how to program a sevcon gen4

General Discussion about large electric scooters and motorcycles and other things with no pedals.
ewa1001   10 µW

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Re: how to program a sevcon gen4

Post by ewa1001 » Dec 15 2019 2:44am

Is any one have DLD file compatible for induction motor ? Controller: GEN 4 80V 550A
Like 0711.0002 or else.

frodus   10 kW

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Re: how to program a sevcon gen4

Post by frodus » Dec 16 2019 11:59am

Each motor is different. You'll need to provide the make/model of the induction motor before we're able to tell you if one exists.
Travis

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Re: how to program a sevcon gen4

Post by ewa1001 » Dec 17 2019 2:37am

Hi Travis,
The motor is an AC Induction 48V RMS from a Germen brand.
I tried to integrate with SEVCON GEN4, but it seem missing some fields in the set up software.
There are no rotor parameter, slip, saturation. Looks like its ready for PMAC motor.

Amit.

ewa1001   10 µW

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Re: how to program a sevcon gen4

Post by ewa1001 » Dec 17 2019 10:26am

I think it calls: Firmware for GEN4 Size6 80V 550A Sin Cos
Any one can send me a DLD file for that ?

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Re: how to program a sevcon gen4

Post by frodus » Dec 17 2019 12:22pm

Each motor is different. You'll need to provide the make/model of the induction motor before we're able to tell you if one exists.
Travis

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Re: how to program a sevcon gen4

Post by Robinev » Feb 29 2020 7:10am

liveforphysics wrote:
jamo96 wrote:
liveforphysics wrote:I've never used anything but a $99 USB to CAN adapter for all my sevcon programming.

Even Sevcon doesn't use the handheld thing.
Do you still need the sevcon PC software along with a USB to CAN for programming?

Yes.
I need the dvt old version and new if possible...


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OpenGB4   1 µW

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Re: how to program a sevcon gen4

Post by OpenGB4 » Mar 02 2020 11:33am

Has anyone developed C# code to send/receive COB data to SEVCON? This is alternative to older supplied dvt software and required license. I am working on C3 app with IXXAT USB-CAN dwe as interface. Any ideas or support would be appreciated.

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Re: how to program a sevcon gen4

Post by Robinev » Mar 02 2020 1:30pm

OpenGB4 wrote:Has anyone developed C# code to send/receive COB data to SEVCON? This is alternative to older supplied dvt software and required license. I am working on C3 app with IXXAT USB-CAN dwe as interface. Any ideas or support would be appreciated.
How is it coming along. Is there any hold backs to it and is it possible to connect via an rs232 ftdi tx rx usb converter? Any one know which pins on the sevcon gen4 s2 is txrx


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Re: how to program a sevcon gen4

Post by 2xhp » Mar 05 2020 4:58pm

Ingo wrote:
Sep 23 2019 2:23pm
thanks. i got it :)

Now I'm smarter: you have to swap sin and cos. Swap M2 and M3. then it turn in correct way.

but i still can not record a trace... says me not enough data points.

logs.rar
Hey there Ingo!

It looks like you resolved this somehow. I'm getting the same error:
DVT_error.PNG
Error when importing trace file to graph voltage vectors
DVT_error.PNG (12.37 KiB) Viewed 1866 times
I record Uq and Ud for about 10 seconds. Do I need to do it longer? Do I need to go longer? I'm using this great post as a guide:

https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=88647

Thanks in advance.

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darseygodwin   10 mW

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Re: how to program a sevcon gen4

Post by darseygodwin » Mar 05 2020 10:01pm

Sorry I edited this post a couple times as I was remembering how thing went down for me in the end.

@2xhp, try spinning the motor in the other direction, or swapping the M2 and M3 leads at the controller and trying again. Ingo's comment about flipping sin/cos suggests the motor's turning direction was opposite the sin/cos encoder's direction when it wasn't working. It's been just slightly too long since I did this that it's hazy and I can't remember if DVT needed to be in "forward" or just having the wheel spinning in the same direction as the applied torque direction. When my stuff was backwards I switched DVT to "forward" which spun the motor in backwards in order to take a trace. I then switched DVT back to "Reverse" again to hit the road. Careful that you don't have everything aligned 180 degrees out, because it can first seem ok but then quickly go unstable and race to Mach 10 when freewheeling. As in, be ready to hit the brakes when testing.

