Knight Electric Motorcycle 5000w

Found the first US video of one of these full size bikes! Looks good so far

I haven't followed ZEV since I finally got rid of my crappy 5000 watt POS, but he was hawking a bike that looked very much like this one a couple of years ago. It may be the same body (and maybe frame) with cheaper drivetrain. Check out ZEV's site to see what they are selling, and if it looks like this. They would be about 2.5X as expensive.

Skeetab,

If you add mass, you want to decrease diameter and increase voltage to get to the speed you want. With electric bicycle weights many can get away with large diameter wheels, but with hubbies on electric motos the smallest diameter you can live with is always the way to go unless ice-wagon performance is acceptable and terrain is pretty flat.

I like the idea of getting something built to haul lead weights, especially since I have multiple electric car battery packs in my possession. ie easy to fit a far better higher capacity lithium battery.

Motorcycle shaped object. Probably is the same size as this.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pGxUZhd31Eo

I think I was right. Same bodywork as ZEV MS, different forks and drivetrain.

https://www.zelectricvehicle.com/m-s-motorcycles

I own a very similar motorbike to the ones you're talking about. Had it for about two years now as my daily ride.
See here: https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=12&t=90032



There are several versions of those bikes, probably from different manufacturers. The plastics will differ as well as the shocks,and powertrain, but the main frame usually remains the same.
For what I can see on the pics, the ones you're showing are the "lesser quality" ones. The shocks are tiny, same thing goes for the brakes and the plastics look to be the cheapest so they won't like at all the UV light.

That being said, they are quite a good basis and you can do a lot with them, But you'll need to DIY a lot if you want to have something nice.
Don't get me wrong, they should work fine out of the box, but I bet they'll use the cheapest motors, cheapest controllers and cheapest batteries so don't expect something crazy or reliable.

I suggest you the following upgrades:
-look up for your motor specs
-Depending on your motor specs, see what is the best controller you can afford. I believe you should be able to go for 200Amps continuous (4-500Amps/phase) if you're lucky to have a 3000W motor or more. Changing your controller will make a huge difference in terms of performance, but will kick your battery pretty hard so at this point you'll have to plan for a better battery.
-Go for lithium. But you'll have to find a battery with a high continuous discharge rate, which is not so easy, because the bike wil still be heavy so the controller and basically all the powertrain will have to work harder for a much longer time than an ebike would in order to reach top speed.
-Reinforce your chassis. This is vital, the welds are usually horrible and the tubes seem to be bent with a hatchet. Total garbage.
-Change your shocks, this is a must
-Change your brakes, at least the front ones, probably a must too if the bike comes equipped with floating calipers
-Put some vinyl sheets onto all your plastics. This will protect them against UVs so they won't disintegrate in 6 month.
-Change the garbage tires.

About the size, it seems to me that they are very slightly undersized compared to an equivalent 250cc. I'd say they are 90% or 95% scaled. But that might also be because the rear whell is only 16 inches.

Anyway, those bikes have flaws for sure, but they are quite a good basis to work on. Relatively lightweight, plenty of battery space, awesome looks and relatively nice and stable ride once modded. Seems overly expensive in the US though...

Thanks for the reply! Glad to see another member riding one of these bikes. Come to think of it i have already watched your youtube drag vids on the other guys thread. I almost bought a 250cc magician also.

Cheap and bad quality is my middle name so im excited to see what comes in the mail! I do have a KLS kelly controller i will probably use to get programming and regen. But yes i need to find out what motor i get on the bike first. Im hoping its atleast a 4000w

I didnt think about the UV and the plastics but i have bought a set of ABS plastics from china for a Katana 600 i used to ride and they were the worst things ever so they will likely be similar to those. Look good from afar for a year.

What does your bike weigh? Seems like they are saying this one is only 265lbd but the sla battery is small on this version. Being under 300lbs makes me not super worried about the brakes and suspension for now, but i may say different on the first ride for all i know.

Also what did you pay over there? Since your saying $3k is expensive is US? This is the cheapest bike ive seen here

So I asked the vendor to send the speedometer with MPH and not KPH just to make sure, also checking lead time...and this is their reply to me

Hi
Each Bike is Customed made at time of Order by Manufacturer.
It takes about a week and a 1/2.
Then it is shipped, by the Asian Manufacturer and usually takes about 10 to 14 days to reach USA.
Yours should be finished in the next few days and then shipped.
Probably This Monday.

As soon as it is shipped, We will send you a message and upload Tracking Number.

so they seem to respond to me but don't really answer any questions that pertain to the bike. They likely have no idea!

skeetab5780 said:

Thanks for the reply! Glad to see another member riding one of these bikes. Come to think of it i have already watched your youtube drag vids on the other guys thread. I almost bought a 250cc magician also.

