Quick 220

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markz   100 GW

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Quick 220

Post by markz » Oct 11 2017 9:05pm

Just ran across this, used for welding but got me thinking about chargers using 220/240V.

Here is the link, the downside is - its $225usd
http://www.quick220.com/220_catalog/vol ... rters.html

There might be something cheaper out there. Its neither here nor there, just something random I thought was neat and cool.

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Alan B   100 GW

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Re: Quick 220

Post by Alan B » Oct 11 2017 11:36pm

There's not much to making one of those. Just cabling and connectors. And finding 120 outlets on both phases.

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Re: Quick 220

Post by markz » Oct 16 2017 4:36am

I really wanted this 295A Arc welder for 150 bones cdn but it was AC and it got sold, to convert to DC all I needed to do was get a rectifier. Which from my Youtubing, DC is a much better/easier process for stick arc welding. The only 220 outlet is the stove and dryer, but I could have used the garage 120V outlet and the garage door opener outlet, I believe them to be on separate circuits by code. If not then a hallway outlet + garage outlet. I got my eyes set on another welder but will have to rent a car to go out of the city. Hoping for $20 weekend rate.

I assume the one type of welder is a transformer that has its windings tapped.
http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-2TM2MWeGZ1M/U ... 631deb.jpg

The other type, the one I am aiming for, I believe has the slider transformer for more accurate amp setting.
https://s3-us-west-2.amazonaws.com/used ... 56_614.jpg
I want to do 1/4" so I need 0.001" per amp makes it close to 300A.

A few projects I want to do over the winter.
1) e-bike trailer for long distance riding
2) fix my steel e-bike suspension mount with its downtube battery placement
3) try my hand at alum welding which requires AC, pannier boxes.

markz   100 GW

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Re: Quick 220

Post by markz » Dec 21 2017 6:49pm

Well I bought me a used Lincoln Welder AC 225-S its huge! and its heavy!
Here is a random interweb picture of its inside, I thought the selector slides infinite, but its not. Its just a tapped transformer.
http://www.yesterdaystractors.com/cgi-b ... &th=315471
Next up is this to get DC
https://www.ebay.com/itm/MDQ-400A-Singl ... 0011.m1850
Also some alum heat sink and a few computer fans to see if I can get the duty cycle increased. Clamp and electrode I hope arent too expensive.

markz   100 GW

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Re: Quick 220

Post by markz » Dec 21 2017 6:58pm

Alan B wrote:
Oct 11 2017 11:36pm
And finding 120 outlets on both phases.
What does that mean?
So I need any 2 different 120V outlets on different circuits?
Or can 2 diff outlets on diff ccts be in the same phase?
I def need to do this because a 250V cable is expensive.
Ah ok ok I see the situation. https://forums.tesla.com/forum/forums/c ... -connector so I am betting there are two 120V "rails" and each rail is a certain phase, one pos and one neg, pos + neg = 240V. pos + pos = 0V and neg + neg = 0V

Was thinking to just parallel a 3 or 4 - 8awg hobbyking wire, but I am thinking thats just too jenky. And use the dryer outlet next to garage door. But then the dryer is out and the cables running 20'.

Two 120V outlets I can do the walk-up path outlet and the garage outlet, or garage door outlet. 120V extension cords are cheap.

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Alan B   100 GW

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Re: Quick 220

Post by Alan B » Dec 21 2017 8:58pm

They must be on different phases, that's how there's 240V between the hots.

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Re: Quick 220

Post by amberwolf » Dec 22 2017 3:46am

markz wrote:
Dec 21 2017 6:58pm
And use the dryer outlet next to garage door. But then the dryer is out and the cables running 20'
That's exactly what I do, and it works fine; it's probably about 25 feet of . I think I"m using 10g, might be 8g, for most of the run, then it goes to what's probably 12g heavyduty former extension cord the rest of the way to the welder (another 20 feet?).

Even when I'm on the highest welder setting (so I can weld 1/4" thick steel stuff together), it still works, nothing gets hot, etc.

It's kinda annoying to unplug the dryer, plugin the welder, and then do the reverse when done, but since I don't actually use the dryer except maybe once a year (if it's raining when I need to dry clothes / etc quickly). (Raine uses it every few weeks though, so I can't just leave the welder plugged in all the time).

