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by Balmorhea
Oct 26 2020 2:30pm
Forum: EBike General Discussion
Topic: How practical is 72v (or 60v) for a street legal direct drive set-up meant for climbing and sub 28 mph speed?
Replies: 124
Views: 3190

Re: How practical is 72v (or 60v) for a street legal direct drive set-up meant for climbing and sub 28 mph speed?

I think you will occasionally see "moral equivalent" used in a rather broad sense, where it's simply about a fundamental distinction that may matter to people. I don't care to take on the motorcycle vs. bicycle question here myself, but indeed it may matter to people. That's what I meant....
by Balmorhea
Oct 26 2020 2:16pm
Forum: EBike Technical
Topic: electrical question: horn cuts my engine
Replies: 22
Views: 690

Re: electrical question: horn cuts my engine

bruno_mac_douglas wrote:
Oct 25 2020 1:35am
Balmorhea which capacitor/resistor do u suggest ?
I'd start with a 100V, 100uF electrolytic capacitor, and a 5 kOhm resistor to discharge it.

A choke would probably work fine too, but I've personally only used smoothing caps and RC filters to reduce noise in DC systems.
by Balmorhea
Oct 26 2020 1:10pm
Forum: EBike General Discussion
Topic: New to this
Replies: 17
Views: 713

Re: New to this

Re shifters, you still can replace your shifter with a lever type shifter, which can also be located on the left side. I mean old school shifter, just a simple lever that mounts on the bars. They come in left and right. You can adapt the bike better to your needs if you have trouble with shifting. ...
by Balmorhea
Oct 25 2020 9:04pm
Forum: EBike General Discussion
Topic: How practical is 72v (or 60v) for a street legal direct drive set-up meant for climbing and sub 28 mph speed?
Replies: 124
Views: 3190

Re: How practical is 72v (or 60v) for a street legal direct drive set-up meant for climbing and sub 28 mph speed?

"Taking" lots more current, does that translate to running cooler at that low speed power (torque) level? No. The same motor architecture with the same amount of copper makes the same amount of heat to produce the same amount of torque, no matter how many turns in the winding. You're just...
by Balmorhea
Oct 25 2020 7:26pm
Forum: EBike General Discussion
Topic: How practical is 72v (or 60v) for a street legal direct drive set-up meant for climbing and sub 28 mph speed?
Replies: 124
Views: 3190

Re: How practical is 72v (or 60v) for a street legal direct drive set-up meant for climbing and sub 28 mph speed?

Very high weight loaded tandem / cargo rig, long steep mountain climbs, none of those fixed values, #1 goal is just to maximise them. Need maximum torque at low speeds, Any system voltage between 24V and 72V is OK, whatever works out best, never mind cost issues due to higher voltage, Any winding c...
by Balmorhea
Oct 25 2020 4:39pm
Forum: EBike General Discussion
Topic: Is DIY dying?
Replies: 40
Views: 1775

Re: Is DIY dying?

Yesterday someone on reddit posted a sale on a 250w hub motor Walfart mountain bike ... I ordered 2 yesterday. [...] As a DIYer. I want to order parts this weekend to change to a programmable controller (which one?!) and screen, to add more volts to the 250 hub (is battery capable?) then I want to ...
by Balmorhea
Oct 25 2020 4:22pm
Forum: EBike General Discussion
Topic: New to this
Replies: 17
Views: 713

Re: New to this

Lemme get this right. You have a Day 6 semi-recumbent bike with a trike subframe added to it, and you're putting on a BBS02? You need to be careful. Regular BBS02 speed is sliding-on-your-face-with-your-trike-on-top-of-you speed. Use the lowest gearing you can accommodate. Don't let the motor's easy...
by Balmorhea
Oct 25 2020 4:06pm
Forum: EBike General Discussion
Topic: How practical is 72v (or 60v) for a street legal direct drive set-up meant for climbing and sub 28 mph speed?
Replies: 124
Views: 3190

Re: How practical is 72v (or 60v) for a street legal direct drive set-up meant for climbing and sub 28 mph speed?

John in CR wrote:
Oct 24 2020 11:53pm
To me it's pitiful that anyone needs to suffer with a slower bike at the end of a ride than the beginning,
That's because you don't understand bicycles or the principle of enough is enough.

