to a coach or train station, and pick up another at the other end to take you to you final destination. Cars fail by trying to combine door-to-door with long distance transport, which results in places too thinly spread for walking and traffic too fast for cycling. Public transport (where it is available) is awkward with anything more than hand luggage.

I'm thinking of a sort of hybrid truck/bus system that could be used by any flat-bed with spare capacity. They stop between platforms at load level on either side from where passengers and freight enter and leave. Each, depending on size, may accommodate 4-8 Twizy-sized sections which may carry (for example) either eight passengers on facing benches, up to six freight pallets, a small EV, a stretcher case, or a couple of heavily-loaded bikes and their riders. Since all can be loaded or unloaded simultaneously, stopping time is minimal. The carrier has no responsibility other than to get safely to the next stop, so could be anything from private hauliers making a bit of money from their empty trips to a dedicated electric rail line.

Stops could have a local delivery service like CargoHopper, or NEVs, trailers and ebikes for hire.

[Matthijs]

I just found out that in Holland a Twizy is registered as a L7e vehicle:

Quadricycles (L7e), also referred to as Heavy quadricycles, are defined by Framework Directive 2002/24/EC as motor vehicles
 with four wheels "other than those referred to (as light quadricycles), whose unladen mass is not more than 400 kg (category L7e) (550 kg for vehicles intended for carrying goods), not including the mass of batteries in the case of electric vehicles, and whose maximum net engine power does not exceed 15 kW.
These vehicles shall be considered to be motor tricycles and shall fulfil the technical requirements applicable to motor tricycles of category L5e unless specified differently in any of the separate Directives".[1]

But because this category in Holland is not clasified at the Dutch RDW. (DMV) it's 3 wheeled motorvehicle and has NO maximum construction speed limit! And who says 15 kW is peak power?

[Matthijs]

[Matthijs]

First video I have seen driving in heavy rain and 6 C temps. I would like to have sidewindows.

[o00scorpion00o]

I rang my insurance company and guess what ?

They will not insure a Twizy, no acceptable reason given. The girl said "it has no doors" I said it has half doors she said "but it has no windows" they are just assholes.

I bet it will cost 600 euro's or more judging by the way things are in this place!

I will ring another company later!

[o00scorpion00o]

Rang 2nd company and they said it's not on their system and they have to get back to me!

Wouldn't you think insurance companies would be informed by the auto companies of new vehicles like this ?

SO chances are If I had a Twizy in the morning I wouldn't be able to find an insurance company to insure me!

What a country!

[Lessss]

The real stupidity is that you have to have insurance at all. Cough up slave!