Electric RC planes?

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Toshi   10 kW

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Electric RC planes?

Post by Toshi » Dec 06 2009 5:38pm

i know that recumpence is into RC helis (?) bigtime, but is anyone else? i'm thinking of getting a RC plane. i have no gear, and frankly i don't know any better so i think a ready to fly (RTF) kit would be the ticket for me. which one should i get? i imagine i should be looking for something with LiPo batteries, but is a brushed motor ok?

one that i'm particularly curious about is the Hobby Zone Super Cub LP RTF (LP = LiPo, RTF is as above). it runs $180 at hobbyzone.com with everything needed in the box.

http://secure.hobbyzone.com/search/HBZ7300.html

it has at least one very positive review: http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1068138 as well as others that are nearly as positive but carp about the inexpensive radio and brushed motor.

thoughts from the peanut gallery?

Image
(it has an optional float kit that might be fun once landings are dialed in.)

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Re: Electric RC planes?

Post by JEB » Dec 06 2009 6:04pm

I never have had a rc to fly, but try a computer setup first of the type of plain you want to fly- what I was told start with a slow flyer, haveing the prop in the center of the plain over the wing (a pusher), and buy an extra wing.

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Re: Electric RC planes?

Post by rscamp » Dec 06 2009 6:25pm

What every beginner wants is a nice looking plane. What ever beginner needs a basic trainer and experienced help.

Join a club, get insured (AMA or whatever) and hook up with a flight instructor who can recommend an aircraft, properly set it up, preflight it and test fly it BEFORE you get your hands on the sticks. Then he'll let you have stick time at three mistake altitude... ;)

Oh, and a simulator these days is a great help - but remember the real thing won't be trimmed like the one in the simulator, so you still need help with that...
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Toshi   10 kW

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Re: Electric RC planes?

Post by Toshi » Dec 06 2009 6:46pm

thanks for the tips! i had no idea that the AMA existed (well, that one--i'm a member of the American Medical Association already 8) ), and similarly hadn't heard of RC airplane insurance. would the Park Plane category of AMA membership be enough? it seems to fit me to a T:

http://www.theparkpilot.org/

here's a local club that looks interesting (ie, their website exists and isn't awful):

http://www.meroke.com/

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Re: Electric RC planes?

Post by D-Man » Dec 06 2009 7:49pm

My first electric plane was re-contructed 3 times before I had trouble free flights. It was a low wing tail dragger. Stll have it. I started with beginner type gliders before that though.
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Re: Electric RC planes?

Post by AussieJester » Dec 06 2009 8:24pm

PLUS 1 for computer simulation, learn to fly on the PC before even attempting to take off your model.


I was right into RC helis couple of years back the simulation on the PC i found INVALUABLE, theres nthing you cant do on the sim
and it is as hars if not harder than the real thing IMHO. If you can do it on the sim and you can get over the "shit i dont want to break it" scare factor when flying the real thing, there's nothing you wont be able to do with the real thing that you can do on the sim.

I would check out the RC Helis, i could fly planes (basic stuff) with my eyes shut after 5-10 minutes on the sim, the helis takes literally days and days the difficulty factor is HUGE and thus seems to keep you 'hooked' alot longer (for me anywayz) than the fixed wing aircraft. The helis themselves are also HUGELY technical aircraft requiring exact setups for them to even hover, something that also seems to grab you. The planes (for me) were rather boring after helis. (absolutely NO OFFENCE intended to fix wing flyers...)

This fella Alan Szabo jnr is one of the best pilots in the world maybe this will provide you with some inspiration to go with a heli...(you can do all these stunts on sim too FYI...if your good enough that is hahaha) p.s its an outrunner electric motor dont it sound coooool!



and just to make everyone thats ever tried to fly a rc model, here (at the time) 4 year old Justin Chi-->



FOUR YEARS OLD FFS!!!!! (and no its not fake this kid is the real deal...)

Best of luck with your rc hobby it is immense fun...but can get pricey

KiM

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Toshi   10 kW

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Re: Electric RC planes?

Post by Toshi » Dec 06 2009 8:37pm

sims: something like AeroFly? (i see that it has a mac version, and my wife's MacBook meets the minimum requirements even tho my Mac Mini sadly does not.)

one needs a radio to use with the sim, no? such a setup is much more expensive than a simply RTF plane kit!

