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New Samsung cell 33G

Posted: Feb 17 2017 6:55am
by Overclocker
Image

interesting new cell but i can't find any solid info on this yet...

Re: New Samsung cell 33G

Posted: Feb 17 2017 9:54am
by wesnewell
Found on ebay;
Standard Charge Rate : 0.2C
Maximal Charge Rate : 1C
Max. Continuous Discharge Rate : 10C
Pulse Discharge Rate : 20C
Working Charge Temp : 0~40°C
Working Discharge Temp : –10°C~45°C
Storage Temperature(≤1month): –10°C~40°C ≤6month 0°C~35°C
Appearance : Without scratch, distortion, contamination and leakage
Applications : Electric tools, ebike battery, pedal battery, e-golf cart battery, etc.

Re: New Samsung cell 33G

Posted: Feb 17 2017 12:28pm
by multifrag
I wouldn't trust the image as the company ''Imren'' seems to re-bag other cells. They're selling ''their own'' 3000mah ''40A'' discharge cell
http://gaodmei.en.alibaba.com/product/6 ... msung.html

Re: New Samsung cell 33G

Posted: Feb 18 2017 8:29am
by redilast
10C lol. I highly doubt it. I bet its a 10A rated cell. A cheaper version of the 35E would be my guess, but I was unable to pull up any authoritative datasheets or anything.

Re: New Samsung cell 33G

Posted: Feb 18 2017 8:42am
by Pajda
redilast wrote:10C lol. I highly doubt it. I bet its a 10A rated cell. A cheaper version of the 35E would be my guess, but I was unable to pull up any authoritative datasheets or anything.
I agree with you, it is 10A rated cell for sure. Here is another info looks like from original datasheet https://www.alibaba.com/product-detail/ ... 63194.html Given 2C continuos and 3C peak looks more realistic. By the way I have seen a catalogue list with series: INR18650-36G and INR21700-48G but without any information.

Re: New Samsung cell 33G

Posted: Apr 24 2017 6:44am
by sannder
The question is whether this cell is really produced by Samsung or they just sold a crappy 35E recipe to China.
Samsung has a good reputation for not exaggerating the specs, the 10C raises an eye brow here.
The overenthusiastic list of specs seems to favor the initial speculation.

Meanwhile, both Eric and Paul are using them in their packs - which is very interesting indeed.

Maybe this is the Samsung's answer for NCR18650B, the (overrated) 3350mAh cell... ?

Re: New Samsung cell 33G

Posted: May 16 2017 9:24am
by Perth_ebiker
I've just bought a 14s6p pack from EM3EV using thsese cells.

I was interested in the 937 watt hours advertised.

What's the consensus ? Anything to look out for ?

Re: New Samsung cell 33G

Posted: May 16 2017 10:37am
by 999zip999
The thing about batteries it takes time and use to find out. Years. Iet us know how it works ands at what amp draw are you using it at ?

Re: New Samsung cell 33G

Posted: May 16 2017 5:13pm
by cal3thousand
Can't seem to find a datasheet on the webz. That seems a bit odd.

Re: New Samsung cell 33G

Posted: May 19 2017 5:50am
by cell_man
sannder wrote:The question is whether this cell is really produced by Samsung or they just sold a crappy 35E recipe to China.
Samsung has a good reputation for not exaggerating the specs, the 10C raises an eye brow here.
The overenthusiastic list of specs seems to favor the initial speculation.

Meanwhile, both Eric and Paul are using them in their packs - which is very interesting indeed.

Maybe this is the Samsung's answer for NCR18650B, the (overrated) 3350mAh cell... ?
33G are an EV grade cell that are produced in China by Samsung. Yes they are produced by Samsung, and we purchase from legitimate Samsung supply channels. They are supposed to have good cycle life and if charged/discharged to 4.1V/2.75V are supposed to last 8 years plus in an EV Car application (just from discussion with my contact in Samsung, don't have any data to back that up). They are ~2C continuous (6.4A) and 3C max (9.6A) rated (as stated in the spec sheet I have). Our tests indicate a capacity of 3.15Ah or more per cell with a 2.75V/cell LVC in a finished pack (spec sheet states 3.15Ah typical capacity, to 2.5V LVC, not 3.3Ah as some try to market them), we rate them as 3.1Ah per cell and the discharge test for each battery is included with the battery. IMPE, they actually run a bit cooler than the higher capacity cells, when ran at the same discharge rate. The 6P pack we offer is comfortable at the (conservative) discharge rates we recommend (1.5C continuous, 2C burst). 1.5C on the 6P pack is ~28A, so if you keep the max to no more than that, the pack will not be stressed.

No, i don't think it is as simple as saying that cell A has more capacity than cell B, so cell A is a superior to cell. I'd imagine there is a bit more to it than that and as I mentioned, these are intended for EV (and I believe they are intended to be fitted or are already being used in EV cars), so possibly they have been created with various requirements, 1 of the major being good cycle life.

For info, the 35E cell has never been in mass production (according to my sources), and only relatively small quantities have been produced up until now. The 35E are due to hopefully going into mass production in the near future with a revised formulation.

