Theft controller

Talk about anything and everything here within reason.
Harold in CR   1 MW

1 MW
Posts: 1632
Joined: Feb 01 2010 7:19pm
Location: Costa Rica

Theft controller

Post by Harold in CR » Aug 24 2012 8:45pm

Down here, there is getting to be more motorcycle theft. Sometimes, it's a gun pointed at you so, you climb off, and the thief rides off with your moto.

I have been searching on the computer for a simple push button, electronic system, that you can deactivate your power source, by pushing a button, on a device that hangs around your neck, tucked inside your shirt. Park the Moto or Bike, push one button to deactivate. When you want to go, push a button to reactivate.

Some asshole steals your bike, he has no way to start it, and, the motor cogs, so, he abandons the bike or moto. OR, as he drives away, you simply stop the machine, preferably when he is in the middle of a busy intersection. :twisted:

I want this to work on EBikes, EMotos.

Any electronics guys know how to build this ??

It would work like the cold weather start features on cars used in the great white north.
Thanks to Justin, the forum is open source and NON-commercialized.

nechaus   1 MW

1 MW
Posts: 1875
Joined: Oct 11 2011 7:41pm
Location: Brisbane > AUSTRALIA

Re: Theft controller

Post by nechaus » Aug 24 2012 11:06pm

You could get a baseball bat, paint it black

Find a really powerful servo that could knock someone out,


Set up somekind of swinging arm to beat someone from a button

User avatar
MattyCiii   100 kW

100 kW
Posts: 1367
Joined: May 05 2007 2:06pm
Location: Boston, MA, USA

Re: Theft controller

Post by MattyCiii » Aug 25 2012 12:11am

I bought a GPS tracker/alarm system for my bike. Put a SIM chip in it and it'll report its position back to you. There are wires/outputs for things like fuel pump disable (even included a relay for this purpose), and a secret "carjack panic button", but I did not explore what that does. Has a key fob for close range activation/deactivation, and can be remotely activated through text message commands. This might be just the ticket. I pay about $15 for the SIM chip on AT&T as an "extra line" on the family plan.
1st build: Dahon Jetstream folding bike. Quick, reliable, capable of 32mph. Light enough to lift, folds for easy transport by car/bus/train.
2nd build: RC powered 2009 Norco A-Line. Top speed 39mph. Built like a tank, it's resistant to Boston potholes, can stop on a dime, easily goes up/down curbs when necessary.
3rd build (just started): Scratch build ultimate utility bike. Based on a common power module using a NuVinci left side freewheel.

Kin   10 kW

10 kW
Posts: 858
Joined: Mar 05 2011 6:16pm
Location: NC or MA, U.S

Re: Theft controller

Post by Kin » Aug 25 2012 12:25am

Uhh, a rfid tag system.


But you don't want to piss off a guy with a guy while he's only 20 meters away from you. So you'd have to have the RFID system only turn off if you're not in signal for X number of seconds. Or you'd have to go the route of something cellphone networked.
New to endless-sphere? Notice a lot of signatures recommending Ebikes.ca? That's because it's the best place for a quality and manageable, (but still 'real'), first build. Justin is a solid supporter of electric bike development, and a good source of equipment.

User avatar
amberwolf   100 GW

100 GW
Posts: 26735
Joined: Aug 17 2009 6:43am
Location: Phoenix, AZ, USA, Earth, Sol, Local Bubble, Orion Arm, Milky Way, Local Group
Contact:

Re: Theft controller

Post by amberwolf » Aug 25 2012 1:02am

Jeremy Harris built an RFID system in the seat that does this. So if you're not on the bike it won't go.

You coudl make something to extend it's range.

Personally, if it's a thief, I'd have a second system that electrifies the handlebar grips with a conciousness-robbing shock, high enough voltage to even go thru thin gloves if possible, whenever your RFID is out of range. Just make sure you wear gloves thick enough to not be affected should something go wrong with the RFID. ;)


Alternately, I found a doggy door by PetSafe that has an RFID "key" that opens when the key is within a preset range (it has a variable range setting, too, but it's not very far), and it can use up to four different keys, IIRC. I haven't yet converted it to the bike "ignition" RFID, but plan to when I have time. I got it really cheap on clearance, but you might find something similar on the web cheap, too.