I've considered making a double-outlet box to plug into the dryer outlet, so both dryer and welder can be plugged in at the same time (since they'll never be used at the same time), but I'd need to buy two more outlets to do it, if using the present plug type on there. I have some other plug types around, and matching outlet for at least one of them, so I could probably just change the cords out...but then the money spent on the existing plugs on dryer and welder would be wasted (and they werent cheap). There's alternatives to that with parts I have....but it's at present easier to just swap the plugs when I need to weld. (not like I do it more often than every few months, sometimes every few weeks).

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marty   10 MW

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Re: Quick 220

Post by marty » Dec 22 2017 8:43am

http://www.lincolnelectric.com/en-us/Eq ... nElectric)
AC225™ Stick Welder
Input Power 230/1/60
Input Current 50A

Run a new wire from circuit breaker or fuse panel to a dedicated circuit for the welder.

Input Current 50A requires a big wire. 8 gauge? Check local codes.
http://www.cerrowire.com/ampacity-charts

Input Power 230V yea that's 2 hots. Please take a picture of your panel and I will show you the 2 hots. Get a little tester to play with.
Image

Dedicated circuit means dryer and welder can not share a outlet.

Be safe. Follow all codes. Fire is bad.
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Alan B   100 GW

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Re: Quick 220

Post by Alan B » Dec 22 2017 11:36am

For a similar application of sharing 240 between dryer and electric car charging I bought a box that has a relay and two outlets. So only one thing is connected to the 240 at a time. The relay is appropriately rated.

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marty   10 MW

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Re: Quick 220

Post by marty » Dec 24 2017 9:53am

http://www.lincolnelectric.com/assets/s ... imt237.pdf
• Do not touch electrically hot parts.
Input Power and Grounding Connections
Before starting the installation, check with the power company to be
sure your power supply is adequate for the voltage, amperes, phase
and frequency specified on the welder nameplate. Also, be sure the
planned installation will meet the United States National Electrical
Code and local code requirements. This welder may be operated
from a single phase line or from one phase of a two or three phase
line.
All models designed to operate on less than 250 volt input lines are
shipped with the input cable connected to the welder.
Place the welder so there is free circulation of air in through the
louvers in the back and sides of the case and out of the bottom on
all four sides. Mount a NEMA Type 6-50R receptacle in a suitable
location. Be sure it can be reached by the plug on the input cable
attached to the welder.
Using the following instructions, have a qualified electrician connect
this receptacle (NEMA 6-50R Type) to the power lines at the fuse
box. Three #10 or larger copper wires are required if conduit is
used. For long cable runs over 100'(31m), #8 or larger wire in
conduit will be needed to prevent excessive voltage drops. Fuse the
two hot lines with 50 ampere super lag type fuses as shown in the
following diagram. The center contact in the receptacle is for the
grounding connection. A green wire in the input cable connects this
contact to the frame of the welder. This insures proper grounding of
the welder frame when the welder plug is inserted into the
receptacle. If a separate disconnect switch is used, it should have
two poles for the two hot lines and both should be fused for 50
amperes.
welder.png
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marty   10 MW

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Re: Quick 220

Post by marty » Dec 26 2017 7:55am

I was taught that in a drawing, electricity flows left to right and ground is on the bottom. Fixed the drawing.
flip_vert.png
flip_vert.png (46.26 KiB) Viewed 929 times
Now I am wondering about .gif vs .jpg vs .png?
Image
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markz   100 GW

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Re: Quick 220

Post by markz » Jan 11 2018 11:42pm

Here are some pictures and my initial plan.
Dryer vent, as you can see in the pictures, is 240V 30A, but welder needs more then 30A, I believe, will double check. The black circuit breaker is the Holmes on Homes circuit protector for lightning strikes. I was thinking to wire into that and save some money on buying a separate circuit breaker, but its only $30cdn.

Lowes store
Buy 15 to 20 feet of 4 conductor 8awg cable. I think its like $5/m or $1.50/ft.