Re: New Samsung cell 33G

Posted: May 27 2017 9:09pm
by Firedog
1. No such Samsung product. If Samsung had a 3.3ah, 33amp continuous discharge cell, they would be shouting the news and a data sheet would exist.
2. Compare the IMREN logo to the Chinese company Kdest. https://www.alibaba.com/product-detail/ ... 61015.html Same company.

They buy Samsung and LG seconds (rejects). I bought a 18v Makita tool battery clone, and it used the cells in the link above. They turn out to be 2.1ah Samsung cells, re wrapped (label and color) to look like LG 2.5ah cells but with 1 character in LG's product code wrong. I suspect if they used a true LG product code they would have more trouble with counterfeit laws. I also suspect Samsung wouldn't sell them seconds if they re label them "Samsung", but don't care if they use other names. The ebayer that sold the Makita clone, promised genuine Samsung or LG cells. Indeed, that what was inside. He didn't think to mention the #2 part or name change part or that they couldn't possibly deliver the 5.0ah promised (5s2p).

Apparently, they do the same tricks going the other way. If I had to guess, I those 33G cells are actually LG 2.1ah or 2.5ah seconds, re wrapped to look like Samsung cells. Oh, with a little imaginary bump in performance.

Re: New Samsung cell 33G

Posted: May 27 2017 11:21pm
by tomjasz
Firedog wrote:1. No such Samsung product. If Samsung had a 3.3ah, 33amp continuous discharge cell, they would be shouting the news and a data sheet would exist.
2. Compare the IMREN logo to the Chinese company Kdest. https://www.alibaba.com/product-detail/ ... 61015.html Same company.

They buy Samsung and LG seconds (rejects). I bought a 18v Makita tool battery clone, and it used the cells in the link above. They turn out to be 2.1ah Samsung cells, re wrapped (label and color) to look like LG 2.5ah cells but with 1 character in LG's product code wrong. I suspect if they used a true LG product code they would have more trouble with counterfeit laws. I also suspect Samsung wouldn't sell them seconds if they re label them "Samsung", but don't care if they use other names. The ebayer that sold the Makita clone, promised genuine Samsung or LG cells. Indeed, that what was inside. He didn't think to mention the #2 part or name change part or that they couldn't possibly deliver the 5.0ah promised (5s2p).

Apparently, they do the same tricks going the other way. If I had to guess, I those 33G cells are actually LG 2.1ah or 2.5ah seconds, re wrapped to look like Samsung cells. Oh, with a little imaginary bump in performance.
Two post wonder making claims. Care to back them up? Data, proof of theory? Something besides a nom de plume?

Re: New Samsung cell 33G

Posted: May 30 2017 12:17am
by Overclocker
so this battery supplier (not recommended!) spams me every month on skype. interesting to see the 33G this month. cheap too!

Image

Re: New Samsung cell 33G

Posted: May 30 2017 12:02pm
by cal3thousand
cell_man wrote:
sannder wrote:The question is whether this cell is really produced by Samsung or they just sold a crappy 35E recipe to China.
Samsung has a good reputation for not exaggerating the specs, the 10C raises an eye brow here.
The overenthusiastic list of specs seems to favor the initial speculation.

Meanwhile, both Eric and Paul are using them in their packs - which is very interesting indeed.

Maybe this is the Samsung's answer for NCR18650B, the (overrated) 3350mAh cell... ?
33G are an EV grade cell that are produced in China by Samsung. Yes they are produced by Samsung, and we purchase from legitimate Samsung supply channels. They are supposed to have good cycle life and if charged/discharged to 4.1V/2.75V are supposed to last 8 years plus in an EV Car application (just from discussion with my contact in Samsung, don't have any data to back that up). They are ~2C continuous (6.4A) and 3C max (9.6A) rated (as stated in the spec sheet I have). Our tests indicate a capacity of 3.15Ah or more per cell with a 2.75V/cell LVC in a finished pack (spec sheet states 3.15Ah typical capacity, to 2.5V LVC, not 3.3Ah as some try to market them), we rate them as 3.1Ah per cell and the discharge test for each battery is included with the battery. IMPE, they actually run a bit cooler than the higher capacity cells, when ran at the same discharge rate. The 6P pack we offer is comfortable at the (conservative) discharge rates we recommend (1.5C continuous, 2C burst). 1.5C on the 6P pack is ~28A, so if you keep the max to no more than that, the pack will not be stressed.

No, i don't think it is as simple as saying that cell A has more capacity than cell B, so cell A is a superior to cell. I'd imagine there is a bit more to it than that and as I mentioned, these are intended for EV (and I believe they are intended to be fitted or are already being used in EV cars), so possibly they have been created with various requirements, 1 of the major being good cycle life.

For info, the 35E cell has never been in mass production (according to my sources), and only relatively small quantities have been produced up until now. The 35E are due to hopefully going into mass production in the near future with a revised formulation.
Firedog wrote:1. No such Samsung product. If Samsung had a 3.3ah, 33amp continuous discharge cell, they would be shouting the news and a data sheet would exist.
2. Compare the IMREN logo to the Chinese company Kdest. https://www.alibaba.com/product-detail/ ... 61015.html Same company.