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Re: Electric RC planes?

Post by Toshi » Dec 06 2009 9:05pm

Toshi wrote:sims: something like AeroFly? (i see that it has a mac version, and my wife's MacBook meets the minimum requirements even tho my Mac Mini sadly does not.)

one needs a radio to use with the sim, no? such a setup is much more expensive than a simply RTF plane kit!
how much more expensive? i attempt to tally it up:

1) the cheap, "wrong" way: buy a RTF kit, learn to fly it yourself in a field. total investment < $200.

2) join the AMA, maybe with its limited Park Flyer membership ($30, or $50 for the full meal deal). join a local club (my local club would be $60/yr + $50 initial fee + the county aerodrome park permit $20/yr). buy a sim, such as Aerofly (~180 Euro). buy a compatible radio (i imagine ~$200). then buy a kit that just needs one to add the radio, buy batteries, put it together. this seems like a great way to spend close to a grand…

i'd love to learn without breaking off a wing but the price disparity between the "wrong" and "right" approaches is really shocking.

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Re: Electric RC planes?

Post by lesspedal » Dec 06 2009 9:11pm

Try flying first up with no help, no previous experience.
Result, 20 seconds of flight with a heap of rubbish to put in rubbish bag.
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Toshi   10 kW

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Re: Electric RC planes?

Post by Toshi » Dec 06 2009 9:22pm

lesspedal wrote:Try flying first up with no help, no previous experience.
Result, 20 seconds of flight with a heap of rubbish to put in rubbish bag.
isn't that the whole point of these foam, self-correcting geometry, slow starter RTF plane kits? i did have a cheap 3-channel heli kit a year ago btw, and it gave many an hour of indoor and outdoor entertainment before it developed a death wobble from being crashed too many times.

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Re: Electric RC planes?

Post by will_newton » Dec 06 2009 9:26pm

i have been flying rc for a few years. I mostly fly gliders and electric planes along with a few helis. I have spent well into the five digit figures on that hobby and fly at competitions and scratchbuild competition gliders.

If you are just starting out by yourself, with no one around then you should look into getting a Parkzone plane to learn on. they are all in one kits, but of a higher quality than you get at Wal-mart. These kits are designed for beginner's or folks that don't want to build. there is some corner cutting to save money, but the kits are still very nice and a well supported by the company and online forums. PZ stuff also can be interchanged, so if you buy a kit with a transmitter, you can use that transmitter and equipment for other kits.

I would maybe get an Ember. It's 3-channel plane and built very lightly. This actually nice because inevitable crashes don't do much damage. http://www.parkzone.com/Products/Defaul ... ID=PKZ3400

If you want something bigger and more planelike apprearance, try a Radian.
http://www.parkzone.com/Products/Defaul ... ID=PKZ4700

I would not recommend jumping into larger helis right away unless you have a buddy to help you out a bit. But if you want an absolutely awesome simple indoor heli that you can fly inside, within a few minutes of opeing the box get a Blade MCX. I keep one at work just to horse around with. http://www.e-fliterc.com/Products/Defau ... D=EFLH2200

and you definitely need to go to the beginner's electric airplane forum on http://www.rcgroups.com It's one of the best rc forums on the planet.

good advice on the AMA as well.
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will_newton   1 kW

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Re: Electric RC planes?

Post by will_newton » Dec 06 2009 9:35pm

one more thing, go to those clubs and start asking questions. EVERYONE that has been flying long has old stuff for sale or knows of deals on used parts, planes, transmitter, chargers, and flightsims. Generally, clubs want members and will help new guys out. You should be able to "test fly" the club a few times before officially joining, but don't be surprised if you are not allowed to fly without an AMA license (just get the park license until your planes get bigger) also check the for sale forums on rcgroups.som you can buy about anything you could ever want there.

Dude, you live near an aerodrome indoor club? you gotta go there. there will be lots of small planes to check out.

you should be able to get airborne for well under $200. The complete PZ kits range from $100-$200 for starter setups and a bit more for nicer stuff.
Adult sized E-kick Scooter- Self-made frame, NC1606/35amp, 12s10 ah lipo Hidden build thread in the E-S Beer section!
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AussieJester   100 GW

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Re: Electric RC planes?