2 Pole 40A Circuit Breaker - https://www.lowes.ca/breakers/federal-p ... 89226.html

Plastic pipe from plumbing aisle, for the 8/4 wire to go 3' or so, from vent bend up past the grate by a foot. So the 8/4 wire doesnt get cut on the venting metal. Cut hole in vent, buy some vent tape. Then duct tape the pipe in place, when welding.

String cable from panel
up and through the furnace piping of the front door branch for a distance of 8'
up and through the floor grate, over to garage entry door which is 3' away
and into garage so I can place the welder near the double car garage door.
This of course will be done when the wife is not home!

It will not be permanent! Just used a few times a year for an hour or so.
Plan is - I will unscrew the output wire from the new 240V 40A circuit breaker that has been placed in the OFF position. Then pull the cable up and out of the venting, from the garage side. I was thinking of leaving an outlet in the vent right under the grate, but NOOOOO! NOOOOOO!
Panel1.jpg
Panel2.jpg
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panel3.jpg
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panel4.jpg
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marty wrote:
Dec 22 2017 8:43am

Input Current 50A requires a big wire. 8 gauge? Check local codes.
http://www.cerrowire.com/ampacity-charts

Input Power 230V yea that's 2 hots. Please take a picture of your panel and I will show you the 2 hots. Get a little tester to play with.

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marty   10 MW

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Re: Quick 220

Post by marty » Jan 12 2018 9:36am

markz wrote:
Jan 11 2018 11:42pm
String cable from panel
up and through the furnace piping of the front door branch for a distance of 8'
up and through the floor grate, over to garage entry door which is 3' away
and into garage so I can place the welder near the double car garage door.
This of course will be done when the wife is not home!
marty wrote:
Dec 22 2017 8:43am

Input Current 50A requires a big wire. 8 gauge? Check local codes.
http://www.cerrowire.com/ampacity-charts

Input Power 230V yea that's 2 hots. Please take a picture of your panel and I will show you the 2 hots. Get a little tester to play with.
Wire through heat ducts is usually a NO NO. Imagine that you are looking at the house when the frame was done but before it was all covered up. Now start fishing the wire. 3 inch piece of coat hanger in a drill is a good exploratory tool to feel what's inside walls and ceilings. Wire fishing can be a 2 person job. Sure the wife would be glad to help.
From: https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewt ... ys#p718134
Marty's Security Alarm Company can run a wire to every window and door in a building without making any holes in the walls, ceilings, or floors. I have a drill that can drill around corners, string, little chains, magnets, coat hangers, fiberglass rods, fish tape, sling shots, bean bags, AND a team of trained miniature monkeys. My monkeys are about 8 inches tall when fully grown. These monkeys pull wires under floors, over ceilings, and anywhere a wire needs to go.
Don't be afraid to cut some holes in walls and ceilings if you have to. Do you own this house? Electrical conduit is fun also. Usually grey PVC. In the electrical department. I have found that counter guys in a electrical wholesale place have more knowledge of conduit then the girls at Lowes. Use stranded wire in conduit. Not solid.
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markz   100 GW

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Re: Quick 220

Post by markz » Jan 12 2018 4:49pm

LOL I hear you on that part. I will snap some pictures so you get an idea of what I am talking about. Remember this is not permanent, it will be just for the short time a few times a year I will weld, talking no more then an hour or two.
setup1.jpg
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setup2.jpg
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setup3.jpg
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setup4.jpg
through the duct cleaning opening taped part, up and 3' behind main duct goes to floor vent.
setup4.jpg (86.06 KiB) Viewed 470 times

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marty   10 MW

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Re: Quick 220

Post by marty » Jan 12 2018 5:05pm

Coleman Cable 1917 8/3 STW 6-50 Welder Extension Cord With 3-Prong Plug In Blue (25-Foot, 8/3 Gauge)
71QbP294WoL._SL1500_600w.jpg
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markz   100 GW

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Re: Quick 220

Post by markz » Jan 13 2018 3:14am

One thing about the Quick 220, is I can get the 220-240V but its only 20A because the wall outlets are 120V 20A.

https://youtu.be/1hmtxWyOzIk?t=74

So yeah Lincoln welder will need more then 20A thats a given.

Gotta spend more money!

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