They buy Samsung and LG seconds (rejects). I bought a 18v Makita tool battery clone, and it used the cells in the link above. They turn out to be 2.1ah Samsung cells, re wrapped (label and color) to look like LG 2.5ah cells but with 1 character in LG's product code wrong. I suspect if they used a true LG product code they would have more trouble with counterfeit laws. I also suspect Samsung wouldn't sell them seconds if they re label them "Samsung", but don't care if they use other names. The ebayer that sold the Makita clone, promised genuine Samsung or LG cells. Indeed, that what was inside. He didn't think to mention the #2 part or name change part or that they couldn't possibly deliver the 5.0ah promised (5s2p).

Apparently, they do the same tricks going the other way. If I had to guess, I those 33G cells are actually LG 2.1ah or 2.5ah seconds, re wrapped to look like Samsung cells. Oh, with a little imaginary bump in performance.


Hmm... I think I would rather trust Paul (cell_man) as he's sold more cells than you've ever seen in your lifetime.

Second, the IMREN logo is SIMILAR to Kdest, but not the same. Are you really surprised that one Chinese battery supplier has a logo that is quite similar to another one? Take a closer look, the animals are different: KDest is clearly a wolf, when the IMREN logo is something like a dragon or a fu dog.

thirdly, there is no way a company is taking 2.1Ah cells and getting anywhere near the pack capacities using the same counts.

Take time to do some evidence gathering before your 3rd post on the 'Sphere.

Re: New Samsung cell 33G

Posted: May 30 2017 9:28pm
by tomjasz
2 post wonder, no data just noise.
Shill?
hina produces some great cells. Urban legend prevents common sense reviews.

Re: New Samsung cell 33G

Posted: Jun 01 2017 4:13am
by Punx0r
Open your eyes and apply a little critical thinking...

The capacity/performance specs are unprecedented
No data sheet
No independent test results
No marketing info from the manufacturer
Only available for sale from ebay and alibaba

It could be real, but it's a significant jump in 18650 technology to a suspicious lack of fanfare. Balance of probability suggests it's exactly what it looks like: too good to be true. As always, extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence and from this thread there appears to be none. So the wisest course of action would be caution.

Re: New Samsung cell 33G

Posted: Jun 01 2017 6:07am
by Hillhater
Why do you think a 3.3ah, 3C, cell is unprecedented ?
It sounds very realistic.
If Cellman says he has the spec sheet, thats a reputable source for me.

Re: New Samsung cell 33G

Posted: Jun 01 2017 6:13am
by rojitor
I agree. Cellman has proved to me he is a reputable salesman and es member. I trust his comments.

Re: New Samsung cell 33G

Posted: Jun 01 2017 6:39am
by torker
I have always read good things about Cellman / Paul so I made my first plug n play battery purchase from him. Just took delivery of my second battery. Measured at 12.70 ah 33g 48v . The Impedance showed 116.43 milliohms.

I have not had time to mount it yet.

Re: New Samsung cell 33G

Posted: Jun 01 2017 8:59am
by Punx0r
Hillhater wrote:Why do you think a 3.3ah, 3C, cell is unprecedented ?
This thread claims 10C

Re: New Samsung cell 33G

Posted: Jun 01 2017 9:20am
by Overclocker
Punx0r wrote:
Hillhater wrote:Why do you think a 3.3ah, 3C, cell is unprecedented ?
This thread claims 10C
don't read fake news LOL

em3ev says 3c max. powertrading says 10A

the cell is real and definitely interesting especially the price. it's a new cell so the datasheet hasn't been leaked yet

Re: New Samsung cell 33G

Posted: Jun 02 2017 2:10am
by Punx0r
Overclocker wrote:
don't read fake news LOL

em3ev says 3c max. powertrading says 10A
No, I read this thread... I just checked back and your post quoted above is the first stating it is a 3C cell.

Re: New Samsung cell 33G

Posted: Jun 02 2017 10:44am
by Overclocker
Image

bottom vent like panasonic BE

Re: New Samsung cell 33G

Posted: Jun 02 2017 1:03pm
by cycborg
Punx0r wrote:
Hillhater wrote:Why do you think a 3.3ah, 3C, cell is unprecedented ?
This thread claims 10C
10C comes from a random ebay listing. 3C comes from an actual datasheet via a respected vendor. Why do you trust the former over the latter?

Re: New Samsung cell 33G

Posted: Jun 02 2017 1:24pm
by cal3thousand
Punx0r wrote:
Hillhater wrote:Why do you think a 3.3ah, 3C, cell is unprecedented ?
This thread claims 10C

To be fair. That was one person, not the thread. I actually didn't catch that part and would have written it off as typo had I seen it, since 10A is certainly the right ball park. Someone truly claiming 10C on an 18650 like this doesn't know what they are talking about as that would be 33A from a single cell.