HELP nuvinci plus cyclone

[kriskros]

anyone running a nuvinci withe cyclone 3 chainring freewhewel?? how do you pedal?? with a normal crank setup,as you pedal ,the crank arms rotates forward for the next stro9ke...with the cyclone,the pedals DO NOT rotate forward...they freewheel... i woul d think this is for the motor to turn without forcing the pedals to rotate at the same time... i do not have the motor installed yet...just a chain line from the cyclone chainring back to the nuvinci..the nuvinci works and shifts fine hand turning the crank...maybe somebody with the same setup will understand and make a suggestion

[StudEbiker]

I have re-read that post five times and I have no idea what you are asking.

[StudEbiker]

Usually the pedal come back around from the pedaling action of your legs. The idea of a freewheel is that they don't spin with the motor so you don't have to pedal with the cranks all the time.

[kriskros]

Usually the pedal come back around from the pedaling action of your legs. The idea of a freewheel is that they don't spin with the motor so you don't have to pedal with the cranks all the time.

in other words,you cant just pedal[as with a DD] you HAVE TO use the motor...YYUUUKKK...but thanks

[StudEbiker]

That is definitely not the way it should work.

Do you have your chain on the wrong ring? There are two chainrings on the crank right? One for the motor, and one to go to the Nuvinci. If you put the drive chain on the ring that is supposed to have the chain for the motor then the cranks would just freewheel without turning the Nuvinci.

[Tench]

It sounds to me like you need to remove the chainwheel freewheel turn it over and refit it.

[kriskros]

there are THREE chainrings on my crank....one ,32t and two42t...they turn together... one chain runs from a 42t to the nuvinci... the 32t will be used for the cyclone.............if i reverse thr freewheel[even if it could be done],the motor would then force the crank to turn

[StudEbiker]

I think one of the 42s should be for the motor. Is the order from inside to outside of the bike 32/42/42? Then I think the motor goes to the outer most 42 and you can use a derailluer to switch between the other 42 and the 32 for better gearing. What's the use of having two 42s to drive the rear wheel??

[kriskros]

i really dont know why there are three chainrings[cyclone provide very little info] but,one 42t MUST go to the nuvinci [20t cog]for correcy ratio..min2/1...using the 32t to the motor and a 42t to the nuvici,would,i think, give betterspeed than having the motor and the nuvinci both on a 42t ... thanks for the brain bustyin:mrgreen:

[StudEbiker]

i really dont know why there are three chainrings[cyclone provide very little info] but,one 42t MUST go to the nuvinci [20t cog]for correcy ratio..min2/1...using the 32t to the motor and a 42t to the nuvici,would,i think, give betterspeed than having the motor and the nuvinci both on a 42t ... thanks for the brain bustyin:mrgreen:

But you said you have three chainrings on the cranks. So the outer 42 is connected to the motor. This should be the ring with the freewheel.

The two inner rings (a 32 and a 42) are for going to the Nuvinci. Standard freewheel size is 16t. If you have one of those on the rear then you would still have a 2:1 ratio using the 32t front ring.

Te 42t chainring going to the Cyclone motor will indeed give you a lover top speed, but it will give you higher reduction. Trust me, with that Nuvinci's gearing, you will not be looking for more top gear than you have!

I am running one using a mid drive and at 24mph I am only in shift position 743 of a possible 977. More reduction (so your pedal cadence can match the motor) is what you want.

At least that's what makes sense to me.

[kriskros]

as i said my nuvinci has a 20t cog..must use the 42t chainring ALL 3 chairings are linked together,so all rotate at the same time.. at 86 i could not keep a cadence at 24mph,thats why i need to be able tp pedal OR motor

[StudEbiker]

Why can't you change the 20t to a 16t? Then you would still have a 2:1 ratio even with the 32 front chainring.

I found this picture at the Cyclone site. Your set-up should be very similar to this one.

http://www.cyclone-tw.com/images/motor-cover.jpg

You will figure this out.

Have you put the motor on yet? I think once you do that things are going to make more sense. Basically though, the way I have seen Cyclone set-ups is the motor goes to the outer chainring.

Even if you didn't change the rear gear to a 16t, that doesn't dictate that you have to use the 32t for the Cyclone motor, it's just not recommended by Fallbrook that you use the 32 gear. Cyclone has no idea what your rear transmission is when they send out the motor kit. But one thing I do know for sure is that there is absolutely no reason to have two of the same gears going to the back of the bike which logically means that if you have a 42t, a 42t, and a 32t on the front crank that the motor absolutely goes to one of the 42s.

[kriskros]

as i said the three chainrings are bolted together an d therefore turn together... but this still doesnt answer my basic question...how can i use pedal OR power

[Ricky_nz]

as i said the three chainrings are bolted together an d therefore turn together... but this still doesnt answer my basic question...how can i use pedal OR power

The motor should have a freewheel attached (inside its cog) so that you can pedal without the cogging of the motor affecting your pedalling much (There is some drag). The freewheel on the crank allows all sprockets to turn even if the pedals are stationary allowing the motor to keep driving while you are not pedaling.
so the pedal speed is reasonable the cyclone should drive one 42t and you should be able to select either of the remaining cogs from the crank to the back.
The freewheel on the nuvince (I'm assuming you have a freewheel there and not a fixed cog) or a normal hub will stop the chain being driven when coasting.

