Homemade Battery Packs

Batteries, Chargers, and Battery Management Systems.
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DrkAngel   100 GW

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Re: Homemade Battery Packs

Post by DrkAngel » Feb 25 2018 8:56pm

Index

Recent Build update:
1. Samsung-22p 25.9V 26.4Ah build = Run several times and performs excellent in cold weather, still getting used to the lower 3.40V "empty"
2. Samsung-22p 37V 13.2Ah (37V hoverboard packs, 3 paralled) = Used on my Snow Beast with great performance and sufficient range for any of my cold weather runs.
3. Samsung-22p 37V 17.6Ah (37V hoverboard packs, 4 paralled) = Tested with the 600w front brush hub. Bag, with controller, will mount on any handle bar and run any of my brush motor bikes with XT60 motor connector. Even built XT60 extension cable to run back to rear mounted eZips.
4. Sony-Sanyo 33.3V 31.2Ah = Seems excellent, but cold weather and 37V Samsung packs have limited it's use, so far.

5. 2nd Samsung-22p 25.9V 26.4Ah = Sold with 2009 eZip LS last Fall. Will have to contact buyer and give check-up for Spring.

Better check-up 2015 25.9V 25.92Ah Lipo build for neighbor too.

Still testing FullRiver LiFePO4 ...
Last edited by DrkAngel on Mar 16 2018 5:00am, edited 2 times in total.
A little learning is a dangerous thing;
Drink deep, or taste not the Pierian spring:
There, shallow draughts intoxicate the brain,
And drinking largely, sobers us again.

I enjoy enlightening ... and enlivening the spirit of the innovators.

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vagosofron   10 W

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Re: Homemade Battery Packs

Post by vagosofron » Feb 26 2018 6:40pm

I hope I'm in the correct topic, I want to build two 4s3p batteries. My esc is 60A, so the packs I will build must provide that current, correct? If I use 20A cells, in the 3p configuration, I can achieve that number. Is that logical, or am I wrong somewhere?

Joachim   1 kW

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Re: Homemade Battery Packs

Post by Joachim » Feb 27 2018 1:38am


vagosofron   10 W

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Re: Homemade Battery Packs

Post by vagosofron » Feb 27 2018 5:00am

Joachim wrote:
Feb 27 2018 1:38am
to be save go for thes https://www.nkon.nl/rechargeable/18650- ... 0vtc6.html
Thank you, I just send them an email and asked if they can ship those cells to Greece.

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Re: Homemade Battery Packs

Post by Philaphlous » Feb 27 2018 3:58pm

Considering building a new battery pack. The one I built wasn't the greatest for fitting to my bike frame and some of the cells are pretty old from laptops but most of the cells are decent Chinese cells rated for 2C draw which they see typically... Considering a slightly larger 13S8P pack... Kinda a bother though I don't have a spot welder nor do I have the space or means to build one...or $$$ to buy one. Lol. I already have 39 new cells...Maybe I should just build an entirely new pack....

vagosofron   10 W

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Re: Homemade Battery Packs

Post by vagosofron » Feb 28 2018 6:06am

Anyone tried to build a pack with these 18650 cases?
Image
Can we find out how much current they can hold?

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Re: Homemade Battery Packs

Post by Philaphlous » Feb 28 2018 6:25am

vagosofron wrote:
Feb 28 2018 6:06am
Anyone tried to build a pack with these 18650 cases?
Image
Can we find out how much current they can hold?
Not very much if you plan to use the wire leads that they come with... I bought a 10 pack or whatever from CHINA china...china... :P anyway... I glued 3 of them together to give me a 6 cell holder. Makes it easy for balancing/charging cells IMHO. I think you can solder your own wire on the back of them...you just need to get a little crafty... I really like these kind too, they're way better than a spring holder...these really hold the cells well.

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Re: Homemade Battery Packs

Post by vagosofron » Feb 28 2018 7:12am

I was going to solder a thicker wire obviously, but will that be enough? Will those little metal things that hold the batteries hold up the current? I want to build two 4s3p batteries, for a 60A esc. I hope using 12awg wire will do the trick.

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Re: Homemade Battery Packs

Post by Philaphlous » Feb 28 2018 8:19am

vagosofron wrote:
Feb 28 2018 7:12am
I was going to solder a thicker wire obviously, but will that be enough? Will those little metal things that hold the batteries hold up the current? I want to build two 4s3p batteries, for a 60A esc. I hope using 12awg wire will do the trick.
That's pretty high amperage... Its hard to tell. They will probably hold the cells hard enough for an ebike but I'd still either do some removable tape or zip tie or velcro straps to ensure they stay in the housing.