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Yep, that was me and my friend Marcus.

skeetab5780 said:

Cheap and bad quality is my middle name so im excited to see what comes in the mail! I do have a KLS kelly controller i will probably use to get programming and regen. But yes i need to find out what motor i get on the bike first. Im hoping its atleast a 4000w

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Let's hope it is, but there are different versions of 4000W so let's hope it's a good one!
If you have a good 4000W motor then you can expect to get very decent performance without having to change your motor, otherwise you'll need an upgrade. My 3000W has plenty enough power and doesn't heat too much but it is not so far from its limit. 4000W should give you a bit more slack.

skeetab5780 said:

I didnt think about the UV and the plastics but i have bought a set of ABS plastics from china for a Katana 600 i used to ride and they were the worst things ever so they will likely be similar to those. Look good from afar for a year.

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Use some vinyl sheet on the outside and several layers of paint in the inside if you want the plastics to be more durable, it's an easy fix and it will make your bike look better too

skeetab5780 said:

What does your bike weigh? Seems like they are saying this one is only 265lbd but the sla battery is small on this version. Being under 300lbs makes me not super worried about the brakes and suspension for now, but i may say different on the first ride for all i know.

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It used to be very heavy with the lead acid, somewhere around 170-180 kg if I recall correclty. Now that I've ditched this anchor I think it should be around 130-140kg.
About the forks and brakes, I never tried the standard fork so I cannot tell you how bad it might be, but as for brakes the ones generally fitted on bikes and scooters here are absolute garbage. They might seem fine at the beginning but after a few hard brakings they will fade totally and progressively become uneffective. But that's an easy fix anyway.

skeetab5780 said:

Also what did you pay over there? Since your saying $3k is expensive is US? This is the cheapest bike ive seen here

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Well I bought mine second hand for around 700 usd including many, many mods (analogic dashboard, nice shocks, handmade seats, full carbon wrap, custom feet rests, nicer screws and hardware, and some other stuff I forgot). But you can find some very nice bikes like this at around 1000-1200 USD:

https://endless-sphere.com/forums/download/file.php?mode=view&id=246928

Here is the link but I'm not sure it can be accessed from outside of China, you might need a VPN:
https://item.taobao.com/item.htm?spm=a230r.1.14.29.184f60d9qMwg22&id=577828646642&ns=1&abbucket=8#detail

Some bikes are even way cheaper, they generally start at around 500 bucks.

Also, those bikes probably don't comply with the regulations in your country, I don't know. They don't even comply with the regulations in China, riding them is theoretically not allowed. But somehow, selling them is.

After doing some research on the ebay scooter controllers it seems that the bike i bought may only have a 3000w system. I am hoping it doesnt but it very well might. I was hoping it would be 5k continuous and like 7k peak

The 72v 3000w controllers say 72a max draw which is 5184 watts total

The 72v 4000w controllers say 84a max draw which is 6048 watts total

All i can do now is wait impatiently and hope for the best

another hub moto vid
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8CGALGXC6Z8
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WoTo6YdDzvk

skeetab5780 said:

After doing some research on the ebay scooter controllers it seems that the bike i bought may only have a 3000w system. I am hoping it doesnt but it very well might. I was hoping it would be 5k continuous and like 7k peak

The 72v 3000w controllers say 72a max draw which is 5184 watts total

The 72v 4000w controllers say 84a max draw which is 6048 watts total

All i can do now is wait impatiently and hope for the best

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Even at 5-7k continuous it will be weak. You need at least 10k for a smooth ride, and it starts getting interesting and fun around 15k. Do not expect to keep the original hardware for long you'll get bored of it very quickly.

Ya that is expected...i have a bike under 100lbs with over 10kw already

Im just hoping that the hub motor is strong enough since that is the only thing im not planning on buying again

Another video of hub motor sports bikes, these guys are ballin' it

video seems to show then riding downhill most of the time! these claim 96v so im sure they are a bit faster
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wQLeS9GHNZA
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=647_DQ0WyFw

skeetab5780 said:

Another video of hub motor sports bikes, these guys are ballin' it

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Interesting, thank you

Seems like they've got tons of configurations at their Alibaba shop:
https://hanbird.en.alibaba.com/

Looks like about $2,500 for 8000W? wow

If anyone orders one from alibaba let me know how it goes. From what i understand you have to pay extra to import/ship to the USA or other countries. One youtube video claimed it took 3months and another $1200 and alot of phone calls.

The prices seem tgtbt but then again its just a steel generic street bike frame from a gas bike with a hub motor controller and batteries...

skeetab5780 said:

If anyone orders one from alibaba let me know how it goes. From what i understand you have to pay extra to import/ship to the USA or other countries. One youtube video claimed it took 3months and another $1200 and alot of phone calls.

The prices seem tgtbt but then again its just a steel generic street bike frame from a gas bike with a hub motor controller and batteries...

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I don't recommend anyone to purchase one of these bikes with a factory lithium battery.
The battery won't survive for very long, especially with a powerful setup. The current needed is just way too high and usually chinese cells can't handle more than 3C of discharge more than a few weeks.

