Mystery solved: Why so many new 'cycles crashed - new tires!

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Aug 28, 2015
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Been watching 'how I crashed' videos and blogs. On the video clips, the crashes seem very mystefying -- low speeds, not banking hard, etc etc.

After spending a few days and getting my eyeballs crooked from reading tiny, print, in a very long and very sad story of a young man who destroyed his life stunting, one poster stated what I was looking for: "New tires are like greased weasels."

Here are the videos and blogs that I am referring to ..

http://forums.anandtech.com/showthread.php?t=66746

https://www.reddit.com/r/motorcycles/comments/10k0fv/til_new_tires_are_slippery/

https://www.google.com/search?q=new+motorcycle+tires+are+like+greased+weasels&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8#q=motorcycle+new+tires+are+slippery

https://www.google.com/search?q=new+motorcycle+tires+are+like+greased+weasels&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8#q=new+tire+accident+my+motorcycle++crash+because+new+tires




These are the mysterious crashes, with no apparent reason for their crashes:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ksn6at2dHwQ

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4J6HlmqkQDA

see rider's view: "rubbish tires .. lost traction"
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YAccUxspDEI

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qmul6Do4gFc


nSNIP, FROM ONE OF THE GOOGLE HITS:

"New tires can be *very* dangerous. I know a guy that has been riding forever and puts lots and lots of miles on. A couple years ago he got new tires put on, which is nothing new for him. The shop is only half a block from a main intersection in town. He lost control in the middle of the intersection. Ended up beaten up pretty bad, with a broken collar bone and cracked ribs. He doesn't remember what happened, but from what they can figure out he low sided since the bike just slid out from underneath him.

New tires are very slippery. That being said, it doesn't take many miles to scuff the tires up. I guess it depends on your riding style on how many miles it takes. If you do lots of turns (or go to a parking lot and do figure 8's), it wouldn't be but a couple of miles. But, if you mostly go in a straight line, I suspect it could take a while to get the off center spots scuffed a bit. But I would think in normal riding 100 miles is excessive to break in tires
."



QUESTION FOR E-RIDERS:

Did the vendor/dealer tell you this?
 
Last time I got new rubbers on the sport bike it fixed my speed wobble though :p

But you make valid points, new tires should be treated like just wetted summer asphalt, and speed wobble is no joke- mine was just the ability to ride no hands, so new tires made for perfect tracking with no hands at up to highway speeds :D
 
I have been riding motorcycles for years and yes always be very careful on new tyres until they are scrubbed in ( same with car and bicycle tyres ).. there is no real time or miles scale as it depends on the tyre compound as to how quick they scrub .. very hard wearing compound tyres tend to take the longest to scrub in ( and these tend to be the most expensive ), soft compounds scrub a lot quicker but also wear quicker.
 
This was always my favorite new tire crash...
[youtube]Q9zNUPDmnz4[/youtube]
 
Theres also the fact that most of these riders have little throttle control, or are just plain not paying attention.

I laugh at these people blaming the tires, mostly because:
1. we put brand new tires on sportbikes all the time, and then go out on the track.
2. they do NOT put any kind of mold release on the tires.. the molds are just polished that smooth, so it looks slick.

short of a dealer or moron putting tire shine on his tires, he should be able to ride normally on the street without issue.. however most of these are new riders or atleast people new to riding a high performance motorcycle, and they crash. older, experienced riders often crash because they plain old were not paying attention.
 
MrDude_1 said:
Theres also the fact that most of these riders have little throttle control, or are just plain not paying attention.

I laugh at these people blaming the tires, mostly because:
1. we put brand new tires on sportbikes all the time, and then go out on the track.
2. they do NOT put any kind of mold release on the tires.. the molds are just polished that smooth, so it looks slick.

short of a dealer or moron putting tire shine on his tires, he should be able to ride normally on the street without issue.. however most of these are new riders or atleast people new to riding a high performance motorcycle, and they crash. older, experienced riders often crash because they plain old were not paying attention.


Will just have to agree to disagree about this then.. so all tyres are equal and there is no difference between them, I think that's what you are saying and its never down to the tyre just a server lack of throttle control .