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Re: Homemade Battery Packs

Post by vagosofron » Feb 28 2018 8:25am

Philaphlous wrote:
Feb 28 2018 8:19am
vagosofron wrote:
Feb 28 2018 7:12am
I was going to solder a thicker wire obviously, but will that be enough? Will those little metal things that hold the batteries hold up the current? I want to build two 4s3p batteries, for a 60A esc. I hope using 12awg wire will do the trick.
That's pretty high amperage... Its hard to tell. They will probably hold the cells hard enough for an ebike but I'd still either do some removable tape or zip tie or velcro straps to ensure they stay in the housing.
I will use straps for extra safety, that is for sure.
I have a 60A esc ( dlux 60A from hobbyking), I hope it will work.

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Re: Homemade Battery Packs

Post by Philaphlous » Mar 01 2018 10:10am

Failed to capitalize on this opportunity... Im 99% sure the seller made a mistake and didn't refuse to deliver the item. Got a brand spanking new Lenovo 6 cell pack for $6!!! Lol! Was thinking it might not be genuine but it sure is! Came with 3000mah panasonic 18650BD cells! Best part was the pack was the easiest pack ever to open. Man an ebike battery with all these would be freaking awesome! I only ordered one...checked back an hour later...the price is now $16. Lol someone forgot to type the full number.

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Re: Homemade Battery Packs

Post by jcool3 » Mar 02 2018 1:21pm

4 SPIM08HP 3.7V 8AH LITHIUM POLYMER BATTERIES 25C 200A SUPER CELLS 24V 36V 48V on ebay https://www.ebay.com/itm/4-SPIM08HP-3-7 ... 6016.l4276
10 of these in series would run my ebike. 37v Question: best way to charge them and do they need to be balance charged?
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Hummina Shadeeba   1 MW

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Re: Homemade Battery Packs

Post by Hummina Shadeeba » Mar 02 2018 3:08pm

definitely need to be balanced somehow. i like the simple "lipo discharge balancer" but they're very slow.

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Re: Homemade Battery Packs

Post by SharingSociety » Mar 15 2018 6:54am

vagosofron wrote:
Feb 28 2018 6:06am
Anyone tried to build a pack with these 18650 cases?
Image
Can we find out how much current they can hold?
I've used these a good bit and I think 30A is safe non-continuous (used in 2s RC car); I've also done about 15-18A 30min continous and I believe they didn't get hot.

It's cool because a standard 18650 max discharge is about 5A so these handle about what the batteries can handle so its a good matchup (5Ax5=20A continuous, 30A max burst). At these ratings a regular 18650 will get hot more than the wires do. I also use wago connectors and they run fine (20A/32A max rating, not sure what difference this means but wago's are rated for AC)

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Re: Homemade Battery Packs

Post by SharingSociety » Mar 15 2018 7:05am

I've bought and tested the fullriver LiFePO4's recently and came up with some pretty inconsistent results

I wasn't able to get close to 3300mAh capacity (by a long shot) about 85% of the time.

Some ratings came up between 1000 to 2500.

I was charging at 0.25A to 0.375A and discharging 1A first like I do with 18650's but these batteries seemed to like a 0.5A discharge (imax b6) to get much more capacity.

I'm going to further test with consistent results to see if I can get some consistent capacities or if these are just bad quality/damaged cells which would be a good reason why they're selling for cheap (near $1/cell) and the company seems to be non-existent I cannot even find a spec sheet on them!

But at your own risk

Image

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DrkAngel   100 GW

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Re: Box of 80 Fullriver LiFePO4 26650 3.2V 3300mAh

Post by DrkAngel » Mar 15 2018 7:59am

Similarly disappointed with the Fullriver LiFe.
Preliminary iMax cycle test (3.6V >> 2.0V) proved out near 2000mAh. (3.65V is recommended charge)
Experimented with LiFe charge 3.6V >> LiIo discharge 3.0V with poor results.
Accidentally ran a cycle at LiIo 3.0V >> 4.10 and got 3000+ mAh!
DrkAngel wrote:
Feb 05 2018 10:39am
.
.........
LiFePO4 Capacity "Map" Test


Image
Will connect as 4s20p for cycle testing via inverter, through VAWAh meter.
Cycling cells multiple times might enhance-stabilize capacity-performance?
Will allow differing charge-discharge rates and voltages.
Will bulk charge with MeanWell and monitor banks with 6s volt meter.
Last edited by DrkAngel on Mar 16 2018 4:48am, edited 1 time in total.
A little learning is a dangerous thing;
Drink deep, or taste not the Pierian spring:
There, shallow draughts intoxicate the brain,
And drinking largely, sobers us again.

