Duyunov wheel-hub motor

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youlik   100 µW

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Re: Duyunov wheel-hub motor

Post by youlik » May 04 2018 9:59am

I can imagine, this special way of winding can bring some huge advantages to dumb industrial motors that work on fixed frequency (or just very crude control system) in varying load situation, but I see no evidence (not only me apparently), there is any advantage, in this “technology”, by using intelligent control systems with varying frequency and voltage/ speed algorithms.
Of course not just you. That's why I wrote in my first post:
At the moment, a testing laboratory is being launched and preparations are under way for the construction of a production complex for small-scale production.
I will Add about the laboratory. The first thing that started the commercialization of the project is the creation of a testing laboratory, which will be certified according to the established procedure. Then such questions will disappear. Not long to wait.
Parabellum, You have a Russian wife? Congratulations, if so! :D Send her greetings from fellow countrymen.

skazburg   10 mW

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Re: Duyunov wheel-hub motor

Post by skazburg » May 16 2018 11:14am

SlowCo wrote:
Apr 21 2018 10:14am
Great developments!
I wish you all well and will follow the progress.
During the last time, several important things happened.
1. We have a guarantor. The firm that guarantees to close the investment in case the crowdinvesting fails. The name is not spoken yet, due to an agreement of confidentiality.
Personally, I'm 100% sure that we will invest without his help.
But it's good that there is such a guarantor.
His guarantees will help us obtain permission to build a plant in the tax-free zone of Alabushevo.
2. Also we have a zone without taxes of the Lipetsk region.
There's also preparing construction of an electric plant.

skazburg   10 mW

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Re: Duyunov wheel-hub motor

Post by skazburg » May 16 2018 11:18am

cwah wrote:
Apr 22 2018 3:45pm
Why can't we buy if it's so much better?
Before that, there were prototypes and rewinding standard electric motors.
And now the technology is being introduced into mass production.

skazburg   10 mW

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Re: Duyunov wheel-hub motor

Post by skazburg » May 16 2018 11:31am

....
, those guys just go the “special”, Russian path you and me will never understand, like I will never understand my wife, things in Russia are just made the way to only work upside down, this is not related to translation inaccuracies. It is probably the reason we do not see many Russian startups on western platforms.
In the 90s the USSR collapsed.
And for many years we have been far from startups.
We just survived as a people and as a country.
At this time, Russian engineers were bought for small money.
Later, the Russian economy began to grow and grow stronger.
And Duyunov one who refused to sell technology for low price.

skazburg   10 mW

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Re: Duyunov wheel-hub motor

Post by skazburg » Jul 22 2018 12:36am

I have not written for a long time, I have a lot of news on technology.
The largest is an agreement with WeiHai province in China.
Below are pre-plant tests.
https://youtu.be/6p2AgTqyww4

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macribs   1 GW

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Re: Duyunov wheel-hub motor

Post by macribs » Jul 23 2018 7:41am

Nice a mid drive version too. Like that one a lot.

Well this is all good and dandy, but when will these motors be available to the public? When will we see them for sale? I mean I like the fact the motor do without magnets, that it reduces the the size and weight of the motor. But it seems this motor have been in development for about 6 years now. I think it is about time to step it up from prototype to full scale production ready and get the first batch manufactured and put to sale. No company makes money on the idea itself. It's when the idea is completed and turned into an actual product that is ready to be sold the magic happens.