It would mostly require adding a latching circuit that would convert it's momentary door-opening-motor-signal into a latch for when the RFID is near it, and unlatch when the RFID is pulled away from it. Runs off C-size batteries so you coudl power it off the bike's pack or it's own.


There are almost certainly aftermarket RFID systrems for cars, motorcycles and scooters, too, but I haven't looked for them.



Another deterrent system would be a remote controlled flame source, like a propane torch, that starts spurting fire straight up right in front of the seat. :) If he's on fire he might not come after you. :lol:

User avatar
Jeremy Harris   10 GW

10 GW
Posts: 4208
Joined: Oct 23 2007 4:15pm
Location: Salisbury, UK

Re: Theft controller

Post by Jeremy Harris » Aug 25 2012 2:44am

If you're running a Xiechang controller ("Infineon", Lyen, e-crazyman etc) then there is a theft lock built in that you can programme. This locks the wheel electrically when activated, and is remarkably powerful - you couldn't ride off with it set or even push the bike.

If it were me I'd go for really simple activation, using a double pole reed switch wired inside the controller box to the theft wire connection (called "guard" I think in the programming software). If this were glued to the inside of the case, with a small piece of thin sheet steel glued on the outside, then you could have a neo magnet on a bit of string that sticks to this and keep the wheel unlocked for normal riding. When you pull the string and release the magnet the controller locks the wheel.
Please ask questions on the forum, rather than by PM, as it helps others and you'll get a better range of answers.

Harold in CR   1 MW

1 MW
Posts: 1632
Joined: Feb 01 2010 7:19pm
Location: Costa Rica

Re: Theft controller

Post by Harold in CR » Aug 25 2012 2:49am

OK. First, I know nothing about electronics. I don't have a cell phone (GASP), so, don't know if that system works down here?
Second. Seat activated will not do what I want. I want to be able to shut down the bike-moto, after it's been taken. Once the thief is 50 meters or so away, push the button, bike-moto goes dead. Guy is not likely to go looking for me. He wants to get away, especially if he is in the street and traffic is trying to get by. Same type thing the cops use in the bait-car scam they run, as seen on TV. It would also work on a parked bike-moto, of course.

I know of more than 1 instance, where, 2 guys are on a moto or in a car, pull up to a rider, and flash the pistol. Do a grab and run. One guy has seen his moto since, with a guy driving it. I wanted to go look for the guy, but, owner was scared. :roll: :roll:

I think this system would sell well, and, have the guy to initiate it and install them. I'm thinking to cut the power to the controller, like an open-close relay, but, I'm electronically challenged.

AHhhhh, Jeremy is thinking like I am. Jeremy, would it stop the bike in motion ??

Now, I need to find out what a reed switch is. :roll: :roll: 8)
Thanks to Justin, the forum is open source and NON-commercialized.

User avatar
dogman dan   100 GW

100 GW
Posts: 34826
Joined: May 17 2008 12:53pm
Location: Las Cruces New Mexico USA

Re: Theft controller

Post by dogman dan » Aug 25 2012 4:39am

My car remote door locks work at a suprising distance, at least 100ft, maybe more. So something yanked out of a junk car could be a possiblity.

Youd be having a 12v actuator of some kind out of the door lock, that could be used to switch on whatever your deterrent is. Maybe regen braking to shut off the controller and lock the wheel. Not sure where the reciever is located in most cars. It would be activated by hitting the lock button on a key fob transmitter.

It would work at 50-100 feet or so from the original thief, or if you could get close to the bike later on.

Here's another fairly simple idea. How about a set of timers? You set the timer for 30 min or whatever, and have to open a lockbox to reset it. Your bike gets jacked, 20 min later it goes dead. Ist timer shuts off controller, a few min later, the wheel locks. That way if you screw up and let the timer run out, you have time to reset before the braking kicks in. You'd still have to try to locate the thing, but nobody would be riding it around till they figured out the lockbox had a timer switch inside it.