I enjoy enlightening ... and enlivening the spirit of the innovators.

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TheBeastie   1 MW

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Re: Homemade Battery Packs

Post by TheBeastie » Mar 16 2018 1:13am

Makes sense, any of these non-cobalt chemistry batteries perform badly which is why all Western based EVs use Cobalt based chemistries.
As far as I am concerned all non-cobalt chemistrys aren't made for ANY other reason other than to try and provide something thats better than Nickel–metal hydride but cheaper than anything lithium-cobalt based.
Speed Kills Range, 10mph = 46 miles range, 20mph = 20 miles, 30mph = 8 miles rangehttps://goo.gl/1JNL53
Over Charging Kills ur battery bit.ly/1hzWKl4
Consider PAS as your only throttle https://goo.gl/Kg1F8F
Fuel-Cell is the ultimate battery coupled with 4th-gen Nuclear
https://goo.gl/TcKtHs https://goo.gl/ZhFFot https://goo.gl/gfa215
10 Square Miles of solar panels = 0.12GW average power! https://goo.gl/Ub1S39

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bobbill   10 mW

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Re: Homemade Battery Packs

Post by bobbill » Apr 09 2018 10:27am

I know squat. Have never built a pack. But, I happened on this site and must say, I found it the max. Will ask no questions (now) as I back into this e-bike stuff, to learn how its is done by doing. Keep it up...

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Re: Homemade Battery Packs Newbie

Post by bobbill » Apr 16 2018 9:30am

I already mentioned I know squat...Do I get it so far, with this DIY battery?

Intended for Bafang geared hub motor...250-watt to 500-watt. (Grin Kit) I guess depends.

I peddle mostly and have one short hill at end of ride. 4% one km or about .75 mile. Why the kit.

Battery pack design: 25s maybe 30s high-end 18650s.

Square, to fit below-seat bag.

1 BMS.

N.B. I have no desire to go fast on a bicycle and peddle mostly...small town here.

The above is not idle ?...I do/did research. Read all of above thread, some of which is over my head, but absorbed.

Had to retread HS physics a bit and redo my ideas...but thus far, the above seems to fit the plan.

Make sense?

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DrkAngel   100 GW

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Re: Homemade Battery Packs

Post by DrkAngel » Apr 18 2018 9:10am

"s" stands for number of cells in "series".
eg. 10 (3.6V lithium) cells in series (10s) equals 36V. electrical "pressure"
Additionally, cells are placed in parallel "p".
eg. 4 (2500mAh) cells in parallel (4p) equals 10,000mAh (10Ah). electrical "volume-capacity"
10s4p would be a 36V 10Ah battery. (40 cells)
A little learning is a dangerous thing;
Drink deep, or taste not the Pierian spring:
There, shallow draughts intoxicate the brain,
And drinking largely, sobers us again.

I enjoy enlightening ... and enlivening the spirit of the innovators.

New & Improved - Acronym Definitions

Index - Homemade Battery Packs - Updated - February 2019

EBike Toolbox - Bargains! $

Endless Sphere Wiki - Lost?

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bobbill   10 mW

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Re: Homemade Battery P10 long, acks

Post by bobbill » Apr 18 2018 12:45pm

DA, appreciate the note. I mix things up.

I screwed up and forgot to correct what I ended up changing. Thanks. Am learning, a bit at a time, but do know one learns most by doing...

The pack has or plans to be 30 (typed "18' in error) good 18650s...to make, if I have it right...a 10s3pack...10 in series x3 parallel or 10 long x 3 across, with matching BMS I have not yet bought; same with a 2-amp charger. I figure it will be

Just a slow going plan, I know nada and have changed a few things each time I do on paper...plan to acquire quality cells..,, if first pack works, with the controller etc Grin sent, with the 36v geared Bafang FW hub kit (Did not know what else to do.)

I do not plan to ride distance much. Just up the hill maybe a few miles out by river... sort of fun.