As for investors as I seem to recall you asked for investors last year. If there was actual real world sale figure for the first batch of motors I think you would attract investors more easily.

skazburg   10 mW

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Re: Duyunov wheel-hub motor

Post by skazburg » Jul 23 2018 11:54pm

Technology began to invent in the year 95.
2011 technology has been used repeatedly.
Large investors wanted to buy technology for very cheap.
Therefore, last year, began to collect people's investments, microinvestment.
And now we go 5 times faster than the plan.
Issue one separate electric motor does not make sense.
The reason is simple, electric motors are tens of thousands of species.
Therefore, we create a certified laboratory and engineering company.
And the most important direction is the sale of technology.
What you saw on the last video is the first buyers of our technology.
The engine shown in the video can be purchased separately.
There will be wholesale purchase to Russia and to Europe.
One engine to buy more expensive, but also possible.
Become an investor and promote our technology in your country.
http://reg.solargroup.pro/bwk577

skazburg   10 mW

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Re: Duyunov wheel-hub motor

Post by skazburg » Jul 31 2018 12:10am

Video shows the tests and characteristics of the vehicle Denzel Mini motor rewind of "Slavyanka" technology.
https://youtu.be/Rb7Ys_aBZPM

SlowCo   10 kW

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Re: Duyunov wheel-hub motor

Post by SlowCo » Jul 31 2018 3:38am

Great work! Nice to see this technology progress and evolve. Good luck going forward.

youlik   100 µW

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Re: Duyunov wheel-hub motor

Post by youlik » Aug 06 2018 6:06am

Here is a link to the English part of the channel.
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCivix5 ... 6xGoR56WcQ
Look, quite informative, in my opinion.
On the website of the company, which brought here scazburg, also appeared the English part.

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macribs   1 GW

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Re: Duyunov wheel-hub motor

Post by macribs » Aug 09 2018 7:34am

From an end user side I will make these comments. I am no engineer nor do I have any such training. So this is me talking about what those videos did for me, the end user. That guy that will consider buying these motors if I get excited about them.

These videos seemed to me like a a lot of blah blah. Very long videos containing nothing of valuable information. 2 or 3 minutes videos of riding with not additional information about the motor? Who needs that? And the one that had some information was made so that I mid way in the 8 minutes long video felt I should kill myself rather then watch it to the end. Nothing to get excited about and nothing that convinced me I should try to buy such a motor. Just dry facts explained in a really ongoing way that was almost a turn off.

What I would like to see in the videos. What sets these motors apart from traditional dd hubs using magnets? How does that work in a practical situation? Demonstrated by side by side ride with two e-bikes one with well known dd hub motor the other with the duyonov induction motor. How does the induction motor perform in acceleration, climbing and speed compared with regular dd hub, like QS 205H? What about motor temperature during acceleration, climbs etc? What are the weight savings over similar performing dd hub motor? Will an induction motor give me more range then a dd hub? Claiming to be effective I would suspect so. But show me.

And what about the new mid drive induction motor? Why no in depth video about that motor? Also for that mid drive motor we should have seen a side by side comparison with a well known and familiar mid drive motor. Give us facts like motor weight, max operating temperature, torque, etc. Show us how motor performs in hill climb, acceleration and top speed.

From an end user perspective how the windings are done, star or delta winding or combining those are not too important. We should see how this translate into real world performance. How will such a motor be lighter then a regular magnetic electric motor? How much weight can we save by choosing his induction motor over a traditional motor? Will induction motor give us faster acceleration? Can we climb steeper hills? Have the same top speed or possible higher top speed? These are what we need to see and be informed about. That will get us excited. Videos as I see them now are just blah blah. Nothing that got me fired up, nothing in them videos makes me wanna go and buy such a motor, and nothing of the info made me feel the need to dig deeper into the subject because the videos didn't create any desire to get such a motor.

skazburg   10 mW

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Re: Duyunov wheel-hub motor

Post by skazburg » Aug 09 2018 11:33am

macribs wrote:
Aug 09 2018 7:34am
We have already done many comparative tests.
But we were often told that we do the wrong tests.
We are tired of listening to such conclusions.
And we decided to make a certified laboratory for the project.
Now the laboratory is almost completely ready.
Comparative tests are already conducted.
We talk about them gradually.
English versions of the news lag behind the news in Russian.
Investments we collect five times faster than the plan.
Therefore, we do not have the task of convincing everyone.
Wait until you can buy our serial model.
And then, test it yourself as you like.
If you see for yourself other perspectives in our project, then respond to my personal message for you.
First of all, now we are looking for investors, and those who want to represent our project in other countries.