It's OK, boomer.
by Balmorhea
Oct 25 2020 4:03pm
Forum: EBike General Discussion
Topic: How practical is 72v (or 60v) for a street legal direct drive set-up meant for climbing and sub 28 mph speed?
Replies: 124
Views: 3190

Re: How practical is 72v (or 60v) for a street legal direct drive set-up meant for climbing and sub 28 mph speed?

All wheel diameter and motor winding combinations I matched up to produce the same top speed on flat ground, That's a sign that the speed is power limited and not motor RPM limited. It's likely that every one of those windings is faster than optimal for the voltage and current you specified. The sl...
by Balmorhea
Oct 25 2020 3:31pm
Forum: EBike General Discussion
Topic: Slowest wind direct drive hub motor(s) available?
Replies: 63
Views: 1685

Re: Slowest wind direct drive hub motor(s) available?

If you want to get the very best from a hub motor, then use a small wheel Agreed ----> https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=108781&start=75#p1593391 -- but it will beat you up. If the tire is narrow then yes the pressure will have to be high because the diameter is so small...
by Balmorhea
Oct 24 2020 4:59pm
Forum: EBike General Discussion
Topic: How practical is 72v (or 60v) for a street legal direct drive set-up meant for climbing and sub 28 mph speed?
Replies: 124
Views: 3190

Re: How practical is 72v (or 60v) for a street legal direct drive set-up meant for climbing and sub 28 mph speed?

ebike4healthandfitness wrote:
Oct 24 2020 12:09pm
And if the goal is limited power then maybe even the lowest voltage is best?
The voltage that makes it easiest and cheapest to get a controller and battery is best. Then use the motor winding that does what you want, at that voltage.
by Balmorhea
Oct 24 2020 11:09am
Forum: EBike General Discussion
Topic: How practical is 72v (or 60v) for a street legal direct drive set-up meant for climbing and sub 28 mph speed?
Replies: 124
Views: 3190

Re: How practical is 72v (or 60v) for a street legal direct drive set-up meant for climbing and sub 28 mph speed?

The only time a different winding needs to come into play is if you're already locked into a specific voltage. "Locked into." Your mean by certain voltages of battery and controller being way more plentiful and diverse, and costing a lot less? And by not having to change to higher ampacit...
by Balmorhea
Oct 23 2020 7:25pm
Forum: EBike General Discussion
Topic: How practical is 72v (or 60v) for a street legal direct drive set-up meant for climbing and sub 28 mph speed?
Replies: 124
Views: 3190

Re: How practical is 72v (or 60v) for a street legal direct drive set-up meant for climbing and sub 28 mph speed?

Think what you misunderstand is that not everyone wants to ride like a motorcycle, and motorcycle setup doesn't help us. The OP wants 750W and 20mph, but he for some reason wants to use 72V to do that. I think it's a bad idea, the same way it's a bad idea for John in CR to prescribe a 3 turn motor t...
by Balmorhea
Oct 23 2020 12:41pm
Forum: EBike General Discussion
Topic: How practical is 72v (or 60v) for a street legal direct drive set-up meant for climbing and sub 28 mph speed?
Replies: 124
Views: 3190

Re: How practical is 72v (or 60v) for a street legal direct drive set-up meant for climbing and sub 28 mph speed?

36V 20A on a 4 turn motor produces exactly the same torque, speed, heat, power, and efficiency as 72V 10A on an 8 turn motor. Top speed will not be the same. And getting higher torque at the lower speed ranges, steeper longer hill with more weight? More turns/lower current can result in the same sp...
by Balmorhea
Oct 23 2020 12:27pm
Forum: EBike General Discussion
Topic: How practical is 72v (or 60v) for a street legal direct drive set-up meant for climbing and sub 28 mph speed?
Replies: 124
Views: 3190

Re: How practical is 72v (or 60v) for a street legal direct drive set-up meant for climbing and sub 28 mph speed?

The reason to do a high wind motor is using less amps and get better torque for fewer amps, fewer amps less heat. That's not true for hub motors, unfortunately. Resistance heating is proportional to resistance times the square of current. But the high turn count motor uses thinner wire (more resist...
by Balmorhea
Oct 23 2020 11:25am
Forum: EBike General Discussion
Topic: How practical is 72v (or 60v) for a street legal direct drive set-up meant for climbing and sub 28 mph speed?
Replies: 124
Views: 3190

Re: How practical is 72v (or 60v) for a street legal direct drive set-up meant for climbing and sub 28 mph speed?

