Chinese Retro Scooter - Running at 72v versus 60v

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swiftyds   10 W

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Chinese Retro Scooter - Running at 72v versus 60v

Post by swiftyds » Feb 12 2021 11:12am

Just managed to pick up this Quazzar e-divine retro scooter for cheap without battery pack. I believe it was manufactured by Ecobit back in 2015 and looks identical to any number of retro Vespa inspired scooter that have been around a number of years.

Image

It originally ran off dual 60v 20ah removable packs - I’ve managed to run it OK with a single 60v 20ah pack. It’s not the quickest of things so I will be looking at upgrading the controller at some point (most likely Sabvoton).

Until then I have a 72v 40ah pack I’d like to use to increase range but I’m not sure the controller can cope with this when fully charged. It’s branded UGBest (same as original battery packs) and the label on it states 72v 45a output. It looks like a generic controller with form factor similar to a Votol.

Image

The step down converter for 12v system can cope with up to 100v so really just trying to get a sense from folks here what you think the likelihood is that I can run 72v (84v fully charged) through the controller without blowing any FETs or caps?

I know to be certain I should take controller apart to identify specific caps and FETs to see what they can handle ... just working out if I risk it and connect my 72v pack given I will replace the controller eventually anyway.

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spinningmagnets   100 GW

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Re: Chinese Retro Scooter - Running at 72v versus 60v

Post by spinningmagnets » Feb 12 2021 12:02pm

The LVC wont work, but 60V battery capacitors (16S x 4.2V = 68V fully charged?) Are likely 100V caps.

If it blows, get another.

Frankly I'd buy another controller and keep the 60V controller with the 60V packs. Buy a new 72V pack.

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Re: Chinese Retro Scooter - Running at 72v versus 60v

Post by Voltron » Feb 12 2021 1:33pm

If you're just riding it for fun, sure go for it!
If it was your only transportation, then maybe wait until you have a new controller actually in hand.

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Re: Chinese Retro Scooter - Running at 72v versus 60v

Post by swiftyds » Feb 12 2021 1:45pm

Thanks guys - I’ve got a controller on order. Reckoned I could use that new 72v capable controller for both packs given it’s programmable and I can switch settings for LVC phase amps etc.

Still be good to know if anyone recognises the controller in this model - there are quite a few in the U.K. as they were ex Pizza Express scooters only used for a short while before Deliveroo took off.

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Re: Chinese Retro Scooter - Running at 72v versus 60v

Post by LeftieBiker » Feb 12 2021 2:02pm

You might want to try that first ride with no more than 50% charge...
2018 Nissan Leaf SL with Pro Pilot
2009 Vectrix VX-1 Maxi Scooter W/ 18 Leaf modules
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2019 GreenBike folder
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Re: Chinese Retro Scooter - Running at 72v versus 60v

Post by Sapper735 » Feb 19 2021 2:42pm

I’m following this, I’ve sent the op a pm. Cheers guys.


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swiftyds   10 W

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Re: Chinese Retro Scooter - Running at 72v versus 60v

Post by swiftyds » Feb 20 2021 4:24am

Just replied to your PM. I’ve not got round to fitting the Sabvoton 72150 I’ve bought for this yet.

I’ve also got another spare original controller on its way which I’m waiting to arrive before I try putting 72v through the original set up.

I think it should be capable of 45-50mph with the Sabvoton and the 72v pack I have which is capable of 100A output continuous - wouldn’t want it any quicker than that but there are 125cc engined scooters from likes of AJS with same frame and brakes so should still be safe enough at that speed. Just won’t get much range.

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Re: Chinese Retro Scooter - Running at 72v versus 60v

Post by Sapper735 » Feb 22 2021 3:10pm

Just found this:

https://www.ugbest.com/product/ecobit-c ... ooter.html

On their scooters it says speed: 45-75kph. That says to me that they set the controllers up in the factory as either 50 or 125cc equivalents. I cannot see them using two different controllers for the same scooter? I’ve emailed them asking what they do and what software they use. Let’s see if they answer, I’m not holding my breath. I’d be happy with 46mph.


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swiftyds   10 W

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Re: Chinese Retro Scooter - Running at 72v versus 60v

Post by swiftyds » Feb 23 2021 4:30am

I was going to try if there’s any way to derestrict top speed in the controller. Can’t see any obvious derestrict wires to cut/plug in as there are on some ebike controllers to limit speed.

Next step I was going to try is the method Super Soco/Cineco (City Slicker) use on their bikes - hold right brake on, turn the bike on and apply full throttle for 5-10 seconds. Probably won’t do anything but worth a shot - if it works it’s usually the same again to reverse it and put it back into restricted mode.

I’ve also managed to source a second new original controller from the guy who is selling the scooters so I can play about a bit with higher voltages and see if there’s a way I can programme the controller safe in the knowledge I’ve got a working 60v controller I can fall back on.

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Re: Chinese Retro Scooter - Running at 72v versus 60v

Post by Sapper735 » Feb 23 2021 4:35am

I was to
D by scooter city that the controllers can be programmed. Does yours have a usb lead running from it? Mine does, but I’m not sure if that’s just a usb power put, I hope it’s a controller interface. There are special Boss usb leads with like a odd/canbus chip in them that I’ve seen online. Maybe there is an app that is compatible? It would be the easiest way of restricting a controller (by software map)?