Second possibility is that it wasn't turning fast enough to register Ud/Uq values. You can see that right in the vehicle monitor screen though so you might've already ruled that out. Good luck.

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Re: how to program a sevcon gen4

Post by 2xhp » Mar 06 2020 10:24am

darseygodwin wrote:
Mar 05 2020 10:01pm
@2xhp, try spinning the motor in the other direction, or swapping the M2 and M3 leads at the controller and trying again. Ingo's comment about flipping sin/cos suggests the motor's turning direction was opposite the sin/cos encoder's direction when it wasn't working. It's been just slightly too long since I did this that it's hazy and I can't remember if DVT needed to be in "forward" or just having the wheel spinning in the same direction as the applied torque direction.

Second possibility is that it wasn't turning fast enough to register Ud/Uq values. You can see that right in the vehicle monitor screen though so you might've already ruled that out. Good luck.
Thank you, those are some great ideas which I'll try. After looking at my trace file and the Uq and Ud value magnitudes and comparing to a data file Ingo posted, I do think the motor wasn't spinning fast enough. I was using a drill, but it was struggling to get the motor to spin very fast. Maybe a few hundred rpm was all.

I'll try some things and report back what I come up with. Thanks again!

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Re: how to program a sevcon gen4

Post by USU_ENGR » Mar 14 2020 3:48pm

Hi All,

My buddies and I are trying to program a Gen4 controller for part of our senior project. It has been a very bumpy ride with the DVT software so far. After some initial struggles,we were able to get the line contactor to close, and have tried commissioning the sine/cosine encoder but are not having any luck. We have gone through the "Setting up PMAC Software" app note to comission the encoder and also this thread: viewtopic.php?t=88647

We keep getting this error when we try and graph the voltage vectors:
DVT_error.PNG
DVT_error.PNG (12.37 KiB) Viewed 1753 times
The motor controllers were purchased from a third party vendor, and Sevcon will not offer any assistance. Has anyone ran into this problem before? If so, any suggestions on how to proceed?

We have also tried the suggestions from this thread, but no luck with that either:
viewtopic.php?f=10&t=36146&p=1534700&hi ... n#p1534700

Any help would be greatly appreciated.

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Re: how to program a sevcon gen4

Post by Fldavy » Apr 06 2020 4:26pm

Hello,

I am trying to program a Sevcon GEN4 4845 with U, V, W encoder for an EMRAX 188 motor but unable to make it spin.
I have been able to follow all the Sevcon instructions in order to check the signal alignments an the cables orderings.
I have made calculations (with constructor data) and measurements with a scope for the Ke value and I found the same figures in both cases.
About the inductance, I have the Ld and Lq data (5.4 and 6 micro H) but the DVT software requires the Ls value. I don't know how I can get it.
With no fault message from the controller the only thing I can get from the motor is some noise.
I do not know how to manage all the other parameters.
Does anybody know this motor or could help me with the settings for such a motor ?

Thank you for your help.

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Re: how to program a sevcon gen4

Post by john61ct » Apr 06 2020 6:15pm

Thanks to everyone contributing to this thread.

Reminding the rest of us to avoid Sevcon products,

unless there is a locally available pro with the programming equipment, licensed software and knowledge/skills/training/experience

to help us tune/program the controller for a given motor in our unique rig for our preferred usage.

Obviously the company is actively working to ensure the profits of their OEM business partners, and rejecting the attempts of DIYers

and our community should really not support that business model any more than say Bosch's.

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darseygodwin   10 mW

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Re: how to program a sevcon gen4

Post by darseygodwin » Apr 10 2020 10:36am

As someone who's fought with a gen4 for two years off and on evenings and weekends to get a single prototype running, I assure you I understand the frustrations with not having technical support from Sevcon.

But that's exactly why we should continue supporting the product on this forum in my opinion. If I were Sevcon and made a product that's both reliable and highly capable as long as it's programmed by a professional, then I too would not directly support hobbyists because it's a dead end. You'll also see the same thing on this forum. If someone posts a blank question "yea so I found this sevcon on ebay and I need some help. How do I hook it up?" -> that user is not getting much help here because we'd need to get paid to supply those hours. 2nd comment on that too, the gen4 is something like 12 or more years old now is it not? Why should we expect deep OEM customer support on a product like that?

