Dashboard suggestions

General Discussion about large electric scooters and motorcycles and other things with no pedals.
Upwinger   100 µW

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Dashboard suggestions

Post by Upwinger » Dec 09 2017 3:00pm

Hello Everyone,
I've finally officially joined the forum after a few years of occasional searches. In 2018
I am upgrading my electric dirtbike that I built with a ME1003/AXE7245 combo to a
a ME1616/Sevcon gen4sz6 combo.
Image

I want to start a thread on dashboards, because this is where I need the most help . This will be such a huge and expensive upgrade, I want the dashboard to be as advanced as I can make it, within my abilities.
Right now, the dash consists of a Cycle Analyst, a key switch, an amber led turn indicator, and an aux fan switch.
Simple and basic, gets the job done.
Image
I want to redo the entire dash assembly. I will probably keep the CycleAnalyst, but I would like to ditch the key switch and incorporate a small waterproof rugged tablet like this:https://www.walmart.com/ip/WinBridge-S9 ... 3=&veh=sem
My thought was that the tablet could be the secure interface with the SevCon controller, as well as gps and/or other basic dash info like speedometer/odometer (although CycleAnalyst already does that). I hope somebody here on this forum can help me with ideas, experience, and how to's to get this configured and functional.
Thank you in advance!

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Re: Dashboard suggestions

Post by amberwolf » Dec 10 2017 2:42am

There are projects for android here on ES that display CA info on the android device. Ebike Analyzer has a thread of that title; there's others if you look around for "android" in the first posts of threads.


I don't know if there's anything android to deal with Sevcon--you can look thru Methods' threads to see if he's done anything like that (has a lot of Sevcon threads).


There's also threads about electronic keyswitches; I think Agniusm has a project at the completed stage. Jeremy Harris had an RFID keyswitch thread.

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Re: Dashboard suggestions

Post by John in CR » Dec 10 2017 7:17pm

Unless you're going to have advanced BMS info displayed I like the original...nice and simple, especially for a dirtbike. Why introduce lots more points of failure with no real benefit?

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macribs   1 GW

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Re: Dashboard suggestions

Post by macribs » Dec 13 2017 12:02pm

I like the idea of dashbord, it is up to your imagination what can be displayed onto the dashboard.
If you tap into the can bus of the controller all sorts of fun facts can be displayed. Add that to various sensors, battery pack health, all down to each single cell.

Sure adding a dashboard introduces new potential sources of errors. But as long as you don't rely on the dashboard for basic operations of vehicle I see no problems. If you dash fails, all that would mean is that for the duration of your ride you won't know how fast you are going, battery health, motor temp, battery tempt etc.

Critical info like lvc should be at least on a buzzer as well as the dash, so you hear when you need to stop draining battery. The same for motor heat. One buzzer that goes off as an early warning, and a second one that tells you "heat is on". One thing I would find really useful was to display various graphical presentation of various riding stat from log files filled from your can bus.

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Re: Dashboard suggestions

Post by Upwinger » Dec 13 2017 4:14pm

The original idea of using a tablet for a dash was for security. The key switch can easily be hot wired by any thief with 1/2 a brain.
I have learned of this company and password protected bluetooth relay controllers: https://www.tinyosshop.com/tinysine-blu ... ooth-relay which need a 12-24v to 5v converter to operate, which the company also offers: https://www.tinyosshop.com/index.php?ro ... uct_id=710
This is a nice solution as it will allow me to charge my cell phone and tablet off of my bike's battery pack. No more keys!

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macribs   1 GW

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Re: Dashboard suggestions

Post by macribs » Dec 13 2017 9:02pm

If you are after security may I recommend RFID? The secure ones uses a number generated code with each contact so to avoid breach in security. You could even inject the RFID chip under your skin, just brush the RFID reader slightly with your forearm to turn on e-bike. And for that you don't even need a dashboard.

But to be honest, any thief worth their salt won't care about how hard or easy it is to hot wire your bike. If they first got their eyes on the price and have decided to have a "renewing of ownership" no matter what you do and how you bolt it down they will find a way. Use U-lock. They use HD disk grinder. Use wires covered with anti cut and stab sleeve and they will find the right tool to first get away with the anti cut sleeve then snap the wire. If you by chance or luck should find a lock they can't pick, crack or smack and bolt your e-bike to a heavy slab of concrete they will use a fork lift and steal away the block of concrete and your bike at the same time.