User avatar
Jeremy Harris   10 GW

10 GW
Posts: 4208
Joined: Oct 23 2007 4:15pm
Location: Salisbury, UK

Re: Theft controller

Post by Jeremy Harris » Aug 25 2012 4:57am

Harold in CR wrote: AHhhhh, Jeremy is thinking like I am. Jeremy, would it stop the bike in motion ??

Now, I need to find out what a reed switch is. :roll: :roll: 8)
It would stop the bike in motion, for sure, it locks the wheel up. I use it to lock the propeller on one of my electric boat drives, I have a switch that's activated by the prop shaft position and this locks the motor solid using the "guard" anti-theft feature when I activate it and the two blade prop is pointing up and down (so I can swing the motor up through a narrow slot in the hull).

A reed switch is a tiny glass encapsulated switch (pretty cheap, less than $1) that is activated by a magnet. If you had the magnet on a length of cord, maybe clipped to your belt, when you moved away from the bike the magnet would pull off and turn on the wheel lock. Unless the thieves figured out how to turn it back on with another magnet it's effectively immobile until the battery runs down. If they challenge you, say it's bio encoded to your body and only works with you sat on the saddle- they'd probably not have the IQ to work out that was BS.
Please ask questions on the forum, rather than by PM, as it helps others and you'll get a better range of answers.

John in CR   100 GW

100 GW
Posts: 13652
Joined: May 20 2008 12:58am
Location: Paradise

Re: Theft controller

Post by John in CR » Aug 25 2012 6:56am

Simply stickers on both sides of the bike that say "Alto Voltaje" will do the trick until they learn the value of batteries. Then nothing will stop them.

The nice thing about ebikes is no dripping oil, odor, or hot parts, so they're fine to bring inside.

Now for the bike jack ender, either a remotely operated reverse switch or front wheel lock would be nice. For a high power bike, a remote control throttle or even something as simple as having that reed switch convert the throttle into ON/OFF instead of variable, or stuck on WOT at first twist.

Harold in CR   1 MW

1 MW
Posts: 1632
Joined: Feb 01 2010 7:19pm
Location: Costa Rica

Re: Theft controller

Post by Harold in CR » Aug 25 2012 7:59am

Thanks Jeremy. 8)
Thanks to Justin, the forum is open source and NON-commercialized.

User avatar
dogman dan   100 GW

100 GW
Posts: 34826
Joined: May 17 2008 12:53pm
Location: Las Cruces New Mexico USA

Re: Theft controller

Post by dogman dan » Aug 25 2012 2:47pm

Yeah, full plug braking on a front hub, activated by your car remote door lock device would be ideal.

At about 100', when they hit at least 20 mph, then hit the front wheel locker. Wheeee! Even locking a rear hub would give em a reason to think again about keeping the bike. They aren't going to carry it off most likely.

User avatar
Jeremy Harris   10 GW

10 GW
Posts: 4208
Joined: Oct 23 2007 4:15pm
Location: Salisbury, UK

Re: Theft controller

Post by Jeremy Harris » Aug 25 2012 3:33pm

The anti-theft wheel lock on all the Xiechang controllers isn't plug braking as such, it's active, so a heck of a lot more powerful. The controller actively powers the motor to stop it turning, a bit like the way a servo works. The harder you try and turn the wheel, the more current the controller stuffs in to keep it locked solid. It's of limited use, as it uses a bit of battery power whenever it's turned on (not much, just the controller on current unless someone tries to turn a wheel), so can't easily be used for long term security.

It'd have someone off for sure if remote activated with the bike on the move.
Please ask questions on the forum, rather than by PM, as it helps others and you'll get a better range of answers.

Harold in CR   1 MW

1 MW
Posts: 1632
Joined: Feb 01 2010 7:19pm
Location: Costa Rica

Re: Theft controller

Post by Harold in CR » Aug 25 2012 4:21pm

:twisted: :twisted: :twisted: Thanks again, Jeremy. 8)
Thanks to Justin, the forum is open source and NON-commercialized.