I'm using real A123 cells on mine and they already have a hard time to cope with the weight of my bike. And those cells are super tough and strong, that's way better than whatever you might get in these bikes.

My advice would be to buy one without battery and without controller, with a 3-8000W motor depending on your budget. A 3000W motor will be fine up to a 200A continuous battery draw controller, the maximum I tested was 510A/phase reliably (it is running at this power rating everyday for about a year and a half now).
If you go with a more powerful motor you can theoretically go way higher than this, but you'll have to find a good controller and at some point the bottleneck will be the battery, it is hard to find a battery capable of delivery so many amps continuously. But don't get too focused on motor power, what actually matters most is the controller. If you use a too powerful motor you'll just end up blowing your controller at some point if you're not using a good (and expensive) one.

I think my setup is a good compromize who would satisfy most people so I really recommend it. It is pretty cheap (battery was about 500 USD + BMS around 80 USD + controller around 200 USD), reliable and there is quite enough power, it's anything but weak. I don't know the prices for such a setup in the US or wherever you live but I guess it should be close to that.
The battery is a A123 system second hand 23S2P which came out of a Vtrux prototype.
The BMS is the BMS Ant 300A
The controller is the Sabvoton 72150, factory unlocked at 200 continuous battery Amps, capable of 450A/phase in theory, but still fine with a bit more than 500A/phase in real life. But Sabvoton has a new controller capable of 260Amps battery continuous so you might want to look into that, their controllers are very, very nice for the price and they are capable of carrying the load of those bikes reliably.

You can surely get a more powerful setup if you want, but the price will be way, way higher.

They have another set of bikes up today 72v 50ah lead acid

•DP-Ninja Electric Motorcycle comes with a powerful 5000w motor to enable you to ride at a speed up to 65 MPH and climb up to 15 degrees.
•The e-motorcycle features a 72V battery for a non-stop riding around the city. The motorcycle comes with a 50AH Lead Battery
•This electric motorcycle comes in 4 different color options (RED/ BLUE/ BLACK/GOLDEN) to suit your style.
•DP-Ninja e-motorcycle features an efficient dual disc brake system to provide amazing stopping power.
•The e-motorcycle comes equipped with heavy-duty 17-inch front and 16-inch rear tires to provide a comfortable riding experience on wet or bumpy road conditions.

Specification:

Motor 5000W
Battery 72V, 50AH
Charging Time 7 to 8 Hours
Max Load 150 to 200 Kg
Max Speed 65 MPH
Max Range 40 miles
Color Option various
Gradient 15 Degrees
Brake System Front & Rear Disc Brake System
Light LED Lights
Tire Vacuum Tire; Front: 17-inch, Rear: 16-inch
Weight About 160 Kg

skeetab5780 said:

They have another set of bikes up today 72v 50ah lead acid

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That's a different seller than the OP, and the weird thing is, they're claiming to be in Costa Mesa, CA, yet say that shipping is 15-20 business days, and the only thing they've sold on eBay is alarm-company yard signs

They are all different vendors im just pooling similar products here. Mine said it was in Texas but they are actually made to order in China so lead time is likely worse than quoted

Apparently its coming from Japan not China...Who knows, I'd rather a bike from Japan IMO its where the good bikes come from

This is what I got from seller, I haven't bugged them at all

Your Bike will be finished Friday and shipped on Sunday.
It will take 10 to 14 days to get to get to you from Japan.
I will upload the Tracking once it is shipped.
Sorry about the delay, but our Business partners were on Asian New year Holiday for a whole week and started on yours just last week.

skeetab5780 said:

Apparently its coming from Japan not China...Who knows, I'd rather a bike from Japan IMO its where the good bikes come from

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This is fascinating, thanks for the update. I've always been curious/scared to buy one of these--so cool to get an E-S member's perspective when it arrives

skeetab5780 said:

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Any chance of getting the original listing of that? I'm currently converting a Ninja 250R, which that bike is very obviously based off:



If they have detailed photos, I might be able to learn something about where to put weight, etc.

skeetab5780 said:

Apparently its coming from Japan not China...Who knows, I'd rather a bike from Japan IMO its where the good bikes come from

This is what I got from seller, I haven't bugged them at all

Your Bike will be finished Friday and shipped on Sunday.
It will take 10 to 14 days to get to get to you from Japan.
I will upload the Tracking once it is shipped.
Sorry about the delay, but our Business partners were on Asian New year Holiday for a whole week and started on yours just last week.

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Pretty sure that's bullshit, I'd bet my right hand that your bike is coming from China.
Japanese people don't celebrate the Chinese new Year or so called "Asian new year", they work as usual during this period.

I agree with you. I doubt its coming from Japan and you make a valid point on the holiday excuse!

On another note, there is now an electric dirt bike on EBay also the Kolter Es1