Best thing to do is to build something that is not too unik, something you can replace fairly easy. Then go see a man about insurance. Get good coverage and if that day comes and you lost your e-bike, build yourself a new one and don't waste time worrying.

But for fun and cool information displayed to suit your needs a dashboard is the way to go. Using a tablet with decent screen resolution will allow for making a GUI that is easily read in all weather conditions, sun or rain. You could even have a night ride mode that uses red colors to avoid messing up your natural night vision. Like you see on some ships, in some Audi sport cars, etc. Notice they illuminate with red color.

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Re: Dashboard suggestions

Post by amberwolf » Dec 14 2017 12:46am

Upwinger wrote:
Dec 13 2017 4:14pm
I have learned of this company and password protected bluetooth relay controllers:
Unless the relay is embedded in the wiring where a thief couldn't find or access it or the wiring that goes to and from it (so they could just wire around it), it's still possible to hotwire it, if they knew enough electrical stuff to know what to look for. (though it would take a little time to find the right wires).


which need a 12-24v to 5v converter to operate, which the company also offers:
This is a nice solution as it will allow me to charge my cell phone and tablet off of my bike's battery pack.
If it helps, you can probably use most 115VAC-powered 5V chargers or power supplies to do this, wiring the AC prongs to your traction battery pack. Most of the modern ones (just about anything supplied with tablets or phones, laptops, etc) will start at an input voltage over about 50-60VDC.

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Re: Dashboard suggestions

Post by Upwinger » Dec 14 2017 4:57pm

If it helps, you can probably use most 115VAC-powered 5V chargers or power supplies to do this, wiring the AC prongs to your traction battery pack. Most of the modern ones (just about anything supplied with tablets or phones, laptops, etc) will start at an input voltage over about 50-60VDC.
I wasn't aware of that, I could give it a try ... I have a few around in a box somewhere. You may have saved me 10 bucks. Thanks!

I am redesigning my battery enclosure so I can put all the security stuff inside. It wont be easy to get to. The batt pack will have to be removed from the bike to get to it. Ya I agree if a thief really wanted it, just throw it in the back of a truck and go. But I don't like giving free easy joyrides with my bikes. They have to work a little for it, I did!

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Re: Dashboard suggestions

Post by Bernel » Jan 03 2018 4:17pm

You can always go down the multi functional display route and custom fit it to the bike just like the Mission Motorcycles and Energica's. I had a 7 inch tablet with a wireless connection to a micro processor but wanted something permanent so I designed the system below.
Multi Function Display.pdf
Multi function Display schematic
(169.8 KiB) Downloaded 44 times
My project currently looks like this
IMG_1468.PNG
Display not powered
IMG_1468.PNG (86.15 KiB) Viewed 1201 times
IMG_1470.PNG
Display powered
IMG_1470.PNG (89.86 KiB) Viewed 1201 times
With an Android App to monitor the charging.
IMG_1416.JPG
Android App
IMG_1416.JPG (80.31 KiB) Viewed 1201 times
You will notice that the BMS is not associated with this set up so the bike will run regardless of a failure.

Bernel

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Re: Dashboard suggestions

Post by jonescg » Jan 03 2018 9:41pm

Here's my dash:
Voltron dash.JPG
Voltron dash.JPG (56.53 KiB) Viewed 1188 times
Volts, amps, and two LEDs showing BMS happy/sad. No real need to over-complicate what should be a hassle-free experience, in my opinion.

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Re: Dashboard suggestions

Post by Upwinger » Aug 05 2018 1:46am

I ditched the tablet idea in favor of just using my cell phone, a Google pixel2.
I decided to keep the cycle analyst, as it does it's job nicely. The cool thing about using a
cell phone is that the display is the perfect size in my opinion, for my build anyway.
I am using an app called Virtuino to control a secure bluetooth relay with passphrase security.
I have a secret hidden button to bypass the Arduino Uno just in case it fails (Shhhhhh, dont tell nobody!)
The Virtuino app will also display coolant temps and battery temps. I have DigiHUD app also for a speedometer/odometer/timer display that has day/night settings which is cool, and I can toggle between these apps as well as google maps on the fly easy enough.
Image
The phone is held tightly in a 1 1/2" thick dense foam rubber that I carved out with a Dremel and router bit. I have to try pretty hard to stick my finger in at the bottom to grab the phone from behind it to pull it out.
I think I'm ok with the way it turned out. I'm sure I could refine the phone mount a bit better the next time I try.