Kin   10 kW

10 kW
Posts: 858
Joined: Mar 05 2011 6:16pm
Location: NC or MA, U.S

Re: Theft controller

Post by Kin » Aug 25 2012 8:10pm

Don't hurt yourself though...I feel this might be more likely can be the case with hacked together emergency brakes. Also consider whether you want to potentially kill someone who stole your bike [by flinging them off the bike at speed] just because they stole your bike. I don't mean to be preachy but you could be thinking about the awesomeness of fighting back without thinking of the potentially awful side effects. In the U.S at least, that could be considered criminal (vigilante justice is not much good.) And things like spam SMSs could really be dangerous if they triggered your system (so yeah don't forget about those.)
New to endless-sphere? Notice a lot of signatures recommending Ebikes.ca? That's because it's the best place for a quality and manageable, (but still 'real'), first build. Justin is a solid supporter of electric bike development, and a good source of equipment.

Harold in CR   1 MW

1 MW
Posts: 1632
Joined: Feb 01 2010 7:19pm
Location: Costa Rica

Re: Theft controller

Post by Harold in CR » Aug 25 2012 8:27pm

So, you don't think a guy pulling a pistol and threatening to shoot you if you don't give up your ride, is not serious enough to retaliate :shock: :roll:

But ossifer, I have no idea why that bike stopped so quick. Maybe the guy is just too stupid to be a thief ?????
Thanks to Justin, the forum is open source and NON-commercialized.

Kin   10 kW

10 kW
Posts: 858
Joined: Mar 05 2011 6:16pm
Location: NC or MA, U.S

Re: Theft controller

Post by Kin » Aug 25 2012 8:44pm

Hey, i'm not trying to argue with you, I was just trying to bring up some of the implications of a hard lock at speed if they weren't already explicitly thought of.

But, to clarify, you wouldn't be defending yourself or protecting yourself [since he already pulled the gun on you and stole the bike], you would be revenging your potentially killed self [and only would you be around to activate the lock if he didn't actually kill you.] Its up to you. Hell, maybe if he (or she, I guess) is a serious killer then you'd be saving someone, but it's up to you to decide. I personally have no interest in killing people and realize there's a risk someone might kill me, but believe there's little that I can do to mitigate that [besides avoiding being excessively foolhardy.] You might think otherwise, I can't argue with you.
New to endless-sphere? Notice a lot of signatures recommending Ebikes.ca? That's because it's the best place for a quality and manageable, (but still 'real'), first build. Justin is a solid supporter of electric bike development, and a good source of equipment.

Harold in CR   1 MW

1 MW
Posts: 1632
Joined: Feb 01 2010 7:19pm
Location: Costa Rica

Re: Theft controller

Post by Harold in CR » Aug 25 2012 9:08pm

It's not arguing. Why not just face plant the thief ?? This is a different world down here. We don't have frivilous lawsuits like the USA. It's stand up for one self. Still no need to do stupid stuff either, like try to take the gun. :roll:
Thanks to Justin, the forum is open source and NON-commercialized.

Kin   10 kW

10 kW
Posts: 858
Joined: Mar 05 2011 6:16pm
Location: NC or MA, U.S

Re: Theft controller

Post by Kin » Aug 25 2012 9:18pm

You're missing my point, but whatever. Its your life. I don't mean missing my point as if it's some intellectually superior concept, it's just I guess you see things differently.
New to endless-sphere? Notice a lot of signatures recommending Ebikes.ca? That's because it's the best place for a quality and manageable, (but still 'real'), first build. Justin is a solid supporter of electric bike development, and a good source of equipment.

User avatar
Dauntless   100 GW

100 GW
Posts: 7338
Joined: May 29 2010 1:49am
Location: Coordinates: 33°52′48″N 117°55′43″W

Re: Theft controller

Post by Dauntless » Aug 26 2012 12:50am

Your best ever antitheft. Without one of these, how about an exploding dye pack as with the bank robber? Not only will it mark him, but when that cloud goes up in his face at 40mph, he might prefer the magnavolt over the landing he's about to suffer.

