Help me upgrade my mini scooter

[kmxtornado]

5/27/12: I'm turning this thread into my build thread. Updated posts at the bottom.

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Okay, since I took the dive into the ebike world and purchased my conversion kit from Hightekbikes, I was thinking how cool it'd be to upgrade this bike too using the same battery. I took the motor out of the frame and found that it's a 24v motor, but no sticker that shows how many watts unfortunately. Being a cheapy and fairly old and so small, I'm guessing it's a 100-150watts.

MY POTENTIAL SETUP:
I'm wondering if I can hook up my 36v 10ah LiFepo4 battery to this thing.
I'd upgrade my 24v 30amp controller to a 36v controller. Should I get this one?
http://www.monsterscooterparts.com/36v-1200w-controller.html
24v motor would be replaced by a 36v 200w motor with a matching belt drivel sprocket from Monster Scooter Parts (see tiny pic below).
http://www.monsterscooterparts.com/36vo20mowsp.html The diameter is perfect.

What's your opinion guys? I need some expert advice. I'm still new to this stuff. Thanks.

CURRENT:





NEW:

[kmxtornado]

So you guys think this'll work? I'm hoping I can increase the speed of this thing with $100-$150. The motor's only $62 and I can't imagine the controller would be much more. Thoughts?

[SamTexas]

Since you already have plan to replace all three (battery, motor & controller) it does not matter if the motor and/or the controller is ruined, RIGHT?

If so, don't do anything big. Simply add 12 volts to the current battery and see what happens? May be that's all you'll ever need.

[kmxtornado]

Errr, yeah sorta. I suppose. I'm just scared b/c I literally know nothing about this sorta stuff. I just know everything's gotta match in terms of volts. I did hear that I could put more voltage into the existing 24v system to see what would happen and I was warned that the motor my fry. I suppose I could try that.

So just pull the 24v SLA battery out and replace it with my 36v 10ah LiFePo4 and see what happens?
No harm can be done to the battery right?
And isn't 36 a pretty big jump from a 24v system?

Alternatively what would happen if I kept everything the same about the 24v system and swapped the 24v and what I assume to be a 150w motor with a 250w one?
http://www.monsterscooterparts.com/24vo350semoc.html I assume the range would just go to @#@$# since I'm using the same energy to power something that requires more. I don't want to be stuck with low range and not be able to get back home. I really wouldn't mind spending the cash to up it to 36v all around. I just need some feedback on:

1. How much of an improvement I can expect.
2. Exactly step-by-step how to do it and confirm whether I'm specifying the correct parts or not.

[sk8norcal]

good faq here,
http://forum.modifiedelectricscooters.c ... b1ba4b9ddd

do u ride that mini-bike indoors..?
you should get a standup scooter, they are fun...

[kmxtornado]

Thanks - I'm reading the FAQ's from that forum now. According to the rules of overvolting, I shouldn't go more than 1.5x the current voltage. If I'm at 24v now, that's 36max. It's pretty much the limit. I feel like I should be below the limit/capacity for safety and so I don't blow the motor (not sure if I'd be able to find a replacement for this old thing). Overvolting requires a new controller anyway, so I may as well just get a new motor too. It's the battery that would've been the high cost item but since I already bit the bullet and bought that for my bigger e-bike conversion, that cost is pretty much settled.

So have I specified the correct parts? Just do a swap of everything and be sure I have the correct wire heads/adapters and I'm set? Anything else I need to worry about? Bit scared of all this electrical stuff. And again, the new battery I just bought would be fine right? There's no way to mess it up with this project I'm trying to do? Please confirm. Thanks!

P.S. I do not ride this thing indoors typically, but I have ridden it off the sidewalk straight into a cafe. Hahha.

[SamTexas]

So just pull the 24v SLA battery out and replace it with my 36v 10ah LiFePo4 and see what happens?

Correct.

No harm can be done to the battery right?
And isn't 36 a pretty big jump from a 24v system?

No harm to the battery as far as I know. EDIT to add: "As long as the new 36V battery is superior to the current 24V battery in term of discharge rate." Worst case will be a toasted controller. The brushed motor should have no problem handling 36V. None of those matter to you anyway, since you are going to throw the controller and the motor away anyway. That said, I believe the 36V battery will work fine and you will gain at least 25% in speed.

Edit: Pay attention to the following post by sk8norcal. Very valid point about discharge rate.

[sk8norcal]

what brand battery did u get?
c rating?

i think you need a controller with lower amp limit than the one you linked,

i read pulling too much amp might hurt the battery...

still learning about these stuff, feel free to correct me..

[Drunkskunk]

Go for it. as long as you're planning to trash the old motor and controller in favor of the new ones, might as well trash them in style. and it just might work, saving you $100 you can buy us all a beer with.

I'd give it 50/50 odds of working or smoking. But another way to see it is 50/50 odds of saving $100.

[kmxtornado]

Just thought I'd provide an update in case there's anyone actually watching this thread. Maybe I'm talking to myself, but here it goes.

I'm just waiting so I'm not spending a ton of money on so many projects all at the same time. The plan is to buy a new 36v throttle, matching controller and keep the motor as-is and pop the new battery in to see what happens. If it doesn't work, then maybe you guys can help me from there. If it does, then maybe I'll have a 24v controller and throttle up for sale.

In the meantime, I'm enjoying the e-bike conversion and working on the Specialized Hardrock restoration which are both coming along nicely thanks to you fella's here in the forum. Much thanks again to those who contributed to my threads seeking help. I hope my happiness is worth your effort. I'm trying to show my appreciation with updated photos. All are on the blog and some are reposted in the associated threads in my sig.