[Dave_S]

...how can i use pedal OR power

I have the same setup as you do except that my rear wheel is just a common three speed hub. If you connect everything up as shown in the images on the Cyclone site, then you will be able to pedal OR power which is just what the system was designed to accomplish. The motor chain goes to the outer chain ring and you can use either of the inner two chain rings to go to the rear wheel. The freewheel in the chain ring group allows the motor to drive without the pedals moving and the freewheel in the motor allows for pedaling without the motor turning. You can also coordinate power AND pedaling which is my preferred operating mode.

[Tench]

With a name like KrisKros you would expect him to have everything back to front

http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/20/krosskross.jpg/ Sorry, its the way i tell em.

[schwibsi]

May I try to simplify this.

In your bike you have 3 freewheels.
One on the NuVinci, one on the crank and one on the motor.

Let's talk about, what they do.

1. On the Nuvinci.
This one allows for the rear wheel to spin, while the cog on the rear hub does not move or even moves backwards. This allows you to keep the crank still, while the rear wheel moves.

2. The one on the crank.
This allows for the crankarms to stay still, while the chainwheels are turning forward. This allows for the motor to power the chains and the chainwheels in the bike resulting in spinning the rear wheel while the crank arms stay still. So you can have the motor power the bike and the crankarms needn't do anything

3. The one on the motor.
This allows for the insides of the motor to stay still, while cog on the motor turns.
Thiss allows you to pedal the bike and power all chainwheels with your crank, but reduces the drag on produced by the motor. Still, both chains move and all chainwheels spin, but the internals of the motor do not move along, while the motor is not powered.

If this was all clear, don't mind me. If one of these 3 aspects does not work as described here. you might want to clarify, what it does instead

I hope this helps.

[kriskros]

SCHWIBSI.your explanation of the functions are very clear..thanks...they are asi thought,just not reasoned out as precisely as you have....perhaps i have not outlined my problem clearly....maybe nw i can..i also have trike with a DD..when the left pedal is at the top of its rotatyion and pressure is applied, the pedal moves forward and down,bringing the rirht pedal up and into position for the power stroke....with the nuvinci/ cyclone setup this does not happen exactly the same..i think the reason for this is that my design is" crank forward"...the crank pivot is about 14"in front of a vrtical line down the seat post...so, when my left pedal is at the top of its rotation and i apply pressure the bottom of theforward arcis not right below me in a vertical 180,but is forwar,which means that thr right pedal ,at the top of its rotaton,is back of the seat post line, thefreewhel in the cranbk stops the forward motion of the crank and allows the peal to fall ackwad preventing from making a forward power stroke...... i think the answer is my design fault... this the wood frame bike that i showed the basic design of some time ago uner index general bicycles "wood frame bicycle" I THANK ALL POSTERS FOR YOUR HELP

[StudEbiker]

If you are able to post pictures, it would be a huge help.

[tony67]

It sounds like you are describing that your crank arms are not moving equally and oppositely. When you say your left pedal moves forward and down, ie in an arc (circular motion) the right pedal does not arc rearward and upwards to return to "top dead centre" These two crank arms are supposed to be locked together through the bottom bracket. If you have ANY play, ie one moves and the other does not you have a mechanical problem, maybe a loose crank bolt or worn crank hole.

The forward position of your crank sounds strange but as long as your angled into your crank pivot it should not be an issue. However if your riding position is vertical and you have a crank pivot point 14 inches forward of your seat post, this might cause a weird sensation of a kind of incomplete power stroke that ends short of bottom dead centre so your returning pedal will fall short of top dead centre causing the problem you describe.

If you built this bike with a vertical riding position and a bottom bracket 14 inches forward of your seat post, this sounds like a design flaw. Lowering your seat might help as would a pic or a link.

Just a suggestion, dont take it the wrong way. I don't know if your on a phone or something but try proof read your posts before submitting, they are quite difficult to follow.

Tony

[kriskros]

the design of the bike could be described as low rider or modified chopper...these bikes are crank forward....i believe the pedaling problem in my case is,not the position of the crank,but rather theaction of the freewh..errors in typing or phrasing..are prabably due to recently developing poor vision..no offence taken

[MotoMel]

Hello Kriskros. I'm duplicating the pm's we have exchanged with this forum post, so as to complete the loop with everyone who has tried to contribute.
***
For some reason, I cannot locate pictures of your completed bike. If you'd like, you can send some to me to help me visualize your bike.

Have you tried pedaling "in a circle"? That technique might help. Perhaps you already know of it, but if not, I'll try to explain.

Most casual bike riders only press down on the pedals. So only one leg at a time is doing any work. Avid recreational cyclists and professional cyclists wear special shoes which attach to the pedals with cleats. Because the shoes are attached to the pedals, the cyclist can now not just push down with one leg but can simultaneously pull up with the other. To make that smooth and more powerful, the cyclist learns to apply some force to the pedal throughout the entire circular stroke.

Kriskros, if you are able to use cleats, then the above technique may work well for you. Without cleats, there is another technique. It is tricky, but if you can keep the shoe of the leg that just made the downstroke in contact with the pedal long enough to push it past its farthest travel and start bringing it around, then the pedal that is closest to you will have made it past its zenith and will accept a downstroke. The technique does require you to point your foot at the farthest point of the downstroke and then push the pedal not away from you, but down towards the ground instead. That brings the other pedal up and around.

If neither of the above works for you, then I suspect that you may have designed and built yourself a bike that cannot be pedaled due to the location of the crankset with respect to the bicycle seat. That would be more than frustrating.

Mel.
***
Kriskros, as you then indicated, this was the issue and you may very well try pedal straps. Bon chance!