Slower wind definitely does produce more torque. You get more torque per amp, which is usually a good thing. But the maximum torque the motor can produce is a function of size and construction, not winding. Lower turn counts take more current to produce it, and higher turn counts take less. For any...
by Balmorhea
Oct 23 2020 1:33am
Forum: EBike General Discussion
Topic: new eZip motor
Replies: 6561
Views: 531607

Re: new eZip motor

If that's the way you want to go, make sure to get a rim with the same effective rim diameter (ERD) as the old one.
by Balmorhea
Oct 22 2020 11:04pm
Forum: EBike General Discussion
Topic: New to this
Replies: 17
Views: 713

Re: New to this

I'm thinking about converting a Day 6 Journey (pedal forward) bike to e-bike with Bafang BBSo2. I don't think that the conversion itself is going to be a problem. What I want to know is whether there is an included throttle to use it as an electric scooter. Thanks. :) I have installed a bunch of BB...
by Balmorhea
Oct 22 2020 10:53pm
Forum: EBike Technical
Topic: Of course I did this - pas sensor
Replies: 26
Views: 1401

Re: Of course I did this - pas sensor

Is it a two wire motor, or a three big wires and five small wires motor? Or something else? Have you had a look at the controller to see if there are unused plugs? A throttle plug has 3 wires, one of which would have +5V on it when the bike is powered up. Typical is red/black/green, but there are ot...
by Balmorhea
Oct 22 2020 10:47pm
Forum: EBike General Discussion
Topic: new eZip motor
Replies: 6561
Views: 531607

Re: new eZip motor

I am not happy though about the 1,000W hub motor as I wanted to put that on the back of the 26" dual suspension. It is not straightforward to convert a front hub motor to rear. At the least, you have to replace the right side cover and the axle. By that point you might as well buy a new rear m...
by Balmorhea
Oct 22 2020 10:41pm
Forum: EBike General Discussion
Topic: Slowest wind direct drive hub motor(s) available?
Replies: 63
Views: 1685

Re: Slowest wind direct drive hub motor(s) available?

Here is a 24v system (using the faster wind Clyte H3540 laced to a 29" wheel) vs. a 48v system (using a slower wind Clyte H3525 laced to a 20" wheel) on a 7% grade The winding isn't proportional to the voltage, isn't proportional to the free speed. Changing the wheel diameter renders the ...
by Balmorhea
Oct 22 2020 8:46pm
Forum: EBike General Discussion
Topic: Slowest wind direct drive hub motor(s) available?
Replies: 63
Views: 1685

Re: Slowest wind direct drive hub motor(s) available?

@Balmorhea, The advantage of the high voltage (with the slow winding) is torque and efficiency. Getting 20 mph (without pedaling) could be done with low voltage and a faster wind motor......but it wouldn't climb as well. It's just not true. Watts are watts. 750W at 24V/40A and 200 RPM doesn't climb...
by Balmorhea
Oct 22 2020 8:38pm
Forum: EBike General Discussion
Topic: How practical is 72v (or 60v) for a street legal direct drive set-up meant for climbing and sub 28 mph speed?
Replies: 124
Views: 3190

Re: How practical is 72v (or 60v) for a street legal direct drive set-up meant for climbing and sub 28 mph speed?

The reason to do a high wind motor is using less amps and get better torque for fewer amps, fewer amps less heat. That's not how it works. High wind motors use thinner wire, and longer windings, therefore more resistance. High or low turn count gives you the same heat for the same torque. The reaso...
by Balmorhea
Oct 22 2020 11:01am
Forum: EBike General Discussion
Topic: Slowest wind direct drive hub motor(s) available?
Replies: 63
Views: 1685

Re: Slowest wind direct drive hub motor(s) available?

20 mph (or 28 mph with pedaling) top speed is not hot rodding. Right. That's why you don't get any advantage by using high voltage. I'm quick to advocate for using the right winding for the job. In most cases, that's a slower winding than the industry provides as a default. But since you're only lo...
by Balmorhea
Oct 22 2020 12:13am
Forum: EBike General Discussion
Topic: Slowest wind direct drive hub motor(s) available?
Replies: 63
Views: 1685

Re: Slowest wind direct drive hub motor(s) available?

What is the slowest wind direct drive hub motor available? Leaf Bike will make you whatever winding you want for their 1000W and 1500W direct drive hubs, no extra charge. If you tell them what wheel size and speed you want, or how many RPM you want, they'll choose the best winding for the job. For ...