In my opinion, this forum is supporting semi-professionals too, not just hobbyists. Of course I'm still nowhere near an expert, but this forum's content has been critical to my success and I'll do my part to forward any knowledge to anyone else to pay it forward. If fighting with a sevcon for this long means I'll get 15% more range and/or power than using a comparable unit that's easier to program but less efficient, I'd have chosen the Sevcon again hands down.

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Re: how to program a sevcon gen4

Post by john61ct » Apr 10 2020 11:19am

I'd be willing to travel for a good training program.

Saw a few dozen Gen4s going cheap last month, shame to think they're likely to go unused.

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Re: how to program a sevcon gen4

Post by jamo96 » Jul 06 2020 3:41am

Hey all,

Has anyone swapped a potentiometer throttle to a hall effect? The hall effect throttle supply required is 5v however I cant seem to find in DVT where to set the voltage. It is currently set to 10v for the potentiometer.

Thanks

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Re: how to program a sevcon gen4

Post by romelec » Jul 06 2020 4:55am

I don't think it is possible to change the supply voltage, just put an external voltage regulator.

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Re: how to program a sevcon gen4

Post by jamo96 » Jul 08 2020 2:46am

Yes the potentiometer supplies are fixed to 10v as I found out. Some later models have 5v output on pin 10 but my model - it is at batt +ve. The encoder supply is programmable to 5v or 10v but is already being used by the hall sensors. Might have to go down the regular path. Thanks

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Re: how to program a sevcon gen4

Post by frodus » Jul 08 2020 12:53pm

What hall throttle are you using? Some have an input that is 12V tolerant.

I got some that were 8-30V, spring loaded, and waterproof from MCS.
Travis

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Inwo   10 kW

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Re: how to program a sevcon gen4

Post by Inwo » Jul 08 2020 11:05pm

P34 is current limited for use with a 2 wire throttle.
I have not done it, but clamp it with a 5v zener and measure current. A few hundred ma is safe for a common 5w 5v.

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Re: how to program a sevcon gen4

Post by jamo96 » Jul 11 2020 4:29pm

a few things to try - thanks guys. I dont have much info on the throttle apart from it taking 5v supply. I have it working now using the CycleAnalyst 5v supply so all good for the moment.

Another question I have is that at 0rpm with the throttle engaged slightly the motor kind of hesitates - oscilating slightly back and forth - before it starts to ramp up rpm (there is also a sound while at 0rpm and slight throttle). It seems like that it detects throttle voltage and engages the drive circuit but trys to hold it at 0rpm before the throttle reaches a threshold and then ramps up as normal. I have a small deadband in the throttle start voltage - which the manual indicates there should be. Any thoughts? the sound is reasonably loud.

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Re: how to program a sevcon gen4

Post by jamo96 » Jul 12 2020 6:37am

Okay I've got rid of the hesitating. The sound remains, especially when returning to 0rpm after spinning up.

You can see in this video.
https://vimeo.com/437576888

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Re: how to program a sevcon gen4

Post by Robinev » Jul 27 2020 12:21pm

genawin wrote:
I plan to get a motenergy me0913 to use the controller with. My hope now is, since the motor is a quite common one, that there is somebody out there who has this motor run with that particular controller and is able and willing to provide me the data that I need to "upload" to the controller and can give me advice on how to do it (as long as the same data can be used for same models of motors).
I think i can offer you a little help , but i'm far from an expert , The Gen4 is a high quality controller and perfect for the ME0913 - but it has taken a very long time to set up and i would not recommend it to anyone that was inexperienced.
Can you help me with wire loom issue I think I need +voltage to logic side of board. And the contactor power


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darseygodwin   10 mW

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Re: how to program a sevcon gen4

Post by darseygodwin » Jul 27 2020 12:37pm

@jamo96 you might not get away from the low speed whine completely, but I'm thinking it'll have to do with oscillation in the Id/Iq circuit. When you say you got rid of the hesitation, was that from changes in ramp rates or PI gains? You might need to tighten up the PI control a bit more to get rid of the noise. If you take a trace and it's still oscillating, especially at load, then you might need to check that you have shielding on all B- wires, even the little signal ones like the run switch or seat switch etc. For the record I still hear that too when I hold my rear brake and open up the throttle.

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