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macribs   1 GW

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Re: Duyunov wheel-hub motor

Post by macribs » Aug 09 2018 7:22pm

My intentions was not to step on anyones toes here. I was trying to sa what I think about those videos I watched. And I watched them as a potential customer who are looking for the next thing in electric motors. That is my point of view.

People looking for a new motor might not be have enough training or schooling to fully understand what delta, star winding means or what benefits comes from combining those. I mean we have had a few DIY projects here on ES and a few threads of people making such motors themselves but it was bldc motors and not induction motors.

Inventor of the Duyunov motor is a skilled engineer from what I understand. And clearly he knows everything about this motor, why the choices where made and how those choices impact performance, torque, horsepower etc. But us potential buyers, for us it is more useful to see comparison with well known motors that we can relate to. Motors we know how the perform, we know their strong a weak sides and what one could expect from such a motor and what kind of cooling is required to meet our performance need.

If we could see videos that addresses these things those videos would be a major deciding factor, that would be beneficial for us and that would in the end probably help to create demand for these motors, ensuring that companies will get in touch with you to secure orders or even custom motors to their specs or performance needs.

Dismissing this and just brushing it off I must say I find it a little arrogant. If you already done comparisons pls show us in your videos. If you get feedback that people got different wishes why not try to meet their wishes and do more tests? Or try to have a dialogue to see if you can somehow meet their needs. Just saying you are tired of it all, well again that just seems arrogant.

If you are pleased with the orders you've gotten, and you don't need more investors or pre orders or bulk orders i guess it does not matter. Then you can focus solely on what you deem most important and make sure you reach your goals and deliveries. If not maybe now is the time to rethink you earlier choice and try to listen to what people are asking. It used to be that if you made a great product people would learn about it and customers would show up knocking. Today we are flooded with information of all kinds all day long, and to penetrate this steady stream of information make your mark a strategy and planning will increase you chances to be heard and seen.

This is just my thoughts on the subject. I could have missed important videos or maybe all this is addressed already in russian forums etc. I am not trying to be a dick here, I am trying to point out there might be other areas that could need some attention.

Anyway, I look forward to see the end product. And especially the mid motor, I have high hopes for that one. I wish you the best for the launch and I know when motors are available we will soon see people doing their own testing.

Hillhater   100 GW

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Re: Duyunov wheel-hub motor

Post by Hillhater » Aug 09 2018 11:00pm

skazburg wrote:
Aug 09 2018 11:33am
.....
First of all, now we are looking for investors, and those who want to represent our project in other countries.
?? but you say you want to sell the " Technology" to investors..?
Investors are only interested in business performance to date, and business potential in the future
..basicly that means what are your sales to date, and how will you increase that in the future.
So you have to have a Marketing plan and strategy .. IE: Advertising !

As macribs said, buyers want to know how the product compares on performance, price, availability, reliability etc..they are not concerned with the testing labs, or the magic technology..just end results.
This forum owes its existence to Justin of ebikes.ca

youlik   100 µW

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Re: Duyunov wheel-hub motor

Post by youlik » Aug 10 2018 6:36am

Dismissing this and just brushing it off I must say I find it a little arrogant. If you already done comparisons pls show us in your videos. If you get feedback that people got different wishes why not try to meet their wishes and do more tests? Or try to have a dialogue to see if you can somehow meet their needs. Just saying you are tired of it all, well again that just seems arrogant.
Guys, no one is tired and especially there is no arrogance, we just have to say in such cases: I'm talking about Thomas - you're talking about Eremu.
You always ask about the serial engine, but it is not exist! There is no motor, which was originally designed by the technology "Slavyanka" and manufactured in an industrial way. What is exist there? There are several motors of different types, which are assembled to varying degrees using parts of serial engines, mainly the body parts. Even the motor, which makes Denzel and installs in cars and motorcycles, in fact there is a serial asynchronous motor with winding converted by technology "Slavyanka".
So what's all this "blah-blah-blah"about? All this is about the fact that the originally designed and manufactured by this technology, the engine will give an advantage over commercially manufactured engines, both magnetic and asynchronous. The advantage in weight, material capacity, power, etc. Given that the world uses about 10,000 types of asynchronous motors, using this technology can get more savings. To promote and commercialize this technology is the goal and task of Dmitry Duyunov`s company.
So, those who need a specific motor in a particular store can relax and wait. You will get a motor that will make you throw out all of his magnetic motors. And no one, but several types of engines.
Those who understand the perspectives of that technology have the opportunity to join the process.