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swiftyds   10 W

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Re: Chinese Retro Scooter - Running at 72v versus 60v

Post by swiftyds » Feb 23 2021 4:39am

Also meant to say the kill switch on mine seems to vary speed - almost like it’s a two speed switch going into the controller. Haven’t actually measured what the lower setting is though in MPH / have you tried changing that on yours?

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Re: Chinese Retro Scooter - Running at 72v versus 60v

Post by Sapper735 » Feb 23 2021 5:52am

Yeah it’s a two speed switch, around 15mph then I get 34-36mph on setting two. Mines nearly in bits now. Just sanding the side panels. Doing a full respray similar to this.Image


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swiftyds   10 W

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Re: Chinese Retro Scooter - Running at 72v versus 60v

Post by swiftyds » Feb 23 2021 10:57am

I like the colour scheme! I managed to get a couple of black side panels and leg shield cheap so going for all black on mine.

I didn’t get chance to try the brake/throttle trick today but did spot that there’s a USB cable fitted to the controller that looks like it’s a programming cable.

Image

Colour coding looks similar to what I’ve seen before on a Infineon IRFB controller where I’ve used XPD to program/change parameters. That controller came with a USB to TTL cable - can’t really tell if the cable on the Quazzar is a TTL convertor or not. Will try to open up the spare controller I’ve ordered when it arrives to see what FETs they’ve used but at least it indicates there is some programming capability on the controller if we can find out what software to use to change the settings.

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Re: Chinese Retro Scooter - Running at 72v versus 60v

Post by Sapper735 » Feb 23 2021 11:07am

The Bosch one I saw is usb to ttl. Is there an iPad app or anything we could download to try it? All my devices are Apple, so would have to to be iPhone, MacBook or iPad based. I think we are onto something here.


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Re: Chinese Retro Scooter - Running at 72v versus 60v

Post by Sapper735 » Feb 23 2021 11:12am

I suspect xpd for windows would work?


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Re: Chinese Retro Scooter - Running at 72v versus 60v

Post by Sapper735 » Feb 23 2021 11:45am

I wonder if a sabvoton Bluetooth dongle would work, or another make?


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swiftyds   10 W

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Re: Chinese Retro Scooter - Running at 72v versus 60v

Post by swiftyds » Feb 23 2021 2:27pm

Not sure that will work. I’ve programmed Kelly controllers with their own app on Android but that’s pretty unique to their controllers in how they communicate to the control unit in the controller itself. Also the Bluetooth module they use is generic but the way the app communicates through it to the controller is the unique bit.

Really need to find the software that UGBEST use - I’ve read that they describe the controller as a UG Vector controller - interestingly it does look a bit like the Vector controllers that Magic Pie sell with their motors. That said I’ve trawled the web and can’t see an image / picture of anything that looks identical to the controller we’ve got.

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Re: Chinese Retro Scooter - Running at 72v versus 60v

Post by Sapper735 » Feb 23 2021 3:21pm

There’s a download for vector controller software here

https://goldenmotor.bike/product/vector ... ontroller/
I can’t check if it can be used on various others.


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Re: Chinese Retro Scooter - Running at 72v versus 60v

Post by Sapper735 » Feb 23 2021 3:48pm

Image
This is what’s in there newer model


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Re: Chinese Retro Scooter - Running at 72v versus 60v

Post by Sapper735 » Feb 23 2021 3:50pm

http://lingbo-mc.com
Website on the controller


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Re: Chinese Retro Scooter - Running at 72v versus 60v

Post by Sapper735 » Feb 23 2021 3:51pm

http://lingbo-mc.com/list/?10_1.html

Is it one of these?


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Re: Chinese Retro Scooter - Running at 72v versus 60v

Post by Sapper735 » Feb 23 2021 3:57pm


swiftyds   10 W

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Re: Chinese Retro Scooter - Running at 72v versus 60v

Post by swiftyds » Feb 25 2021 9:22am

Not sure it matches any of them - but the pdf link does look close!

I did a bit more digging and found the type approval documents for the Ecobit scooter range including the Quazzar (which is model number ZM-EV03). There are some reference in those documents to the controller but the code for this just looks to be a generic code and doesn’t help in showing anything up on a web search.

What I did find is reference to the fact that the controller is adjustable for speed through programming - unfortunately no clues as to how you do this or what software!

I have sent an email to Quazzar in Madrid but to be honest not even sure they are still operating.

Any luck getting any response to your email to UGBest?

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Re: Chinese Retro Scooter - Running at 72v versus 60v

Post by Sapper735 » Feb 25 2021 9:53am

They haven’t got back as yet, I’ve sent a follow up email.


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swiftyds   10 W

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Re: Chinese Retro Scooter - Running at 72v versus 60v

Post by swiftyds » Feb 25 2021 10:12am

Just found this ....

http://www.härdin.se/blog/2019/08/04/lifan-e3-teardown/

[url]http://www.härdin.se/blog/2019/08/04/lifan-e3-teardown/[/url]

Looks to be same controller as on the Quazzar - if so then it is a Lingbo LBM and the GUI software (which looks same as used for Magic Pie) should work. My spare controller is arriving tomorrow so I will take the case apart to see what markings are on the PCB and also note the spec of the caps and FETS. At least if it is one of these it can take 72vs easily enough.

Then I will have a go and trying to connect the spare controller via the USB cable ( which on closer inspection looks to have an RS485 convertor built in) and see if it detects it with suitable drivers installed on Windows 10. Found three versions of the software to try !

https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/ ... 0SJVLfPGCa

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