Yeah, Kin, you gotta be careful around here. Some of these people are pathologically left wingers until THEY are the crime victims, then suddenly it's no longer society's fault.

Any sufficiently advanced technology is INDISTINGUISHABLE FROM MAGIC!
- Arthur C. Clarke

User avatar
dogman dan   100 GW

100 GW
Posts: 34826
Joined: May 17 2008 12:53pm
Location: Las Cruces New Mexico USA

Re: Theft controller

Post by dogman dan » Aug 26 2012 5:04am

I do agree, for a bike stolen when parked, you'd just want to shut off power if you saw it ride by. But a bike that was jacked, screw em, even in the USA.

Those car remotes I was talking about have three buttons. Open, closed, and a panic button. Rig the panic button to be the one that locks the wheel.

User avatar
Nehmo   10 kW

10 kW
Posts: 518
Joined: Jun 11 2011 3:40pm
Location: Kansas City, Kansas, USA

Re: Theft controller

Post by Nehmo » Aug 26 2012 6:44pm

dogman wrote:Yeah, full plug braking on a front hub, activated by your car remote door lock device would be ideal.

At about 100', when they hit at least 20 mph, then hit the front wheel locker. Wheeee! ...
The problem arises when the device works *too* well and the thief flies head first and the impact kills him. It then becomes problematic how to retrieve your bike without getting involved in legalities surrounding the body.
`~- Nehmo

cwah   10 GW

10 GW
Posts: 4150
Joined: Jul 24 2011 5:42am
Location: Between paris and london

Re: Theft controller

Post by cwah » Aug 26 2012 6:55pm

Dauntless wrote:Your best ever antitheft. Without one of these, how about an exploding dye pack as with the bank robber? Not only will it mark him, but when that cloud goes up in his face at 40mph, he might prefer the magnavolt over the landing he's about to suffer.

Yeah, Kin, you gotta be careful around here. Some of these people are pathologically left wingers until THEY are the crime victims, then suddenly it's no longer society's fault.

I waaant this for my biiike :lol:
Help me find my stolen electric brompton: http://bit.ly/1a0vbBC and Bosch Sinus B3 http://bit.ly/1eV0WQz

Harold in CR   1 MW

1 MW
Posts: 1632
Joined: Feb 01 2010 7:19pm
Location: Costa Rica

Re: Theft controller

Post by Harold in CR » Aug 26 2012 7:28pm

No need to trouble the police. Exactly.

I wouldn't want that odor, though :shock: :roll: :roll:
Thanks to Justin, the forum is open source and NON-commercialized.

User avatar
Kingfish   10 GW

10 GW
Posts: 4064
Joined: Feb 03 2010 11:23am
Location: Redmond, WA-USA, Earth, Sol, Orion–Cygnus Arm, Milky Way. Age: > yesterday < tomorrow
Contact:

Re: Theft controller

Post by Kingfish » Aug 26 2012 8:28pm

Presume we have the Guard Feature that is magnetically activated. Instead of instant lock, just have it trigger a slow timer that counts off 30 seconds, then waits until the accelerometer reads over 20 mph – for HV you’d certainly want to have certainty of max-pain so make it 40 mph :wink: then engage the brake-lock, …and call for Daddy.

No fuss, no muss.
~KF
* My 2WD Garden Wall
* Kinaye MotorSports
* Primary ride: 2WD Disc 9C 2806-equiv / Dual Lyen 12FET / 20S7P LiPo.
* Epics: Going to California: 2011 8)
* 50-mph, 101, 10k-Club. 12,527 miles-to-date, 7037 as 2WD.

It is by caffeine alone I set my mind in motion.
It is by the beans of Java that thoughts acquire speed.
The hands acquire shakes, the shakes become a warning.
It is by caffeine alone I set my mind in motion.

Post Reply