Post by AussieJester » Dec 06 2009 9:51pm

You can buy cheap sims on ebay
for under 50 bucks come with a "transmitter" i have tried these they are nowhere at the leavel
of RealFlight G5 Sims graphically
but they still work as far as being able to teach you how to control the plan/heli.

If your like me and dont mind a lil piracy you can download RealFlight/crack from bittorrent and buy a cable from Ebay
and hook them to the transmitter you use for your plane...but i dont condone software piracy :mrgreen:
OH...before i actually even had a transmitter i used a 'standard' game pad, easier than a transmitter though so might not be
the best option.

KiM

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Re: Electric RC planes?

Post by voicecoils » Dec 06 2009 9:52pm

I'm having similar thoughts, Toshi.

Looking at my set of Zippy 5S1P 5Ah 15C lipo packs, I was thinking "I should be putting one of these in a RC plane!". Then I looked at what sort of plane would use even one pack of that size and they all seemed to have wingspans larger then would fit in my GF's car :lol:

Anyways this is the sort of thing I was thinking...

* I don't want to join any more forums (I don't have the time!!!)
* I'd like a nearly indestructible plane
* I'd like something that could carry a GoPro HD camera on the underbelly (~170 grams)
* I don't really care about extreme acrobatics
* I'd like to be able to hand launch it

Perhaps the experts can chime in and make some suggestions?

Cheers guys!

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Re: Electric RC planes?

Post by AussieJester » Dec 06 2009 10:13pm

This is the advantage of the lecky planes voicecoils, you could hand launch it from your driveway and fly it too the park as your girlfriend drives you in the car ...following the plane :mrgreen:

KiM

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voicecoils   10 MW

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Re: Electric RC planes?

Post by voicecoils » Dec 06 2009 11:08pm

AussieJester wrote:This is the advantage of the lecky planes voicecoils, you could hand launch it from your driveway and fly it too the park as your girlfriend drives you in the car ...following the plane :mrgreen:

KiM
:lol:

I'd love to have a transmitter/receiver that I could wear while riding and have a plane or heli follow and film while flying on autopilot.

But...I don't think such kit exists yet though :?

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Toshi   10 kW

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Re: Electric RC planes?

Post by Toshi » Dec 06 2009 11:16pm

sweet jeebus yet again: so it looks like neither my nor my wife's computer is up to the task for running Aerofly (see their requirements page). furthermore, even the very nice trainer RTF kits that come with all the buzzwords*, for example the E-Flite Apprentice 15e RTF, don't have radios that are snazzy enough to be compatible with Aerofly. sheesh.

:x

* buzzwords in this case: 5 channels, DSM2, 2.4 GHz, brushless, LiPoly

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AussieJester   100 GW

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Re: Electric RC planes?

Post by AussieJester » Dec 06 2009 11:22pm

voicecoils wrote:
AussieJester wrote:This is the advantage of the lecky planes voicecoils, you could hand launch it from your driveway and fly it too the park as your girlfriend drives you in the car ...following the plane :mrgreen:

KiM
:lol:

I'd love to have a transmitter/receiver that I could wear while riding and have a plane or heli follow and film while flying on autopilot.

But...I don't think such kit exists yet though :?

haha not quite...but close... helicommand make
units that keep altitude exact as well as automatically stabilising
the heli, really takes alot of the skillz out of it TBH...coupled with gyro
stabilised camera setups the rc heli guyz get some neat areal photography results

Toshi
theres only one radio you should be looking at getting and thats a Spektrum
brilliant gear i had a DX7 for a park flier a DX6 would be the shot. They run on 2.4ghz
and are interference free*

KiM.

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Toshi   10 kW

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Re: Electric RC planes?

Post by Toshi » Dec 07 2009 12:37am

after reading about this stuff for several hours i think something like the Super Cub or the Apprentice will be a bit too fast and big without simulator time and a very large field, and setting up a good sim is non-trivial. so maybe small is the way to go, just like the dead-on-arrival one that i flirted with last year:

ParkZone Ember 2 review

hmm.

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Re: Electric RC planes?

Post by enoob » Dec 07 2009 1:05am

flying is flying so have atter man . its a blast . im going to look for the setup i saw a while back that gave you 3 bodys and one "control" section that included all the servos and motor . it looked rather robust and gave you the option of beginner/intermediate and advanced body styles all working off the same "control" section. so if you destroy one body you can keep flying . soon as i find it ill edit it in.