I have made 3 gas belt-driven bikes which were perfect, but noise and gas was not the best, so sold the rig and decided to go green on a Xootr bike, with the above for hill and play.
Last edited by bobbill on Apr 20 2018 5:31am, edited 2 times in total.

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Re: Homemade Battery Packs

Post by bobbill » Apr 20 2018 5:28am

Well the plan is now changed...pack is two rows too long to fit into bag, so will have to redo to fit. Duh on me! We learn...slowly. Being a bit dyslectic makes the going slower, but more than once way to skin this cat! Plus I think snow is finally gone, but one never can be sure.

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Re: Homemade Battery Packs

Post by bobbill » Apr 29 2018 10:13am

Still learning...back to 30 cells, took some time to receive.

Don't know how will house/bag on bike, but will work on it. Thirty cells, 3 across...i know basic...but we learn. 10s4p or 10s3p (?) pack...divided in half, if nec, to fit or arranged in some way to fit. As noted, am backing slowly into this. And, without this thread, slow progress here would be slower. BTW. not soldering or spot welding, but using the rigs for cells, so may have to go with square/rectangle shape for storage...glad I have not bought bag yet.

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DrkAngel   100 GW

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Re: Electric Wheel Barrel

Post by DrkAngel » May 08 2018 9:22am

DrkAngel wrote:
Nov 26 2016 5:09pm
Electric Wheel Barrel-Snow Plow

New Winter project!
Found an electric wheel barrel in the dumpster behind my store.

Image
2 larger drive wheels and a smaller bogie wheel.
(Dual motors for posi-traction)
Motors engage with handlebar lever.
I traced problems to a dead 12V 22Ah SLA and a faulty 40A relay.
Replaced relay and tested with 3sRC LiPo but was disappointed at the 2 mph top speed.

Fun begins ...
At 1st I considered running at 4s for a near 3mph but ... too simple and limited.
So, Why not run at 22.2V (6s 14p 22.2V 30.24Ah fits nicely!) with a pot controlled brush controller.
Will maintain handlebar oem relay function or replace with controller on\off circuit?
Variable <1mph - >3mph

50V brush.jpg - $8
Now ... I don't have much use for a wheel barrel, but adding a plow to the front would be a great snow moving utensil!
Torque and speed should be appropriate.
Just have to add some weight. Sand or bags of salt? ... Rated for 200lb loads.
Chains?

Summer use
Mount rear 2 wheeled platform for standing on and cruising, with load, down the street.

Upper (green potion) removable by screws or add sideboards to upper portion ...

Battery compartment and motors-drivetrains remove as single component for alternate use!

LUV motor.jpg
Replaced heavy SLA with 3s12p Sony LiPo.
12V 22Ah SLA upgraded to 11.1V 25.92Ah LiPo.
Built from 3s2p packs with all cells equal after initial balance last year.
I built a 5-30V LED volt meter with standard 12V DC charger plug for monitoring voltage through charging port.

"Donated" to local food pantry and hauled a dozen loads of topsoil with a 25% drop in voltage.
Rebuilding their Community Garden. Many wooden "raised beds" rotting after 8 years of service.
I've been redesigning and rebuilding with 8" cement blocks. Should last for decades-lifetimes with minimal maintenance!
Holes in blocks should make excellent "pots" for various flowers, herbs, small plants.
Marigolds and petunias repel most harmful insects, found some dwarf Dill that is even more effective, might have to prune-harvest continually. Started ♫ Parsley, Sage, Rosemary and Thyme ♫ as well as Oregano, Basil, Lemon Balm for 6" x 6" x 8" holes ... with good soil. Lined block holes in 3rd and 4th beds with tar paper to slow evaporation through blocks. And, hopefully Lime based cement blocks will deter snails and slugs from climbing into beds.

Charged back up. 8 cubic yards of topsoil being delivered today ...
A little learning is a dangerous thing;
Drink deep, or taste not the Pierian spring:
There, shallow draughts intoxicate the brain,
And drinking largely, sobers us again.

I enjoy enlightening ... and enlivening the spirit of the innovators.

New & Improved - Acronym Definitions

Index - Homemade Battery Packs - Updated - February 2019

EBike Toolbox - Bargains! $

Endless Sphere Wiki - Lost?

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bobbill   10 mW

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Re: Homemade Battery Packs

Post by bobbill » May 08 2018 9:38am

Man after me own heart...sounds so kewl...will be looking for one around here and so on.

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