Complete Hobby King Lipo Protection Kit

[NeilP]

That is the thing, I was hoping to get away with no charger, just enough solar cells and a diode or two to fine tune the voltage
Needs to be simple minimal components on the boat/ pack

Will get them to get a balance charger for shore/ main boat charging, but just really wanted a safety cut off relay run from the HVC for when the solar panel is connected up and trickle charging it

Alternate would just be less solar cells to keep max voltage when cells in max daylight to below or just at 4 volt per cell


I have sent the motor people a mail to find out more about the working voltage range of these motors and their controllers

[methods]

There are more cost effective solutions for that particular problem.

I like 4S lipo for a Lead Acid replacement but the hot voltage is 16.8V which trips up some DC-AC Inverters and other "smart" electronics. It will be fine for most things that plug into a ciggy lighter though - as car 14V is noisy as hell.

I guess the important thing is the load they are going to run and for how long.
IF they are not pulling 80A then you could go with a MUCH cheaper 18650 Laptop cell pack with a built in BMS for total protection.

-methods

[methods]

Oh yea...

A couple of days ago Matthew and I took a 30 mile ebike ride. I had a 24S 20Ah pack and he had an 18S 15Ah pack. His pack was almost new and we had no reason to believe there was a problem. 12Ah into the trip his cell level LVC started tripping... The pack was still at 66V~!!! We had pack level LVC set at a conservative 58V - and that was useless. One group of cells was already at 3V when the rest were still up near 3.7V.

It was pretty awesome seeing the system actually work in (what I would consider) a bit of a freak situation. Neither of us thought he had a problem with his pack...

Makes me want to install a system on my pack

I mean... those cells still have to be replaced so it is not like it saved us any money... but I am not sure what would have happened if we had pulled 3AH more through those cells. I suppose we could have reversed them - though I have never done that with a pack. I think Lyen did once

-methods

[Jozzer]

Oooh, nice catch!

I've seen a few cells go through reversal in customers packs - without protection it is inevitable I think. Worse still is if you were to have stopped riding after discharging them a little further, then bulk charged them - that might have been interesting!

As you say, you didn't save much money in this particular case, but if you have packs in parallel then you lose paralleled cells needlesly (important when you have 20 odd Turnigy in parallel!).

[NeilP]

There are more cost effective solutions for that particular problem.

I like 4S lipo for a Lead Acid replacement but the hot voltage is 16.8V which trips up some DC-AC Inverters and other "smart" electronics. It will be fine for most things that plug into a ciggy lighter though - as car 14V is noisy as hell.

I guess the important thing is the load they are going to run and for how long.
IF they are not pulling 80A then you could go with a MUCH cheaper 18650 Laptop cell pack with a built in BMS for total protection.

-methods

I was working on 16.6 voltsd..4.15 need to see what the voltage range is when they get back to me

Curent draw is not an issue. 42 amps max draw, and I was thinking of a 20Ah pack. so even basic Lipo is nicely within range, not needing the expense of Nano Tech.

it is just down to what the max safe working voltage of their controller is..am waiting on a reply from them

[Stochastic]

Oh yea...

A couple of days ago Matthew and I took a 30 mile ebike ride. I had a 24S 20Ah pack and he had an 18S 15Ah pack. His pack was almost new and we had no reason to believe there was a problem. 12Ah into the trip his cell level LVC started tripping... The pack was still at 66V~!!! We had pack level LVC set at a conservative 58V - and that was useless. One group of cells was already at 3V when the rest were still up near 3.7V.

It was pretty awesome seeing the system actually work in (what I would consider) a bit of a freak situation. Neither of us thought he had a problem with his pack...

Makes me want to install a system on my pack

I mean... those cells still have to be replaced so it is not like it saved us any money... but I am not sure what would have happened if we had pulled 3AH more through those cells. I suppose we could have reversed them - though I have never done that with a pack. I think Lyen did once

-methods

I found the bad cell and pulled that pack out and replaced it with another. I'll open up the pack with the bad cell and replace it with a spare then dispose of the cell properly...

Had I not had the protection on there, we might have seen a pretty expensive firework show when bulk charging it.

At least I was able to get pulled home rather than pedaling.

[methods]

HAHA -> yea... I towed Matthew home

He made it 28 miles though and to be fair... his pack had more than enough juice left in it to make it home.
He is a way better rider than I am... he can do like 25wh/mile.

Skillz~!

-methods

[nicobie]

I see you turned blue.

Probably a good idea now that you are selling so much stuff.

[methods]

I don't actually agree with you - and that was not the reasoning behind turning myself blue. I could go on ad infinitum regarding perceived authority...
But I am really tired of that subject for now... so maybe later

-methods

[Bazaki]

The HVC is working very good, I am very happy with it and would recommend it to every RC lipo user.

But I can't get the throttle line working :




Red I use a the signal wire, so I have this wire in line with the throttle.
If I disconnect it from the lvc/hvc board then the throttle is working like normal, as soon as I connect the throttle line with the lvc/hvc board I am not able to ride anymore.
The batteries are all 4,18v per cell 18s.

[methods]

I sent a troubleshooting procedure that will determine if the problem is miss-wired throttle or damaged board outputs.

Without showing the entire procedure here:

1) Measure between pins 1 and 2 of the LVC board (Ground and Signal)

There is normally an open circuit here. When LVC is activated (or the boards are damaged) there will be a short circuit here (less than 50 ohms)

If you measure an open then the boards are fine and the problem is your wiring. It is very easy to confuse the wiring an 9 out of 10 times this is the issue. It is not the customers fault... it is our fault for using confusing wire colors that do not map.