That said im with aussiejester . helis are rather fun, heres my collection starting at the bottom is the dragonfly . dont get one of these .POS . but i learned alot . the second is good the blade cx2 , very easy to learn on as it will hover on its own and steer rather easy . then the cp pro , 3d flight capable and WOW is it a trip . it can do things that seem like its in fast forward . BUT probably the most rc fun ive ever had.
the cx2 is a great entry level flight rc. my wife is able to fly it around the living room and she can barely make it up a flight of stairs with out hurting herself. AND if you take the first few flights outside it will introduce you to triming out an rc without to many variables right away.
Image
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AussieJester   100 GW

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Re: Electric RC planes?

Post by AussieJester » Dec 07 2009 1:14am

enoob, my bro bought a couple of those lil blades hella fun to thrash through the house & garage with
you can get 'cnc upgrade' kits for them im sure your aware? Fun with no wind anything more than a fart or
a burps worth of wind and they get blown away though, i seen the bros literally tumble
end over end 30-40 foot up in a strong wind funny as hell.

Helis FTW :-)

KiM

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Re: Electric RC planes?

Post by enoob » Dec 07 2009 1:32am

brother that video of alan szabo is UNREAL . the part where hes rapidly inverting to hover and then level hover and back and forth is just WOW.

YA these blades are light, the cp pro is very nimble but any wind wind will work it over rather good. best for calm days or indoors. BIG indoors with the pro till youve got a handle on how fast it reacts
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Re: Electric RC planes?

Post by AussieJester » Dec 07 2009 2:52am

enoob wrote:brother that video of alan szabo is UNREAL . the part where hes rapidly inverting to hover and then level hover and back and forth is just WOW.
I think these days with the number of fliers at this level it comes down more to who has the quickest/strongest servos.... for 3d flying anywayz. Szabo is definately pro though no doubt about that, Youtube for Curtis Youngblood hes a bit of a champ too.

KiM

p.s i taught em both everything i know....almost, they havent learnt the crashing part like i did ;-P

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Re: Electric RC planes?

Post by Drunkskunk » Dec 07 2009 11:10am

Toshi wrote:after reading about this stuff for several hours i think something like the Super Cub or the Apprentice will be a bit too fast and big without simulator time and a very large field, and setting up a good sim is non-trivial. so maybe small is the way to go, just like the dead-on-arrival one that i flirted with last year:

ParkZone Ember 2 review

hmm.




Skip the Ember. I've had 2, but I also have thousands of hours of flight time. they are tricky to fly because there size makes them hyper sensitive. And they are fragile. klenex is stronger.
they are a pure joy to fly, though. I like to fly mine around us as I walk through the park with my girlfriend.

The first plane you picked is best. However, Download this First! Its Free!FMS
http://www.flying-model-simulator.com/
Don't worry about using a radio to fly. Hell, you can use your keyboard. the trick is to train the mind. no simulator can train your hands well enough, just like no simulator could prepare your hands for surgery. But FMS or any simulator will prepare you to think in terms of 3 dimensions.

I've taught more than a few to fly, and I recomend 20 hours of playing FMS or any other simulator before you try to fly. I also recomend you play a simulator for a warm up before each actual flight.

As for the best starter plane, the one you listed is the one I have taught more people to fly on. Its a brilliant plane for the job. its fun to fly, has excilent stall characteristics, and is large enough to react slowly enough to allow a new pilot time to think through the problem when they encounter one. Generaly,The larger a plane is, the easier it is to fly for a beginer.
its not crash proof, but its still a tough plane, and cheap and easy to repair. every part is replacable and sold individualy.

FMS = $free
Parkzone Supercub = $180
Buy the ticket, take the ride.
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Toshi   10 kW

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Re: Electric RC planes?

Post by Toshi » Dec 07 2009 2:48pm

Thanks for the firsthand input. I wish the cub was 2.4 GHz. I don't want to dump $180 into a technological dead end. The Ember 2, being DSM2, will work with it's included radio but also can be bound to a "big boy" JR or Spektrum box if I do stick with this...

With regard to sims: I have macs. Not so new ones either. I guess I could try that free sim running under Parallels Desktop (Windows XP, running pseudo-natively on my Intel-based mac)...

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