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Re: Dashboard suggestions

Post by amberwolf » Aug 05 2018 7:07pm

What do you use to keep rain out of the phone? (or is it a waterproof phone?)

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Re: Dashboard suggestions

Post by Upwinger » Aug 05 2018 10:41pm

I have insurance on it. I'll just get a new one.

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Re: Dashboard suggestions

Post by TilmanBaumann » Aug 06 2018 4:14am

I fell in love with Andromeda-Interfaces Intelli-Gauge. https://ai-hmi.com/#products But I haven't actually used it yet myself.
Somewhat programmable. But I suspect you would still have to implement an RFID keyfob solution via external pins.

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Re: Dashboard suggestions

Post by Upwinger » Aug 08 2018 12:08pm

I sent them an email some time ago and never got a response. I'm sure it would be a sweet setup, but probably way out of my low budget.

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Re: Dashboard suggestions

Post by TilmanBaumann » Aug 09 2018 2:29am

Losing my mind over them as well right now. They don't seem to want to sell stuff. :(

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Re: Dashboard suggestions

Post by amberwolf » Aug 09 2018 1:15pm

According to this page
https://www.sbir.gov/sbirsearch/detail/700752
they are run out of an apartment, with 5 employees. ;)

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Andromeda Interfaces, Inc
Company Information
Address 550 Seagaze Dr
Apt 18
Oceanside, CA, 92054

http://www.ai-displays.com
Information

DUNS:

# of Employees: 5

Ownership Information

HUBZone Owned: N

Socially and Economically Disadvantaged: Y

Woman Owned: N


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Company currently does not have any Awards associated.

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Re: Dashboard suggestions

Post by TilmanBaumann » Aug 18 2018 9:14am

Got response from them

Code: Select all

IG is currently available to our OEM customers as engineering samples. We are forecasting to release IG to our non-OEM customers hopefully by Q1 of '19. Not sure if that fits into your timeline but would be great to see it installed onto your scooter.

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Re: Dashboard suggestions

Post by flippy » Aug 23 2018 2:05am

how are your getting the data? is that just from your bms or does it come from the sevcon?
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Re: Dashboard suggestions

Post by TilmanBaumann » Aug 23 2018 3:08am

That was from Andromeda Interfaces

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Re: Dashboard suggestions

Post by frodus » Aug 27 2018 9:37am

I'm currently toying with an idea with another manufacturer to develop CAN to Bluetooth interface that will allow you to convert CANopen to Bluetooth as an ELM327 emulator. Right now we're testing ZEVA BMS and Sevcon controllers so you can display on an android app like Torque or OBD Fusion to read custom PID's. My proto board broke, and I'm trying to test, but so far the developer is having luck and it's looking good.

Andromeda look good too, they've got a 7" and are working on a smaller 4" display.

Clearview displays for Sevcon are going to become harder to find, as I've heard they're being phased out.

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flippy   10 kW

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Re: Dashboard suggestions

Post by flippy » Aug 27 2018 3:06pm

I would love to see a interface that would basically turn sevcon canbus PID's into something a arduino would swallow. That way you can easely create your own dashboard at low cost.
I would be willing to pay for such a conversion tool+ arduino liberary.
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Re: Dashboard suggestions

Post by frodus » Aug 27 2018 5:03pm

Flippy,
I think someone mentioned work that was done on giyhub for the OVMS that could potentially be used as a starting point for Arduino sketches.

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Re: Dashboard suggestions

Post by flippy » Aug 28 2018 1:54am

frodus wrote:
Aug 27 2018 5:03pm
Flippy,
I think someone mentioned work that was done on giyhub for the OVMS that could potentially be used as a starting point for Arduino sketches.
sadly nothing that is usable.
and i am also running a business, i dont have the time to learn how to tape a arduino on a sevcon so i cant do it myself. also because i dont have the patience to do something like this. i already hate all software made to program controllers (everything from kelly to sevcon) with a passion as they are as user unfriendly as technically possible in operation.
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Re: Dashboard suggestions

Post by frodus » Aug 28 2018 9:50am

You want arduino code, but don't have the time to do the project and connect one to a sevcon?

What is it you're looking for then? I'm confused.

(asking because we're developing a board that we hope to release, so feedback is important).

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