[kmxtornado]

Since my last post before Thanksgiving of 2011, I did end up buying all the parts and put it all together recently a couple weekends ago. The 24v SLA battery was replaced with a 36v LiFePo4 that I originally bought for my ebike conversion (see sig). The thing's lighter and doesn't have memory loss. The range is also extended and using the smart charger, I don't have to worry about unplugging it right away.

And the boost on this thing is insane! Overvolting to the 36v setup and pretty much swapping everything for new gear with the exception of the motor) has turned this thing into a monster. It's pretty ridiculously fast for a mini scoot. No longer am I crossing my fingers hoping no one mugs me for it. This thing flies now! I haven't raced anyone on foot and don't hope to anytime soon other than w/friends just to test it out, but I'm fairly certain this machine is going 18-20 mph now - that's up from the 12mph max when it was stock. A mod over at modified electric scooter hooked me up with all the info and the setup's been amazing since.

My wife tried it yesterday and popped a wheelie! Ther'es so much torque going on in the back that this thing just goes out of control if you're not careful. It's already happened to me twice.

[sk8norcal]

hey kmx, haven't talked to u in a while!

nice to hear ur having fun with the little scoot,
where did u buy ur controller and throttle?

i bought an used 36v scooter 10" wheels a while back,
the geometry was all wrong, and the shocks were crap,
it was pretty torquey and sketchy at speed.
ended up giving it to a buddy of mine.

[kmxtornado]

Yeah, the ride's freakin' amazing. I road it 5 miles to see if it could get that far and it did! Too bad I had to charge it up for an hour before returning home. I'll PM you my source for where I got the stuff. Popped 3 wheelies by accident last night b/c the rear wheel's got so much torque. It's crazy. During the ride, my brakes pretty much went out. Used 'em all up and I felt like I was riding your scooter! Had to drop my feet down flat and drag it to slow down w/o making crazy screechy noises.

[kmxtornado]

No video yet of the scooter AFTER the mod (that's in the works), but here's one of it which it was pretty much stock (with the exception of a few accessories).

http://youtu.be/dwBNZ0LoXIo

[sk8norcal]

haha! good video!

I didn't realize that thing extends out
all this time I was picturing you riding that thing like in ur avatar....

pretty cool, not as cool as my Charly though...

[kmxtornado]

Thanks! Hahah, yeah it looks like this:

[kmxtornado]

More of an accessory, but this is what I built with a 9v battery case w/switch and an LED strip from ebay. Total cost I believe was around $3.50 or something crazy like that. More info on my e-bikeconversion blog in my sig, but here's some teaser photos:


Light switch is mounted on the controller ghetto style using 3M tape. Turned out okay.

[kmxtornado]

My escoot's always needed a rear brake since my stupid shop cut my wire w/o ever telling me. This was 4 years ago and I was just glad the thing was functioning that I didn't really pay attention to the details. I mounted another light - not attached to the brake wire though.

For anyone who wants this bracket I used, it's available on DealExtreme. It's thin poor quality plastic - just so you know. Does it's job though and it's cheaper than the Topeak version of the T-bracket.

[kmxtornado]

Looks dorky, but I just had to do it.



Mounting method on blog.

[kmxtornado]

Just thought I'd post another pic. Took this today with the new lights.

[kmxtornado]

Virtual bike lane:

[Cargo_Tom]

I'm loving that bike lane light

I'm sure the cops 'round these parts would deem it as safety hazard (Lasers = bad, seems to be the prevailing attitude in my neck of the woods)

[kmxtornado]

Thanks.

If I ever get pulled over, I'm reporting it to the media for freebie marketing and a source for a new thread topic. "Miniature scooter gets pulled over by cop." Despite the crazy ongoing war between cyclists and motorists, our City is very bicycle friendly. New bike lanes popping up everywhere (except for where I ride, hahah) and I think cops would just see that I'm putting the extra effort in becoming more visible. Glowing lights and all are definitely illegal on cars, but I'm sure they'd let a bicycle off the hook (at least if I'm not speeding which I can't b/c my scoot goes 18mph tops).

I was even thinking of EL lighting, but I'm already on the verge if not already passed the line of tackiness. The thing's like a Christmas tree! More pics (and larger too) in my blog, but here's another for kicks.

[kmxtornado]

Speaking of Christmas tree, I almost forgot about my other recent mod. My wife (girlfriend at the time) had given me this color changing stand that's used for lighting up a crystal type ornament. I found a new use for it and popped it up underneath the scooter just beneath the battery tray. When turned on, it lights up different colors indirectly onto the top of the motor bracket creating a cool subtle color effect. You ca see that it's purple here and green in the pic above.

[kmxtornado]

And of course the sound system. Nothing's complete without a bit of music. Feels like the 80's boombox but in a much smaller package. The thing's almost as small as my headlight. Can you spot it here?




The gizmo's from ebay for $16.82 shipped and runs on internal rechargeable batteries. It claims 15 hrs of run time and it's fairly accurate. Sound is crisp and songs are stored on a micro SD card inserted into the unit under the earphone jack cover (located on the side opposite the speaker).




Here's a shot from the rider's side. The mounting bracket is from ebay too and sold separately (the one that came with it was velcro and I much prefer the rubber). Mounting bracket swivels 360 degrees for easy access to the buttons and rerotating it to whatever position wanted.