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macribs   1 GW

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Re: Duyunov wheel-hub motor

Post by macribs » Aug 11 2018 10:07pm

I will try to examplify what I mean. Once I was gonna trade in my old car for a new model. Because of my job I needed an estate/station wagon. Because of the high mileage travel I knew I needed a diesel engine. And we got long winters and much snow so I decided to go for a 4x4. Those where my needs. A lot of cars could fill those needs. There was SUV's, station wagons, german cars, swedish ones, japanese etc. I didn't study each motor, the 4x4 system or use a tape measure for the boot. I went to a few dealers and looked around, took a few testdrives and narrowed things down. It came down to a choice between two german makers and one swedish. I could choose either one of those, they all would work for my needs. What made the choice simple was how one manufacturer met my needs without being a sales dick, you know the type. In examples regards to seating, I got the updated seats without additional costs, even those cost extra. I got an additional winter package at no cost, even if it in the price list that was extra. So a diesel heater was added and I got vented comfort seat.

If I was to study the 4x4 systems, the engines, turbos etc I am sure there would be a lot of technical details. That was not important to me, first of because this was a work vehicle, and second because I had to speed up the purchase process to ensure I got the new car within the set time frame, mind you I was selling my old one and would need to make the overlap between cars as small as possible.

The salesman who "won" the sale was the salesperson that best met my needs and that could show me something that was different from the others. He went down on the price on some add ons, but he gained the sale of a car, additional wheel sets, roof box, satnav, etc and not to mention after sale follow up and services. He made it easy for me to be brand and shop loyal and stop by their shop for service and aftermarket purchases because he was cool and listened to my needs when I was on the look out, rather then being a badass salesperson that focus solely on the biggest revenue possible.

Make sure you take the right lesson from this. The point of this is not about price, or discount. Nor is it about in depth tech stuff. I didn't study tech spec sheets and compare, and from what I've hear it seems that is more common then you might think. It is about people and how people interact and build relations.

Since that purchase I've bought two other cars from the same dealer. The super price was only the first purchase, and I am fine with that. But the important thing is he build trust and loyalty. If they had electric cars I might have gotten my last car from that dealer as well. Maybe next time the do have electric and I go back possible?

skazburg   10 mW

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Re: Duyunov wheel-hub motor

Post by skazburg » Aug 12 2018 1:03am

Perhaps, "youlik" spoke too directly.
But he said the truth.
Yes, the investments are going well.
But we have a plan for how to spend it.
We have already done different comparisons of electric motors.
Participated in exhibitions and presentations.
But the market is such that all producers hold on to their jobs and for their technology.
Therefore, our project is supported by those who have no direct interests.
These are mostly ordinary citizens of our country.
And now more and more countries are connecting.
It is thanks to ordinary people, small investors, we are moving the project.
To be clear, the average investment of 2000 dollars.
Soon the test lab is almost finished.
And now the video with comparative tests will be more.
First of all, we carry out comparative tests for the manufacturer.
And they are partially closed, because they want to have an advantage over other manufacturer.