If on the other hand a short circuit is measured between pins 1 and 2 then the problem is that the opto outputs are damaged. This could happen from miss wiring, but I have never seen it. If it turns out the opto's are damaged I will ship new boards out to you and you ship the ones you have back to me for analysis.

The LVC retard cable looks like this:

YELLOW = GROUND
RED = SIGNAL (with 1K inline)
BLACK = 5V

Please post pictures of your connection to the throttle and your connection to the controller.
I know it seems simple - but 9 out of 10 times this is the issue.

-methods

[Bazaki]

Everything is working really great ! I will try my LVC this evening.

It was indeed the color lining, Methods gives great support and advice !

I recommend Methods and his products to every Ebike rider

Thank you !

[methods]

Just in case anyone else has trouble:

We source our pigtails from a supplier that uses a Yellow/Black/Red color combination. Sadly, when you mate this up to a standard JST HS throttle connector the mapping goes like this

Throttle Ground = BLACK
Our Ground = YELLOW

Throttle Signal = WHITE
Our Signal = RED

Throttle 5V = RED
Our 5V = BLACK

We considered re-wiring the pigtails but it was found that the procedure of extracting and reinstating the pins lowered reliability.
We have worked out what we believe to be a good solution to this and it will show up in the next version.

-methods

[Bazaki]

Also the LVC is working really good, I set the LVC of my controller and Cycle analyst to a LVC of 20v so completely off.
On exactly 10ah forward my throttle went off.

A few cells were exactly 3.00 v

Another benefit of the system is I can use almost full power till the end, my LVC in the controller was stuttering to LVC when the pack was a third full.and therefore much slower.
Now I can ride hard till the end. Ofcourse you should not run completely empty to 3.00v, I will use about 8 out of 10ah max. to prevent 3.00v but no more cliff divers for me

[methods]

-methods

[cal3thousand]

Just ordered from Patrick! With this kit, I'm stepping into the world of LiPo.

I definitely would not have gone with LiPos for my next project (Wifey bike) without this kit and his guidance. Of course, the reading on here helped me decide that LiPo's benefits greatly outweigh the cons (with this kit, that is)

[chroot]

Hey methods, I forgot ask you to send me one more extra throttle-lvc cable and how much cost? BTW I received the throttle-cable from post office. Thanks!

[methods]

Hey methods, I forgot ask you to send me one more extra throttle-lvc cable and how much cost? BTW I received the throttle-cable from post office. Thanks!

Ok... ok... we wanted to stop producing these but I have like 7 requests right now.

Matthew... you know what you have to do man.
Lets try to get a final - final - final batch done tonight.

-methods

[Stochastic]

I will make a special last batch for those who need them.
This is it though, so you all will have to fight for them.

[chroot]

Ok I understand

Sent from my Tbolt smartphone using Endless Sphere app

[Olly3012]

Am I to late or can I grab a kit

[joe tomten]

go here:

http://www.MethTek.com

[methods]

Exciting news guys....

A member approached me the other day and we got to talking. He runs a Machine Shop and has the capabilities to manufacture a heat sink housing for the HVC Breaker module. This has several implications...

1) We will now be able to run 60A+ continuous
2) The module can now be fully potted in epoxy

So this means that we can re-purpose the HVC breaker to be an LVC Breaker.
You will be able to wire this fully potted module between your battery and controller
If any one cell hits 3.0V it will latch up and stop all discharge on your battery

Voltage range is about 30V to 130V... but that can be extended in either direction pretty easy

We are currently feverishly working on this. It should be plug and play with all of the existing systems out there... just unplug your retard cable and plug this in. OR -> Use both for redundancy.

I was only able to test up to 50A continous here before my testing rig melted down I am going to pick up a huge constant current supply from Liveforphysics to do some 100V 100A testing. Anyway...

Since I am blabbing -

We secured a load of the new motors from Croatia - so expect to see those on our website.
It is looking like we are going to stock 18fet, 24fet, and 36fet controllers. These will be serious controllers for men and women who are out of control.

-methods

PS: Some people might suggest that the LVC Breaker module only temporarily cut power and then resume... Like the throttle retard does. I dont think this is the right way to do it for many reasons. First of all... if a single cell actually hits 3.0V under load on the average ebike you are done. Yea - you could milk it down... but that is just stupid. The way to do it is to set pack level LVC a bit higher and slowly glide down on that smooth power decay ramp. IF any one cell blips 3.0V before your smooth pack level LVC starts to kick in that is a sign of an imballanced pack and it is time to stop. Just think about the sum of the cells and visualize it... So for now this is how we are going to implement the system. I will consider releasing the instructions for how to mod the system to be a temporary cut out...(like the retard cable) the board has an RC delay built into it that I normally do not populate (I just have the breaker latch up and de-power itself) but for those who are adventurous I will show you how to play.
(and then sell you more when you blow it up )
It is basically just a large ceramic capacitor on the gate of the mosfets that is inline with a 100K resistor so once the system "trips" it takes some time for that cap to charge back up to turn the mosfets back on. It basically adds some hysteresis to the system so that it does not shutter when not latching.

[dougnutz]

Awesome news!

I look forward to reducing the number of pigtails hanging off my pack

[DesignerDan]

When do you think these new units will be ready?