Edit:
But you are right when you say that its mainly down to riders not paying attention to what they are riding and riding over.
 
gwhy! said:
Will just have to agree to disagree about this then.. so all tyres are equal and there is no difference between them, I think that's what you are saying and its never down to the tyre just a server lack of throttle control .
Edit:
But you are right when you say that its mainly down to riders not paying attention to what they are riding and riding over.


YES. there is no tire made out there that should cause you to instantly crash just because it is new. This is not a horse, it has no mind of its own. it is a machine that will do exactly what you say. The only question is, do you have the skill to operate it correctly

I have almost a quarter million miles on just one motorcycle, and another 200,000 on various other bikes. I have kind of been through it all. It doesnt matter if you have "offroad only" knobbies, handcut slicks, new sportbike tires, or cruiser tires, fat tires, thin tires... even car tires on some goldwings.. LOL

you always can keep them under you. Its a matter of not doing something stupid with the controls.. (clutch grab, and then throttle chop being the #1 offender, followed closely by the "grabbing throttle and not knowing how to let go"
 
BahamasBiker said:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ksn6at2dHwQ

really? you can see the front wheel wash out. its wet dirt and loose rocks on asphalt. I blame inexperiance here by far.
the fact that the Grom he is on is a short wheelbase bike, and hes sitting so that most of his weight is in the rear, does not help either. I would have been very cautious around this corner, but its brutally obvious that there is dirt here. its not a dusting, its a pile across the road.


BahamasBiker said:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4J6HlmqkQDA

he grabbed the front brake while leaned in the corner. This tucks the wheel, and slams you into a lowside. You do NOT brake in the corner (unless you're trailing off the brakes on tip in, and even then that is not a beginner level thing, nor does it apply here)
I think everyone has done this at some point if they ride long enough.
(btw, even if you know nothing about riding, it should be obvious since its in the video description)

BahamasBiker said:
see rider's view: "rubbish tires .. lost traction"
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YAccUxspDEI
another Grom video.. poor riding position puts too much weight on the back, so the front washes out Its similar to video #1, except theres more traction possible, simply by changing body position. On a grom, you have to remember you weigh almost as much as the bike does, you're much higher, and your body position is much more important than on a fullsize bike. Ive raced plenty of mini-motards to tell you, the smaller the bike is, the easier it is to crash it. My most brutal hits was usually racing minibikes.

BahamasBiker said:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qmul6Do4gFc
this is simple enough, he went in the dirt, it was soft and loose, and the front washed out on him.



most of these vids are just people riding their groms over their heads... nothing to do with tires. feel bad for them of course, but atleast they all seemed geared up and ok. well... except that first vid, but if you're stupid enough to wear shorts, AND throttle around a corner that is wet with mud and gravel, I cant say I feel bad for you... wear your gear atleast...
 
Cant speak for motorcycle tires , but car tires are sometimes sprayed with a protective wax for storage.
but this wax is rubbed off first 500 meters.

.manitu
 
Here you go, this article explains why new tyres can have less grip than worn in/scrubbed tyres.
http://motorbikewriter.com/break-new-set-motorcycle-tyres/
 
interesting theory...but maybe it only applies to "slicks" and road tires.
...in Downhill racing, it is standard to have a brand new set of tires for race day...common across all levels.
I ride worn tires during practice, less grip so I have to pick the perfect line, then race day I have the traction to hold that line at top speed.
Shape of knobs is the most important factor, and fresh tires have the sharpest knobs to dig into the ground.
 
Leebolectric said:
interesting theory...but maybe it only applies to "slicks" and road tires.
...in Downhill racing, it is standard to have a brand new set of tires for race day...common across all levels.
I ride worn tires during practice, less grip so I have to pick the perfect line, then race day I have the traction to hold that line at top speed.
Shape of knobs is the most important factor, and fresh tires have the sharpest knobs to dig into the ground.

Well it doesn't apply to new sportbike tires. Otherwise everyone would crash at turn one. Lol
 
wineboyrider said:
Drag racers like to heat their tires up before racing. :?
yeah we do... the compound works better with heat in it.
same with road racing tires.
or all tires.
they have more traction when warmer.
 
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