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Re: Duyunov wheel-hub motor

Post by skazburg » Aug 12 2018 12:57pm

Friends, if anyone wants to order an electric motor DA90S with a winding "Slavyanka", write to me.
The motor is shown in the video links above.
The price is $ 350 plus shipping costs to your country.
It is possible to supply the controller Curtis or another.
Order an electric motor and carry out tests

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parabellum   10 MW

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Re: Duyunov wheel-hub motor

Post by parabellum » Aug 13 2018 10:48am

skazburg wrote:
Aug 12 2018 12:57pm
Friends, if anyone wants to order an electric motor DA90S with a winding "Slavyanka", write to me.
Do you have a specs. sheet for this modded motor?

skazburg   10 mW

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Re: Duyunov wheel-hub motor

Post by skazburg » Aug 13 2018 12:00pm

SPECIFICATION
DA-90S

Diameter of the rotor: 86mm
Length of rotor: 85 mm
Outer diameter of the stator: 130 mm
6 poles
Weight 10.5 kg

Maximum current without overheating: 90A
Peak current 250 A (2 minutes)
Peak current 350 A (10 s)
The maximum speed of 6000 RPM
Torque from start: 71 Nm (on shaft)
Maximum torque: 74 Nm (on the shaft)

At present day, the optimal controller:
1. Curtis: 1236E-62XX 48-80V
2. Kelly: KAC7230H

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parabellum   10 MW

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Re: Duyunov wheel-hub motor

Post by parabellum » Aug 13 2018 8:04pm

So is this exact same motor from http://www.eastgem.net/da-90.html or is it some other modification?
How much does a matched and programmed kit costs, DA-90S+Kelly KAC7230H?

skazburg   10 mW

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Re: Duyunov wheel-hub motor

Post by skazburg » Aug 13 2018 11:39pm

parabellum wrote:
Aug 13 2018 8:04pm
So is this exact same motor from http://www.eastgem.net/da-90.html or is it some other modification?
How much does a matched and programmed kit costs, DA-90S+Kelly KAC7230H?
Yes.
I clarify now - this is the data of a serial or test electric motor.
I will write later.

Rated power 3kW
Power in peak about 9kW
Voltage 72V

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parabellum   10 MW

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Re: Duyunov wheel-hub motor

Post by parabellum » Aug 14 2018 8:23am

skazburg wrote:
Aug 13 2018 11:39pm
Yes.
I clarify now - this is the data of a serial or test electric motor.
I will write later.

Rated power 3kW
Power in peak about 9kW
Voltage 72V
Let me try to organize what you said.
1. Original series produced motor you took as base is 3kW rated, 9kW peak and works on 72V.
2. Slavyanka mod of former motor permits to make continuous 90Ax72V= ~6.5kW and peak at 25kW, considering 72V system.

Is it right so?

skazburg   10 mW

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Re: Duyunov wheel-hub motor

Post by skazburg » Aug 14 2018 10:40am

parabellum wrote:
Aug 14 2018 8:23am

Let me try to organize what you said.
1. Original series produced motor you took as base is 3kW rated, 9kW peak and works on 72V.
2. Slavyanka mod of former motor permits to make continuous 90Ax72V= ~6.5kW and peak at 25kW, considering 72V system.

Is it right so?
No.
I specified.
Under the link, the old data, some of them on the electric motor of a different power.
Correct data
Rated power 3 kW
Maximum in peak to 20 seconds 9,4 kW
Max. Peak moment at 350A - 74Nm
Voltage 72V (60-85V recommended)
Weight 10.5 kg

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parabellum   10 MW

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Re: Duyunov wheel-hub motor

Post by parabellum » Aug 14 2018 10:59am

skazburg wrote:
Aug 14 2018 10:40am
No.
I specified.
Under the link, the old data, some of them on the electric motor of a different power.
Correct data
Rated power 3 kW
Maximum in peak to 20 seconds 9,4 kW
Max. Peak moment at 350A - 74Nm
Voltage 72V (60-85V recommended)
Weight 10.5 kg
Ok. So how is DA-90S motor better than d7500 BLDC motor here http://www.eastgem.net/d7500.html ? (they are droop in equivalents of eastgem)

DA-90S has:
1) Less torque
2) Less power
3) Weights more
4) Costs more
5) Less controller options on the market

Did I forget something?

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